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This is my working list for my first tournament, if you have any C&C please let me know!

Chaos Renegade Knight 470 pts
Renegade Knight: 2 Avenger Gatling Cannons, Heavy Stubber, Icarus Autocannon

Chaos Space Marine CAD 865 pts

HQ
Sorcerer: Warlord, Mastery Level 1, Spell Familiar (Telepathy)
Sorcerer: Mastery Level 1, Spell Familiar (Telepathy)

Troops
Cultists: x20
CSM: x5, Rhino

Heavy Support
Relic Sicaran: Lascannon Sponsons, TL Accelerator Autocannon, Heavy Bolter, Extra Armor
Havocs: x5, Lascannon x4, Rhino
Havocs: x5, Lascannon x2, Rhino

Black Legion Supplement, Cyclopia Cabal 315 pts
Sorcerer: Mastery Level 2, VoTLW, Spell Familiar (Telepathy)
Sorcerer: Mastery Level 2, VoTLW, Spell Familiar (Telepathy)
Sorcerer: Mastery Level 2, VoTLW, Spell Familiar (Telepathy)

Goal is to give the rhinos to the sorcerers turn 1 (The two in my CAD can start in them), and hopefully one or more sorcerer will learn Invisibility which can be cast on the Knight/Sicarian or cultist blob, the rest will be Shrieking around the table

If they are toguether in one unit only one van cast psychic shriek and while inside the rhino no invisibility van ne cast!

The one that gets invisibility will not be in a rhino, and not all will necessarily be in rhinos, I was under the impression each could cast independent spells while being in the same unit

Nope, a unit can only cast a spell once per turn (unless you're Ahriman shooting witchfires).

Not sure that you're well served by some of the choices here, those sorcerors are too exposed and a rhino is not much protection to hold so many expensive units.

Might I suggest putting the sorcerors on bikes and using a spawn or biker unit as ablative wounds?

If I was your opponent, I think I'd pop the rhinos first turn with my anti tank and then use my anti infantry to drop all your sorcerors. Remaining turns would be spend dealing with the knight and mopping up the remaining trash.

I'm 100% open to any suggestions you might have, but wouldn't sorcerers in rhinos be less prone to being shot/assaulted and thus more viable than ones on bikes? I don't have any spawn, but I have plenty of bikes. The problem is that I haven't found them to be worth while in any game, and only using CSM and it's derivatives means most units are over priced and underwhelming.

That said, what would you consider more worthwhile than the cabal? I could easily change my HQ choices to a warpsmith, lord or dark apostle without having to drastically change my list

I like where your head is at with this list, the dual avenger gatling knight is BALLER!! Now for the constructive crits...drop the Lascannons from the havoks and replace them with autocannons, that way they'll be cheaper and you can have 8 instead of 6 heavy weapons, drop the rhino shenanigans and put the sorcerers on bikes, +1 toughness is golden.

My autocannons literally just arrived, so I will be switching them out. I will also drop the rhinos and exchange the csm unit to a cultist blob to give me more points. Is a sicaran better with malific ammo and bolters or lascannons for the sponsons?





Edit, out of curiosity, because I happen to have a bunch of bits, would sorcerers with jump packs ever be a good idea?

sturgeondtd wrote:
My autocannons literally just arrived, so I will be switching them out. I will also drop the rhinos and exchange the csm unit to a cultist blob to give me more points. Is a sicaran better with malific ammo and bolters or lascannons for the sponsons?





Edit, out of curiosity, because I happen to have a bunch of bits, would sorcerers with jump packs ever be a good idea?

If your running that many cultists, might I suggest the Crimson Slaughter formation: Cult of Slaughter. 2-8 units of cultists and a dark apostle, bringing back D6 cultists per unit is off the chain!! I would run a Sicarian without sponsons, the juiced up autocannons are pretty sweet by themselves and it frees up more points for all those cultist squads. lol I can't see where jump packs on Sorcerers would be very useful, they are made to hang back and buff units, not charge forward into melee.

