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Ok, so noob question here, I want to make my army stronger and deck them out all buggy like. Was looking through forge world cause why not and I saw these Canoptek Acanthrites, Tomb Stalkers, and Tomb Sentinels. Are these legal to play in the current Necron Codex? If so where do I find their stats? I message Forge World but they are slow as balls to getting back to me.

Would also like Cited proof that it is legal

Forgeworld is 100% legal, rules can be found in the corresponding FW 'codex' rulebooks

Some FW publications can address units and rules two editions back. So not all FW is necessarily legal. Rules that don't even exist anymore might be referenced (some Ork stuff for example.)

Unless one considers playing with a 5th edition Codex in 7th legal. Many events certainly don't.

Can't say for sure with the Necron bit, if the units don't include outdated rules then I'd say it's fine myself.

Necronmage14 wrote:
Would also like Cited proof that it is legal

They're rules for 40k published by GW. Why wouldn't they be legal?

 Peregrine wrote:

Necronmage14 wrote:
Would also like Cited proof that it is legal

They're rules for 40k published by GW. Why wouldn't they be legal?

Looking specifically at the 'Fall of Orpheus' book, you need something more than the 'Warhammer 40K expansion' on the cover, and the 'Games Workshop' stamp on the spine?

 cosmicsoybean wrote:
Forgeworld is 100% legal

But that doesn't mean it's legal in your flgs.

 koooaei wrote:

 cosmicsoybean wrote:
Forgeworld is 100% legal

But that doesn't mean it's legal in your flgs.

It is 100% legal in any stock game, it's just as legal as Codex: Space Marines, people may choose to not play against it, but that doesn't mean it isn't legal for play.

Sure, just like using unbound to run an army of 51 solo nurgle spawns. It's totally legal. Not many people would like to play against it.

Forgeworld just has a bad reputation as it's usually taken as a source of codex+1 stuff with no drawbacks. Basically, p2w.

 koooaei wrote:

 cosmicsoybean wrote:
Forgeworld is 100% legal

But that doesn't mean it's legal in your flgs.

Forgeworld is completely legal by default. Anyone who refuses to play against forgeworld models just because they're forgeworld (with the exception of the crazy stuff like Supremacy suits)(provided the current rules are provided) isn't worth playing against.

 koooaei wrote:
Sure, just like using unbound to run an army of 51 solo nurgle spawns. It's totally legal. Not many people would like to play against it.

Forgeworld just has a bad reputation as it's usually taken as a source of codex+1 stuff with no drawbacks. Basically, p2w.

Then you need to read the books for yourself. The only 'p2w' aspects are the titans, and even then look at eldar, space marines necrons or tau, all of them have cheese out the ass anyways so saying FW is p2w is moronic at best, GW is horrible at balance and there are more OP combos in the base books, you just need to find opponents that are not scumbags.


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 Verviedi wrote:

 koooaei wrote:

 cosmicsoybean wrote:
Forgeworld is 100% legal

But that doesn't mean it's legal in your flgs.

Forgeworld is completely legal by default. Anyone who refuses to play against forgeworld models just because they're forgeworld (with the exception of the crazy stuff like Supremacy suits)(provided the current rules are provided) isn't worth playing against.

^^^^^^^^^100% this

 koooaei wrote:
Sure, just like using unbound to run an army of 51 solo nurgle spawns. It's totally legal. Not many people would like to play against it.

Forgeworld just has a bad reputation as it's usually taken as a source of codex+1 stuff with no drawbacks. Basically, p2w.

How isn't Cent-star or Pentatide lists p2w?

How isn't the whole game p2w? You literally pay for the models you use to win. You can't actually win a game if you can't afford any models because you would lose at the end of the 1st turn.

Loopstah wrote:
How isn't the whole game p2w? You literally pay for the models you use to win. You can't actually win a game if you can't afford any models because you would lose at the end of the 1st turn.

People hate on FW for no reason at all, I have had people tell me it should be banned not just because its "not gw" or "its OP" but because it costs too much so its not fair....like wtf, a centstar list is what, 130$CAN PER UNIT? People are just jealous and ignorant.

