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jasper76 wrote: Unless, if by some mental gymnastics, you can construe the belief that life begins at conception as being somehow an offensive position to take. Or, if by some some mental gymnastics, you can construe the effort to protect lives in utero as somehow intending to hurt people that are different.
It isn't that hard to find the hypocrisy in the pro-life movement. Just ask any of them how much they've looked in to alternate means of reducing abortion. Ask them if they read about the incredible impact that free IUD programs have for at risk women, and if on learning it can lead to a drop in abortions of up to 80% if they support such programs.
Almost every time you will get blank looks, because the idea of actually doing stuff to reduce abortion just hasn't occurred to them. Because it isn't actually about the foetus. It's about the crusade.
There are hypocrites everywhere. That doesn't mean that life doesn't begin at conception, or that killing that life is a good thing.
As for hypocrisy, it's there to be had in the pro-choice movement as well. Many pro-choice people simulatanetously believe that killing innocent humans in utero for convenience is acceptable, but killing murderers and rapists to protect society is unacceptable.
You can find hypocrites everywhere you look.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2017/02/24 18:30:58
sebster wrote: It isn't that hard to find the hypocrisy in the pro-life movement. Just ask any of them how much they've looked in to alternate means of reducing abortion. Ask them if they read about the incredible impact that free IUD programs have for at risk women, and if on learning it can lead to a drop in abortions of up to 80% if they support such programs.
Thing is Seb, under the "life begins at conception" definition, an IUD can be murder just the same as the emergency contraceptive pill and any abortion procedure as it can prevent a fertilised egg from implanting into the lining of the womb.
As far as I know (and I am perfectly willing to be corrected here) IUDs works by preventing the sperm from fertilising the egg, meaning an effect taking place before conception. Unless those people consider the very act of having sex as conception.
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"He died because he had no honor. He had no honor and the Emperor was watching."
We have over 1 million people incarcerated in the US
And that is too fething many. Especially with non violent drug users.
Yes I agree. It's pretty crazy that the Federal government has sentenced more people than it has the means to incarcerate and the response isn't to re-examine why Federal laws are resulting in such high incarceration rates but instead to farm out the problem to private prisons.
This is one problem with arguments about pro-life/pro-choice. Lots of people don't actually understand the process they are arguing about. First thing to know is that sex, fertilisation and implantation are all different steps and takes several days to a couple of weeks. The argument generally degenerates in to one side flinging emotional insults about murder and the other side inaccurate portrayals about biology and beliefs of pro-life and calling pro-lifers stupid.
insaniak wrote: Sometimes, Exterminatus is the only option.
And sometimes, it's just a case of too much scotch combined with too many buttons...
jasper76 wrote: Unless, if by some mental gymnastics, you can construe the belief that life begins at conception as being somehow an offensive position to take. Or, if by some some mental gymnastics, you can construe the effort to protect lives in utero as somehow intending to hurt people that are different.
It isn't that hard to find the hypocrisy in the pro-life movement. Just ask any of them how much they've looked in to alternate means of reducing abortion. Ask them if they read about the incredible impact that free IUD programs have for at risk women, and if on learning it can lead to a drop in abortions of up to 80% if they support such programs.
Almost every time you will get blank looks, because the idea of actually doing stuff to reduce abortion just hasn't occurred to them. Because it isn't actually about the foetus. It's about the crusade.
There are hypocrites everywhere. That doesn't mean that life doesn't begin at conception, or that killing that life is a good thing.
As for hypocrisy, it's there to be had in the pro-choice movement as well. Many pro-choice people simulatanetously believe that killing innocent humans in utero for convenience is acceptable, but killing murderers and rapists to protect society is unacceptable.
You can find hypocrites everywhere you look.
Only if you are looking for hypocrisy. Pro-choice may just as easily believe that the fetus does not constitute life, hence no conundrum. Even more consistently, there is a significantly likelihood they oppose the death penalty. Interestingly, pro-lifers don't seem to see the same contradiction and all life is sacred until we start talking about criminals, terrorists, or war.
