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Jousting might be most associated with ancient knights of the Middle Ages, but a new campaign claims it should take its place as an Olympic sport alongside modern events such as weightlifting and tennis.

The campaign by English Heritage aims to secure a place at the Olympics for one of the oldest equestrian sports in the world.

The charity, which hosts jousting events at its castles in England in the summer, claims modern jousters need the same levels of fitness, skill and strength as many of the competitors heading to this summer's games in Rio de Janeiro.

The sport involves competitors with 44lb (20kg) of armour holding lances 12ft (3.7m) long, racing towards each other on horseback at a gallop of up to 30mph, and English Heritage says it shares similarities with Olympic sports from fencing to equestrian eventing.

English Heritage, which insists the campaign is not a publicity stunt, accepts that any road to the Olympics for the event would be a long one. However, the organisation said the sport has international appeal with jousting tournaments held in countries from Belgium to New Zealand, as well as in England.

A form of jousting is the official state sport of Maryland in the US, where a campaign is trying to get jousting established as a recognised equestrian sport.

With the International Olympic Committee (IOC) aiming to encourage innovation in the programme, host city Tokyo has put forward five sports -- karate, skateboarding, sports climbing, surfing and baseball/softball -- for the 2020 games

English Heritage's head of projects Lucy Hutchings said: "We want to see jousting take its rightful place at the Olympics table.

"It is one of the oldest equestrian sports in the world, with its roots in Ancient Greece, and requires similar levels of athleticism and artistry as other official Olympic sports.

"Jousting is a wonderful dramatic spectacle, it is fantastic to watch knights in action against the backdrop of our castles, it would be even better to see it on the Olympics stage."

English Heritage's jousting expert Dominic Sewell added: "Jousting is a sport that requires a huge amount of skill and involves a daily training regime.

"You have to be strong, not just physically but mentally, so you can sit fearlessly in your saddle, face your rival, and offer yourself as a target.

"And just like the Olympic British equestrian team, we ride beautiful horses to an exceptional level."

So in.....way so in. I would actually call in sick just to watch this in 2020


Edit

Yepper...the "j********g was done on purpose for the Brits who know that word like the back of their hands

I would 100% watch jousting and I could not care less for the olympics, generally.

I watched it on tv once.... Ot was like a game show or something there was two teams and it was like 6 weeks long.....

Very boring loke very, they ran at each other then it looked like a fat guy falling of a horse really cumbersome then a twenty or so minite reset. Also one of the horses got a splinter in his leg. Never seen it since it was on oln I think.

Might be interesting to watch. I think I'd prefer to see something a bit more dynamic though. I'd love to see HEMA Longsword or Dussack.

OgreChubbs wrote:
I watched it on tv once.... Ot was like a game show or something there was two teams and it was like 6 weeks long.....

Very boring loke very, they ran at each other then it looked like a fat guy falling of a horse really cumbersome then a twenty or so minite reset. Also one of the horses got a splinter in his leg. Never seen it since it was on oln I think.

So it's like sabre?

Two guys run at each other with steel girders ... on horseback.

Lacking the artistry or ponce of epee or foil.

I'm not super familiar with the rules of jousting, but after a guy gets knocked off his horse, they sometimes have a melee, right?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
also, I just realized this is probably one of the best places on the internet to ask this question:

when using a lance in actual war, how did that work? Like, was it a one-time use - when you speared a guy, did it get stuck?

I assumed it would be a one-and-done technique...

Presumably used to break entrenched lines?

 Ouze wrote:
I'm not super familiar with the rules of jousting, but after a guy gets knocked off his horse, they sometimes have a melee, right?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
also, I just realized this is probably one of the best places on the internet to ask this question:

when using a lance in actual war, how did that work? Like, was it a one-time use - when you speared a guy, did it get stuck?

Well...I can attest the individual get pierced from the front and as they go by the winner arm pivots along with the lance as the loser slides off the lance....actually I've seen it without armor on. I say if the lance hit the gap in armor then its a through and through along with some serious torn flesh as it comes out different then the way it went in. Figure a serious dent in the breastplate and shoulder armor...head..wait. Splinters in the eyes. but I am sure they have protective wear on under helmet.

 Ouze wrote:
when using a lance in actual war, how did that work? Like, was it a one-time use - when you speared a guy, did it get stuck?

So, I been reading up on medieval warfare and it would seem that a charge was almost nothing like Hollywood makes it seem.