Loopstah wrote:
How isn't the whole game p2w? You literally pay for the models you use to win. You can't actually win a game if you can't afford any models because you would lose at the end of the 1st turn.

40k is pay to play, not P2W

 CrownAxe wrote:

Loopstah wrote:
How isn't the whole game p2w? You literally pay for the models you use to win. You can't actually win a game if you can't afford any models because you would lose at the end of the 1st turn.

40k is pay to play, not P2W

GW is pay to win, look at some of the eldar units and grav units. its pay to play, *and* to win

 cosmicsoybean wrote:

 CrownAxe wrote:

Loopstah wrote:
How isn't the whole game p2w? You literally pay for the models you use to win. You can't actually win a game if you can't afford any models because you would lose at the end of the 1st turn.

40k is pay to play, not P2W

GW is pay to win, look at some of the eldar units and grav units. its pay to play, *and* to win

Thats not P2W. Pay 2 win is strictly that a player that is willing to spend more then another player gets an objectively tangible benefit for that extra money. That doesn't apply to 40k because everything costs money, good or bad. In fact the more expensive armies (hoard armies like orks and IG) are less effective then cheaper armies.

40k is NOT P2W.

 CrownAxe wrote:

 cosmicsoybean wrote:

 CrownAxe wrote:

Loopstah wrote:
How isn't the whole game p2w? You literally pay for the models you use to win. You can't actually win a game if you can't afford any models because you would lose at the end of the 1st turn.

40k is pay to play, not P2W

GW is pay to win, look at some of the eldar units and grav units. its pay to play, *and* to win

Thats not P2W. Pay 2 win is strictly that a player that is willing to spend more then another player gets an objectively tangible benefit for that extra money. That doesn't apply to 40k because everything costs money, good or bad. In fact the more expensive armies (hoard armies like orks and IG) are less effective then cheaper armies.

40k is NOT P2W.

Pretty sure it's close if you look at how ridiculously overpowered some of the Forgeworld stuff is, which conveniently costs a lot more (for the good stuff) than normal. That's pretty much the definition of P2W; the more money you spend, the better you are compared to those who don't spend as much money. That's literally true in 40k. If you can drop the $1500 or whatever it is on one of the giant FW titans, you're going to win a lot more than someone who spends money on a couple of Tactical Squads.

Not always the case but a lot of Forgeworld stuff is insanely over the top to where if you can buy it, you'll basically crush anyone who doesn't do the same.

Wayniac wrote:

 CrownAxe wrote:

 cosmicsoybean wrote:

 CrownAxe wrote:

Loopstah wrote:
How isn't the whole game p2w? You literally pay for the models you use to win. You can't actually win a game if you can't afford any models because you would lose at the end of the 1st turn.

40k is pay to play, not P2W

GW is pay to win, look at some of the eldar units and grav units. its pay to play, *and* to win

Thats not P2W. Pay 2 win is strictly that a player that is willing to spend more then another player gets an objectively tangible benefit for that extra money. That doesn't apply to 40k because everything costs money, good or bad. In fact the more expensive armies (hoard armies like orks and IG) are less effective then cheaper armies.

40k is NOT P2W.

Pretty sure it's close if you look at how ridiculously overpowered some of the Forgeworld stuff is, which conveniently costs a lot more (for the good stuff) than normal. That's pretty much the definition of P2W; the more money you spend, the better you are compared to those who don't spend as much money. That's literally true in 40k. If you can drop the $1500 or whatever it is on one of the giant FW titans, you're going to win a lot more than someone who spends money on a couple of Tactical Squads.

Not always the case but a lot of Forgeworld stuff is insanely over the top to where if you can buy it, you'll basically crush anyone who doesn't do the same.

Only the titan-level stuff, which isn't really meant to be balanced in non apoc games honestly, the basic troops are pretty well balanced compaired to the shitshow that is 40k.

Wayniac wrote:

 CrownAxe wrote:

 cosmicsoybean wrote:

 CrownAxe wrote:

Loopstah wrote:
How isn't the whole game p2w? You literally pay for the models you use to win. You can't actually win a game if you can't afford any models because you would lose at the end of the 1st turn.