Likewise, pro-lifers support government intervention on that issue but often oppose government programs that would support children, such as low income food programs. Inconsistent.
To get away from abortion and back to general politics, it's a disconnect that the GOP shares- pro-life but only sometimes.
It's actually one of the reasons I have great respect for the Catholic Church on the issue. They consistently oppose abortion, executions, and war as violations of the sacredness and life.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/02/24 19:07:45
I'm not commenting on the Daily Show interviews where they just ask somebody at an event to comment on camera. I'm referring to the instances where the Daily Show will do long form interviews with people that may be hours long and then edit them down to a segment that's only about 5 minutes long. Multiple people who have done such an interview with the daily show have complained that the editing of the long interview into a short segment was done in a way that misrepresented what they said, why they said it and the context in which it was said. That's the exact same thing that Couric and OKeefe and others do.
How about this? Just comedy or unethical hit piece?
It's unethical to edit interviews to deliberately misrepresent what people said. I stand by that opinion regardless of the context. Being disingenuous is being disingenuous.
I'm not accusing the Daily Show of doing a crime or something truly heinous, I'm just pointing out that when they selectively edit interviews it's poor form just like it's poor form when anyone else does it. That doesn't make the Daily Show evil it just means that they have the same unethical behaviors of others. The Daily Show can still be entertaining (even without Stewart?) it was even entertaining when Robin Williams made the movie about it, and still have disingenuous segments.
There really aren't enough long form interview shows on tv. There are a ton of great popular podcasts that do long interviews but TV still does their audience a disservice by breaking everything down into tiny crosstalking segments of soundbites.
To get away from abortion and back to general politics, it's a disconnect that the GOP shares- pro-life but only sometimes.
It's actually one of the reasons I have great respect for the Catholic Church on the issue. They consistently oppose abortion, executions, and war as violations of the sacredness and life.
I share your respect for the Catholic Church's consistency on these matters.
To get away from abortion and back to general politics, it's a disconnect that the GOP shares- pro-life but only sometimes.
It's actually one of the reasons I have great respect for the Catholic Church on the issue. They consistently oppose abortion, executions, and war as violations of the sacredness and life.
I share your respect for the Catholic Church's consistency on these matters.
Me three!
<---trying hard not to get involved in these debates... XD
Aborting a non-functional bundle of cells that will grow to be a significant drain on the woman's health, not to mention causing a great deal of pain and discomfort = murder.
Shooting a guy to death because he threw popcorn at you = stand your ground.
People are funny.
Maybe if we used guns to conduct abortions it would be OK.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/02/24 19:19:52
Shooting a guy to death because he threw popcorn at you = not murder.
You're just making stuff up. No one said shooting a guy to death because he threw popcorn at you would not be murder. There is no sane person who would argue against that being murder.
Aborting a non-functional bundle of cells that will grow to be a significant drain on the woman's health, not to mention causing a great deal of pain and discomfort = murder.
Yes, I think killing a human for the sake of convenience is murder, whether that human is inside a womb, or out in the world.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2017/02/24 19:31:02
Meanwhile the path to authoritarianism continues from this administration. This is a direct assault on one of this country's fundamental values. The outrage should be coming from every side over gak like this. Start stifling the freedom of the press and begin manipulating the flow of information and it's not even a "slippery slope" anymore, it's worse on a potentially frightening level! Suddenly all those Trump "alarmists" out there aren't looking so hyperbolic in their chorus.
The New York Times, The Hill, Politico, BuzzFeed, the Daily Mail, BBC, the Los Angeles Times and the New York Daily News were among the other news organizations not permitted to attend. Unfethingbelievable!
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/02/24 19:45:13
We have over 1 million people incarcerated in the US
And that is too fething many. Especially with non violent drug users.
