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I agree that Terminator Librarians are too expensive.

I think Deathwing Knights and Belial are the reason to play Deathwing, and maybe even the reason to play Dark Angels. The shooty terminators aren't much better than the other chapters (tho Belial certainly helps).

The Deathwing Apothecary is a good deal if you have more than two other Deathwing units. For 75 points he has everything a bare 26 point Terminator has, plus 3 Wounds so he's already worth at least 40. Then for the remaining 35 points you can heal maybe 3 or 4 Wounds and maybe resurrect a model in the course of a game? Value. But I'd rather have a Sanguinary Priest!

I'm not sure about the Champion. The Ancient might be worth it next to two units of Deathwing Knights.

I recommend the Lascannon Land Raider. The Crusader isn't much of a threat once it's empty.

Shooty dreadnoughts compare favorably to Predators. While they may not be as efficient or as tough shooting platforms as Razorbacks, they have the advantage of swinging back at infantry.

I think a 100% Deathwing army will be a challenge but probably not bad for Eternal War missions. I'm trying a 50% Deathwing army around Belial with the other half centered around Belisarius Cawl.


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Maybe a Jump Pack Librarian is a better buy than Terminator?

Why do you think the crusader isn't much of a threat? It can put out 36+ shots a turn, that's pretty good.

bobafett012 wrote:
Why do you think the crusader isn't much of a threat? It can put out 36+ shots a turn, that's pretty good.

The issue with the crusader in a DeathWing list, as I see it, is that it's just "more of the same". It means that in terms of dealing with vehicles, you only really have assault as a viable option, and DeathWing are slooooow...

That said, I've made a list here: https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/728088.page#9416951

Any thoughts are gratefully received, either here or there.

For reference, from a tactics POV the thoughts I'm having are:

Shooty or CC - I've gone shooty, and take advantage of cover (and bring your own cover of the LRs) - the 3++ is nice, but it doesn't kill much if you're not LR rushing, and without crusaders there isn't much point

Upgrades or bodies - I've gone upgrades, but only because it "felt" right, no other reason, and I'm happy to be corrected

LRs or Dreads - I like Land Raiders, and looking at the Dread rules, I think the LR's add more for the points

LRs or Bodies - the LRs take up the points cost 3 terminator squads (and then some), but I think they add a different dimension

 axisofentropy wrote:
I agree that Terminator Librarians are too expensive.

I think Deathwing Knights and Belial are the reason to play Deathwing, and maybe even the reason to play Dark Angels. The shooty terminators aren't much better than the other chapters (tho Belial certainly helps).

The Deathwing Apothecary is a good deal if you have more than two other Deathwing units. For 75 points he has everything a bare 26 point Terminator has, plus 3 Wounds so he's already worth at least 40. Then for the remaining 35 points you can heal maybe 3 or 4 Wounds and maybe resurrect a model in the course of a game? Value. But I'd rather have a Sanguinary Priest!

Not that it is a huge difference but the Apothecary is 77 points he has to pay two points for the storm bolter.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Russell's teapot wrote:

bobafett012 wrote:
Why do you think the crusader isn't much of a threat? It can put out 36+ shots a turn, that's pretty good.

The issue with the crusader in a DeathWing list, as I see it, is that it's just "more of the same". It means that in terms of dealing with vehicles, you only really have assault as a viable option, and DeathWing are slooooow...

I am in agreement on the Land Raider. Now that deepstrike is way more reliable, you have to get out in the movement phase and the assault cannon doesn't rend hurts the crusader. A crusader either has to get close then next turn disembark its contents while the enemy could simple just run away causing you to have to chase and wait another turn to drop off your knights. Other scenario it charges a unit and uses its new frag launcher rule to keep a squad (4+ to deliver some mortal wounds is nice) in place but the enemy gets to wail on it for a turn and then it drops off its knights and then runs away but can't shoot for a phase. Which kind of sucks having a 287 or 314 point model (multi-melta) that spends an entire turn not shooting.

Also Deathwing really need anti-tank and tanks while more expensive are not going to die easily now so lascannons, multi-meltas and autocannons have to find a way into the list somewhere.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
One note on dreadnoughts, while they can't be deepstruck in a pod right now, unlike other vehicles they do not degrade and are potent in the fight phase as well. The venerable dread for 20 more points gets you 2+/2+ really 3+ BS since he will be moving and a FNP 6+ which is nice.

Throc wrote:


Not that it is a huge difference but the Apothecary is 77 points he has to pay two points for the storm bolter.

yes I was comparing to a bare Terminator. It also pays for its Storm Bolter so it's equivalent.

Throc wrote:

I am in agreement on the Land Raider. Now that deepstrike is way more reliable, you have to get out in the movement phase and the assault cannon doesn't rend hurts the crusader. A crusader either has to get close then next turn disembark its contents while the enemy could simple just run away causing you to have to chase and wait another turn to drop off your knights. Other scenario it charges a unit and uses its new frag launcher rule to keep a squad (4+ to deliver some mortal wounds is nice) in place but the enemy gets to wail on it for a turn and then it drops off its knights and then runs away but can't shoot for a phase. Which kind of sucks having a 287 or 314 point model (multi-melta) that spends an entire turn not shooting.

