King Amroth wrote:Honestly i would be worried about losing most of your scoring units to interceptor straight away and then ofcourse they have their own shooting phase.
Yeah, my Mortis Pattern Contemptor would have a field day with this list.
LOL
Not to mention 10 Space Marines all clustered together for my Scorpius... yeah, that would be fun.
Better yet, I'd love to see what he does vs. a Spartan, Primarch, Terminator Death Star.
Three things you always have to be able to do in 30K:
1. Kill a AV14, Flare Shield, 4
HP vehicle.
2. Kill a Primarch in one round (of close combat or shooting- your choice)
3. Score objectives
This list does one of those things, and not very well (#3- score objectives). Maybe it could take out a Primarch, if the player let them.
There is absolutely no reason what so ever to put a Praetor in Terminator Armor. My version of a Praetor: Paragon Blade, Master Crafted, Iron Halo, Digital Lasers. Can still run, Overwatch, and Sweeping advance, has a 2+/4++. Praetor in Cataphracti Terminator Armor: 2+/4++, can't run, can't sweeping advance, loses grenades (have fun assaulting into cover!) and can't Overwatch. My Praetor costs 180 points (200 if you add the Archaeotech pistol, and why wouldn't you?). Your Cataphracti Praetor: 175, and yours can't run, overwatch, sweeping advance, or strike at initiative when assaulting into cover, and has a crappy Combi-bolter.
Can a Moritat take Inferno Pistols? I mention this because the Moritat entry very specifically says what pistols he may take, and I know the Blood Angels can substitute weapons in place of flamers, but a Moritat can't take a flamer...
The Terminators- that's a lot of points, not to mention your Praetor and a Kharybdis not starting out on the table. Like 800 points worth. Do you know what 800 points buys most Legions? a Primarch, a Spartan, and enough points for a Command Squad, all starting out on the table turn 1 with no reserve rolls. Do you know how many special rules there are that mess with your reserve rolls? You could
DS it on turn 1, but... yeah... The load out on the Terminators- why not give them a heavy weapon (like a Heavy Flamer that you could then make into an assault cannon?)? Why Power Axes? +1S, AP2, Unwieldy, so going on initiative 1 with the whole squad? Trying to save points, but... yeah... I'd go with seven power fists and 2 chain fists. That would save you 5 points over 5 chain fists and 4 power axes.
10 model tactical squads are very easy to remove form the table. If you go 10 models, you should have 4-6 units of them. Personally, all of my lists start out with two 20 model tactical squads with Apothecaries attached to them, all with
BP/Bolter/
CCW, and the Sarge with Artificer Armor, combi-melta, melta bombs. I understand, you are doing Drop Pod assault, but there is a lot of
AP 2 and 3 Large Blast template weapons in 30K. With no Vexicila, you'll be testing on a leadership value of 9 and no special rules to help.
I like the support squad with Volkite Charges, but only if you have 10 of them (you didn't specify, and the min sized unit for a support squad is five models). What exactly will this squad do in your list? Volkite Chargers are kind of short ranged, and five of them won't do much to anything. I guess they could if it was like late game, and you
DS'd near a small unit to try and finish them off. The flamer unit would be good for late game objective camping. I'd hate to charge a unit with 5-10 flamers! With the lack of firepower in your army, I'd make these guys all melta (preferred) or plasma (secondary). I love Volkite weapons, but only in mass quantities and only after all my other bases are covered.
Leviathan Dreads... way over priced for what you get. And they will still get smashed by a hidden Sgt and melta bomb or power fist. Fun fact- Melta Bombs don't have the Melta rule. They have the armorbane rule instead. These guys absolutely wreck face against fortifications and vehicles, but in close combat with anything else? A 300 point single model that can be taken out by a 130 point unit of 10 Space Marines with a melta bomb, and no way for the dread to kill them all in return unless they fail their morale test and he sweeps them is too much of a gamble.
Kharybdis Assault Claw- love it, but
is it expensive (both $$ and in points). You are paying the points for a Land Raider with half the armor (huge difference between
AV 12 and AV14) and half the fire power with a model twice the size! I'd say get a Storm Eagle instead if you really are set on the 9 Terminators and Praetor. Save the points and go with 5 Terminators and an Anvilus Pattern Drop Pod instead, and that would give you enough points for another troop squad in a drop pod.
On the battlefield:
Let's talk about the elephant in the room. You can't null deploy in 30K. If you have no models on the table at any time, you lose. Your current army has 1 model- the Moritat, sitting on the table turn 1. Unless he is buried in ruins at the far corner of the table, out of line of sight (and even then, I'd toss some ordnance/barrage at him) if I am going first, he will die. Considering the fire power that's available to most players, having only half your army to play with for basically the whole game is never a good idea. I would fiddle with the points to make two 20 model tactical squads with Apothecarys and Nuncio-Voxes and have them start on the table.
