Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Hi Guys

Ive always liked the looks of CSM possessed wings and hated the look and idea of chaos bikers and i hate the idea that riding a bike gives extra toughness. So what i wanted to know is would you guys have an issue of playing possessed converted to look nurgly and to carry ranged weapons like a plasma or combibolter with wings in a flying pose on the new oval biker bases.

Would this be a problem for anyone as i know they do look similar to models with rules already but they have been converted and look different and are on correct sized bases for what i want them to portray.

Kind thanks Ub

In a non tournament setting/friendly game, I see no problem other than some git being really pedantic to the WYSIWYG rule, but for a "counts as" shouldn't matter.

You probably wouldn't be able to field it in a competition setting or tournament ruler game.

Ah thats fine i have bikers if i wanted to do that but i just really hate the models. They would all be equipped with exactly the correct weapons for what the bikers would have.

I think there might be some confusion with raptors/other flying units.

From a WYSWYG POV, while not exact, wings + nurgle does get across "fast and tough” so you do kinda get what you see.

Do you plan on using any jump pack/winged units in your list? That’s one thing that would stick out. If you had two similar looking units using different rules.

You do need to keep an eye on the overall dimensions of the model.

Loooooong ago, some goon essentially cheated his way through a tournament by representing Bloodcrushers with LotR horses, Bloodletters plonked on top.

Aside for a furore of using a smaller base (also cheating), the LoTR horses are far, far dinkier than a Jugger - and so easier to completely obscure behind cover.

Using the right Base isn't enough

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
You do need to keep an eye on the overall dimensions of the model.

Loooooong ago, some goon essentially cheated his way through a tournament by representing Bloodcrushers with LotR horses, Bloodletters plonked on top.

Aside for a furore of using a smaller base (also cheating), the LoTR horses are far, far dinkier than a Jugger - and so easier to completely obscure behind cover.

Using the right Base isn't enough [/quo

But as the first reply noted you'll be fine in a friendly game. Just watch for TFG and tourney environments.
To me Chaos should be all about weird and wonderful conversions and I don't think we see enough anymore.

Sorry I've managed to add my reply within the quote.

Yeah i dont have any other like jump pack units or anything just these "bikers" they are much bigger than bikers wider than bikers higher than bikers they're using some jetbike see through prong/stand thingys to get the flying aspect across. They just may be a little shorter but maybe by like 1/3 inch but in total much bigger.

Also - general rule of thumb for 'counts as'?

Consider how long it'd take to explain what's what to your opponent.

And just in case they ask you not to use your conversion, see if you can't have the 'right' models on hand. Better use slightly rubbish models than miss out a game or hack off an opponent

Can you even draw LOS to the bike? I kind of thought it was wargear.


EDIT: As long as it's based and armed properly, I'd play it.

It changes the model's unit type, therefore is part of the model.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
It changes the model's unit type, therefore is part of the model.

Interesting. I don't recall that rule. Can you point out a page number for me?

Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
It changes the model's unit type, therefore is part of the model.


Interesting. I don't recall that rule. Can you point out a page number for me?

I don't have the books to hand to quote exactly but it will either be in the Codex under war gear where it is listed as equipment or it is under the Bike subheading under the unit type section in the main rule book.

Just base them as bikes and make the models "bike sized" centours, flying snails, huge maggot abdomen etc. as long as it prevents me from unconsciously mixing them up with jump infantry.
I love conversions, but somehow my unconscious brain refuses to make the these look like unit type x but are really y step even if I consciously know that it is the case.

Depends how well it was done, but probably wouldn't like it. I'm down with conversions, as long as they make sense/are appropriate. For instance, a guy I know runs a Wolf Priest on a bear instead of a bike.

AoS Chaos Knights make great Chaos bikers. And they already come on oval bases and would not easily be confused for Raptors/Warp talons/Possessed etc.

Honestly, you're describing what sounds like, to me, a really awesome Chaos raptor conversion. And I do believe with the same amount of work you could make something that still looks awesome but is still clearly a bike infantry model.

I'd still play with someone with that conversion. But it's very much a 'counts as a bike' as opposed to a 'converted bike' model. If that makes sense.

Thanks for all the feedback guys. Depending on how all the guys i play with feel about it i may change them to raptors and try get Giant worms or something to convert into bikers.

I think it's a great idea. I hate the idea of bikers as well, and always intended to convert plague marines either riding spawn or palanquins of zombies or nurglings. Never got around to it though.
The kind of people who don't like cool/different conversions aren't the kind of people I want to play with.
Modelling for advantage is one thing, rule of cool is another.

I picked up the Imperial assault starwars game for super cheap a while ago and i used the 2 nexu you get in the game as mounts and they worked really well

If it's maggots/worms you want, I designed these ones with just that idea in mind xD

https://www.zinge.co.uk/collections/infantry/products/3-large-mutant-maggots

Love conversions, personally, but this definitely seems more like a converted raptor than a biker. It definitely feels more "counts as" territory. Something like putting him on a slug though? Two big thumbs up!

 B Stores wrote:
If it's maggots/worms you want, I designed these ones with just that idea in mind xD

https://www.zinge.co.uk/collections/infantry/products/3-large-mutant-maggots

Thats awesome and pretty much the design ill end up going with when it comes to that. Thanks a heap

If they meet the following criteria I would have no problem facing them. Approximately the same size, on the correct base and WYSIWIG as far as wargear/weapons.

