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Got the codex today, skimming through it over some beers right now so I'm likely missing some stuff, but this codex definitely seems to have a lot of potential.

In the Subterranean Uprising, Aberrants gain Infiltrate and can basically roll 3d6 and pick one for Cult Ambush, giving a good chance of the 6 results.

If it's a part of a larger Cult Insurrection with a Brood Cycle core, the Acolyte Iconward also gains Infiltrate, and can thus join the Aberrants and give them a 4+ FnP. The Aberrants have Infiltrate from their sub-formation, so they get first turn Shrouded from the CI. Throw in a Patriarch with the Primaris to reduce whatever you charge to I1, so Unwieldy hammers aren't a problem, and it seems like a pretty solid assault unit.

You don't reduce initative to 1.
You reduce WS, BS, I and attacks BY 1

 dan2026 wrote:
You don't reduce initative to 1.
You reduce WS, BS, I and attacks BY 1

Ah you're right, thanks for the correction

Even then, the Aberrants seem like they could hit pretty hard on the charge and take a beating in return.

Can somebody with access to the book tell me if GC psykers are affected by Shadow in the Warp? Thanks!

Yeah, GSC-IG interactions seem like they could be a little silly.

"Welcome to the Imperial Guard, recruit!"

"Skreeeee!"

"I wish we were all as patriotic as you!"

 TheWaspinator wrote:
Yeah, GSC-IG interactions seem like they could be a little silly.

"Welcome to the Imperial Guard, recruit!"

"Skreeeee!"

"I wish we were all as patriotic as you!"

They're a highly intelligent cult the members of which in the third and fourth generation look exactly like everyone else, not rhesus monkeys!.

I dunno, the Guard accepts "Ab humans"...who's to say? And having powerful Telepaths can't hurt...

The "Guard" that they are AoC with is presumably units of the Guard that have been populated by cultists or hypnotized. Not the loyal Guard.

The more human part of the Genestealer Cult usually are exemplary Imperial citizens, there should be plenty of IG regiments infested with 4th generation hybrids and/or familiars.

Tyranids and gsc seem like far better allies than guard.

Tyranids desperately need a ground game-their bread and butter are units like mawlocks and flyrants but their troops are garbage. Meanwhile gsc have some of the best troops around but theres nothing special about their support elements.

You say that until you face GSC backed by an armored company or a Hellhammer.

What they will do for Tyranids is provide an immediate threat (which can then fade away), giving time for the swarm to approach.

 Red Corsair wrote:
You say that until you face GSC backed by an armored company or a Hellhammer.

I'm more curious about what happens to a GSC with access to a Stormlord.

I think it's important to note that when deploying via ambush a roll of 5 will allow the unit to shoot in the deployment portion of the game.

A unit of 20 Acolyte Hybrids with hand flamers costs 13ppm x 20 = 260 points.

Taken as part of the Subterranean Uprising with an attached Primus you get to roll 3 dice for ambush and choose the result you want.

That is about a 1/2 chance of having the ability to deploy and shoot 20 flame templates in deployment before the game even begins. You could very easily grab First Blood and Slay the Warlord this way through sheer volume of dice.

Considering every other unit in the "decurion" also has a chance to hit the table shooting (though mostly it's a 16ish% chance per unit) That is the most ridiculous alpha strike in the game.

I wonder if the rule Nexus of Devotion(12" FNP 6+) that the Acolyte Iconward have, stack with other Iconwards Devotions even though he himself doesn't benefit from it as RAW?
"Models that already have the Feel No Pain (excluding any Acolytes Iconwards) special rule instead add 1 to their Feel No Pain roll."

Do the the units around both of them get FNP +5 or more?

Also, say that during the deployment. I have Infiltrate units and deployed them via Cult Ambush, I rolled a and moved them onto the board on my own table edge. Am I able to "Return to the shadows" to ongoing reserves on turn 1 since RAW doesn't prevent me from doing so?
"A unit cannot return to the shadows in the same turn it arrives from reserves or ongoing reserves and cannot do so whilst embarked in a vehicle."

