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 Ernestas wrote:
Well, I will not respect them until they start taking major fluff characters out of the lore. .

Aun'Va, leader of the entire Tau Empire faction, is not enough? He may not be the fan boy hero (farsight) but in fluff terms, he is the single most important character to the Tau. In addition, Shadowsun is severely wounded, and farsight as well. Not mortally but significantly. Even Aun'shi is captured by the dark eldar, so what more do you want with named characters with models?

Mr Morden wrote:

Also, I'm totally with you on the ineffectiveness of the Assassins, though I did find the Vindicare's failure at least plausible. Chalk that up to poor GW choices and the Imperium's relative lack of knowledge on intricacies of the Tau - The Callidus can't replicate what it doesn't know to replicate. The Eversor also didn't explode, so GW just dropped the ball on that one. The Vindicare nearly succeeded, but the selflessness of Farsight's bodyguards (a few of which seem to have died in the process) was at least a plausible reason for preventing the final shot.

I was not as unhappy with the Assassins - they walked through the Tau and it was only when they had to try and take out the named characters that they had issues - as they always do.

I loved the Vindicare killing everything from Riptdies to Pathfinder Squads with consummate ease and a bodyguard sacrificing them self to deflect the kill shot was in keeping - similar thing happens with the Callidus. The Culixous just becomes walking death to the Tau and achieves its mission.

IIRC the Eversor did explode and took the dome with it.

Tau technology is not technology at al

What? Seriously, what?

Isn't this the faction which GW constantly, repeatedly, describes in official fluff as being technologically advanced? Seriously Ernestas, how can you say Tau 'technology isn't technology' when the actual creators of the setting constantly describe them as technologically advanced and possessing advanced technology?

Also your requirement for Assassins gaining 'respect' is insane. No non-special characters are going to repeatedly defeat and slay special characters, that's not how narratives work. Not to mention don't you think, well, maybe players of factions other than the Imperium wouldn't want it that Greater Daemons, the Swarmlord and such can all just be killed by the Assassins?

But, really, they already killed Aun'va, the leader of the entire Tau Empire, that's the most important special character to have died in ages. What more do you want? That Farsight and Shadowsun also die and the entire faction just get destroyed?

Say, what's the last time an Imperium special character with a miniature in 40k was killed off by a Tau? Or a Tyranid? Or a Daemon? When's the last time the leader of their entire faction got killed off by a non-special character?

The hatred of the Tau (and non-Imperium in general) and desire to see them die is so pervasive. I really must stop coming here for my own health *sigh*

To be fair, a first-founding Chapter Master was killed by the Tau within the Warzone: Damocles books.

To put that into perspective, it wasn't an unnamed Tau battlesuit that did the deed... In fact, it was one of the Tau's special characters and arguably its highest-ranked commander in the Tau Empire.

That Chapter Master was also not, to my knowledge, a special character with a model in WH40k, as each and every target of the Assassins was.

And to add insult to injury, the assassins actually killed off 3 named Tau special characters with models/rules: Two of Farsight's Eight were killed in this action alongside Aun'va.

That means that the Tau lost 3/14ths (over 20%) of their current named special characters with rules (not including forgeworld) as a result of being targeted by 4 unnamed Imperial Assassins, and they nearly succeeded on killing the highest-ranked commander in the faction.

That's a devastating blow to the Tau faction, no matter how you slice it.

I only recall one of the 8 being wounded and it was Ob'lotai the AI who can easily be repaired.

Yes, as I said, ones with miniatures. Severax not only didn't have a miniature, but he had only ever been a minor character mentioned twice before he died, nothing comparable to Aun'va, Shadowsun or Farsight.

Also I don't recall two members of the 8 dying, who? Oblotai can be brought back through personality Ingrams and it mentions Bravestorm blocking the Vindicaire's bullet with an upraised shield generator, and never mentions him dying. And when fighting the Eversor later it mentions the Eight as a unit again so I didn't pick up that Bravestorm had died. Did I miss something?