Most of what has been said is on the ball.
- drop all the rhinos and the 5 CSM
- drop the 2 sorcerers in the CAD
- take a dark apostle and a second cultist blob and run Crimson Slaughter (as mentioned above)
- put the Cabal on bikes
- get 1 or prefereably 2 CSM biker units to put them in. give the bikers nurgle if you can (T6 ablative wounds are golden). if you dont have the points then run units of spawn instead
- swap the 6 LCs for 8 autos

I'd probably only be running telepathy on 2 of the sorcerers. That should be enough to get you invis, and with either two or all three of the sorcerers in one bike unit youll only be able to use shriek with one of them.

JPs do have a place on sorcerers, but that place is not here.

The problem of moving the cultists to a Cults of Slaughter formation is that my CAD would no longer be legal, so I would either have to find a way to get a sicaran and 2 havocs, or find a new set of units for adding the extra fire power


Forgot to mention, I would not be running the cabal sorcerers as a single unit. Each will be an individual on the table top, maybe even attached to the cultists, but never more than 1

sturgeondtd wrote:
The problem of moving the cultists to a Cults of Slaughter formation is that my CAD would no longer be legal, so I would either have to find a way to get a sicaran and 2 havocs, or find a new set of units for adding the extra fire power

This is a good point. Id still be running cultists instead of CSM regardless, and then maybe take a warpsmith as HQ.

Forgot to mention, I would not be running the cabal sorcerers as a single unit. Each will be an individual on the table top, maybe even attached to the cultists, but never more than 1

If you can get 2 bike units (or spawn if need be) I'd run two sorcerers in one and one in the other. You want them mobile and protected. That being said I suppose you could run one in each bike unit and the third backfield with a havoc unit. I'd still run him on a bike both for the T5 and to be able to split of late game. keeping him on the bike also means you can choose to hold back whichever sorcerer rolls invis (to use on the knight), rather than relying on the one foot sorc to get it.

Updated list is as follows,

Chaos Renegade Knight 470 pts
Renegade Knight: 2 Avenger Gatling Cannons, Heavy Stubber, Icarus Autocannon

Chaos Space Marine CAD 750 pts

HQ
Sorcerer: Warlord, Bike, Mastery Level 1, Spell Familiar (Telepathy)

Troops
Cultists: x20
Cultists: x20

Fast Attack
Chaos Biker: x3

Heavy Support
Relic Sicaran: Lascannon Sponsons, TL Accelerator Autocannon, Heavy Bolter, Extra Armor
Havocs: x5, Autocannon x4
Havocs: x5, Autocannon x4

Black Legion Supplement, Cyclopia Cabal 315 pts
Sorcerer: Bike, Mastery Level 2, VoTLW, Spell Familiar (Telepathy)
Sorcerer: Bike, Mastery Level 2, VoTLW, Spell Familiar (Telepathy)
Sorcerer: Bike, Mastery Level 2, VoTLW, Spell Familiar (Telepathy)

I have 55 points remaining, if I did take off the lascannons from the sicaran, I would have 95 (if I exchange for hvy bolters and maelific ammo on the tank it would bring me back down to 35 points remaining)

I'd be making room for that second bike squad. Drop the sponsons and you can give both units Nurgle. This greatly improves the flexibility and durability of the sorcerers. Otherwise looks good

I dropped 4 cultists total and brought in another squad of bikers. I am left with a single point and could drop the Lasc. and give them MoN (I would then have 5 points left over, as I only need 35 more points to give each biker squad the mark)

sturgeondtd wrote:
I dropped 4 cultists total and brought in another squad of bikers. I am left with a single point and could drop the Lasc. and give them MoN (I would then have 5 points left over, as I only need 35 more points to give each biker squad the mark)

Nice. I think its worth it for MoN. Just give someone melta bombs with the extra points