Am I reading these rules correctly? Like to hear your thoughts about it.

BRB I believe says the same rule does not stack unless it specifically says it does. The rule that grants FNP is Nexus of Devotion. So 2 Nexus of Devotions should not stack thus it is still 6+. If they managed to get FNP from a second source then it would be 5+.

Yes you can return to shadows on turn 1 since deployment is not a turn and even if it was it would be your "next turn" on turn 1.

 Red Corsair wrote:
You say that until you face GSC backed by an armored company or a Hellhammer.

Those two things that are terrible on their own and not conducive to the cults melee play style?

Gsc don't want large blasts flying around near their melee troops who hang out 6" from the enemy. They want a big scary anti armor monster that pops up in a similar place that they do so they can screen it.




Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Lance845 wrote:
I think it's important to note that when deploying via ambush a roll of 5 will allow the unit to shoot in the deployment portion of the game.

A unit of 20 Acolyte Hybrids with hand flamers costs 13ppm x 20 = 260 points.

Taken as part of the Subterranean Uprising with an attached Primus you get to roll 3 dice for ambush and choose the result you want.

That is about a 1/2 chance of having the ability to deploy and shoot 20 flame templates in deployment before the game even begins. You could very easily grab First Blood and Slay the Warlord this way through sheer volume of dice.

Considering every other unit in the "decurion" also has a chance to hit the table shooting (though mostly it's a 16ish% chance per unit) That is the most ridiculous alpha strike in the game.

Here's the question though: do you deploy these guys during your deployment step or when you would be infiltrating?

the_scotsman wrote:

 Red Corsair wrote:
You say that until you face GSC backed by an armored company or a Hellhammer.

Those two things that are terrible on their own and not conducive to the cults melee play style?

Gsc don't want large blasts flying around near their melee troops who hang out 6" from the enemy. They want a big scary anti armor monster that pops up in a similar place that they do so they can screen it.




Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Lance845 wrote:
I think it's important to note that when deploying via ambush a roll of 5 will allow the unit to shoot in the deployment portion of the game.

A unit of 20 Acolyte Hybrids with hand flamers costs 13ppm x 20 = 260 points.

Taken as part of the Subterranean Uprising with an attached Primus you get to roll 3 dice for ambush and choose the result you want.

That is about a 1/2 chance of having the ability to deploy and shoot 20 flame templates in deployment before the game even begins. You could very easily grab First Blood and Slay the Warlord this way through sheer volume of dice.

Considering every other unit in the "decurion" also has a chance to hit the table shooting (though mostly it's a 16ish% chance per unit) That is the most ridiculous alpha strike in the game.

Here's the question though: do you deploy these guys during your deployment step or when you would be infiltrating?

It's an out of phase shooting attack.

I know, but if im remembering the rules it says "A unit that can infiltrate can DEPLOY via cult ambush"

Which means you dont cult ambush after deployment, like infiltrate. That means if you deploy first, a roll of "5" is pretty much useless (no models willb e on the board to shoot at).

So, I'm looking over several of the formations again, and I'm seeing some odd holes here and there that will probably require erratas.

Doting Throng: The way Frenzied Devotion and Willing Subjects work, there is no actual requirement for the Magus to actually be from this formation either. Unless the Magus himself gets Zealot (which would allow him to join another unit, ex: Metamorphs), it appears there's no practical reason to include the Magus in this formation versus just running him in a command slot; at the end of the day, you're just grabbing more grunts that you can conditionally buff up (and if you're running something like a Biomagus, that's not going to work either).

Subterranean Uprising: I asked on YMDC but The RAW is for Meticulous Planner states "If unit in this formation joined by 'a' Primus" for the '3d6 & choose" ability. It doesn't mention that the Primus actually *has* to be from this formation in order to provide Meticulous Planner. Considering the Primus already has Infiltrate, there appears to be no *practical* reason to include him in the Subterranean Uprising (you "could" argue that he could let a unit of Neophytes roll 2d6 and choose) rather than including him as a standalone Command Choice, so he has the option of either joining a unit from Subterranean Ambush or joining a unit doing regular Infiltration (Granting "Shrouded" to a large Neophyte unit camping an objective always has its appeal too).

