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Walnuts wrote: To the gents who suggested tripping a titan, oh my god you're ignoring the sort of inertia something that big and heavy has. That would be like trying to trip a moving skyscraper, or, to compare to a skyscraper like object that actually moves, that tank think NASA uses to move around vertical rockets.
Also, I wouldn't imagine titans walking the way humans run. When you run you're effectively in a controlled free fall. You can't at any time stop your motion and retain that position exactly. If you do a more robotic motion of raising one leg, moving it forward, fully placing it down, then repeating with the other leg, you won't really be tripable.
NOW, to the OP, according to the rules, 'dragons teeth', ie, totally contemporary tank traps, ie concrete cubes about 3 feet in height, are impassible terrain to all vehicles that don't ignore terrain. This means super heavy walkers. THIS MEANS YOU, EMPEROR TITAN. Therefore a titan can't step over a 3 foot cube, and it cannot jump. THERE, QUESTION ANSWERED.
Its kinda funny to imagaine a to fluff giant unstoppable moving fortress halted by a 3 food concrete cube,,,,
Sgt. Vanden - OOC Hey, that was your doing. I didn't choose to fly in the "Dongerprise'.
"May the odds be ever in your favour"
Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:
I have no clue how Dakka's moderation work. I expect it involves throwing a lot of d100 and looking at many random tables.
FudgeDumper - It could be that you are just so uncomfortable with the idea of your chapters primarch having his way with a docile tyranid spore cyst, that you must deny they have any feelings at all.
I was done with 40k (in favor of 30k) before geomancy ever appeared,
BUT
I would love to see a bunch of geomancers surround an enemy titan with dragon's teeth, that would really be such an ultimate troll move
2,500 points of warlord tied up be a few naked Liberians...
Lol Rage the rage!
Sgt. Vanden - OOC Hey, that was your doing. I didn't choose to fly in the "Dongerprise'.
"May the odds be ever in your favour"
Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:
I have no clue how Dakka's moderation work. I expect it involves throwing a lot of d100 and looking at many random tables.
FudgeDumper - It could be that you are just so uncomfortable with the idea of your chapters primarch having his way with a docile tyranid spore cyst, that you must deny they have any feelings at all.
jhe90 wrote: 2,500 points of warlord tied up be a few naked Liberians...
Lol Rage the rage!
Or better yet, if you knew in advance that you were facing a melee-centric superheavy, like a brass scorpion, specifically take a librarian conclave and like four sets of dragon's teeth just to fence it in. Would rule so hard.
'cause, as funny as it would be, fencing in a warlord or a reaver wouldn't do much
"Oh well, guess I'll just launch my vortex missiles at you from over here."
jhe90 wrote: 2,500 points of warlord tied up be a few naked Liberians...
Lol Rage the rage!
Doesn't it have a rule stating it can't be locked in combat?
Its not in combat, its by the Geomancy power Dragon's Teeth which puts a layer of terrain on the field which is impassable to all vehicles except skimmers and flyers.
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Close, deadshot, but that's not exactly how it works. There's a geokinesis power you need to roll a 6 for that lets you re-deploy a piece of terrain up to 24" from where it started. If you purchase a piece of terrain from the stronghold assault book like an aegis defense line, you can then purchase up to six obstacles that can each be 6" long. Tank traps are 15 points and that's what you'd be using here (I erroneously called them 'dragon's teeth' because that's what they were called IRL). You'd realistically need to move about 3 of them to immobilize your target, but if your target is a 900 point brass scorpion, shoot, just drop your 100 pts worth of fortifications, and then 800 points worth of geomancers and hope for the best!
I'd try for it at least once just to unlock the god-tier 40k troll achievement.
We should really be talking about range of motion for a warhound instead. Scout titans being agiler is plausible, though likely jet assist would be required. A warlord, not a chance in hell is it going to leap, and I think it is going to be very stiff with regards to other range of motion.
n'oublie jamais - It appears I now have to highlight this again.
It is by tea alone I set my mind in motion. By the juice of the brew my thoughts aquire speed, my mind becomes strained, the strain becomes a warning. It is by tea alone I set my mind in motion.