I may well have missed something myself. Rereading (again) the passage, it does appear that Bravestorm didn't explicitly get taken out by the Vindicare. Edit: I probably read too much into the "Sacrifice for the greater good" theme involved in several of those assassination attempts: the Tau tendency to "Look Out, Sir!" is strong.

I don't think I'm the only one confused, as I've seen it mentioned elsewhere that Bravestorm died in the process, but its at best ambiguous.

Oblotai could potentially be brought back from personality engrams (Do we know if he has a backup?), but he's still a special character who "dies" (but is easily replaced as a copy of his former self - arguably different quantifiably from other special characters that die and are reborn, like Lucius or Celestine).

An interesting little side note: Anyone else notice that O'vesa, our Earth Caste member of the Eight, uses specialized nanomachines to live to an older age?

That sort of addresses what little remains of the "short-lived" argument against the Tau developing better technologies, if the best and brightest of the Earth Caste have access to a Tau equivalent of Rejuv treatments...

I really don't understand what all this "Tau deserve some hardship" stuff is. While they're not dwarfed as gakky villains that are easily destroyed like Orks or Eldar can be and experience a lot of battlefield victory, at this point they've become a worse version of the Imperium.

-Their whole Alliance, non-xenophobic vibe seems to be being done away with. While it was once one of their unique things that the other factions didn't really have. Now they're being said to not allow aliens in high roles and sterilize other races, and to be very Tau supremacist, taking away one of the one things they had over the Imperium.

-For all their technological advancements, the other races still infinitely outrank them in tech levels, barring Orks and Tyranids. The Tau's best technology is nothing compared to what the Imperium has. Hell, they can't even successfully travel through space at a rate even close to that of the Imperium.

-It's size is pitiful. The Imperium is massive, with huge swathes of territory and resources. Compared to them, the Tau Empire is a pinprick.

-The whole "Brainwashing" thing has eliminated what moral high ground they had over the Imperium. A least there's a modicum of freedom in the Imperium. In the Tau, they're brainwashed into specific roles without freedom. No freedom, no sex, nothing like that.

-They're lacking in psychic powers, one of the most important things in 40k. Not only this, their ignorance of the Warp makes them incredibly unprepared in regards to the slowly approaching threat of Chaos.

-Their Shas'O, who would be like the Emepror, was killed, alongside one or two members of the eight. They already have so few members, now we learn that some Assassins simply kicked the ass of the best Tau had, like Riptides, and took out their head. When was the last time the Imperium lost a named character, let alone one of their greatest leader? People would freak if the Emperor, or even Dante, finally died.

All in all, it seems the Tau have been gak on a lot. There's really nothing they have over the Imperium, and are worse in many, many ways.

I can agree with some of what you're saying, but not all of it.

They aren't completely outside a non-xenophobic vibe, they've just added shades of gray to better fit in with the grimdark setting. The reluctance towards allowing leadership positions is not a blanket ban (There was a Kroot who was allowed to lead Tau forces a few editions back), and the claims of sterilization comes from a single source (The Dawn of War campaign ending for Tau) which is explicitly not the canon ending of that encounter.

They certainly do have an air of Tau Supremacist in them (few non-tau will ever achieve the Tau's understanding of the Greater Good, in their mind), but they aren't ashamed to admit that other species have strengths that outshine the Tau in particular areas.

On the technology front, the Tau's best technology is no where near almost any other faction's best technology (and I'll even admit that this applies to the Orks - they've got some areas where their Tech is insanely impressive), but their baseline technology is arguably equal to or higher than all but the Imperial Navy, Adeptus Mechanicus, Eldar, and the Necrons. The dynamic is that of a technologically expanding/advancing race, a fairly unique trait in the universe of WH40k, and the balance of that dynamic in the overarching narrative practically requires the Tau to start comparatively lower than their neighbors.

