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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/08/04 13:46:24
Subject: National Institutes of Health to alter Laws of Alchemy, allow Human Transmutation
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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http://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2016/08/04/488387729/nih-plans-to-lift-ban-on-research-funds-for-part-human-part-animal-embryos
The federal government announced plans Thursday to lift a moratorium on funding of controversial experiments that use human stem cells to create animal embryos that are partly human.
The National Institutes of Health is proposing a new policy to permit scientists to get federal money to make embryos, known as chimeras, under certain carefully monitored conditions.
The NIH imposed a moratorium on funding these experiments in September because they could raise ethical concerns.
One issue is that scientists might inadvertently create animals that have partly human brains, endowing them with some semblance of human consciousness or human thinking abilities. Another is that they could develop into animals with human sperm and eggs and breed, producing human embryos or fetuses inside animals or hybrid creatures.
But scientists have argued that they could take steps to prevent those outcomes and that the embryos provide invaluable tools for medical research.
For example, scientists hope to use the embryos to create animal models of human diseases, which could lead to new ways to prevent and treat illnesses. Researchers also hope to produce sheep, pigs and cows with human hearts, kidneys, livers, pancreases and possibly other organs that could be used for transplants.
To address the ethical concerns, the NIH's new policy imposes several restrictions.
The policy prohibits the introduction of any human cells into embryos of nonhuman primates, such as monkeys and chimps, at their early stages of development. Previously, the NIH wouldn't allow such experiments that involved human stem cells but it didn't address the use of other types of human cells that scientists have created. In addition, the old rules didn't bar adding the cells very early in embryonic development.
The extra protections are being added because these animals are so closely related to humans.
But the policy would lift the moratorium on funding experiments involving other species. Because of the ethical concerns, though, at least some of the experiments would go through an extra layer of review by a new, special committee of government officials.
That committee would, for example, consider experiments designed to create animals with human brain cells or human brain tissue. Scientists might want to create them to study neurological conditions such as Alzheimer's and Parkinson's diseases. But the experiments would undergo intensive scrutiny if there's any chance there might be a "substantial contribution" or "substantial functional modification" to an animal's brain.
In addition, the NIH would even consider experiments that could create animals with human sperm and human eggs since they may be useful for studying human development and infertility. But in that case steps would have to be taken to prevent the animals from breeding.
"I am confident that these proposed changes will enable the NIH research community to move this promising area of science forward in a responsible manner," Carrie Wolinetz, the NIH's associate director for science policy, wrote in a blog post.
"At the end of the day, we want to make sure this research progresses because its very important to our understanding of disease. It's important to our mission to improve human health," she said in an interview with NPR. "But we also want to make sure there's an extra set of eyes on these projects because they do have this ethical set of concerns associated with them."
Several scientists said they are thrilled by the new policy. "It's very, very welcome news that NIH will consider funding this type of research," says Pablo Ross, a developmental biologist at the University of California, Davis, trying to grow human organs in farm animals. "We need funding to be able to answer some very important questions."
But critics denounced the decision. "Science fiction writers might have imagined worlds like this — like The Island of Dr. Moreau, Brave New World, Frankenstein," says Stuart Newman, a biologist at New York Medical College. "They've been speculations. But now they're becoming more real. And I think that we just can't say that since it's possible then let's do it."
The public has 30 days to comment on the proposed new policy. NIH could start funding projects as early as the start of 2017.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/08/04 13:58:07
Subject: National Institutes of Health to alter Laws of Alchemy, allow Human Transmutation
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Incorporating Wet-Blending
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I have long though that growing human compatible replacement organs would be a huge boon to medicine. For example, a pig with human compatible heart for transplants. Such animals should not be used for consumption, for obvious reasons.
The doomsaying is overblown. (The biologist quoted obviously didn't realize only one of the works he named even involved crossing man with animals.) So long as ethical safeguards and monitoring are in place, it's far less a risk than some of the stuff that has been done with engineered food or viruses, for example.
Also, Manbearpig.
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-James
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/08/04 14:11:37
Subject: National Institutes of Health to alter Laws of Alchemy, allow Human Transmutation
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Hangin' with Gork & Mork
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Amidst the mists and coldest frosts he thrusts his fists against the posts and still insists he sees the ghosts.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/08/04 14:28:11
Subject: National Institutes of Health to alter Laws of Alchemy, allow Human Transmutation
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Dark Angels Librarian with Book of Secrets
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jmurph wrote:I have long though that growing human compatible replacement organs would be a huge boon to medicine. For example, a pig with human compatible heart for transplants. Such animals should not be used for consumption, for obvious reasons.
The doomsaying is overblown. (The biologist quoted obviously didn't realize only one of the works he named even involved crossing man with animals.) So long as ethical safeguards and monitoring are in place, it's far less a risk than some of the stuff that has been done with engineered food or viruses, for example.