Yes I agree. It's pretty crazy that the Federal government has sentenced more people than it has the means to incarcerate and the response isn't to re-examine why Federal laws are resulting in such high incarceration rates but instead to farm out the problem to private prisons.
Or simply re-examine the seemingly very high incarceration in general.
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"He died because he had no honor. He had no honor and the Emperor was watching."
BigWaaagh wrote: Meanwhile the path to authoritarianism continues from this administration. This is a direct assault on one of this country's fundamental values. The outrage should be coming from every side over gak like this. Start stifling the freedom of the press and begin manipulating the flow of information and it's not even a "slippery slope" anymore, it's worse on a potentially frightening level! Suddenly all those Trump "alarmists" out there aren't looking so hyperbolic in their chorus.
BigWaaagh wrote: Meanwhile the path to authoritarianism continues from this administration. This is a direct assault on one of this country's fundamental values. The outrage should be coming from every side over gak like this. Start stifling the freedom of the press and begin manipulating the flow of information and it's not even a "slippery slope" anymore, it's worse on a potentially frightening level! Suddenly all those Trump "alarmists" out there aren't looking so hyperbolic in their chorus.
Too good not to share, purely for their promotion tagline
Paddy Power's odds on potential Trump events:
Impeachment: 6:4
Trump's marriage breaking down before the end of his term: 5:1
Trump/Putin joint Nobel Peace Prize: 50:1
Mexico to directly pay for wall: 50:1
BigWaaagh wrote: Meanwhile the path to authoritarianism continues from this administration. This is a direct assault on one of this country's fundamental values. The outrage should be coming from every side over gak like this. Start stifling the freedom of the press and begin manipulating the flow of information and it's not even a "slippery slope" anymore, it's worse on a potentially frightening level! Suddenly all those Trump "alarmists" out there aren't looking so hyperbolic in their chorus.
The New York Times, The Hill, Politico, BuzzFeed, the Daily Mail, BBC, the Los Angeles Times and the New York Daily News were among the other news organizations not permitted to attend. Unfethingbelievable!
This is REALLY bad.
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"He died because he had no honor. He had no honor and the Emperor was watching."
BigWaaagh wrote: Meanwhile the path to authoritarianism continues from this administration. This is a direct assault on one of this country's fundamental values. The outrage should be coming from every side over gak like this. Start stifling the freedom of the press and begin manipulating the flow of information and it's not even a "slippery slope" anymore, it's worse on a potentially frightening level! Suddenly all those Trump "alarmists" out there aren't looking so hyperbolic in their chorus.
The New York Times, The Hill, Politico, BuzzFeed, the Daily Mail, BBC, the Los Angeles Times and the New York Daily News were among the other news organizations not permitted to attend. Unfethingbelievable!
I'm sorry, the fething BBC? What have they ever done to earn Trump's ire?
But seriously, how do people defend this gak.
Homosexuality is the #1 cause of gay marriage.
kronk wrote: Every pizza is a personal sized pizza if you try hard enough and believe in yourself.
sebster wrote: Yes, indeed. What a terrible piece of cultural imperialism it is for me to say that a country shouldn't murder its own citizens
BaronIveagh wrote: Basically they went from a carrot and stick to a smaller carrot and flanged mace.
Trump's CPAC speech highlight: The president also spent a large part of his keynote address going after another popular target of his: the press. Trump doubled down on his claim that the "FAKE NEWS media" is the "enemy of the American people," this time saying he plans to "do something about it."
Trump Speak: "Fake News" = Media not bobbleheading my every word.
And today his response was to bar multiple outlets from WH Press Briefing. That's right, news being limited during peace time in the United States of America. There should be a march on Washington to remove this man.
BigWaaagh wrote: Meanwhile the path to authoritarianism continues from this administration. This is a direct assault on one of this country's fundamental values. The outrage should be coming from every side over gak like this. Start stifling the freedom of the press and begin manipulating the flow of information and it's not even a "slippery slope" anymore, it's worse on a potentially frightening level! Suddenly all those Trump "alarmists" out there aren't looking so hyperbolic in their chorus.
