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Title says it all really. Age of Sigmar had summoning cut back with the general's handbook. I quite like the idea of a tzeentch summoning army, but I suspect that this might be a good thing to hold back on before we know if summoning will fundamentally change with 8th

It might be. We all do not know. However I would like it if they did tone it down summoning is already hard to pull of in 40k.
And other things need some serious nerfs such as, formation point cost, bikes and all the insane ways to make 2++ rerollable possible.

Yeah - personally I feel that if you invest the points in psykers then you shouldn't have to pay the additional points for summons like AoS does. I guess I'd be OK with them upping the amount of warp charges for summons if they felt the need to nerf it in some way, but at the moment, I suspect the most likely options are A: it stays the same or B: it will work like in AoS.

The uncertainty's a bit annoying tbh. I've been having fun painting some Tzeentch daemons for a change, and don't want to have it become junk on the battlefield... It's really demotivational to carry on until we know

Yeah - personally I feel that if you invest the points in psykers then you shouldn't have to pay the additional points for summons like AoS does.

Except obviously that would just mean Psykers are auto-included in most armies just so you can get some extra free points of models.

And upping the cost of Psykers to compensate would be irritating to those who don't use summoning tactics.

To me the issue with summoning is that so many armies can do it. I would like to see it less available if it's left as "free models" like it is now. Restricting who can use it would be nice.

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:

Yeah - personally I feel that if you invest the points in psykers then you shouldn't have to pay the additional points for summons like AoS does.

Except obviously that would just mean Psykers are auto-included in most armies just so you can get some extra free points of models.

And upping the cost of Psykers to compensate would be irritating to those who don't use summoning tactics.

That's funny, because last I checked you don't need to pay any extra points for summons, and summoning psykers AREN'T an auto-include in every army.
Weird how that works.

To be honest I wouldn't be too disappointed if they restricted summoning to chaos/daemons (plus maybe IG for renegades and inquisition seeing as they use daemonhosts...) It is a bit weird seeing space marine librarians, sanctioned psykers and ork weirdboyz conjuring up screamers and daemonettes.

Mind you, I quite enjoy my IG primaris psyker doing a little summoning. I have some sinister twisted guardsmen with extra limbs to represent daemonettes

I think from a tactical point of view summoning isn't broken currently (particularly compared with all the other craziness these days). One thing I would like to see changed however is the ability to summon 10 pink horrors. They're just a bit too strong given how split works now

 DoomMouse wrote:
To be honest I wouldn't be too disappointed if they restricted summoning to chaos/daemons (plus maybe IG for renegades and inquisition seeing as they use daemonhosts...) It is a bit weird seeing space marine librarians, sanctioned psykers and ork weirdboyz conjuring up screamers and daemonettes.

Mind you, I quite enjoy my IG primaris psyker doing a little summoning. I have some sinister twisted guardsmen with extra limbs to represent daemonettes

I'd agree with that, I'd like it also force the army to adjust on the allies chart. Changing who they can battle brothers with. So I guess deciding to summon should be part of army construction.

It probably won't go away entirely, as it's both featured in the Rising Storm lore and is a way for GW to sell more models to players. Toning it down would be nice though.

Summoning is less terrifying than people seem to think it is. The AoS matched-points summoning solution (anything you summon has to come from a pool designated ahead of time that counts against your army's points total) made Summoning functionally useless, trying to impose that on 40k would be a gross overreaction.

A better set of solutions would be to prohibit summoned models from summoning more models, to require more sacrifices for summoned models, to make Summoning actually deny-able rather than make everyone deny it on 6s, and/or to let each psyker have only one summoned unit in play at a time.

If you want to nerf it, nerf it. Just leave it playable. Or delete it. Don't waste space in the rulebook with things nobody is ever going to use.

I like the AoS system. It means I can plan what to summon, not paint up 60 lesser Daemons. And its hardly useless to summon an untouched unit 9" away from the enemy.

Since Pink Horrors are the crazy stupid thing right now, I'm certain they will be made unplayable in the new edition once all the WAAC players have bought 100 each.

I've considered it but not willing to collect an army of ugly pink models just to win at Warhammer for two months.

EDIT: Also continually removing and replacing models every time something dies gets really old fast.

XT-1984 wrote:
I like the AoS system. It means I can plan what to summon, not paint up 60 lesser Daemons. And its hardly useless to summon an untouched unit 9" away from the enemy.

I think the AoS system does make sense in the context of AoS. It could probably be done with 40k, but I think a lot of things in 40k would have to be changed in order for it to work well. Like right now the Tyranids have the Tervigon, which effectively "summons" termagants wherever it happens to be. It makes sense in the context of that army to have the points cost built into the cost of the Tervigon, but maybe if the Tyranids got a whole bunch of other "summoner" units it could work with AoS style summoning rules.

(I might be reading the rules wrong, but my understanding of summoning in AoS is that it counts not just units brought onto the board through magic spells, but through other means like the Chaos Lord's ability try to outflank a Slaves to Darkness unit onto the table each turn.)

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:
Except obviously that would just mean Psykers are auto-included in most armies just so you can get some extra free points of models.

And upping the cost of Psykers to compensate would be irritating to those who don't use summoning tactics.

I don't think that psykers should become more expensive some should be especially those nasty not at 3+ or 2+ casters and anyone who has some reroll trick.
But the majority of them pays a hefty fee for their 4+ warp charges and you will need to generate at least 6 extra of them to even have a decent change of summoning 1 unit of daemons a turn, and this is if your opponent doesnt ruin your plan. This is likely to be a 300-400 pts investment just to have a chance at summoning a 100 pt squad a turn in a game that only lasts ~5 turns.


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 AnomanderRake wrote:

A better set of solutions would be to prohibit summoned models from summoning more models, to require more sacrifices for summoned models, to make Summoning actually deny-able rather than make everyone deny it on 6s, and/or to let each psyker have only one summoned unit in play at a time..

I agree with you and so did GW apparently.They removed the summoning abilities of pink horrors. So the only daemons who now can summon other summons are heralds and greater daemons. Both require a sacrifice and are non guaranteed spells.