Orlanth wrote: We should really be talking about range of motion for a warhound instead. Scout titans being agiler is plausible, though likely jet assist would be required. A warlord, not a chance in hell is it going to leap, and I think it is going to be very stiff with regards to other range of motion.
Warhound has a leg design that suits speed more. The battle titans have huge wide legs braced like towers to withstand the massive recoil of the guns. They go slow, solid, and heavy. Reaver is more braced, the warlord and the emperors are massive braced towers and slow solid footed machines.
Sgt. Vanden - OOC Hey, that was your doing. I didn't choose to fly in the "Dongerprise'.
"May the odds be ever in your favour"
Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:
I have no clue how Dakka's moderation work. I expect it involves throwing a lot of d100 and looking at many random tables.
FudgeDumper - It could be that you are just so uncomfortable with the idea of your chapters primarch having his way with a docile tyranid spore cyst, that you must deny they have any feelings at all.
Tyranids - Like I mentioned, Psychic fields. Generally anything that can use psychic in this setting kicks physics to the curb. Otherwise the Hierophant should have imploded in a shower of gore the moment it made planetfall.
Yes, physics wise, they have to be completely different from normal organics or their guts would immediately tear through their skin and spill onto the ground.
Planet fall might be an issue, but they are not going to just fall apart on the ground - they are not that large. Plenty of dinosaurs are larger than Tyranids bio Titans are supposed to be. It would need to be fairly light to have the leg structure it does (it would make more sense for smaller Tyranids to have sprawling legs and the big ones to have them set under the body) but it's doable.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/07/11 19:49:14
Replying to the above -
Tyranids are actually pretty good at engineering and obeying physics as far as 40k races go. (THIS DOES NOT MEAN THEY ARE GOOD BY REAL WORLD STANDARDS). To quote one of my characters in another thread-
Spoiler:
Verviedi wrote:
Science done properly assumes for every probable outcome by testing each variable to a point where there is very little uncertainty. For example, take the humble fusion reactor. Ancient scientists on Old Earth perfected the device, allowing a fusion reactor to fit into devices as small as a toaster oven. They had no Old Tech or Xenotech to work off of, they simply, over decades, tested each possible method of making a safe, practical fusion reactor, and stuck with the best option. Even the plasma containment shielding was tested at different temperatures and possible breach situation.
The Men of Iron weren't tested that way. By the time they were made, the proud scientific tradition and ethics of the Dark Age of Technology were gone. The Men of Iron were slaves designed for war, slaves given free will and capabilities far beyond any human. Personally, I'm surprised that they took that long to rebel against their masters. It is proven time and time again that when the Scientific Method is thrown away, nothing good ever comes out of it. The Axis of the 2cd millennium performed much of what they believed was science. It was not. They had no concept of ethics or the scientific method. Their "science" was little more than in innovative torture.
The Mechanicus is much the same. They turn sapient humans into slaves, instead of getting past their fear to build a nonsapient servant robot. They have the technology, we know that from their Kastellan engines and servo-skulls. Sometimes, I think they're parodying the dark status of the galaxy, as their work is so nonsensical as to be worthless in any truly advanced society.
The Eldar, also, are guilty of breaking with the scientific method. They do not innovate, preferring to use the same ancient methods that they brought with them when the craftworlds first escaped the Eye of Terror. Instead of inventing new methods to fight an enemy, they simply use the same tactics that have worked for thousands of years. What happens when psychic might is not enough, and they have forgotten how to create truly new ideas?
Even the Necrontyr, for all of their god-tech, are also guilty. They have become arrogant in their technological superiority, not bothering to adapt their wonders to any purpose but war. What happens if they wipe out or imprison every other sentient race, and seal off the warp from realspace? They can only destroy, not build new and greater things. They may have used the scientific method, millions of years ago, but now they care not for reason or innovation.