The New York Times, The Hill, Politico, BuzzFeed, the Daily Mail, BBC, the Los Angeles Times and the New York Daily News were among the other news organizations not permitted to attend. Unfethingbelievable!
I'm sorry, the fething BBC? What have they ever done to earn Trump's ire?
But seriously, how do people defend this gak.
We asked difficult questions such as "You know what you said makes no sense, right?" probably. Maybe Trump hasn't forgiven us for David Frost and how he didn't go easy on Nixon.
I think we should Paxman him.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/02/24 20:05:59
The Laws of Thermodynamics:
1) You cannot win. 2) You cannot break even. 3) You cannot stop playing the game.
Colonel Flagg wrote:You think you're real smart. But you're not smart; you're dumb. Very dumb. But you've met your match in me.
whembly wrote: I'm surprised that the rest of the media didn't simply walk out.
'
That would have been a powerful statement.
A million people marching on Washington demanding his removal would be a powerful statement. This bullgak has crossed the line. Verbally whining like a little bitch about the press is one thing, limiting physical press access to WH Press briefings is too much, w-a-a-a-a-a-y too much.
whembly wrote: I'm surprised that the rest of the media didn't simply walk out.
'
That would have been a powerful statement.
A million people marching on Washington demanding his removal would be a powerful statement. This bullgak has crossed the line. Verbally whining like a little bitch about the press is one thing, limiting physical press access to WH Press briefings is too much, w-a-a-a-a-a-y too much.
*meh* disturbing... but still *meh*.
You'll find that that WH doesn't have to let anyone in during a breifing... they control the access. Nothing Congress or the Judicial Branch can do to force 'em.
'Tis why I'm disappointed that the other media didn't walk out.... unless, we're missing something here.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/02/24 20:12:52
whembly wrote: I'm surprised that the rest of the media didn't simply walk out.
The AP and Time did walk out.
Breitbart News, One America News Network, The Washington Times, ABC, CBS, The Wall Street Journal, Bloomberg, and Fox News stayed.
While not universal, there's a definite slant in that makeup.
IRON WITHIN, IRON WITHOUT.
New Heavy Gear Log! Also...Grey Knights! The correct pronunciation is Imperial Guard and Stormtroopers, "Astra Militarum" and "Tempestus Scions" are something you'll find at Hogwarts.
whembly wrote: I'm surprised that the rest of the media didn't simply walk out.
'
That would have been a powerful statement.
A million people marching on Washington demanding his removal would be a powerful statement. This bullgak has crossed the line. Verbally whining like a little bitch about the press is one thing, limiting physical press access to WH Press briefings is too much, w-a-a-a-a-a-y too much.
*meh* disturbing... but still *meh*.
You'll find that that WH doesn't have to let anyone in during a breifing... they control the access. Nothing Congress or the Judicial Branch can do to force 'em.
'Tis why I'm disappointed that the other media didn't walk out.... unless, we're missing something here.
Really? Just "meh'. That's Chamberlain-esque apathy and appeasement and it's just indefensible. The fact that they can do it, should NEVER be used to defend an action like this. Certainly not with the overall attack on the media being orchestrated by this administration on an almost daily basis. This is just another step in a very dangerous direction. How anyone can not see this, is beyond me.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/02/24 20:19:55
A very odd event all around, not a comforting one.
IRON WITHIN, IRON WITHOUT.
New Heavy Gear Log! Also...Grey Knights! The correct pronunciation is Imperial Guard and Stormtroopers, "Astra Militarum" and "Tempestus Scions" are something you'll find at Hogwarts.
I'm not much of a protester but if I lived on that side of the country I'd be making a sign & plans to go to Washington right now. This seriously crosses a line.
Also, slight chuckle at Whembly not being upset. If Obama did this the rage would have been epic, but his side POTUS does it and 'meh'.
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