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So, after a longish break I'm diving back into my huge Ork collection and gearing up to play a lot of casual games with them. The problem I keep running into is that the detachments available to the greenskins either provide decent bonuses but are needlessly restrictive (Ghazkhull requires either the Goff Kill Mob or Waaagh-band, but give you lots of Waaagh uses), or they give bonuses that just aren't that great (Hammer of Wrath is pretty crap on Boyz). Playing two CAD could be decent with all the Objective Secured available. My main opponent these days is my good friend's Iron Hands list, which is just one headache after another. Why someone thought Space Marines needed to play more like Necrons is beyond me, coolness notwithstanding.

I'd like to construct an effective, fun list with my broad range of models but it needn't be competetive per se. Which detachments are working for you other Warbosses? The way I see it, I need a Warboss, probably two Big Meks, and at least one Painboy. I've found Weirdboys to be both fun and deadly so there's that one too. I'd happily run Mogrok's Bossboyz and Finkin' Kap, but is that worth losing Waaagh? The Pain Mob seems really interesting too (I know Deff Dreads aren't great but I like them anyway). The Kill Mob seems decent but making those sixty Boys effective and having points for other good stuff could be a problem.

I've also been playing around with the idea of a Mek with the relic KFF hanging out with two big Boyz mobz with Painboyz, or maybe a huge Grot screen. Seems like massive Boyz mobz get expensive very quickly if you make them actually good by adding 'Eavy Armour or vehicles, leading to the same old Boyz or Toyz problem. So which detachments work for you?

The problem with the relic KFF or any KFF is how are you going to fit all those boys within 6"? It's no longer unit within 6" but models within 6". It is doable with one max boy squad but that's awful tempting fate for templates.

Playing malestrom? You want Ork MSU, be it footslogging or trukk units.

Do not overbuild your HQ's they will not stand up to any IH IC, focus more on using a warboss buried in boyz to ensure you'll have the WAAAGH on turn two.

There are a couple types of IH players, the guy who spams FnP marines, the guy who spams FnP bikes, the Fist of Medusa guy who wants Vindicators with PotMS, and the Land Raider Spearhead guy. Build your fire support to shoot bikes and light AV (bring Lootas). For armored lists, be sure to eliminate anything you are considering firing at to negate IH advantages in HP regen, if he is Land Raider guy focus your goals on objectives and try to ignore the AV14 boxes unless you can smack it with four PKs or maybe 7-10 tankbustas in CC (FAQ details pending). IH bikes are more expensive try to play to objectives and hopefully you'll get some lucky assaults in contested areas. Spreading objectives out should help keep the marine footprint too spread out and allow you to utilize your larger footprint mo betta, keeping the bikes in the middle of the board and under constant pressure from any support Dakka you bring (lootas right?). FnP marines are different to deal with, and will likely be about who is better at rolling dice to tie and lack any real strategy.

Your best bet is multiple cad with some formations when needed.

 Spacewolverine wrote:
The problem with the relic KFF or any KFF is how are you going to fit all those boys within 6"? It's no longer unit within 6" but models within 6". It is doable with one max boy squad but that's awful tempting fate for templates.

Yeah, Thunderfire is definitely a thing. I was also thinking about a Morkanaut since it has a much larger bubble and I already own one. The 4++ on the relic is tempting though, certainly more cost effective than 'Eavy Armour on the boyz. That's kind of where I'm leaning, having observed how resilient a 4+ save can be even on a T3 model. Of course you get the armour save even in CC which helps win those fights and mitigate the Mob Rule damage.



Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Rismonite wrote:
Playing malestrom? You want Ork MSU, be it footslogging or trukk units.

Do not overbuild your HQ's they will not stand up to any IH IC, focus more on using a warboss buried in boyz to ensure you'll have the WAAAGH on turn two.

There are a couple types of IH players, the guy who spams FnP marines, the guy who spams FnP bikes, the Fist of Medusa guy who wants Vindicators with PotMS, and the Land Raider Spearhead guy. Build your fire support to shoot bikes and light AV (bring Lootas). For armored lists, be sure to eliminate anything you are considering firing at to negate IH advantages in HP regen, if he is Land Raider guy focus your goals on objectives and try to ignore the AV14 boxes unless you can smack it with four PKs or maybe 7-10 tankbustas in CC (FAQ details pending). IH bikes are more expensive try to play to objectives and hopefully you'll get some lucky assaults in contested areas. Spreading objectives out should help keep the marine footprint too spread out and allow you to utilize your larger footprint mo betta, keeping the bikes in the middle of the board and under constant pressure from any support Dakka you bring (lootas right?). FnP marines are different to deal with, and will likely be about who is better at rolling dice to tie and lack any real strategy.

Of late he is playing a lot of FNP/PotMS in the form of a bunch of Techmarines joined to squads. It's surprisingly good given the lack of AP2 for most Ork units in shooting, and 2+ with a boost to FNP is brutally effective at tanking small arms fire when you can also look out sir. The It Will Not Die everywhere is very strong too. I've been thinking about smaller mobz in 'Eavy Armour to take advantage of Trukks. To that end, the CAD seems good with ObSec. Or I suppose that the Waaagh- band would work there well enough, would certainly close faster.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 koooaei wrote:
Your best bet is multiple cad with some formations when needed.

Which ones have been working for you? The ones that look best to me (with the models I have) are Pain Mob, Waaagh-Band, Mogrok's Boss-Boyz, and Snikrot's Kommandos. I almost want to use the Goff Killmob but having to take so many boyz sort of undoes the fact that it comes with a lot of fun "Tax Units". It's mega expensive before upgrades. Have you used the others at all? Waaagh every turn sounds good.

