Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:
No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
Times and dates in your local timezone.
Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.
If you are already a member then feel free to login now.
Interesting batrep about a guy getting beat by grey knights. A pure grey knights list that went to win a tournnament.
"Glory in our suffering, because we know that suffering produces perseverance; perseverance, character; and character, hope. And hope does not disappoint"
-Paul of Tarsus
If my post seems goofy, assume I am posting from my phone and the autocorrect elf in my phone is drunk again
One thing I noticed right off the bat in that bat rep
In the psychic phase, the Grandmaster cast Sanctuary on himself. He then cast Astral Aim on himself.
Can't do that as a GM only knows 1 power plus smite
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Elric Greywolf wrote: Had pretty good success this past weekend at a 20-man tourney. Tabelled two Eldar (one with Harlie support, one with Fire Prisms, both with ~15 Reapers and Farseers).
I'm considering swapping out Draigo and some Striker bodies for Celestine and an Apothecary with Soul Glaive, but I'm torn on the change.
Draigo does more damage in CC and has a better invuln (can get to 2++ with the Strat, and can fight after death with the strat); he also provides support to my GK units and is a general beatstick--he ALWAYS hits, and wounds on at least a 3+, or 2+ with HH. However, he's slow and is vulnerable to getting tied up in melee with chaff.
Celestine is insanely survivable, thanks to having 14 wounds and a 2+4++. Her resurrect ability is basically a free Gate, that I usually use to protect my backfield objective against enemy Deep Strikers. (For example, in one game I played this weekend, some Ruststalkers came up and murdered my two Guard squads sitting on an objective. I had to Gate a GMDK back there to deal with it. Whereas with Celestine, she would've just died and popped up back there to kill them all.)
But she provides no support for the rest of my army--she's a lone wolf in my list, and I already have a Callidus and a Culexus in there as loners.
Tactically, Draigo drops by a 10man GKSS and the Raven for rerolls fun, and then tries to make a charge.
Celestine would faith move forward and prolly kill some chaff, which she's great at, then fly over and try for a vehicle/monster. Without Draigo, I'd have to position a GMDK near the Raven and GKSS for a worse reroll than Draigo. This is bad because the GMDK base size is often difficult to position when he has to triangulate between 1) a charge target, 2) the Raven, and 3) the GKSS. Draigo is much easier to fit into that position.
The Apothecary with Soul Glaive is basically a self-healing, baby Draigo. He can survive in combat thanks to restoring wounds to himself. He'll always hit on a 2+ rerolling, and he'll usually wound at S5 rerolling. However, while Draigo can solo anything and do lots of damage (S8 D4 yes please), this guy is best against troops only, while he could get to 4+ wounds on vehicles IF Hammerhand. And his damage is d3 instead of flat 4, booooo. And he can't go in with anything that hits hard, bc he only has a 2+5++, and Sanctuary/Prognosticators will always be on the GMDKs.
Just wanted to let you know that Draigo does a flat 3 damage not a flat 4. His weapon is str +4 ap -4 D3
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/03/28 12:32:25
There is no such thing as a plea of innocence in my court. A plea of innocence is guilty of wasting my time. Guilty. - Lord Inquisitor Fyodor Karamazov
In an Imperium of a million worlds, what is the death of one world in the cause of purity?~Inquisition credo
He who allows the alien to live, shares its crime of existence. ~Inquisitor Apollyon
Zarroc1733 wrote: One thing I noticed right off the bat in that bat rep
In the psychic phase, the Grandmaster cast Sanctuary on himself. He then cast Astral Aim on himself.
Can't do that as a GM only knows 1 power plus smite
The list didn't say who was the Warlord for the GK, but couldn't the GKGM have had the +1 psychic power knowd trait?
I honestly forgot that warlord trait existed. I guess it's possible (though I always saw that one as a waste. Maybe why I forgot it.) So it could be legal after all. Another weird part of that batrep was that he said he failed to saves against Draigo and took 4 damage, but it should've been 6 which iirc would kill a bike captain though I guess he could've taken the FNP warlord trait and reduced that by 2. Also I'm assuming a lot of it is from memory so it could be wrong in a couple places.