Their size is pitiful, and their greatest weakness in the grim, dark future of the 41st millenium. Their continued existence relies entirely on growing and operating in the spaces between the comparatively massive entities around them, and is the main aspect that keeps the hope embodied by the Tau Empire within the grimdark theme of the universe.

The brainwashing is not explicitly confirmed, but it does add shades of gray that tarnish the supposed noblebright nature of the Tau Empire. They're fascists of a different kind, and there's no doubt that even the kindest of fascists remain fascists and dark.

As far as the psychic powers and comparative naivety of the warp, that's true to an extent... but the Tau aren't the only race in their Empire, and they've had no compunctions against letting races with particular strengths step forward to occupy important roles. As the Tau learn more and more how important knowledge and manipulation of the warp is, I suspect they'll look more and more to their psychic allies for guidance and assistance.

I think we're basically in agreement, though, that the Tau occupy among the most fragile positions in WH40k when you consider all the factions, barring perhaps the Craftworld/Exodite Eldar: They have immense potential and hope, but their chance of achieving even a fraction of their potential is exceptionally low considering the magnitude of the threats they face in their current state.

@Solar-powered_chainsword: Though I understand the impulse to despair, and share it very much, the picture you paint is a bit too bleak;

Though I agree their extent of tolerance has reduced with time, and I share your sentiments that this is a pity, they're still far and away the most tolerant of all nations in the setting. The most recent fluff has only reinforced this;

-In the Genestealer Cult Codex it is mentioned that unlike the Imperium Tau do not abhor different species but instead believe in tolerance of the.
-In the recent Damocles Deathwatch novella a Tau Stormsurge Pilot even recalls using his Mech to shield Imperium civilians from being killed by Imperium forces shelling the area.

Though the extent of the Tau's tolerance has been reduced recently, its still easily the most tolerant and progressive regime in the setting. No contest.

The sterilization thing is very anecdotal, it occurred once in a game and that's pretty much it. A lot of fluff covering the Gue'vesa, the Kroot and others definitely shows that they're treated well, if not equal.

The whole 'brainwashing' thing also doesn't really have any evidence anymore; Shadowsun directly disobeys the Ethereal Council in Mont'ka and we've already had an Earth Caste engineer do the same, and neither of them explain any mental interference. Additionally Farsight's men, and himself, make no mention of brainwashing and do not fall under the control of any Ethereals simply by being near them. Furthermore since we know Tau, like Torchstar, can defect from the Empire to the Enclaves the mind control theory is pretty much false at this stage.

All the rest of what you said is true though, and highly depressing I agree. Except its not their Shas'O who died by their Supreme Aun. But yes they already lost their supreme faction leader. For many people this is apparently too little.

 Anemone wrote:

Tau technology is not technology at al

What? Seriously, what?

Isn't this the faction which GW constantly, repeatedly, describes in official fluff as being technologically advanced? Seriously Ernestas, how can you say Tau 'technology isn't technology' when the actual creators of the setting constantly describe them as technologically advanced and possessing advanced technology?

Also your requirement for Assassins gaining 'respect' is insane. No non-special characters are going to repeatedly defeat and slay special characters, that's not how narratives work. Not to mention don't you think, well, maybe players of factions other than the Imperium wouldn't want it that Greater Daemons, the Swarmlord and such can all just be killed by the Assassins?

But, really, they already killed Aun'va, the leader of the entire Tau Empire, that's the most important special character to have died in ages. What more do you want? That Farsight and Shadowsun also die and the entire faction just get destroyed?

Say, what's the last time an Imperium special character with a miniature in 40k was killed off by a Tau? Or a Tyranid? Or a Daemon? When's the last time the leader of their entire faction got killed off by a non-special character?