40k is pay to play, not P2W

GW is pay to win, look at some of the eldar units and grav units. its pay to play, *and* to win

Thats not P2W. Pay 2 win is strictly that a player that is willing to spend more then another player gets an objectively tangible benefit for that extra money. That doesn't apply to 40k because everything costs money, good or bad. In fact the more expensive armies (hoard armies like orks and IG) are less effective then cheaper armies.

40k is NOT P2W.

Pretty sure it's close if you look at how ridiculously overpowered some of the Forgeworld stuff is, which conveniently costs a lot more (for the good stuff) than normal. That's pretty much the definition of P2W; the more money you spend, the better you are compared to those who don't spend as much money. That's literally true in 40k. If you can drop the $1500 or whatever it is on one of the giant FW titans, you're going to win a lot more than someone who spends money on a couple of Tactical Squads.

Not always the case but a lot of Forgeworld stuff is insanely over the top to where if you can buy it, you'll basically crush anyone who doesn't do the same.

No, no. Forgeworld produces a miniscule amount of OP units, compared to all of the balanced or bad units they produce. For every Supremacy suit, there is a Piranha TX-42, a Hazard Suit, and a Heavy Gun Drone.

 Verviedi wrote:

Anyone who refuses to play against forgeworld models just because they're forgeworld (with the exception of the crazy stuff like Supremacy suits)

Haven't seen anything other than crazy stuff from forgeworld. People generally field it not for the fluff but simply to make their stuff stronger. Simple as that. FW can be great but you're most likely to encounter codex+1 units rather than fun fluffy stuff.

You know, it's like saying that eldar are perfectly fine because banshees. People want to limit the cheeze. And fw is not yet regarded as being mandatory. So, a lot of people will be wary towards fw at least.

Also, a lot of people scream that fw is fine and than field something like a supremacy suit and tetras. You're having a boring game in which you get smashed w/o chances and than you instinctively want to avoid that stuff again. So, to make things easier you blame fw. Kinda like the eldar hate. Playing vs knights+scat bikes+spiders is no fun for most regular armies. That's why after a game or two you are not as willing to play vs eldar on the whole.

Why do i have to explain elementary stuff? Iif fw is used to make your stuff unnecesserily stronger it just adds to bad fw rep. Those who field fw made it 'illegal'.

 koooaei wrote:

 Verviedi wrote:

Anyone who refuses to play against forgeworld models just because they're forgeworld (with the exception of the crazy stuff like Supremacy suits)

Haven't seen anything other than crazy stuff from forgeworld. People generally field it not for the fluff but simply to make their stuff stronger. Simple as that. FW can be great but you're most likely to encounter codex+1 units rather than fun fluffy stuff.

You know, it's like saying that eldar are perfectly fine because banshees. People want to limit the cheeze. And fw is not yet regarded as being mandatory. So, a lot of people will be wary towards fw at least.

I can't think of anything from FW that is more broken then GW units (ignoring titans)

 koooaei wrote:
Haven't seen anything other than crazy stuff from forgeworld. People generally field it not for the fluff but simply to make their stuff stronger.

The same is true of codex rules. Therefore ban all "main GW" rules.


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 CrownAxe wrote:
I can't think of anything from FW that is more broken then GW units (ignoring titans)

And of course it should be noted that, while the models for titans are cast by FW, their rules come from the "main GW" Apocalypse books. So GW gets full blame for titans, not FW.

All i want to say is that you should talk to people you're gona play against first. They may or may not accept FW for some reason. Also, you shouldn't expect it to be accepted in a lot of tourneys yet. You have real chances of purchasing an expensive resin dust collector if you don't do the recon first.

 koooaei wrote:
All i want to say is that you should talk to people you're gona play against first. They may or may not accept FW for some reason. Also, you shouldn't expect it to be accepted in a lot of tourneys yet. You have real chances of purchasing an expensive resin dust collector if you don't do the recon first.