There is no such thing as a plea of innocence in my court. A plea of innocence is guilty of wasting my time. Guilty. - Lord Inquisitor Fyodor Karamazov
In an Imperium of a million worlds, what is the death of one world in the cause of purity?~Inquisition credo
He who allows the alien to live, shares its crime of existence. ~Inquisitor Apollyon
Interesting batrep about a guy getting beat by grey knights. A pure grey knights list that went to win a tournnament.
Honestly did anyone else think how ghastly the White Scars list was?
I could've beat that with Index Necrons.
Yeah, not impressed either. There's almost no anti-tank/big stuff shooting, and most of it is Missile Launchers. No wonder the Grand Master ran rampant through the White Scars.
For thirteen years I had a dog with fur the darkest black. For thirteen years he was my friend, oh how I want him back.
I don't know vanilla marines very well so I wasn't sure but it seemed rather bad to me as well.
There is no such thing as a plea of innocence in my court. A plea of innocence is guilty of wasting my time. Guilty. - Lord Inquisitor Fyodor Karamazov
In an Imperium of a million worlds, what is the death of one world in the cause of purity?~Inquisition credo
He who allows the alien to live, shares its crime of existence. ~Inquisitor Apollyon
I remember somewhere people mentioning that scout allies mix really well with GK but don't recall why? Was it because the scout move helps preventing getting deep striked back?
Interesting batrep about a guy getting beat by grey knights. A pure grey knights list that went to win a tournnament.
Can't say I was impressed by the White Scar general, he himself noticed his mistakes in the after-thoughts. Shooting a 3+ invul isn't very productive in the long run. Also he played the mission objectives rather than doing the smart thing and going for the tabling or at least killing power armor squads. It was an interesting choice to engage a strike squad with just a captain and some scout bikers while Draigo was so close. Moving back and shooting would have been a real good move on his part. I'm going to ignore how badly he was outscored because of the kill point modifier. I would like to see the rest of the opponents.
Interesting batrep about a guy getting beat by grey knights. A pure grey knights list that went to win a tournnament.
Can't say I was impressed by the White Scar general, he himself noticed his mistakes in the after-thoughts. Shooting a 3+ invul isn't very productive in the long run. Also he played the mission objectives rather than doing the smart thing and going for the tabling or at least killing power armor squads. It was an interesting choice to engage a strike squad with just a captain and some scout bikers while Draigo was so close. Moving back and shooting would have been a real good move on his part. I'm going to ignore how badly he was outscored because of the kill point modifier. I would like to see the rest of the opponents.
I'm curious, since the grey Knight player won the tournament what his his other games were against and the rules of the tournament.
"Glory in our suffering, because we know that suffering produces perseverance; perseverance, character; and character, hope. And hope does not disappoint"
-Paul of Tarsus
If my post seems goofy, assume I am posting from my phone and the autocorrect elf in my phone is drunk again
I'd be more interested in seeing his actual list to see if the assumptions made in this thread are correct or whether he played an illegal list or made some illegal uses of his figures. I also wonder if he remembered that all of his psilencers were firing at -1 to hit since they moved (it just seems like he got an awful lot of hits/wounds per unit). I'm not saying that he did anything wrong but I'd like more details.
Anyone had any success with purifiers? I currently run paladins with draigo. Just bought my first dreadknight but I really want to figure out how to use purifiers as I love their fluff.
TheMostWize wrote: Anyone had any success with purifiers? I currently run paladins with draigo. Just bought my first dreadknight but I really want to figure out how to use purifiers as I love their fluff.
Stormravens? Razorbacks?
28 ppm after stormbolters makes them too expensive for me. Combined with the fact that they gain nothing for those points except a more damaging but more limited smite(which means you're paying 30 more points for a rule that pretty much only benefits one model as you only get one cast per unit). If you are dead set on using them a stormraven would probably be your best bet. Drop them off as close as possible. I've tried this but never had any luck. But I guess if you have an extra 30 points you have no reason not to upgrade a squad of strikes to a squad of purifiers (except maybe you may need strikes to meet detachment requirements) but I'd probably look for upgrades elsewhere.
