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 Duncan_Idaho wrote:
They told us the miniatures would be scanned and cleaned up on the computer. But I can´t see how they are going to finance this.

Yes, totally agree, a digital cleaning process is a boring process, very boring, there is some automatic tool, but the result is far from good.

Hanskrampf wrote:Yeah, like it was mentioned before, at this pricepoint it has to be PVC.
For good results, they would need to scan the masters and rework them for the different casting method/material.

They offer no insight of what exactly they have done, though.
You should assume the worst..

Agree, they only show a Gargoyle, but this model looks like a cheap conversion and not a new sculpted model.
They remind me a company I sculpted some models, Kings Makers and they kickstarter for a game called War Prime (where they want produce plastic models and selling for a 1 $ per model)

Exactly, I do have the original miniatures of the two Gargoyles and those shown are not so goo conversions.

So I can pledge one Euro or three hundred.

Not much choice, all in or pledge manager, and we cant even see what we are getting properly.

I share most of you guys' concerns, but my main reason for not backing is the all-or-nothing deal. We've known about it for a while, but I have no interest in buying 200 minis, most of which I really don't care for.
It's a bit frustrating, as I would love to show my support for the Resurrection project. I guess this KS is in part designed to "test the water", and see how much people are interested in the game, but their setup isn't great for that.
If there were an option to buy a single faction, or at the very least a couple ones with the board/terrain (a typical starter set in the end), I would have backed it.

It's already funded, by a large margin, so at least there's some big interest for the game. Hopefully that will drive the Resurrection program forward.

fresus wrote:
I share most of you guys' concerns, but my main reason for not backing is the all-or-nothing deal. We've known about it for a while, but I have no interest in buying 200 minis, most of which I really don't care for.
It's a bit frustrating, as I would love to show my support for the Resurrection project. I guess this KS is in part designed to "test the water", and see how much people are interested in the game, but their setup isn't great for that.
If there were an option to buy a single faction, or at the very least a couple ones with the board/terrain (a typical starter set in the end), I would have backed it.

It's already funded, by a large margin, so at least there's some big interest for the game. Hopefully that will drive the Resurrection program forward.

In my opinion, they cannot produce anything even if the Kickstarter will be successful. 176 model for 300 euro, if they will produce in metal (because they cannot produce in "plastic" pressure injection mould, like GW and digital refine is a mess so even PVC is not a practical option, in my opinion, I know because I'm a digital and traditional miniatures sculptor) it will barely cover the moulds cost.
I hope they can explain with concrete examples what is their plan, so happy to be wrong but IMO they have not the experience and know out for a so big mass production task.

They told one guy from a miniatures blog that there will be no production samples during the KS. And the miniatures at Studio Giraldez are resin ones and as such not identical with the final product.

I share your doubts. No way will they be able to do it even with this much money. Alone the digital cleaning up will cost them massively if done right.

A lot of people will get burned on this,lol

So if I got it correctly, they will provide rules but not cards for models? Or will they also include every card that came with models people are getting?

They told them that cards in five languages will of course be included. They better get some good translators.

And I for sure will not be one of them. As it looks they hope that it will be done for free for them.

 Duncan_Idaho wrote:
They told them that cards in five languages will of course be included. They better get some good translators.

And I for sure will not be one of them. As it looks they hope that it will be done for free for them.

Aren't all cards already in different languages? I know I have French, English and German ones from different ebay models I bought.

Didn't the recaster company sign up with them? Could they just be using the recasting companies resources to produce masters for the plastic casting?

Noone knows... they are not giving any details.
And the cards need at least some editing, since quite some erratas need to be included.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Don´t know whther they really have a contract. From their product plan I would say that they at best have a verbal agreement and want to put it on paper after the KS.

 Overread wrote:
Didn't the recaster company sign up with them? Could they just be using the recasting companies resources to produce masters for the plastic casting?

As I stated in my previous post, a model designed for spincast mould cannot be used for plastic moulds due to undercuts. They can use the same model for PVC cast, but PVC models have less crisp details, and in general, a very low quality, to avoid as much as possible PVC problem you need to sculpt the model in a different way (an example, more crisp and bold details), this mean they need to heavily retouch the actual model they just have.

There is just no way these will look like anything else then a melted lump of plastic imo.
Confrontation minis just have too much of thin filigree on armor plates etc.

 Duncan_Idaho wrote:
. They better get some good translators.

And I for sure will not be one of them.

Well that's all hope for the project sunk then.

Grabbed an EB.

Saw no concrete info on materials and the creators are unwilling or unable to say anything other than “look at the FAQ”.

Immediately dropped pledge.

Post from the creators in the comment section just now:

''Hello Adventurers,
We are reading all your comments and concerns especially about the plastic.
We will give more informations about our process soon.
And thanks again for your support ! ''

 Nostromodamus wrote:
Grabbed an EB.

Saw no concrete info on materials and the creators are unwilling or unable to say anything other than “look at the FAQ”.

Immediately dropped pledge.

I'm following a similar program with one key difference:

Grabbed an EB.

Saw no concrete info on materials and the creators are unwilling or unable to say anything other than “look at the FAQ”.

Will hold on to pledge until near the end - if my concerns aren't addressed or if I'm still leery, will drop pledge in last few days.

Of course, you've got to be careful as after a certain point, I believe KS won't let you drop a pledge in the Nth hour if it would cause the project to not fund?

Don't want to be without a chair if/when that particular song stops...

(Unless KS has since changed that?)

 Nizar wrote:

 Overread wrote:
Didn't the recaster company sign up with them? Could they just be using the recasting companies resources to produce masters for the plastic casting?