For a group of knights with lances to be successful, their best bet is for the enemy to be spread out a bit, particularly, they should be breaking and running. There are a number of books that make mention of how we have records of various medieval battles and these accounts talk about knights making 5 or 6 charges in one day... but the leading theory right now is that a "charge" was merely the act of going forward, many German Knight's diaries that survive today apparently talk about being scared gakless, and wheeling about before the charge hits. (Namely because charging a pike square is undoubtedly gonna feth you up about as much as the infantry dudes)


So... As to what would happen when a charge actually hits home... From what I can tell through reading, the size of the lance meant that often times, if the tip actually did pierce someone, the force of the impact would either break the lance, or wrench it out of the riders hands. This is one of the biggest reasons why mounted knights still carried swords, axes, maces or whatever other hand weapons they preferred, because a full speed charge means that you're gonna basically be surrounded (especially, considering as I mentioned before, they're gonna charge a loosely formed element that has spaces, not a properly formed pike block), and just sitting there hoping your pony can get moving again is asking to be killed or maimed or captured.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Ouze wrote:
I'm not super familiar with the rules of jousting, but after a guy gets knocked off his horse, they sometimes have a melee, right?

Also... I feel I should point out that the melee and the joust are two completely different, and separate events.

In fact, the joust as we would commonly envision it wasn't necessarily the proscribed manner of holding a tourney. For instance, we know that various Louis' and Henry's held jousting tournaments in which they'd basically take 50 competitors, divide them up into teams of 25 and have the teams charge all at once, until there was declared a winner (via all other competitors withdrawing, being unhorsed, injured, or killed)

 Ouze wrote:

Automatically Appended Next Post:
also, I just realized this is probably one of the best places on the internet to ask this question:

when using a lance in actual war, how did that work? Like, was it a one-time use - when you speared a guy, did it get stuck?

Kinda depends on the time period in question and the place that the lancer is from as different culture's and time changed the way the generally used a lance in a charge but in general the lance is really a giant lever for the weight and momentum of the rider. Upon impact to a poor victim the poor sod go's flying for a bit before crashing back to earth and hopefully knocking a a good portion of his mate's around with him. Which achieves the main aim for all cavalry; the disruption of an enemy formation. As far as skewering a person on them, that can happen though most lances are more blunt then sharp and so it was rare but could happen. In which case either the lance broke from the guy's weight or the lancer would drop it. As far as the weapon itself it would be lucky if you could get more the one use out of it per charge; breakage or just plain losing your grip on it would see most lancers being dis-armed after the first charge.

That all being said it really matters on what type of charge you are going for. A cycle charge would see you hit an enemy formation and charge right through, trying not to lose your momentum fighting the enemy and have break out of it and reform and rearm yourself out so you could do it all over again.(The polish-lithuanian lancer of the 15th to 16th century really perfected this type of charge, i.e the Winged Hussar's) Or you could do something like a continuous charge like which Ensis Ferrae pointed out. Where a spaced out formation of cavalry would charge in waves, with the heaviest armed and armored would be in the first wave with light equipped cavalry in later waves. The first wave would hit and instead of trying to break from the enemy line they would get stuck in, dropping lances if they had them and getting what every secondary melee weapon was needed. Substance waves of the lighter armed cavalry would hit after the heavies got it in until the enemy line broke.

Hope that helps a bit though I am sure someone more knowledgeable could explain better or more, but that is the cliff notes of the lance.

I'm not super familiar with the rules of jousting, but after a guy gets knocked off his horse, they sometimes have a melee, right?

In modern theatrical jousting no, but in the actual medieval jousting yes. The fact is that medieval jousting was more a training exercise to keep the skills of knights sharp even during peace time. So it was not uncommon that a fight would continue after a man was unhorsed, with either him fighting his opponent on horse back or sometime the other guy would dismount and would continue the fight on the ground. In generally this jousting is a lot more martial and bloody, with death or maiming an opponent a common thing. It was in the end a training tool for war. Also it had the added bonus of keeping the murderous armored thugs happy and distracted so they don't go around and cause trouble for their lords. It's not until the 15th century dose Jousting start to become more like a sport then a military exercise.

Sounds boring. I mean, it'd be interesting to watch once, and might be interesting to go to an actual real life event once, but it sounds like a terrible spectator sport.

The risk of injury and death would probably be the only thing keeping people entertained.

I would like to see paintball turned into an Olympic sport more I would have said airsoft but those kids are special and need mental help

AllSeeingSkink wrote:
Sounds boring. I mean, it'd be interesting to watch once, and might be interesting to go to an actual real life event once, but it sounds like a terrible spectator sport.

The risk of injury and death would probably be the only thing keeping people entertained.

Seriously? The Olympics have a dozen events that are running fast. How could this possibly be more boring than watching people run in circles or a straight line?

I'd like to see it. It's sort of the biathlon of horseback riding. You have to ride well, and spear somebody at the end of it. Plus imagine lance or helmet mounted cameras.

Be fun.

But not as much as full armoured combat.
First to a x hits or a knock down

Axes, swords, sheilds and hammers!

Joust
Close combat
Mounted swordsmanship
Archery with historic bows

The historic games

Jousting?! Olympics?! Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes...........