The hatred of the Tau (and non-Imperium in general) and desire to see them die is so pervasive. I really must stop coming here for my own health *sigh*

I do not know that part you are quoting first of all. Secondly, I'm not sure of how many people actually died. 20% of Tau high command dying is something to write home about, but assassins are not warriors. In additions, we have to compare them to other competition. Why for example do you think they are better than mandrakes of a dark eldar? Leave it to emo panzies to do job properly! They are not ought to slay common rabble, but to kill just one person. If they fail in their task then they had failed and as I had understood, 1/4 of assassins achieved their goal. That is depressive 25% success ratio from an extremely rare event which only 13'th Black Crusade has called for and it was Horus assassination attempt then this kind of force was gathered. Failing against minor xeno race do not bring much confidence in them nor hope that they are actually competent enough to assassinate Abaddon if given half a chance.

This is that I had wrote. All glory comes to helmless commanders. In addition, there are gakloads of super powerful characters who are unknown. Maybe it is just me since I do not play tabletop, but is Abbadon's 4 commanders characterized? Or even more, why an assassin cannot fire bullet right into Abbadon? This way this organization will gain some credibility above of its peers, Abbadon will get saved or injured and it is a basis for a really cool story.

@Ernestas: Uh...Assassins don't have to be better than Dark Eldar Mandrakes. I mean, they clearly are within the setting, but I'd have no problem with Dark Eldar assassins as effective as Imperium ones in the setting. Also what job did the 'emo panzies' do properly? I don't recall any major achievements by Mandrakes in the fluff ever, certainly nothing comparable to killing Aun'va or Severin Drask so, in your own comparison, the Imperium Assassins are superior to Mandrakes.

Oh my goodness! 1/4 of the Assassins succeeded in their goal, which was the elimination of all three major characters of the entire playable Tau Empire faction. Honestly did you expect GW to kill off three major characters and render the entire narrative of the Tau Empire redundant? Do you think, for example, that three Special Character Chapter Masters of the Marines will ever be killed by mooks? Of course not, your setting way to high a bar here.

Also the Execution Force has been deployed at times beyond Horus and Abaddon. It was also deployed against Severin Drask (and they succeeded although everyone but the Vindicaire died in the process).

And the 'minor xenos' they failed against are still one of the games main playable factions and thus can't just be ignored. Just being a minor faction doesn't automatically mean Assassins need to work against them. And of course Assassins aren't going to kill Abaddon! Really, how weak do you want the enemies of the Imperium to be that they can all just be killed by Assassins? You realize their are lots and lots of Assassins but only 1 Abaddon and he's a pretty big deal, right?

Your bar for the Imperium Assassins just seems ludicrously high.

 Anemone wrote:
? Do you think, for example, that three Special Character Chapter Masters of the Marines will ever be killed by mooks?

To be fair while Assassins aren't mooks that would be really funny.

Bonus points if it's Logan Grimnar in retaliation for killing a Lord Inquisitor.

 Anemone wrote:
@Ernestas: Uh...Assassins don't have to be better than Dark Eldar Mandrakes. I mean, they clearly are within the setting, but I'd have no problem with Dark Eldar assassins as effective as Imperium ones in the setting. Also what job did the 'emo panzies' do properly? I don't recall any major achievements by Mandrakes in the fluff ever, certainly nothing comparable to killing Aun'va or Severin Drask so, in your own comparison, the Imperium Assassins are superior to Mandrakes.

Oh my goodness! 1/4 of the Assassins succeeded in their goal, which was the elimination of all three major characters of the entire playable Tau Empire faction. Honestly did you expect GW to kill off three major characters and render the entire narrative of the Tau Empire redundant? Do you think, for example, that three Special Character Chapter Masters of the Marines will ever be killed by mooks? Of course not, your setting way to high a bar here.

Also the Execution Force has been deployed at times beyond Horus and Abaddon. It was also deployed against Severin Drask (and they succeeded although everyone but the Vindicaire died in the process).

And the 'minor xenos' they failed against are still one of the games main playable factions and thus can't just be ignored. Just being a minor faction doesn't automatically mean Assassins need to work against them. And of course Assassins aren't going to kill Abaddon! Really, how weak do you want the enemies of the Imperium to be that they can all just be killed by Assassins? You realize their are lots and lots of Assassins but only 1 Abaddon and he's a pretty big deal, right?

