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the_scotsman wrote:
That is true, the example given was BT as BA. So I guess my question would be: Were you using BA specific stuff? Were you using the actual models for those rules, and if not, how were you representing them with Black Templangels?

I'm not saying I have any kind of problem with it across the board. If you wanted to use Blood Angels rules and you said something like "All guys in Jump Packs are all Death Company" and the rest of the army was fairly basic, or if you took stuff you wanted to use from BA (say, a furioso dread) and took that real model and painted it up as a BT, then that'd be fine.

If you said "all guys in jump packs are DC, this standard dread with MM is a fragioso, this Ironclad is a libby dread, this laspred is a baal pred...." etc etc etc across the whole army, that'd be approaching the line for me. If it was occasional, AND really consistent, I'd be OK.

As soon as you had either two detachments painted matching colors representing different factions, or similar proxies of distinct units (say, two assault squads, one of which was DC, one of which was standard Assault Marines or Sang Guard, both modeled and painted identically) that's where I'd have a problem.

This is what I was running in a 2000 point game:

* Dante with a Priest and a Squad of 10x Sanguinary Guard (or 15x Death Company Depending on which list)
* Fire Raptor
* 5x Drop Pods of Tac Squads, each with a Meltagun, Hvy. Flamer, and a Combi Melta

Every model is painted as a Black Templar, and the Commander representing Dante atm is just the Emperors Champion with a Jump Pack, with the Priest being custom made. When it comes to my Army, I really only use 2x other Chapter Tactics/Rules with this Army or when I play with my Black Templars. Either the Imperial Fists as the BT's are a successor of the IF's, or BA because they are an aggressive army and there tactics are similar to the Black Templars in that reguard at least. I will use the same Chapter Tactic for the most part for the whole Army, only exception would be if I run lets say: My Black Templars with BA Rules (like Above), but have a Terminator Unit Formation with Lysander with IF tactics, or I run my BT's with IF Chapter Tactics but I have a Skyhammer Formation using the Ultramarine Chapter Tactics. But in most cases I still field the Skyhammer with just IF tactics as their Dev. Squads have Tan Hunter and they become a solid unit with Multi-Meltas instead of the usual Grav-Spam. Plus I think we can agree that the BT Chapter Tactics are pretty bad right now. I have them as Templars atm as it is an easy scheme to paint and they look great, but I am opting to do a 30k/40k Luna Wolves Army instead as then I could do any Chapter Tactic I want. But I won't go overboard like some people have.

we have 2 guys in our area,

One has SM painted to his favorite football team, as new hotness comes out he always changes which chapter they counted as.


the other had bike heavy Ultra marines that change allegiance as the 6th and 7th editions rolled to use the best new bike army rules.


neither ever chose a chapter that was subpar always played the new best. While not against the rules, it is WAAC TFG behavior. It gets old after awhile.

 Griddlelol wrote:
It's not WYSIWYG. I dislike playing games where I have to remember what my opponent told me his models are, rather than just looking at them and instantly seeing what I expect to see. I'm going to forget, or I'm going to constantly have to ask.

Even worse when they're not painted, might as well just put down cardboard counters with a short description written on them.

I don't expect everyone to buy every model, but at least try to convert it or something, or I'm probably never going to play you again.

How wouldn't a flail be WYSIWYG? They're unwieldy, strike with concussive properties, and hit with high strength. That's literally one of the easiest things to remember. It's your own fault, not the opponent's.

 Rune Stonegrinder wrote:
we have 2 guys in our area,

One has SM painted to his favorite football team, as new hotness comes out he always changes which chapter they counted as.


the other had bike heavy Ultra marines that change allegiance as the 6th and 7th editions rolled to use the best new bike army rules.


neither ever chose a chapter that was subpar always played the new best. While not against the rules, it is WAAC TFG behavior. It gets old after awhile.

There's a guy at my LGS who does that. He leaves all his stuff unpainted for the sole purpose of switching CT's to benefit him, and he runs at least five fliers when he knows you don't have any.

There's no reason for someone to be in your grill about your red marines acting like green marines. That's one of the advantages of playing marines in general. You can buy 4 times the rule books and own 4 times the armies with the same models.

My chapter is painted "like" BA, (gold aquilas instead of black, and I don't follow squad markings and helmet colors) and I've never had anyone challenge the idea that they are able to run as other chapters, but if I were to run into such a TFG, I'd just tell him my chapter is a free chapter whose numbers are made up of marines separated from their chapters, deathwatch survivors, and other outcasts, and they deploy chapter-brothers together as strike forces to maximize battlefield efficiency.

And no, to reassure you, there is no rule stating that your marines must be the right color for your chapter tactics, and even the biggest events don't care. Steve Sisk played "blue scars" -obviously ultramarine models with white scar tactics- at Las Vegas open for example.

If there ever was a rule like that, I'd be out a few models, since I even paint non-BA models into my BA-like scheme, such as grav cannons and cataphractii termies, things I can't run out of the BA codex.

As long as your models reflect what you have on paper in terms of wargear, I wouldn't raise a stink. As soon as you start trying to proxy "this" as "that", then I start to get irritated.

 casvalremdeikun wrote:
As long as your models reflect what you have on paper in terms of wargear, I wouldn't raise a stink. As soon as you start trying to proxy "this" as "that", then I start to get irritated.

I never proxy weaponry lol. One of the advantages of Space Marines is to be able to use the correct weaponry for every unit. Only thing that comes into question is the Paint Scheme.

As many have said, as long as war gear is good you're good, and as long as you're painting each chapter different (meaning if you're wanting to use 2 detachments of different chapters, don't paint them the same).

I'd also say that the fluff is not an issue. It is always possible that one company fights differently, or spent a bunch of time with another chapter and picked up some of their tactics. Even for IH tactics for someone not painted as IH, it's plausible there is a company that happens to be the beat up company with lots of cybernetics. You can remedy most fluff issues pretty easily, the hardest to do would be the ones that are from physiological differences.

For special characters: If you have SM painted as BT and use them as UM and want Calgar, buy Calgar and paint him up as a BT, following by a "here's his actual name". Same with any other model.