The Tau and the Orks, surprisingly, are the least guilty of doing bad science. The Orks innovate, but they have no concept of the scientific method. They care not for safety or basic practicallity. The Tau, however... As usual, they are the best hope for the concept of the scientific method to survive the galactic war. They still do bad science occasionally, but at least they care. At least they understand that in science, you have to throw away your ideology and declare that you are wrong, occasionally.
And then... We have the Tyranids. They are hands down the single best scientists and innovators in the galaxy. The Hive Mind is capable of analyzing and creating new life to the best of its abilities. If the Hive Mind didn't understand the scientific method, I'm a fish.
Compare the Heirophant to the Warhound, as they fulfill the same purpose. The Warhound has not changed in milennia. It is incapable of functioning in low-visibility, high-interference environments, and cannot right itself if it falls. In addition, in marshy areas or areas with soft ground, it often gets stuck or trips. The Heirophant, on the other hand, is redesigned for each individual situation it is deployed in. The Hive Mind perfectly tailors each Heirophant to the planet it's attacking, using data gained from expendable vanguard organisms. It identifies a problem, which is "How can I capture this planet?" It does research by scouting the planet and its defenses using its first wave and infiltration organisms. It forms a hypothesis using the available data as to the best way to solve the problem of how to capture the planet. It then tests with different possible configurations of attack organisms making use of the data it's gained. That is the experiment. If the procedure, which is the attack wave, fails, it designs another possible solution to the problem, or experiment. If it succeeds, it reflects on the data gained, stores it, and uses it to continue capturing planets. Finally, it communicates the data it gained to other Tyranid fleets when it comes in contact with them.
Isn't it sad when a species that lives only to consume is the best user of the scientific method in the galaxy?
Peregrine - If you like the army buy it, and don't worry about what one random person on the internet thinks.
Tyranids - Like I mentioned, Psychic fields. Generally anything that can use psychic in this setting kicks physics to the curb. Otherwise the Hierophant should have imploded in a shower of gore the moment it made planetfall.
Yes, physics wise, they have to be completely different from normal organics or their guts would immediately tear through their skin and spill onto the ground.
Planet fall might be an issue, but they are not going to just fall apart on the ground - they are not that large. Plenty of dinosaurs are larger than Tyranids bio Titans are supposed to be. It would need to be fairly light to have the leg structure it does (it would make more sense for smaller Tyranids to have sprawling legs and the big ones to have them set under the body) but it's doable.
Respectfully, when we say biotitans we mean this correct? Thats substantially larger than any dinosaur discovered. These don't seem plausible in an earth or greater level gravity well..
https://www.forgeworld.co.uk/en-ES/Tyranid-Hierophant-Bio-Titan but of course we can agree to disagree.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Raven911 wrote: I hear the slaneesh Titans have been known to skip...
You sir, win the thread.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/07/12 13:07:41
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I like to revise my answer we are all thinking in terms of earth g like the Terran monkeys that we are. All titans can jump, how high just depends on the g field that they are in.
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In response to the OP, the thought of a Warlord Titan jumping is the same as picturing an elephant jumping...i.e. it's not happening.
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Walnuts wrote: To the gents who suggested tripping a titan, oh my god you're ignoring the sort of inertia something that big and heavy has. That would be like trying to trip a moving skyscraper, or, to compare to a skyscraper like object that actually moves, that tank think NASA uses to move around vertical rockets.
Also, I wouldn't imagine titans walking the way humans run. When you run you're effectively in a controlled free fall. You can't at any time stop your motion and retain that position exactly. If you do a more robotic motion of raising one leg, moving it forward, fully placing it down, then repeating with the other leg, you won't really be tripable.
NOW, to the OP, according to the rules, 'dragons teeth', ie, totally contemporary tank traps, ie concrete cubes about 3 feet in height, are impassible terrain to all vehicles that don't ignore terrain. This means super heavy walkers. THIS MEANS YOU, EMPEROR TITAN. Therefore a titan can't step over a 3 foot cube, and it cannot jump. THERE, QUESTION ANSWERED.
Its kinda funny to imagaine a to fluff giant unstoppable moving fortress halted by a 3 food concrete cube,,,,