As I stated in my previous post, a model designed for spincast mould cannot be used for plastic moulds due to undercuts. They can use the same model for PVC cast, but PVC models have less crisp details, and in general, a very low quality, to avoid as much as possible PVC problem you need to sculpt the model in a different way (an example, more crisp and bold details), this mean they need to heavily retouch the actual model they just have.

Almost all of these old sculpts would work for top notch PVC. They honestly aren't as sharply detailed as you remember being wowed by nearly 20 years ago. I've seen results for Mythic Pantheon, Rising Sun, etc. THAT factory could do them, if they were provided with good renders. Problem is we don't know who these guys are using, and the stretch goal pacing is too close together to give me confidence they're building good margins to correct issues later, with multiple figures lumped in one 30k stretch goal.

 Bossk_Hogg wrote:

 Nizar wrote:

 Overread wrote:
Didn't the recaster company sign up with them? Could they just be using the recasting companies resources to produce masters for the plastic casting?

As I stated in my previous post, a model designed for spincast mould cannot be used for plastic moulds due to undercuts. They can use the same model for PVC cast, but PVC models have less crisp details, and in general, a very low quality, to avoid as much as possible PVC problem you need to sculpt the model in a different way (an example, more crisp and bold details), this mean they need to heavily retouch the actual model they just have.

Almost all of these old sculpts would work for top notch PVC. They honestly aren't as sharply detailed as you remember being wowed by nearly 20 years ago. I've seen results for Mythic Pantheon, Rising Sun, etc. THAT factory could do them, if they were provided with good renders. Problem is we don't know who these guys are using, and the stretch goal pacing is too close together to give me confidence they're building good margins to correct issues later, with multiple figures lumped in one 30k stretch goal.

Even if they're using someone like Ludofact, they still would need to rework the models. PVC shrinks a lot more than metal.
Vampire Hunters used Ludofact, and even made an update about them reworking the renders on suggestions of Ludofact, because the details were too shallow. Obviously they didn't get around to all models and/or details (or simply forgot), because a good portion of the models came out mediocre and missing details.

This looks like a complete and total poop show. Good luck to anyone who keeps their pledge. This couldn't have more red flags if they they tried. It's like they're checking off a list of every red flag we've ever seen to date.

I´ve been palladiumed/sansdetoured? as a future entry in the dictionary

 Duncan_Idaho wrote:
I´ve been palladiumed/sansdetoured? as a future entry in the dictionary

We've been smeckledorfed!

SANS-DETOUR Creator 3 hours ago
@Jczodli @Lionel Humber
We said earlier that we would make an update about our process and the production soon.

Ah...soon™.

I think this one might see the biggest drop ever about 72 hours before the end if they can't satisfactorily answer the Material and Factory questions.

Because there's no doubt this is PVC - but who will be making them?

 Hanskrampf wrote:

 Bossk_Hogg wrote:

 Nizar wrote:

 Overread wrote:
Didn't the recaster company sign up with them? Could they just be using the recasting companies resources to produce masters for the plastic casting?

As I stated in my previous post, a model designed for spincast mould cannot be used for plastic moulds due to undercuts. They can use the same model for PVC cast, but PVC models have less crisp details, and in general, a very low quality, to avoid as much as possible PVC problem you need to sculpt the model in a different way (an example, more crisp and bold details), this mean they need to heavily retouch the actual model they just have.

Almost all of these old sculpts would work for top notch PVC. They honestly aren't as sharply detailed as you remember being wowed by nearly 20 years ago. I've seen results for Mythic Pantheon, Rising Sun, etc. THAT factory could do them, if they were provided with good renders. Problem is we don't know who these guys are using, and the stretch goal pacing is too close together to give me confidence they're building good margins to correct issues later, with multiple figures lumped in one 30k stretch goal.

Even if they're using someone like Ludofact, they still would need to rework the models. PVC shrinks a lot more than metal.
Vampire Hunters used Ludofact, and even made an update about them reworking the renders on suggestions of Ludofact, because the details were too shallow. Obviously they didn't get around to all models and/or details (or simply forgot), because a good portion of the models came out mediocre and missing details.

Totally agree. Maybe I'm wrong they have a big surprise

Good point!

When even the previous 'PVC Gold Standard' (such as it is) factory produces some fairly mediocre results...

Completely unacceptable and downright immoral to just re-use the original Rackham photographs to show off the product, very misleading... We see the many red flags because we know they're re-used, but other people will not be so fortunate and fall for this. Just overlooking the page I still haven't found any obvious disclaimers on that the pictures are not of prototypes or final product.

On top of that the video doesn't even show anyone talk about the product, all we get is some cheesy trailer and P&R as if we're back with good 'ole GW in the 2000s. Best outcome would be them working with the previous recasters (Unlikely due to plastic), worst a pile of heroclix figures. ....Unreasonable dream outcome: They already have big capital behind this, go for the long game, HIPS low part-count figures on sprues a-la GW's LotR.

From their risks, this doesn't sound too appealing either:
- We already master the various stages to manufacture the miniatures: concept-art, modeling, master, sprue-casting or complete and assembled miniatures…

Frankly, I would just as much like someone to just put out unpainted versions of the prepainted plastic Age of Ragnorok minis. Despite not being as detailed as the metals, most of the evils of those were in the bad paintjobs. Plus they wouldn't require special tooling.

 .Mikes. wrote:
Studio Giraldez have announced they're working on Confrontation Resurrection on their FB page, along with resin models.

Painting guide for this model on its way, also.

that model is awesome, I bought a good amount from Cadwallon and love their work, was hoping they would just do the minis for the game,.

Those would be metal, though. God only knows what the shipping would be for 200 metal models :(