There is no such thing as a plea of innocence in my court. A plea of innocence is guilty of wasting my time. Guilty. - Lord Inquisitor Fyodor Karamazov
In an Imperium of a million worlds, what is the death of one world in the cause of purity?~Inquisition credo
He who allows the alien to live, shares its crime of existence. ~Inquisitor Apollyon
I'm giving them a try the next game I play. Rather than starting them in a Raven I'm putting them and a strike squad in a redeemer. My meta has a high number of Fire Raptors and math hammer says that land raiders last longer than Ravens. If I were building a list around them I would also put Crowe, a Captain and a banner bearer in the list. The captain will allow them all to Smite at 6" and the other 2 models also have normal smites, albeit normal range is only 3". If you're going to go after units using smite then you might as well go whole hog.
I miss the power purifiers had last edition. That Nova was awesome. I would love to see their smite do something like that again.
"Glory in our suffering, because we know that suffering produces perseverance; perseverance, character; and character, hope. And hope does not disappoint"
-Paul of Tarsus
If my post seems goofy, assume I am posting from my phone and the autocorrect elf in my phone is drunk again
Leo_the_Rat wrote: I'm giving them a try the next game I play. Rather than starting them in a Raven I'm putting them and a strike squad in a redeemer. My meta has a high number of Fire Raptors and math hammer says that land raiders last longer than Ravens. If I were building a list around them I would also put Crowe, a Captain and a banner bearer in the list. The captain will allow them all to Smite at 6" and the other 2 models also have normal smites, albeit normal range is only 3". If you're going to go after units using smite then you might as well go whole hog.
I'm thinking of take them in a crusader. With the Psybolt stratagem that thing will out out 24 str 5 ap -1 and 12 str 6 ap -1 shots. Great for clearing infantry before your purifiers get out. Drive it up shoot at a target. Charge the land raider into something else and drag launcher them. Next turn 3 purifier squads get out and D6 smite stuff then proceed to shoot and charge anything left.
I just wish GW went back to the old rule where you could exit a vehicle after it moved but couldn't move any farther. Then purifiers would really be useful.
Or maybe they should enable that rule for vehicles with assault ramps and their equivalents. That way troops aren't trapped in a vehicle for extra time and riding in a vehicle would be more useful than the vehicle just being mobile armor. At least assault vehicles would have a true purpose.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/03/30 15:33:38
Leo_the_Rat wrote: I just wish GW went back to the old rule where you could exit a vehicle after it moved but couldn't move any farther. Then purifiers would really be useful.
Or maybe they should enable that rule for vehicles with assault ramps and their equivalents. That way troops aren't trapped in a vehicle for extra time and riding in a vehicle would be more useful than the vehicle just being mobile armor. At least assault vehicles would have a true purpose.
Yea I'm not really sure what they changed that rule. The fact that disembarking has to occur at the start of the movement phase is odd to me.
Leo_the_Rat wrote: I just wish GW went back to the old rule where you could exit a vehicle after it moved but couldn't move any farther. Then purifiers would really be useful.
Or maybe they should enable that rule for vehicles with assault ramps and their equivalents. That way troops aren't trapped in a vehicle for extra time and riding in a vehicle would be more useful than the vehicle just being mobile armor. At least assault vehicles would have a true purpose.
Yea I'm not really sure what they changed that rule. The fact that disembarking has to occur at the start of the movement phase is odd to me.
It does seem to negate some of the use of a transport you know "transporting" units. They move quicker when they're in it but often have to wait a turn before getting out.
Purifiers just have no synergy to be useful. Plenty of easy fixes for purifiers.
Automatically Appended Next Post: On another note... Anyone ever try a 5 man purgation squad with 4 incinerators in a storm raven or landraider? seems like legit dakka with the mobility to get places
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2018/03/31 03:25:31
"Glory in our suffering, because we know that suffering produces perseverance; perseverance, character; and character, hope. And hope does not disappoint"
-Paul of Tarsus
If my post seems goofy, assume I am posting from my phone and the autocorrect elf in my phone is drunk again
If the incinerators were cheaper I would agree. GW needs to get it though their thick heads we should not be paying so much for "upgrades" when it forces us to literally give up a force sword and stormbolter.