So close yet so far.

the_scotsman wrote:
I know, but if im remembering the rules it says "A unit that can infiltrate can DEPLOY via cult ambush"

Which means you dont cult ambush after deployment, like infiltrate. That means if you deploy first, a roll of "5" is pretty much useless (no models willb e on the board to shoot at).

That bears more looking at. It seems weird that first blood could be gotten by the second player without seizing. Are we sure this is how it works?

the_scotsman wrote:
I know, but if im remembering the rules it says "A unit that can infiltrate can DEPLOY via cult ambush"

Which means you dont cult ambush after deployment, like infiltrate. That means if you deploy first, a roll of "5" is pretty much useless (no models willb e on the board to shoot at).

It's not "can".

Units with this special rule THAT infiltrate, or arrives from reserves or ongoing reserves, can choose to roll on the Cult Ambush table...


You have to be deploying by infiltrate (or show up from reserves/ongoing reserves) to roll on the table at all. I am convinced that while 6 is probably the best option once the game gets going 5 is by far the best on deployment. Kill everyone you can before the game even begins. Hope you get initiative first turn and then shoot them all up a second time.

Yeah it seems to me that you arrive BY using the cult ambush rule (not during your standard deployment) but also not via the infiltrate rule (so no servo skull sadness)

Worth nothing, if a unit is deployed using Cult Ambush, and it doesn't count as Infiltrating, then it would also seem that any unit that deploys that way could charge turn 1.

 minionboy wrote:
Worth nothing, if a unit is deployed using Cult Ambush, and it doesn't count as Infiltrating, then it would also seem that any unit that deploys that way could charge turn 1.

Deploying via ambush is infiltrating. You have to actually infiltrate in order to roll on the ambush table.

 Lance845 wrote:

 minionboy wrote:
Worth nothing, if a unit is deployed using Cult Ambush, and it doesn't count as Infiltrating, then it would also seem that any unit that deploys that way could charge turn 1.

Deploying via ambush is infiltrating. You have to actually infiltrate in order to roll on the ambush table.

Isn't it phrased "can instead deploy via cult ambush?"

Crystal-Maze wrote:

 Lance845 wrote:

 minionboy wrote:
Worth nothing, if a unit is deployed using Cult Ambush, and it doesn't count as Infiltrating, then it would also seem that any unit that deploys that way could charge turn 1.

Deploying via ambush is infiltrating. You have to actually infiltrate in order to roll on the ambush table.

Isn't it phrased "can instead deploy via cult ambush?"

No, it's not.

"A unit with this special rule that infiltrates, or arrives from reserves or ongoing reserves, can choose to roll on".... etc etc...

You have to be infiltrating to roll on the table in deployment. The Ambush table changes how you arrive but you have to actually initiate infiltrate to do it.

You never actually arrive via ambush. Ambush is a kind of interrupt that inserts itself into other actions. Either 1) you infiltrate in deployment and then make a choice to roll on the ambush table and do what it says. Or 2) you come in from reserves or ongoing reserves and as you enter the table you choose to roll on the ambush table. There is no such thing as arriving via ambush.

Crystal-Maze wrote:

 Lance845 wrote:

 minionboy wrote:
Worth nothing, if a unit is deployed using Cult Ambush, and it doesn't count as Infiltrating, then it would also seem that any unit that deploys that way could charge turn 1.

Deploying via ambush is infiltrating. You have to actually infiltrate in order to roll on the ambush table.

Isn't it phrased "can instead deploy via cult ambush?"

'Instead of deploying or arriving from Reserves normally.'

That is the phrase used. The fact they seperate the two and the fact that units which infiltrate can choose to roll on the table 'instead of deploying normally' implies it happens at the same time as Infiltration. Infiltration Plus as it were.

So.. servoskulls affects cult ambush or not? : /

I would argue that servo skulls do prevent GSC being placed close to them. You are infiltrating.