 Ubl1k wrote:

 B Stores wrote:
If it's maggots/worms you want, I designed these ones with just that idea in mind xD

https://www.zinge.co.uk/collections/infantry/products/3-large-mutant-maggots

Thats awesome and pretty much the design ill end up going with when it comes to that. Thanks a heap

No worries, glad you like them! I'm hoping to have the Mk.2 maggots cast and released this year, but they should be compatible with each other

Knowing the person, it could be a cork and I would say go-ahead.

Your plans run a bit afoul of WYSIWYG but it does sound like a good attempt for a concept you want.
The biker bases is a thoughtful touch in at least giving a hint/visual cue of "treat as bikes".

The proper forum to ask this question is the people you plan on introducing this conversion to.
If the people are reasonable, they would at least be happy to see so much effort put into the models.
Seeing more than a bunch of bare plastic models is something to be happy for.

Good luck with it.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
You do need to keep an eye on the overall dimensions of the model.

Loooooong ago, some goon essentially cheated his way through a tournament by representing Bloodcrushers with LotR horses, Bloodletters plonked on top.

Aside for a furore of using a smaller base (also cheating), the LoTR horses are far, far dinkier than a Jugger - and so easier to completely obscure behind cover.

Using the right Base isn't enough

And here I am reluctantly crippling myself with my Death Guard bikes - not using bikes but instead slowly converting up Ogre Kingdoms Rhinoxen and doing the bikers as sort of beastmasters with flails and whips.

Because I like the mental image of bloated Plague Marine beast masters riding in on shuffling hairy plague rhinos better than a legion dedicated to decay somehow having working bikes

 DarkStarSabre wrote:

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
You do need to keep an eye on the overall dimensions of the model.

Loooooong ago, some goon essentially cheated his way through a tournament by representing Bloodcrushers with LotR horses, Bloodletters plonked on top.

Aside for a furore of using a smaller base (also cheating), the LoTR horses are far, far dinkier than a Jugger - and so easier to completely obscure behind cover.

Using the right Base isn't enough

And here I am reluctantly crippling myself with my Death Guard bikes - not using bikes but instead slowly converting up Ogre Kingdoms Rhinoxen and doing the bikers as sort of beastmasters with flails and whips.

Because I like the mental image of bloated Plague Marine beast masters riding in on shuffling hairy plague rhinos better than a legion dedicated to decay somehow having working bikes

This is why i hate the idea of bikers. I barely use Rhinos or landies either because it just doesnt make sense and the ones i do use are heavily modified to look rusted and really damaged and falling apart. Being a biker id never get on my bike if it wasnt moderately looked after so one that is rusted and falling to piece doesnt really do it for me.

 jreilly89 wrote:
Depends how well it was done, but probably wouldn't like it. I'm down with conversions, as long as they make sense/are appropriate. For instance, a guy I know runs a Wolf Priest on a bear instead of a bike.

I guy I've seen runs space wolves bikers that stand on wolves and dual wield bolters.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Solis Luna Astrum wrote:
If they meet the following criteria I would have no problem facing them. Approximately the same size, on the correct base and WYSIWIG as far as wargear/weapons.

What if they were bigger than bikers?

Sounds good to me.

Hell, if you want, I'll let you use the Jetbike rules instead of the Bike rules. Makes more sense for flying things.

 Ubl1k wrote:

 DarkStarSabre wrote:

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
You do need to keep an eye on the overall dimensions of the model.

Loooooong ago, some goon essentially cheated his way through a tournament by representing Bloodcrushers with LotR horses, Bloodletters plonked on top.

Aside for a furore of using a smaller base (also cheating), the LoTR horses are far, far dinkier than a Jugger - and so easier to completely obscure behind cover.

Using the right Base isn't enough

And here I am reluctantly crippling myself with my Death Guard bikes - not using bikes but instead slowly converting up Ogre Kingdoms Rhinoxen and doing the bikers as sort of beastmasters with flails and whips.

Because I like the mental image of bloated Plague Marine beast masters riding in on shuffling hairy plague rhinos better than a legion dedicated to decay somehow having working bikes

This is why i hate the idea of bikers. I barely use Rhinos or landies either because it just doesnt make sense and the ones i do use are heavily modified to look rusted and really damaged and falling apart. Being a biker id never get on my bike if it wasnt moderately looked after so one that is rusted and falling to piece doesnt really do it for me.

Huzzah! Someone else who understands the Death Guard truly!

My Rhinos and Land Raider are basically done up, damaged and weathered to the point where they look to be in states. The Land Raider is really nothing more than a dedicated Transport for a Terminator 'command' squad but the Rhinos were reluctant additions to the army due to the meta's ridiculously hard shift. Still dislike them.

Dislike the whole Bike fad that's going about - hence the bloated Plague Rhino-beast approach. At the moment there's only a lord (and even then he'll trundle about with some Spawn) but I think it heralds the direction I would go if I had to. I'm reluctantly more accepting of Raptors (due to the Death Guard's use of Destroyers) but still feel remarkably uncomfortable with bike spam.