The problem with the purgation squad in a Raven or any transport is in the basic transportation rules. Your opponent knows that the squad is in the model and knows that you can't get out until the start of your next turn. So what happens is you move the transport up to your intended target. The target moves away. Repeat as necessary or until transport is destroyed with the purgators being left away from their target and usually exposed.
GW needs to put some meaning in a vehicle having an "assault ramp". Like allowing models to disembard after the vehicle moves but not allowing the unit to move after disembarkation until the declare charge phase.
Yeah at 33 ppm (153 points for the squad) you could take a strike squad and a half. Maybe if you had the extra points but I never seem to have extra points. But strikes are also more useful for filling up a b for more CPs. The only infantry I've found that I feel rivals the usefulness of strikes are interceptors. You get an extra 6 inches of movement, the ability to move over models and terrain as if they weren't there and a really useful teleport. They don't mind starting on the field meaning you can DS more units. All this for only 4 extra ppm.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Leo_the_Rat wrote: The problem with the purgation squad in a Raven or any transport is in the basic transportation rules. Your opponent knows that the squad is in the model and knows that you can't get out until the start of your next turn. So what happens is you move the transport up to your intended target. The target moves away. Repeat as necessary or until transport is destroyed with the purgators being left away from their target and usually exposed.
GW needs to put some meaning in a vehicle having an "assault ramp". Like allowing models to disembard after the vehicle moves but not allowing the unit to move after disembarkation until the declare charge phase.
This would help a lot of armies too, not just GK. Orks would love it. I wouldn't mind even being allowed to disembark after movement but you gotta roll a d6 and on a 1 a model is slain or something. Anything is better than now.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2018/03/31 13:06:01
There is no such thing as a plea of innocence in my court. A plea of innocence is guilty of wasting my time. Guilty. - Lord Inquisitor Fyodor Karamazov
In an Imperium of a million worlds, what is the death of one world in the cause of purity?~Inquisition credo
He who allows the alien to live, shares its crime of existence. ~Inquisitor Apollyon
Zarroc1733 wrote: Yeah at 33 ppm (153 points for the squad) you could take a strike squad and a half. Maybe if you had the extra points but I never seem to have extra points. But strikes are also more useful for filling up a b for more CPs. The only infantry I've found that I feel rivals the usefulness of strikes are interceptors. You get an extra 6 inches of movement, the ability to move over models and terrain as if they weren't there and a really useful teleport. They don't mind starting on the field meaning you can DS more units. All this for only 4 extra ppm.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Leo_the_Rat wrote: The problem with the purgation squad in a Raven or any transport is in the basic transportation rules. Your opponent knows that the squad is in the model and knows that you can't get out until the start of your next turn. So what happens is you move the transport up to your intended target. The target moves away. Repeat as necessary or until transport is destroyed with the purgators being left away from their target and usually exposed.
GW needs to put some meaning in a vehicle having an "assault ramp". Like allowing models to disembard after the vehicle moves but not allowing the unit to move after disembarkation until the declare charge phase.
This would help a lot of armies too, not just GK. Orks would love it. I wouldn't mind even being allowed to disembark after movement but you gotta roll a d6 and on a 1 a model is slain or something. Anything is better than now.
I like purgation squads with 4 psilencers. They can start on the field and move to about mid field and hang there the rest of the game casting astral aim. Good target for some Psy ammo too with 24 shots doing d3 at str 5 ap-1. Have draigo near and even on the move they hit 75%. Nasty lil squad. They usually don't take much abuse since the opponent is usually concerned with the dreadknights, interceptors, strike squads and paladins in their face a bit more.
