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Hi all,
I'm looking at running my Iyanden army, and, what's the best way to do it? I want to be fluffy not OP.

Wraithguard as troops is a 100% gone right?

should I use Iyanden coded with min guardians and than max my wraithhuard/lords?

Or go with Warhost + wraithhost? Not really excited about using 30 guardians and only getting one spirit seer tbh. and Id have to get a wraighknight.

Or just wraithhost and put my guard in serpents to get to about 1500?

Best would be if I overlooked something and wraithguard can still be troops.

If you can get Doom of Mymera the special Detachment for Eldar (Warhosts of the Pale Court) it starts with this but can be modified

1 Farseer
3 Guardian units
0-1 Warlock Conclave

You can modify it instead with two traits, the ones you'd likely want are Graveyard of Dreams (Guardians become 0-3, must take 3 units of wraithblades and all wraithblades gain crusader

And the other trait would be Tomb-ship of Fallen Heroes which lets you replace the farseer with a Spiritseer or Wraithseer, and you can take a single wraithlord.

So your main detachment would be

1 Spritseer/Wraithseer
0-3 Guardians
3 Wraithblades.

This counts as a Core formation for Eldar so you can take a Wraith Host or Wraith Construct alongside it if you desire.

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:
If you can get Doom of Mymera the special Detachment for Eldar (Warhosts of the Pale Court) it starts with this but can be modified

1 Farseer
3 Guardian units
0-1 Warlock Conclave

You can modify it instead with two traits, the ones you'd likely want are Graveyard of Dreams (Guardians become 0-3, must take 3 units of wraithblades and all wraithblades gain crusader

And the other trait would be Tomb-ship of Fallen Heroes which lets you replace the farseer with a Spiritseer or Wraithseer, and you can take a single wraithlord.

So your main detachment would be

1 Spritseer/Wraithseer
0-3 Guardians
3 Wraithblades.

This counts as a Core formation for Eldar so you can take a Wraith Host or Wraith Construct alongside it if you desire.

Thanks ! I can get the book. fallen heroes seems like the one I should go for. what does the wraith seer do? Is the rest of the detachement same as the warhost? Like can at wraithknight and Hemlock etc?

WraithSeer is a Wraithlord that is instead infused with a Farseer's soulstone. It's ML1 with three powers (cannot roll for new ones) two of which buff Wraithguard/blade/lords. One which grants 5+ FNP to the unit, and one that gives them fleet.

There are additional added detachments within the doom of mymera book, but you can take normal Craftworld Eldar detachments if you use the Pale Court. So you can still take Wraith Construct and the Wraith-Host detachments.

However be careful, sometimes people don't allow forgeworld so you may want to know ahead of time if people will play it. Also if you want to avoid cheese do not take the Skathach Wraithknight within the Doom of Mymera 2nd edition book.

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:
WraithSeer is a Wraithlord that is instead infused with a Farseer's soulstone. It's ML1 with three powers (cannot roll for new ones) two of which buff Wraithguard/blade/lords. One which grants 5+ FNP to the unit, and one that gives them fleet.

There are additional added detachments within the doom of mymera book, but you can take normal Craftworld Eldar detachments if you use the Pale Court. So you can still take Wraith Construct and the Wraith-Host detachments.

However be careful, sometimes people don't allow forgeworld so you may want to know ahead of time if people will play it. Also if you want to avoid cheese do not take the Skathach Wraithknight within the Doom of Mymera 2nd edition book.

our group is mostly okay with FW and this formation would mean I don't have to use the wraithknight in casual play. I think I'd be alright as long as I don't stick my guard in wave serpents.

I'm thinking wraith seer, 3x guard, 3x wraithlords and a hemlock as a base, all on foot.

Dunno how your people are with that, but looks pretty good for a fluffy army.

yeah Mymeara it's the best option i love my full wraith armies and they are still fluff as hell.

just to avoid opness the worst ofenders are wraith host units (run and shoot) and D-scythe wraithguard spam with serpents.

Footslogging Wraithguard are terrible, they'll all die long before they get into range and do something, it's a tactic I've very much given up on as even fluffy non competitive lists are capable of easily killing them. Sticking them in Wave Serpants is the only way to go but at that point I'd avoid the D-Scythes, that gets to be a bit too much.

As for the Wraithknight, I prefer to run the Skathach with a single Inferno Lance and Scatter Shield, it's not as overpowering as the Death Shroud/Wraithcannon/Ghostglaive versions but is actually useful, unlike the Sun Cannon. Giving it a couple of secondary guns can push it up to 350pts, which is much closer to an acceptable price point than the stock 295.

 Imateria wrote:
Footslogging Wraithguard are terrible, they'll all die long before they get into range and do something, it's a tactic I've very much given up on as even fluffy non competitive lists are capable of easily killing them. Sticking them in Wave Serpants is the only way to go but at that point I'd avoid the D-Scythes, that gets to be a bit too much.