Shooting, or should I say the non-existent shooting? The only two models with any kind of firepower at all are the Levithan Dreads, with a S6 R24 assault cannon. What is that going to do vs.
AV 14 and flare shields? Or just
AV 14 in general? Assault it? Woe unto the player that allows his
AV 14 vehicle to get assault by a Dreadnought! For the rest of your army- you have two inferno pistols on the Moritat. After that, it's all Bolter fire. So I basically have to kill one model with a jump pack that has to get within range 6", and two Dreadnoughts to make my vehicles immune to your shooting? Done. Not to mention that the chances of you having both Dreads on the table at the same time will be pretty low...
Let's talk about Assault: Man, those two Dreadnoughts are just going to wreck face of anything they get into assault with! Except anything that's geared for assault (I.e.; Terminators with P-fists, chain fists, and T-Hammers or other Dreads or models with Melta bombs). As the best it can kill would be 4 Space marines a turn, I would happily feed it a 20 model Tactical Squad that would tie it up for the whole game, because my squads have Vexilia's for rerolling failed morale checks, and 5+
FnP from the Apothecaries. Did I mention the sergeants have melta bombs? The real scary unit in assault would be the Terminators and Preator. Except if they assault into cover. Not being able to run when you jump out of a Drop Pod makes you a fire magnet. Unless these guys are in wave one of the Drop Pod Assault, I give them a 50/50 chance of ever seeing combat with the odds against them for every turn after that. Consider: You keep them in reserve for turn two. The Kharybdis deep strikes in, and spits them out, where they stand there in a nice little group that can't move or run because the Drop Pod Deep Strik'ed in. Or you keep them in the Kharybdis, because it is an assault vehicle, so now you have to wait until turn three for them to jump out and charge. Did I mention that whole Sky Fire and Interceptor thing vs. an
AV 12 Drop Pod? Worst case, they never manage to get into the game at all. On average, anything held in reserve won't come into the game until Turn Three. Which means this bad
unit, which it really, really is, won't really be able to affect the late game. They'll probably come in and kill whatever, but because at most I'll only have faced half your army, I'll have out scored you, and there is no way this army would ever be able to table another army.
With only half your army on the table on turn 1, it's going to be an uphill battle. Everyone takes at least a Contemptor Mortis Pattern Dreadnought with two Kheres Pattern Assault Cannons- meaning 12 shots at S6 with Rending and Interceptor/Sky Fire. I would park mine front and center of my deployment zone, and then just shoot at anything you have coming down, because you have nothing that can kill it on the table from shooting on turn 1. If you somehow manage to get both your Dreads with their assault cannons in range, you still will have to get rends to glance it, and I'll have at least a 5++ (maybe 4++ if I'm parked in some ruins). The Mortis will shred any Drop Pod you have that comes down within 24" of it. My priority target turn 1: The Moritat as it'll be the only model you have on the table. Everything else will just run up and take objectives. I'd say your first four Drop Pods should be 3x Tactical Squads, 1 Dreadnought. That leaves your second Dread, Support Squad, and Kharybdis to come in later. Why like that? Model count. 1 Moritat, 4 drop pods, 1 Dread, and 30 Space Marines are a heck of a lot harder to kill then say, Kharybdis, 10 Terminators, two drop pods, and two Dreads. There is also the scoring and holding objectives to think about as well. Maybe two Tactical Squads and both Levithans on turn 1? You need something on the table right away that can shoot at me and take objectives, but the Terminators will require some special handling to get them into close combat. I just don't see any way you could Drop Pod Assault in your favor with this army! Maybe two Tactical Squads, Kharybids, and one Dread on turn 1? Means Terminators probably won't see any action until turn 2, probably turn 3. That's a big risk, because if you keep them inside the Kharybdis and it crashes and burns... ouch.
TLDR
No shooting, or so little of it that it doesn't matter, and no real way to take out vehicles except by assaulting them. All the anti-vehicle fire power is concentrated into two Dreads that can easily be tied up in close combat with a Tactical Squad. Because of the way the army is deployed, seeing them both on the table at the same time will probably not happen.
One super duper strong terminator assault squad which... is about the same with all the other super duper assault squads in 30K. It's MAD- mutual assured destruction. Because I have nothing but a super duper assault squad to take on your super duper assault squad. I'd doubt if your dreads ever make it into close combat, which is the one place they excell in, but they are your main anti armor fire power. Your best close combat models you'll want to keep out of close combat so they can shoot... Oh, and you have no anti-air in your army- watch out for those flyers, especially a Fire Raptor or Xiphon. Or heck, a Lightning!
Honestly, this isn't a very good list, especially at 2,500 points where Primarchs and Lords of War choices start to come out and play. You'll never have more than half your army on the table at one time, and with no real shooting or psychic phase, you are handing half the game to your opponent.
It is an interesting idea, and I'd love to hear how it performs! Good luck.