Well, for starters the BIGGEST tourney hosters allow fw, sooo yeah, and second you always need to talk to people in casual games no matter what to have an enjoyable game.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
"All current source material is allowed, including GW Codexes, Data Slates, Formations, current and experimental Forge World units." -Hoster of the biggest and most frequent tournaments

https://www.frontlinegaming.org/community/frontline-gamings-independent-tournament-circuit/

 koooaei wrote:

 Verviedi wrote:

Anyone who refuses to play against forgeworld models just because they're forgeworld (with the exception of the crazy stuff like Supremacy suits)

Haven't seen anything other than crazy stuff from forgeworld. People generally field it not for the fluff but simply to make their stuff stronger. Simple as that. FW can be great but you're most likely to encounter codex+1 units rather than fun fluffy stuff.

You know, it's like saying that eldar are perfectly fine because banshees. People want to limit the cheeze. And fw is not yet regarded as being mandatory. So, a lot of people will be wary towards fw at least.

Also, a lot of people scream that fw is fine and than field something like a supremacy suit and tetras. You're having a boring game in which you get smashed w/o chances and than you instinctively want to avoid that stuff again. So, to make things easier you blame fw. Kinda like the eldar hate. Playing vs knights+scat bikes+spiders is no fun for most regular armies. That's why after a game or two you are not as willing to play vs eldar on the whole.

Why do i have to explain elementary stuff? Iif fw is used to make your stuff unnecesserily stronger it just adds to bad fw rep. Those who field fw made it 'illegal'.

Except this isn't the case. Most people I've played against use Forgeworld for things like better looking HQ units, or different tank patterns, or the desire to run Eldar Corsairs. The amount of actual WAAC players who can be bothered to run FW is miniscule, when GW produces units far more unbalanced than FW's for lower prices. Are you going to ban Wraithknights and Warp Spiders next? No, because they're GW prime and not scary forgeworld models.
Eldar have many, many strong units and four or so weak units. Forgeworld has uncountable weak units, a large amount of strong units, and a very small amount of broken units. Also, Tetras aren't OP. If you cannot kill a 2HP, AV10, open-topped skimmer, Forgeworld is not the issue here.

There's a rule here. You can bring FW if your entire list is fw. So, no problem fielding corsairs or renegades and heretics on their own or with fw allies.

Until someone decides to use converted Cadians as their Renegades. Still technically plastic, so not FW. I would poke more holes in that system than the average banker.
Your system still locks many, many reasonable models out of the game. No Hazard Suits? No Tetras? I can't take my beautiful Barracuda? I believe it is a system spawned of blind hatred and fear, with one opening (whole FW army) put in place to make players not leave your group.

It's not my system. I just don't care enough to go against the 'rules' in this case. I can live without gunwagons and an underpriced stompa. Also, you could always field those hazard suits as regular crysis and a barracuda as whatever flyer tau have. Nothing preventing it. If you like the models - it's perfectly fine to field whatever you want. Not for the rules tho.

FW is completely legal. The spines of the books even have the GW logo on them.
http://i.imgur.com/67cRj27.jpg?1
Or clearly state on the front they are a 40k expansion.
http://i.imgur.com/HAU9ICB.jpg

I would like to add that I was once a player who refused to play against FW. This was not because I felt the rules were OP, just that the rules were out of my reach (couldn't afford all the FW books and my LGS at the time did not order them)
At this time I owned about 95% of all Codices (all paperback btw), so my issue was an unfamiliarity with the FW rules. I had read every other codex and was aware of 90% of any possible combo of units an opponent might have. So I was rarely surprised and could adjust tactically. 'Know thy enemy' as it were.
To me, when the Codices were black & white, so was the game and thus it was easy to separate GW from FW.

Since, then however, GW has released a freight train worth of releases, supplements, formations, etc. There are now more publications from GW alone than GW + FW back in the day. It is impossible to keep of EVERY rule for EVERY unit in EVERY book

So not only do I not care now if an opponent has FW, but I have started fielding some units of my own.
There is no "is it legal?" anymore. There is only "will your opponent/TO allow FW?". And we here at Dakka cannot answer that, only your local group can.

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