Your bar for the Imperium Assassins just seems ludicrously high.

No, I expected writers not to deploy such dreaded assets in a first place. You simply cannot have an organization built on such hype then it fails all the time. Just look that had happened to Abbadon and his perceived incompetence. Sigh, sometimes it feels that I must spell it out everything word by word in order for you guys to get it right and not something else. Like here, it is not the issue that major lore characters were not killed. It is the issue that supposedly such dangerous individuals were deployed in a first place. One assassin is fine, but the entire kill team is unheard of and are deployed only in extreme cases like assassination of Horus and other galactic figures. They are not, I repeat, they are not meant to destroy figure heads of a minor xenos race on a minor crusade.

Severin Drask is a perfect example of a threats required to call upon whole kill squad of assassins. This individual threatened holy Terra itself if his plans were to be met in full. In addition, you can create a powerful villain and his story arc and then sacrifice him to the assassins. Furthermore, there is no shame or trouble in letting an assassin launch a shot or two at main lore characters too. Injuring Abbadon will serve to show how dangerous they are while he would just lick his wounds and continue as nothing had happened. It is just yet another point that you did not cared to read properly and to understand. So, I need to explain it to you again.

Minor means that attention of Imperium is not spent to that faction. Minor cannot cause so much threat as to call for such a response. Chaos for example is a major threat. One which takes precedence above everything else. This is why Tau is successful recently, border worlds are being left empty while everything is being thrown vs chaos first and tyranids secondly. Also, minor often means immature. As was with case of Tau back then and now, it still has a lot way to go and to learn. A great example, Titan level weaponary. Imperium deployed just minor titans to the front and yet they were invincible. If they would had used it more cleverly and instead of underestimating this alien menance, they would had used at crucial point as a secret weapon, Tau forces would had been decimated as these God machines would had simply rolled through their defenses. Why it would had been such a matter? Because Tau were technologically immature. They did not had proper weaponary to respond to such threats firstly and secondary they thought themselves being clever in their doctrines and never stopped to wonder that if such theoretical weapons would could be deployed. This is why they had no equavalent to deploy against the titans back then and had to lower entire spacecraft to counter them.

While the manta can fly in space (one variant is used as a bomber) the ones they used to engage titans were primarily transport craft. It's not like they were using cruisers or something. They then just stuck some heavy rail guns on a tiger shark, and problem solved, and much cheaper than a titain too. It was nothing to do with the level of tech, they were just not prepared for that type of enemy having never faced them before. So unless your complaint is that they are not omniscient, it doesn't really apply.

And they weren't immune, we have at least one warhound killed by a hammerhead.

 Co'tor Shas wrote:
While the manta can fly in space (one variant is used as a bomber) the ones they used to engage titans were primarily transport craft. It's not like they were using cruisers or something. They then just stuck some heavy rail guns on a tiger shark, and problem solved, and much cheaper than a titain too. It was nothing to do with the level of tech, they were just not prepared for that type of enemy having never faced them before. So unless your complaint is that they are not omniscient, it doesn't really apply.

And they weren't immune, we have at least one warhound killed by a hammerhead.

Thye had faced Titans before in fact the Tiger shark was directly developed due to the "rough handling" the Tau had suffered at the hands of Titans.

The new variant aircraft mission killed a single Warhound - note a scout titan not a Reaver or Warlord - the Titan in question was in the process slaughtering the Tau armoured elements due to its superior range/sensors.

However it was without air support or even accompanying Skitarii. The Ad Mech underestimated the Tau and paid for it with a single Titan being knocked out.

@Ernestas: Why? In 40k Dreaded Assets are deployed to fail constantly.

I mean the Avatar of Khaine is literally an embodiment of the Eldar God of War and it is constantly featured only to die. Why would Imperium Assassins be featured any better than the Avatar of Khaine?