Wait... the British are pushing for jousting to be an Olympic sport...? Are they doing it because they think it will be a sport that most everybody else will be rather poor at, and therefore they will have an easy gold medal (kinda like the US with basketball)..? Because if so, somebody should tell them that the State Sport of Maryland is jousting.

AllSeeingSkink wrote:
Sounds boring. I mean, it'd be interesting to watch once, and might be interesting to go to an actual real life event once, but it sounds like a terrible spectator sport.

The risk of injury and death would probably be the only thing keeping people entertained.

Would you watch it more if they introduced prematch drama, a la WWE??

Will we still have ladies tying their favors to the lances of the knights before the joust?

And whatever happened with the push for darts to be an Olympic sport?

I was under the impression that the Olympics did not allow any sport or game involving non-human animals?

Edit : oh well, I must have been thinking about the Cirque du Soleil. Never cared for equestrian sports anyway.

 Kovnik Obama wrote:
I was under the impression that the Olympics did not allow any sport or game involving non-human animals?

The Olympics have equestrian events, just nobody really pays much attention to them unless they have seven figure income typically, the audience is rather limited

 Dreadclaw69 wrote:
Will we still have ladies tying their favors to the lances of the knights before the joust?

And whatever happened with the push for darts to be an Olympic sport?

Darts is a pub sport at best...
Its not as popular as was. Same with snooker etc.

And "combative" sports are there... Judo, wrestling, fencing etc.
Equestrian is a expensive one to enter though. The horses alone are ... Eye watering.
How you get them across the globe.... Challenges.

Jousting on the Olympics? No. Boring. What we need to restore to its rightful glory is a truly ancient and entertaining to watch sport: Gladiatorial combat!
Bring gladiators to the Olympics and you have my interest.

 Iron_Captain wrote:
Jousting on the Olympics? No. Boring. What we need to restore to its rightful glory is a truly ancient and entertaining to watch sport: Gladiatorial combat!
Bring gladiators to the Olympics and you have my interest.

Australia is perfecting that now. We had a thread on it awhile back.
I gladly took the warning of one word post
"Awesome"

I'd love it if jousting became an Olympic event. The problem is, people in charge of the Olympics probably would be concerned about the safety of it. That's probably why jai alai is not an Olympic sport. Or muy thai fighting.

When I was a teenager I actually thought about trying to convince my friends to try jousting with me, using bmx bikes, trash can lids and mop or broom handles. That would probably not have ended well, so just as well we never did it.

It's worth pointing out that this is just a local sporting group trying to make a case for themselves. They would need to get the British Olympic committee on board, then from there they'd have to establish to the International Olympic Committee that their sport has a large playing base, and would generate enough interest relative to the cost of running the sport. And then there's also a million other considerations, like how it impacts the gender balance in Olympic events.

These guys haven't even gotten to step one, and they almost certainly won't. The Olympics isn't keen on sport with a focus on violence or a serious risk of injury. Boxing is there but its amateur rules, so full head gear and very short bouts with points scored for landing solid connections. And when you add in the animals and the perception of risk to those animals, well this ain't gonna happen.

 Ensis Ferrae wrote:

AllSeeingSkink wrote:
Sounds boring. I mean, it'd be interesting to watch once, and might be interesting to go to an actual real life event once, but it sounds like a terrible spectator sport.

The risk of injury and death would probably be the only thing keeping people entertained.

Would you watch it more if they introduced prematch drama, a la WWE??

You joke, but... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Full_Metal_Jousting
This has contrived drama, storylines and occasional jousting.

One dude deliberately struck a horse and nearly got barred.

 Iron_Captain wrote:
Jousting on the Olympics? No. Boring. What we need to restore to its rightful glory is a truly ancient and entertaining to watch sport: Gladiatorial combat!
Bring gladiators to the Olympics and you have my interest.

Nah, what we really need is to restore the rightful glory of all of the athletes competing naked. That will get the ratings up.

Well, it would certainly be more interesting to watch than Golf - which frankly should never have been made an Olympic sport, IMO.

I would watch this so hard I would have an aneurysm.

I think once you have reduced jousting to the style it would encompass as an olympic sport. Coverd in corporate logos with plastic modern helmets and armour in gaudy colours I am thinking English heritage will not like the idea.

Especially if a safety minded government then insisted the olympic standard equipment gaudy plastic armour was required for all.

On top of this horse strikes would remain a problem, however rare but now accentuated by media interest. With jousting becoming more common by volume of taining horses will get injury and then bam! animal rights activits will be on everyones arse.

It only takes one horse to be skewered on tv because two clown teams compete for thew whole concept of tourney to be endangered.

Jousting needs to remain under the radar. It was lucky to survive new Labour and did so because it was quietly popular.