"Glory in our suffering, because we know that suffering produces perseverance; perseverance, character; and character, hope. And hope does not disappoint"
-Paul of Tarsus
If my post seems goofy, assume I am posting from my phone and the autocorrect elf in my phone is drunk again
Zarroc1733 wrote: Yeah at 33 ppm (153 points for the squad) you could take a strike squad and a half. Maybe if you had the extra points but I never seem to have extra points. But strikes are also more useful for filling up a b for more CPs. The only infantry I've found that I feel rivals the usefulness of strikes are interceptors. You get an extra 6 inches of movement, the ability to move over models and terrain as if they weren't there and a really useful teleport. They don't mind starting on the field meaning you can DS more units. All this for only 4 extra ppm.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Leo_the_Rat wrote: The problem with the purgation squad in a Raven or any transport is in the basic transportation rules. Your opponent knows that the squad is in the model and knows that you can't get out until the start of your next turn. So what happens is you move the transport up to your intended target. The target moves away. Repeat as necessary or until transport is destroyed with the purgators being left away from their target and usually exposed.
GW needs to put some meaning in a vehicle having an "assault ramp". Like allowing models to disembard after the vehicle moves but not allowing the unit to move after disembarkation until the declare charge phase.
This would help a lot of armies too, not just GK. Orks would love it. I wouldn't mind even being allowed to disembark after movement but you gotta roll a d6 and on a 1 a model is slain or something. Anything is better than now.
I like purgation squads with 4 psilencers. They can start on the field and move to about mid field and hang there the rest of the game casting astral aim. Good target for some Psy ammo too with 24 shots doing d3 at str 5 ap-1. Have draigo near and even on the move they hit 75%. Nasty lil squad. They usually don't take much abuse since the opponent is usually concerned with the dreadknights, interceptors, strike squads and paladins in their face a bit more.
I've always found them too easy to destroy and they are a much higher value target than strikes or interceptors. If you babysit them with Draigo I feel you're wasting so much of Draigo's potential. Typically if I'm gonna spend 2 cp on psy a stratagem I'll either use psybolt on a unit of 10 with storm bolters or I'll use psyammo on my GMDK. Of course ymmv
Automatically Appended Next Post: So I'm in a 1750 point match today against sisters of battle with allied astra millitarum. I'm not entirely sure what she's bringing but I know Celestine and Tank Commander Pask will make appearences. The match is an all out slug fest last man (or woman) standing wins. We must completely table our opponent. That being the case I'm kind of worried. This is my list
It cannot be changed at this point. I'm worried that if I don't get 1st turn Pask will wipe my stormraven off the board immediately. In the past she's used the punisher gatling cannon however it could have changed. I'm thinking about trying to wait out her task placement and putting my stormraven around 57 inches away to be out of range of its guns unless it moves full 10 inches (losing the double attack.) If I win turn 1 move 45 inches getting with 12 for my melta and just blowing Pask off the board. I've also yet to see Celestine in action. Looking at her stats it doesn't seem she is much of a threat to Draigo or the GMDK. Anyone else have any tips or anything they think I should be aware of? If I win this match I'm nearly guaranteed to win this league.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Also I've wondered if I should maybe make the champion my warlord as he has few enough wounds to hide.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2018/03/31 17:01:36
There is no such thing as a plea of innocence in my court. A plea of innocence is guilty of wasting my time. Guilty. - Lord Inquisitor Fyodor Karamazov
In an Imperium of a million worlds, what is the death of one world in the cause of purity?~Inquisition credo
He who allows the alien to live, shares its crime of existence. ~Inquisitor Apollyon
If you are shoot my mid field models who are very likely in cover, then my models looking to get into assault tend to survive and reach a combat easier. -or- I can spend a cp and deep strike them behind a building and let astral aim do the work. Their use is to hold mid field and still pour hate from their max range shooting at 24". Strikes have a different role and achieve their max potiential under 12" making use of both the shooting and assault phase. Same with most the rest of the army.
I think just the one squad goes a long way. And are not much more than a strike squad. Psilencers are pretty well priced
"Glory in our suffering, because we know that suffering produces perseverance; perseverance, character; and character, hope. And hope does not disappoint"
-Paul of Tarsus
If my post seems goofy, assume I am posting from my phone and the autocorrect elf in my phone is drunk again
Don't see the issue with the new transport rules. You can move in your turn like normal , so just park your raven 2'' to your target. Only the fastest will be able to escape