As for the Wraithknight, I prefer to run the Skathach with a single Inferno Lance and Scatter Shield, it's not as overpowering as the Death Shroud/Wraithcannon/Ghostglaive versions but is actually useful, unlike the Sun Cannon. Giving it a couple of secondary guns can push it up to 350pts, which is much closer to an acceptable price point than the stock 295.

for friendly games in my meta it should be fine really, the 6 inch run also solves a lot of problems. but a little disappointed with wraithblades in the core slot.

competitive I'd probably ally in dark eldar with a portal and armour of misery to combo with the hemlock and shriek. I also like the Dsword knight. It solves a lot of problems.

what's are best the psychic powers for the hemlock/spirit seer? I think for both shriek and conceal/reveal?

 Imateria wrote:
...Footslogging Wraithguard are terrible, they'll all die long before they get into range and do something...

There's a solution! Shadowseers! Veil of Tears and the enemy can't shoot them!

(It's an impractical and expensive solution but it's also a funny one)

 AnomanderRake wrote:

 Imateria wrote:
...Footslogging Wraithguard are terrible, they'll all die long before they get into range and do something...

There's a solution! Shadowseers! Veil of Tears and the enemy can't shoot them!

(It's an impractical and expensive solution but it's also a funny one)

I do love the scary clowns, who doesn't, but I can't paint them well enough so.. don't want to use :(

I'm pretty sure the FAQ drafted by GW says Iyanden is still good and usable so you absolutely can use that if you want.

Audustum wrote:
I'm pretty sure the FAQ drafted by GW says Iyanden is still good and usable so you absolutely can use that if you want.

yeah and I have the book but..... it doesn't make wraithguard troops anymore, I wanted to avoid the living else and focus on construct.

I think I have to use the wraith seer + 3 units of wraith blades

and the
1 spirit seer
3x wraithguard.
wraithlords
wraith knight formation.

OR

LYANDEN

wraith seer
shadow council
min troops
guard, lords, hemlock, knight.

what's the best way to kit wraith blades ? 2 units with swords one with axes?

EDIT: Double post

My copy of the Iyanden book says they are troops as long as you take a Spiritseer. It's not in the rules section but is buried in the opening intro stuff.

That said, nothing wrong with Pale Court. I just want to make sure you know your options.

Audustum wrote:
My copy of the Iyanden book says they are troops as long as you take a Spiritseer. It's not in the rules section but is buried in the opening intro stuff.

That said, nothing wrong with Pale Court. I just want to make sure you know your options.

whoa for real!? I just have missed that! do you happen to know on what page ? I'll check as soon as I get home.

 Fruzzle wrote:

Audustum wrote:
My copy of the Iyanden book says they are troops as long as you take a Spiritseer. It's not in the rules section but is buried in the opening intro stuff.

That said, nothing wrong with Pale Court. I just want to make sure you know your options.

whoa for real!? I just have missed that! do you happen to know on what page ? I'll check as soon as I get home.

Sadly not.

He refers to the page 48 under The Phoenix Rising . there is a brief explanation of tactical suggestions and combat roles of wraith units, the 1st part just explains what a Spiritseer can do and refers to his old Codex abilities (spirit mark to a single unit at 12" instead to any unit at 12" and making wriathguard as troop choice.)


Anyway if you are playing with Iyanden and no one complains about it ( you need to *rework* a bit 4th warlord trait as example) specially with Wraithknight as Characters and Warlords i would they'll complain about making Wraithguard as troop under Iyanden themed armies.

You're a bit incorrect. There is no reference in the book that the Spiritseer's power is dependent on Codex Eldar or Codex: Craftworlds. It thus stands alone.

Morever, Black Library issued a FAQ for Iyanden and while they made some changes, they refused to change that section. GW also refused to revise it in ghe Draft FAQ despite calling Iyanden out by name. Ergo, it was reaffirmed.

I'd say that's all you need to do it, but this isn't YMDC so we should just advise OP there are grounds to go either way it

hmmm.... I think my opponents will be okay with it as this way I won't use the wraithknight which is mandatory in the craftworld book.

honestly making the wraithhost via formations is torturous, can't seem to fit what I want.

any tips.on the pay powers for wraith seer, spirit seer and hemlock ?

Wraithseer's are pre-set so you're stuck with them, but the one that gives Feel No Pain to Wraith units (other than himself) is the clear standout.

The Spiritseer gets a new Primaries in Iyanden that I like. One trick, however, is to fish for Gate of Infinity. This let's your Wraith guard teleport around the map and unleash strategic shooting attacks.

Remember, Iyanden let's you take multiple Spiritseers in 1 HQ slot so you should be able to sprinkle enough in the army to reliably get Gate most of the time.

Sadly, I have little experience with the Hemlock myself.

Audustum wrote:
You're a bit incorrect. There is no reference in the book that the Spiritseer's power is dependent on Codex Eldar or Codex: Craftworlds. It thus stands alone.