The reason such 'deadly assets' were deployed is because the creators wanted to show that, in Mont'ka and Kauyon, the Imperium had come to feel the Tau were no longer a minor threat but an actual important obstacle (hence the moving them up at the end of Kauyon, hence the battle in Mont'ka being described as the greatest clash of armour in the Imperium since the Horus Heresy). Thus the goal was to demonstrate that the Tau had become formidable and the Imperium responded with one of their most dangerous weapons.

You seem to be missing that the whole point of Kauyon and Mont'ka was that the Imperium felt it had taken the Tau too lightly and thus decided to respond with a major assault to avenge the Chapter Master Severax.

Wait...'there is no shame or trouble in letting an assassin launch a shot or two at main lore characters too.' You do realize that, in addition to killing Aun'va, Shadowsun is injured and must seek urgent medical attention, and is still weak and pale by the end of Mont'ka, whilst O-9 is possibly destroyed? What's the problem then?

Lets not bog this down with an additional conversation of 'Tau so pathetic, only succeed cause they are allowed to, will die soon' and just stay on topic please. I really don't have the mag for it right now.

Also glad to see we're back at the old 'Tau will all die as soon as Titans appear, no ability to fight Titans at all' despite the fact that the entire Legio Thanatris took part in the invasion of Dal'yth, headed its own wedge, and was literally frozen in its tracks.

But of course that counts for nothing.

@Mr Morden: They was accompanied by what are described as 'sprawling formations of guard' and a 'combined force of Raptors Space Marines' and the book refers to it as a 'Combined Arms Assault Force' so I don't quite see how they were unsupported?

Also it doesn't mention the Titan's range/sensors being important. It notes their Void Shields and ability to destroy hammerheads with a single shot as being important, and even then it gives a lot of credit to the Space Marine vehicles as being able to close ground with the Tau because the Tau weren't using their traditional 'melt away' combat style.

 Mr Morden wrote:

 Co'tor Shas wrote:
While the manta can fly in space (one variant is used as a bomber) the ones they used to engage titans were primarily transport craft. It's not like they were using cruisers or something. They then just stuck some heavy rail guns on a tiger shark, and problem solved, and much cheaper than a titain too. It was nothing to do with the level of tech, they were just not prepared for that type of enemy having never faced them before. So unless your complaint is that they are not omniscient, it doesn't really apply.

And they weren't immune, we have at least one warhound killed by a hammerhead.

Thye had faced Titans before in fact the Tiger shark was directly developed due to the "rough handling" the Tau had suffered at the hands of Titans.

Absolutely, but that's nothing to do, with tech levels. It was the fact that they hadn't faced such an enemy before, and didn't have weapons dispersed. Mantas were already a part of the tau force makeup, but were a support and teansport craft, not suited for anti-titan work.

The new variant aircraft mission killed a single Warhound - note a scout titan not a Reaver or Warlord -

It didn't "just kill a warhound", it engaged 3 of them, brought down it's sheilds with a missile barrage, and one-shot it with it's railguns. The other two fled as to not be destroyed. If t
those guns can one shot a warhound, a reaver is not immune. It would be harder to kill, but certainly not impossible.

the Titan in question was in the process slaughtering the Tau armoured elements due to its superior range/sensors.

Source on that? Because the snippet doesn't mention that. Warhound weapons tend not to be long range (only the turbo-las things, and those are mainly anti-titain so they would be pretty stupid to send it against tau) and the tau are pretty consistently portayed as having superior scanning and optics tech (in geneal use, not sure about a titain) .

However it was without air support or even accompanying Skitarii. The Ad Mech underestimated the Tau and paid for it with a single Titan being knocked out.

We don't actually know that, all the blurb tells us is that there were titains.
And a titain us a pretty big loss, it's like losing a battleship. They are expensive, rare, and the loss of a princep is even worse.

Plus, the tau do seem to have contol of the skies pretty consistently. It's about the one thing they always have.