Is the doomsaying overblown? Yes, science has made some great strides, but don't forget that it can have unintended consequences, like when Australia tried to make mice impotent and accidentally created a super pox virus.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/08/04 14:33:33
Subject: National Institutes of Health to alter Laws of Alchemy, allow Human Transmutation
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Veteran Inquisitorial Tyranid Xenokiller
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Has science gone too far?
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Brb learning to play.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/08/04 14:36:08
Subject: National Institutes of Health to alter Laws of Alchemy, allow Human Transmutation
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Stealthy Warhound Titan Princeps
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Not nearly far enough.
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Prestor Jon wrote:Because children don't have any legal rights until they're adults. A minor is the responsiblity of the parent and has no legal rights except through his/her legal guardian or parent. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/08/04 14:46:58
Subject: National Institutes of Health to alter Laws of Alchemy, allow Human Transmutation
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Tzeentch Veteran Marine with Psychic Potential
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jmurph wrote:The biologist quoted obviously didn't realize only one of the works he named even involved crossing man with animals.
But they do involve scientists 'playing god' and fiddling with the way life is created.
The researchers are doing this because they aren't allowed to test on human subjects and so want to create 'almost, but legally not-human' test subjects.
This is a step down from vat grown slaves the mechanicus use for servitors and harvesting geneseed.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/08/04 14:52:10
Subject: National Institutes of Health to alter Laws of Alchemy, allow Human Transmutation
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Longtime Dakkanaut
Sheffield, City of University and Northern-ness
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Oooooooh, progress!
You absolute rotter. I had managed to forget that scene.
On a related note, a couple of jokes:
The cow goes " moo"
The horse goes "neigh"
The cat goes "meow"
The dog goes "Eddddd-waaaaaard"
Shao Tucker - Father of the year.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/08/04 15:13:22
Subject: Re:National Institutes of Health to alter Laws of Alchemy, allow Human Transmutation
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Rampaging Reaver Titan Princeps
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Exciting stuff.
However, should the scientists involved in these experiments indulge in insane laughter, pull on large throw switches which spark and dim the lights and they all look like this:
I'd recommend keeping a close eye on them
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/08/04 15:32:50
Subject: National Institutes of Health to alter Laws of Alchemy, allow Human Transmutation
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Longtime Dakkanaut
Building a blood in water scent
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Yes, yes... good. One step closer to making my fever dreams a reality!
You frigging D-Bees don't stand a chance!
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We were once so close to heaven, St. Peter came out and gave us medals; declaring us "The nicest of the damned".
“Anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.'” |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/08/04 17:20:02
Subject: National Institutes of Health to alter Laws of Alchemy, allow Human Transmutation
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Highlord with a Blackstone Fortress
Adrift within the vortex of my imagination.
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The sources of the embryos sperm should be made specific.
People make donations to sperm/egg banks intentionally so an unknown parents can have a child. They might be less happy if said 'child' is 'half dog'.
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n'oublie jamais - It appears I now have to highlight this again.
It is by tea alone I set my mind in motion. By the juice of the brew my thoughts aquire speed, my mind becomes strained, the strain becomes a warning. It is by tea alone I set my mind in motion. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/08/04 17:23:17
Subject: National Institutes of Health to alter Laws of Alchemy, allow Human Transmutation
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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Orlanth wrote:The sources of the embryos sperm should be made specific.
People make donations to sperm/egg banks intentionally so an unknown parents can have a child. They might be less happy if said 'child' is 'half dog'.
A lot of places have a "unused specimens may be used for medical research" clause in their consent forms. I think there was recently a ruling/decision/something in the US that clarified that the generic "may be used for research" is all that is needed to pretty much do whatever you want with it.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/08/04 17:30:41
Subject: National Institutes of Health to alter Laws of Alchemy, allow Human Transmutation
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5th God of Chaos! (Ho-hum)
Curb stomping in the Eye of Terror!
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d-usa wrote: Orlanth wrote:The sources of the embryos sperm should be made specific.
People make donations to sperm/egg banks intentionally so an unknown parents can have a child. They might be less happy if said 'child' is 'half dog'.
A lot of places have a "unused specimens may be used for medical research" clause in their consent forms. I think there was recently a ruling/decision/something in the US that clarified that the generic "may be used for research" is all that is needed to pretty much do whatever you want with it.
Woah... so an The Island of Doctor Moreau could actually be a thing?
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Live Ork, Be Ork. or D'Ork!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/08/04 17:32:21
Subject: National Institutes of Health to alter Laws of Alchemy, allow Human Transmutation
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Lady of the Lake
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Not yet, but they're trying thankfully.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/08/04 17:36:03
Subject: National Institutes of Health to alter Laws of Alchemy, allow Human Transmutation
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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whembly wrote: d-usa wrote: Orlanth wrote:The sources of the embryos sperm should be made specific.