Morever, Black Library issued a FAQ for Iyanden and while they made some changes, they refused to change that section. GW also refused to revise it in ghe Draft FAQ despite calling Iyanden out by name. Ergo, it was reaffirmed.

I'd say that's all you need to do it, but this isn't YMDC so we should just advise OP there are grounds to go either way it

Iyanden Army rules are on page 50 onwards, the very first text points you to use the Codex:Eldar (6th edition one thus outdated) and there is 0 entrances in Spiritseer stats or abilities (or of any unit ) in the supplement.

So either you play with a 6th edition rules (where the Spiritseer DO makes wraithguard troops) or you use the Codex:Eldar Craftworlds where the Spiritseer can't. Since the Op says most of the people would not complain and allow it, those 2 minor modifications to current rules shouldn't be an issue.

-1 by using an Iyanden themed army the Spiritseer allows me to field wraithguard as troops (6th edition legacy)
-2 the 4th warlord trait Spirit mark it's updated to current version (when wraith units attack an enemy unit at 12" or can be keep as 6th edition and nominate a single unit )

Anyway i'm not bringing this to start a discussion just wish the Op knows exactly the proper way those rules interact should he face someone way picky with rules, so he know exactly wich points he's bending (in the least possible way)

now about the psy powers.

Wraithseer pretty much you'll be using the FNP one, but the witchfire may come handy for pinning down some shooty unit in a pinch specially if playing along a Hemlock.

Spiritseer i'll mostly stick to Battle runes as they are often the most polivalent ones (any power can pretty much be used on any situation aside Embolden/horrify) and telepathy if i need some extra efficient defensive buffs like invis or shrouded while playing with enemy leadership (again aim to use them along the Hemlock) finally if you feel lucky and have enough psy dominance Demonology Sanctic can be terrific with the right powers and the right Wraithblades unit.

Hemlock Ahh love and hate it can be a boon (horde armies/morale affected ones) or a curse (enemy have good access to skyfire/decent flyers) since the last FAQ he's no longer capable to use some Air firepower against MC so your best aim it's to fish into telepathy and work it on tandem with a Telepathy/terrify rune of battle power Spiritseer to wreck their morale wih ease.
The Hemlock can be one of the most devastating weapons in your arsenal if you feel really lucky and go for telepathy sanctic since a 5,6 result there may turn him on a terrific psy platform able to be almost anywhere in the table wrecking havoc, but overall and sadly the Hemlock it's quite underperforming since as soon your enemy can properly shoot at him (flyers/skyfire) it becomes just an expensive flying psyker made of paper.

Lord Perversor wrote:



-2 the 4th warlord trait Spirit mark it's updated to current version (when wraith units attack an enemy unit at 12" or can be keep as 6th edition and nominate a single unit ).

I talked with group for a bit, everyone agrees just use wraithguard as troops, I figure they're happy playnig against eldar with no scatbikes/wraithknights. I'll treat the no4 result as BLANK I guess, will be using wraithseer anyway so it shouldn't come up

Lord Perversor wrote:

now about the psy powers.

Wraithseer pretty much you'll be using the FNP one, but the witchfire may come handy for pinning down some shooty unit in a pinch specially if playing along a Hemlock.

Spiritseer i'll mostly stick to Battle runes as they are often the most polivalent ones (any power can pretty much be used on any situation aside Embolden/horrify) and telepathy if i need some extra efficient defensive buffs like invis or shrouded while playing with enemy leadership (again aim to use them along the Hemlock) finally if you feel lucky and have enough psy dominance Demonology Sanctic can be terrific with the right powers and the right Wraithblades unit.

Hemlock Ahh love and hate it can be a boon (horde armies/morale affected ones) or a curse (enemy have good access to skyfire/decent flyers) since the last FAQ he's no longer capable to use some Air firepower against MC so your best aim it's to fish into telepathy and work it on tandem with a Telepathy/terrify rune of battle power Spiritseer to wreck their morale wih ease.
The Hemlock can be one of the most devastating weapons in your arsenal if you feel really lucky and go for telepathy sanctic since a 5,6 result there may turn him on a terrific psy platform able to be almost anywhere in the table wrecking havoc, but overall and sadly the Hemlock it's quite underperforming since as soon your enemy can properly shoot at him (flyers/skyfire) it becomes just an expensive flying psyker made of paper.

Well my plan for keeping it alive is to hopefully roll shrouded on some spiritseer, cast it, fly hemlock on the board into the bubble, if someone shoots me, Jink. 2+ cover!
I figure I really need to roll shrouded with at least one of the spiritseer (and telepathy is a good table if I'm playing the hemlock, Invis, shriek, shrouded, dominate all become or are great) as you loose conceal from runes of battle so... want to give the wraith guard some protection.

Than for the hemlock I guess I roll the first dice on Telepathy, if I get something good, roll again, if not switch to shriek and grab conceal. I guess it should always have shriek right?