The Tau were orignally handled badly by Titans - thats exactly how its stated in the old codex and the Forge World Imperial Armour book, with the only real way of handling such war machines was to use Mantas

The Tigershark variant was a specific attempt at a counter rather than using such valuable transports, it was proved effective under specific circumstances and against a Scout Titan - a major shock for the Ad Mech there present.

I had anticpated dedicated hunter killed vehicles and/or aircraft - similar to the Eldar and Imperial Superheavy's - for me it was sad to see the increasing focus on giant robots for this faction especially as I don't enhjoy the asthetic - hate the Stormsurge with a vengeance.

I wiould def agree tha the Imperial Assassins proved incedably effective - where the Campaign failed for me was to set it up as a massive confrontation between substantial elemets of the Imperium - Titan Legions, Sororitas Orders, the full might of the Imperial Navy etc - what we got was Marines, Knights and one small element of the Guard versus the Tau

Same old same old.

All the other elements did virtually nothing or were ignored.

Absolutely, but that's nothing to do, with tech levels. It was the fact that they hadn't faced such an enemy before, and didn't have weapons dispersed. Mantas were already a part of the tau force makeup, but were a support and teansport craft, not suited for anti-titan work.

I thnk we are missing each others point - I was addressing the suggestion that the Tigershark was brought in as a rush job - not true - it was a specific variant looking to address a known weakness from previous engagements.

It didn't "just kill a warhound", it engaged 3 of them, brought down it's sheilds with a missile barrage, and one-shot it with it's railguns. The other two fled as to not be destroyed. If tthose guns can one shot a warhound, a reaver is not immune. It would be harder to kill, but certainly not impossible.

Perhaps - certainly with air superiority and operatiing in pairs or larger attack groups, the Tigershark variant would be devestating.

rregarding the Titans fleeing - what the text actually says is: "The remaining three Titans withdrew rather than face further strafing runs.....Thier mission was already complete". But yeah the Ad Mech detachment was badly shaken by the whole thing

the Titan in question was in the process slaughtering the Tau armoured elements due to its superior range/sensors.

Source on that? Because the snippet doesn't mention that. Warhound weapons tend not to be long range (only the turbo-las things, and those are mainly anti-titain so they would be pretty stupid to send it against tau) and the tau are pretty consistently portayed as having superior scanning and optics tech (in geneal use, not sure about a titain) .

What the books says is:

In earlier engagements the Tau had always been able make the most of their long-ranged weaponry to pick off Leman Russes and Chimeras. Now they faced Titans. equiped with huge weaponry and protective void shields, the advantage lay with the Imperium

The Warhounds engaged the Hammerheads at maximum range, blazing away with massive turbolasers.

We don't actually know that, all the blurb tells us is that there were titains. And a titain us a pretty big loss, it's like losing a battleship. They are expensive, rare, and the loss of a princep is even worse. Plus, the tau do seem to have contol of the skies pretty consistently. It's about the one thing they always have.

Oh it was a loss and embaressment to the Legio - we know from the book that there was no inergral AD Mech Air support and that the Imperial Navy was outnumbered throughout the campaign, with a ratio of about 2:1 at best and steadily declining throughout.
No Skitarii are mentioned in the TOE or in the text at any point that I can find - the 4 warhounds were the least the AM could get away with sending.

Yeah, I'm not a fan of the whole focus on giant robots. I liked how the tau worked, small single-person mechs that were more mind-controled armor than anything else. Using flyers and hover tanks intead expensive, unwieldy mechas. If they made a tau superheavy tank (basically a tau baneblade) that would work for the ground based titain removal and bunker-busting. But, no, we get mechas, and now operate exacy the same as every other army.

I'm sorry for not replying during that period in my life. I had exams and then I kinda forgot about it.

At least now I can actually afford to play tabletop. I had ordered bunch of GW models. It is just sad that they had raped the old universe of fantasy and w40k, but what you gonna do. I still pretend that Primaris Marines do not exist.

Locked due to thread necromancy.