People make donations to sperm/egg banks intentionally so an unknown parents can have a child. They might be less happy if said 'child' is 'half dog'.
A lot of places have a "unused specimens may be used for medical research" clause in their consent forms. I think there was recently a ruling/decision/something in the US that clarified that the generic "may be used for research" is all that is needed to pretty much do whatever you want with it.
Woah... so an The Island of Doctor Moreau could actually be a thing?
Here are the details I was trying to remember:
http://www.pri.org/stories/2016-07-24/does-human-specimen-research-always-need-consent
According to proposed updates to ethics rules imposed by the US government, the answer to both questions is almost always no. Many advocate that you should be required to give explicit consent for the use of your specimens, especially as new medical developments are making it possible to link once-anonymous samples back to their donors.
However, under current rules, researchers can use human biological specimens leftover from blood drawn at the doctor’s office or leftover from previous research. But the US government is proposing an update to those rules.
“What's being proposed to be changed now is saying, ‘It doesn't matter if those specimens have been de-identified. We're still going to require researchers to get your consent before using them,’” says Holly Fernandez Lynch, the executive director of the Petrie-Flom Center for Health Law Policy, Biotechnology and Bioethics at Harvard Law School.
(More at the link)
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/08/04 17:42:06
Subject: National Institutes of Health to alter Laws of Alchemy, allow Human Transmutation
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5th God of Chaos! (Yea'rly!)
The Great State of Texas
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This is awesomely terrifying. Now those heroes who brought us the IPOD, mustard gas, zyklon B, thermonuclear war, the Tuskegee Experiments, and probably had a hand in setting up the DMV are now going to be unleashed on nature itself.
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-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/08/04 18:23:26
Subject: National Institutes of Health to alter Laws of Alchemy, allow Human Transmutation
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Battlefortress Driver with Krusha Wheel
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This can only be good news for medical science.
Frazzled wrote:This is awesomely terrifying. Now those heroes who brought us the IPOD, mustard gas, zyklon B, thermonuclear war, the Tuskegee Experiments, and probably had a hand in setting up the DMV are now going to be unleashed on nature itself.
We have been 'playing god' for millennia, its just that now we have the tools and the skill to guide what we need with at least some degree of precision. Incidentally without a long line of heroes we would still be trying to catch deer with rocks and dying before we were 30.
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My PLog
Curently: DZC
Set phasers to malkie! |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/08/04 18:25:45
Subject: Re:National Institutes of Health to alter Laws of Alchemy, allow Human Transmutation
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Pragmatic Primus Commanding Cult Forces
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Russia is way ahead of the US in terms of weird and freaky experiments. Maybe the Pentagon now wanted to close the "weird science gap"?
Cyborg dogs, hell yeah!
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Error 404: Interesting signature not found
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/08/04 18:25:48
Subject: National Institutes of Health to alter Laws of Alchemy, allow Human Transmutation
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Battlefield Tourist
MN (Currently in WY)
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We will need these half-man hybrids to successfully defend us from the AI hunter-killer drones.
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Support Blood and Spectacles Publishing:
https://www.patreon.com/Bloodandspectaclespublishing |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/08/04 18:43:48
Subject: National Institutes of Health to alter Laws of Alchemy, allow Human Transmutation
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5th God of Chaos! (Yea'rly!)
The Great State of Texas
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Silent Puffin? wrote:This can only be good news for medical science.
Frazzled wrote:This is awesomely terrifying. Now those heroes who brought us the IPOD, mustard gas, zyklon B, thermonuclear war, the Tuskegee Experiments, and probably had a hand in setting up the DMV are now going to be unleashed on nature itself.
We have been 'playing god' for millennia, its just that now we have the tools and the skill to guide what we need with at least some degree of precision. Incidentally without a long line of heroes we would still be trying to catch deer with rocks and dying before we were 30.
Whats wrong with chasing deer with rocks? I got an A in that class.
Outside of the Modern Prometheus and the ethical questions raised, we haven't been splicing human genes into anything. Frankly we haven't even been putting jeans on many animals either.
This is whole new level of terror, and don't give me that claptrap about ethics, or rules, or blah blah.
“Not to go on all-Fours; that is the Law. Are we not Men?”
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-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/08/07 22:48:13
Subject: National Institutes of Health to alter Laws of Alchemy, allow Human Transmutation
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Assassin with Black Lotus Poison
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Frazzled wrote:This is awesomely terrifying. Now those heroes who brought us the IPOD, mustard gas, zyklon B, thermonuclear war, the Tuskegee Experiments, and probably had a hand in setting up the DMV are now going to be unleashed on nature itself. The hero who brought us zyklon B also brought us the process of manufacturing ammonia, allowing the production of synthetic fertilisers which in turn allows us to feed people on an enormous scale.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/08/07 22:48:51
The Laws of Thermodynamics:
1) You cannot win. 2) You cannot break even. 3) You cannot stop playing the game.