By "working" you mean "most competitive" then bully boyz, green tide, and blitz brigaide. The others are for fluffhammer, the planeplane formations might have some useful bitz but I havent seen that rulebook.

 Rismonite wrote:
By "working" you mean "most competitive" then bully boyz, green tide, and blitz brigaide. The others are for fluffhammer, the planeplane formations might have some useful bitz but I havent seen that rulebook.

Not really worried about competitive so much as not unplayably bad. I could run Tide now, but Bully Boyz and Blitz Brigade aren't going to happen unless someone just hands me the models. I've got like 200 orks now, more models is pretty much the last thing on my mind. More trying to do what I can with Boyz I own. The answer for tournament is pretty much completely trade my models for spammable tourney models which would suck. Hell, by the time I set up half my armies the tournament would be over and done. I tend to do a lot of infantry.

 Rismonite wrote:
By "working" you mean "most competitive" then bully boyz, green tide, and blitz brigaide. The others are for fluffhammer, the planeplane formations might have some useful bitz but I havent seen that rulebook.

Plane planes look good as long as you are willing to put a lot of planey planes on the table.

Green tide is fun if youu] discount th4 30 minute move time. Thar is why I lean towards trukk boys in heavy stmor. Back it up with battle wagons and 2 or 3 MSU bikes and perhaps nob bikers snikrotk vulcha boyz ahd maybe daiiauets 9r blizbommas. Loota and grot big gund]s afe also good seeing they support your waagh but dont move. The soeed yiy can get on an opponent more than makes ip for the loss of bodies.

It really does seem like twin CAD or Waaagh-band and CAD is looking strongest. Trukk boyz in armour are pretty solid, and I'll give the planes a whirl. I've got two set up to roll with whatever variety of armament. Plenty of Big Gunz too, they really are stupid cheap for how killy they can be.

If you got 12 or more bikers then you can make a good list with zhardsnark, if you do decide to take waagh band then the ghaz mini Death Star is fun.

Here are the two lists I like:

Detachment 1- CaD
Zhardsnark- warboss with Intiative 4 PK on bike that has scout and skilled rider
Painboy on bike

6 tankbustas

8 warbikers-upgrade one to nob with pk (zhardsnark and painboy here)
3 warbikers- upgrade one to nob with pk
3 warbikers- upgrade one to nob with pk

Gunwagon x2- for tankbustas/bullyboys
Gunwagon x2- for bullyboys (proxy trukks if needed for 4x av13 transports)

Detachment 2- bullyboyz
5 meganobs
5 meganobs
5 meganobs

Detschment 3- renegade knight warden
knight warden (have fun converting this model as a looted ork vehicle)

I'm still buying and building meganobs so I haven't finished this list yet but it seems the most competitve for Orks. You can probably build a varient for yourself with the models you have.

The ghaz council is my current fun fluffy and semi competitve list. And this is what I take:
Ghaz council with 2 mega armour warbosses and 1 with Lukky stikk and a big Mek with big choppa is only 724 pts.
(That's 4 pks at 4-5 atks each all at ws8-9 and fnp5+ And rampage. Ghaz usually rerolls to hit and wounds as well. There are 12 models you can put them in a trukk for cheap or do like my list and put them in a battlewagon with Killkannon for 140pts)

Waaagh band 690 pts
(6 squads of boyz on foot tarpitting up the board, bubble wrapping vehicles, providing cover saves to units behind them, eating overwatch, or being fearless objective holders.)
warboss with pk and the 3 nobs on bikes for a small bike star
Then gretchin camping your home objective (because that's all their good for)
Take the Mek with killsaw and put him in one of my two units of tank bustas (auxiliary choice of 6 tankbustas and 5 tankbustas) in trukks for 203pts.
Then I have a squad of 7x lootas (another auxiliary) in ruins for 98pts

Everything is fearless so I don't waste points on nobs or boss poles. Everything can move run and charge each turn except the Gretchin and all for 1850.

So yea you can ignore ghaz unit and let it roll over whatever it charges, but you are still dealing with 60 fearless ork boy tarpit clogging up the board and just being a nuisance, a Pk warboss and 3 nobs on bikes, 2 units of tank bustas in trucks with a badass Mek, a unit of lootas and a killkannon battlewagon that was being repaired by the ghaz bigmek.

the only way to kill ghaz is ap2 spam to kill all his support or strD/stomp him to death. However a ghaz star will eat through almost any superheavy or Iron hand character. He just has a ridiculous amount of str10 ap2 atks. He needs to challenge however almost no one can go toe to toe with him buffed. 2++ with 5+ fnp and eternal warrior and 4wds at toughness 6 and ld9 fearless. He's a pain to kill. And puts out a ton of hurt with 6-7 (on charge) str10 ap2 atks with reroll to hit and wound and rampage for a few more atks if he is outnumbered.

You could convert some boys/nobz into meganobs to form bully boiz.
Hmm, 200 boiz...
Or use 2 tides with painboy each and KKF mek towards the front - you don't generally need all boyz to have saves, just the front rows who will be soaking fire.
As tides will force enemy to hang back/castle, have some artillery (preferably camping on home obj out of LoS) to pound him/force to spread his models.
Just seeing 200boyz will make many players loose their cool, panic and make mistakes... and it is a real monkey wrench army in marine-dominated meta.You can really laugh at grav cents and wraith knights.
And do not forget to have some grot units mixed in to hold objectives ar Tide mega-unts are poor at it.
PS
Moving that ton of models is not that hard - just takes practice - my buddy some years ago played with 120boyz +9 kanz and was quite sift about it.