Colonel Flagg wrote:You think you're real smart. But you're not smart; you're dumb. Very dumb. But you've met your match in me. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/08/07 23:14:06
Subject: National Institutes of Health to alter Laws of Alchemy, allow Human Transmutation
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Douglas Bader
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A Town Called Malus wrote:The hero who brought us zyklon B also brought us the process of manufacturing ammonia, allowing the production of synthetic fertilisers which in turn allows us to feed people on an enormous scale.
Well, not Zyklon B directly, he was dead by that point. But he introduced chemical warfare in WWI, and the Nazis later developed the process for their own uses. It's a pretty interesting story: https://medium.com/@PaulBarach/the-tragedy-of-fritz-haber-the-monster-who-fed-the-world-ec19a9834f74#.pzhrlh7e2. A quote that sums it up pretty well:
Fritz Haber got his way. On April 22nd, he made hell worse. And he couldn’t have been happier.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/08/07 23:14:31
There is no such thing as a hobby without politics. "Leave politics at the door" is itself a political statement, an endorsement of the status quo and an attempt to silence dissenting voices. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/08/07 23:24:50
Subject: National Institutes of Health to alter Laws of Alchemy, allow Human Transmutation
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Zealous Sin-Eater
Montreal
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Ouch, right in my feelings.
And yet, I can't help but rejoice : my dream of splicing a Broca's area in my cats is a little bit closer!
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[...] for conflict is the great teacher, and pain, the perfect educator. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/08/07 23:31:55
Subject: National Institutes of Health to alter Laws of Alchemy, allow Human Transmutation
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[MOD]
Not as Good as a Minion
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You're a bad man d. A bad, bad man. Scar will come for you.
But this is interesting, as long as it's done ethically then go go science
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I wish I had time for all the game systems I own, let alone want to own... |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/08/07 23:36:45
Subject: National Institutes of Health to alter Laws of Alchemy, allow Human Transmutation
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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You can't talk about a story that includes chimeras without thinking about that nice puppy.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/08/08 00:03:07
Subject: National Institutes of Health to alter Laws of Alchemy, allow Human Transmutation
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Fixture of Dakka
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My biggest problem with spicing human DNA into animals is the potential for certain diseases to make the animal-human jump. Many potentially harmful diseases are locked into certain animal strains. If a hybrid gets infected the disease could potentially mutate to accept a human as the next body to infect.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/08/08 00:53:51
Subject: National Institutes of Health to alter Laws of Alchemy, allow Human Transmutation
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Zealous Sin-Eater
Montreal
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cuda1179 wrote:My biggest problem with spicing human DNA into animals is the potential for certain diseases to make the animal-human jump. Many potentially harmful diseases are locked into certain animal strains. If a hybrid gets infected the disease could potentially mutate to accept a human as the next body to infect.
That's a risk I'm willing to make you take if it's going to get me my talking cats.
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[...] for conflict is the great teacher, and pain, the perfect educator. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/08/08 01:07:03
Subject: National Institutes of Health to alter Laws of Alchemy, allow Human Transmutation
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Fixture of Dakka
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Kovnik Obama wrote: cuda1179 wrote:My biggest problem with spicing human DNA into animals is the potential for certain diseases to make the animal-human jump. Many potentially harmful diseases are locked into certain animal strains. If a hybrid gets infected the disease could potentially mutate to accept a human as the next body to infect.
That's a risk I'm willing to make you take if it's going to get me my talking cats.
Of all the things you could make talk you choose cats???? They'd ignore you for hours before telling you to F-off.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/08/08 01:26:23
Subject: National Institutes of Health to alter Laws of Alchemy, allow Human Transmutation
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Secret Force Behind the Rise of the Tau
USA
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I have to agree with Cuda on that one. We'd make for more progress making some talking mice;
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/08/08 02:42:15
Subject: National Institutes of Health to alter Laws of Alchemy, allow Human Transmutation
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Zealous Sin-Eater
Montreal
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LordofHats wrote:I have to agree with Cuda on that one. We'd make for more progress making some talking mice
Might be worth it to hear the little cries of terror and doom.
cuda1179 wrote:Of all the things you could make talk you choose cats???? They'd ignore you for hours before telling you to F-off
I have a dream.
If science can't bring me closer to an all-cat a cappella band named Chipmunk Massacre, then I'd rather we have skipped the whole Enlightenment thing altogether.
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[...] for conflict is the great teacher, and pain, the perfect educator. |
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