Also Deathwing really need anti-tank and tanks while more expensive are not going to die easily now so lascannons, multi-meltas and autocannons have to find a way into the list somewhere.

That's what I was leaning towards myself. Terms already carry stormbolters and assault cannons that were buffed (at least stormbolters), so the LR godhammer seems the way to go, although they are 69 points more expensive...

Throc wrote:

Automatically Appended Next Post:
One note on dreadnoughts, while they can't be deepstruck in a pod right now, unlike other vehicles they do not degrade and are potent in the fight phase as well. The venerable dread for 20 more points gets you 2+/2+ really 3+ BS since he will be moving and a FNP 6+ which is nice.

So i was debating on whether to even give my venerable dreads DCCWs. Its cheaper to give them twin las and missiles and that makes them far more anti tank as well, so a pair of them along with a Godhammer LR seems like a decent enough amount of heavy anti-tank, but again, I'm trying to decide whether the higher cost, and versatility of the DCCW is better than just going pure fire support. I'm envisioning a squad of knights, and depending on my opponent, possibly a couple squads of terms as well, coming down turn 1 or 2 with Belial. The rest of my forces, whatever squads of terms didn't DS, a LR and maybe 2 dreads marching up the field in support of each other, and in that scenario, the dreads might not need DCCWs.

Two things I'm wondering about: Grav Pistols, and the Imperial Space Marine. Is a Grav Pistol worth taking over a Plasma Pistol? It is lower strength, but d3 damage against anything with a 3+ save seems legit, compared to 1 damage or a risky 2 damage with the plasma. Could be nasty vs. other Space Marine characters or something. As for the ISM, he seems really deadly with that d6 damage from his Disintegration gun. I'm just not sure he's worth the 60 points he costs. It is a cool model and I really want to use him though!

Y'all Deathwing Knights are the business. Two or three units, Belial and importantly the Ancient. With a reroll, at least one will likely make a charge.

I talked up the Apothecary earlier and he's good, but the Ancient is even greater value. If he's standing near 8 power fists you paid 160 points for, +1 Attack makes them 50% more effective, an 80 point value. Then his own 4 thunder hammer attacks makes him even more valuable.

I'll try some Ravenwing this week, but I'm more convinced now that Deathwing is the reason to play dark angels in 8th.

 axisofentropy wrote:
Y'all Deathwing Knights are the business. Two or three units, Belial and importantly the Ancient. With a reroll, at least one will likely make a charge.

I talked up the Apothecary earlier and he's good, but the Ancient is even greater value. If he's standing near 8 power fists you paid 160 points for, +1 Attack makes them 50% more effective, an 80 point value. Then his own 4 thunder hammer attacks makes him even more valuable.

I'll try some Ravenwing this week, but I'm more convinced now that Deathwing is the reason to play dark angels in 8th.

So would you say that DW Knights are better than regular Deathwing terminators then? I'm of the opinion that they are both equally good at different jobs, but that's just me. Are Land Raiders worth trying, or should we stick to teleporting in?

The Land Raiders with lascannons are very good. I only have a crusader and I don't use it because it doesn't have enough firepower to be a threat once it's empty.

Yes, Deathwing knights are better than normal terminators. Looking at their points, they're only paying 18 points for a mace that's strictly better than a 20 point thunder hammer, not to mention the fail which killed 8 Genestealers at once for me yesterday.

 axisofentropy wrote:
The Land Raiders with lascannons are very good. I only have a crusader and I don't use it because it doesn't have enough firepower to be a threat once it's empty.

Yes, Deathwing knights are better than normal terminators. Looking at their points, they're only paying 18 points for a mace that's strictly better than a 20 point thunder hammer, not to mention the fail which killed 8 Genestealers at once for me yesterday.

Agreed, if we're talking compared to Thunder hammer/storm shield variety. I think the conversation is going to be Knights VS shooty squads, and how many of each. Having said that, I played my first 8th edition game, and my first 40k game since early 6th edition when I quit playing....


So the Deathwing took home a crushing defeat against a khorn/chaos army list. I ran 4 squads of terms, 3 shooty, 1 squad of knights, Belial, 2 apothecarys, and 3 venerable dreads. all with twin las, and twin autocannons.

I decided to DS in Belial, an apothecary, the DW knights, and 2 squads of assault cannon terms. Meanwhile, Azreal stood near the other apothecary, the 4th squad of shooty terms, and the 3 dreads giving them 3+/4++/6+++ saves, and everyone got re-rolls to hit.

The Dreads annihilated a couple rhinos full of zerkers, and preds along with some infantry and bikers. Azreal did some heavy lifting killing a demon prince, a bunch of bikers, a chaos lord on a bike, and a squad of cultists.

My DS was very ineffective because my opponent set up 4 blobs of cultists in his half the board preventing me from DSing anywhere, so i held them in reserve until turn 2 and 3 in the hops that some space was opened but alas, it never happened so I just had to bring them in and do what I could. The pretty much all my terms failed their charge rolls even with a command point re-roll. short of abilities to re-roll charge distances or other abilities, charging after DSing seems like it will be very un-reliable.

The knights got charged by a whittled down squad of zerkers and pretty much got wiped out to a guy before they could finish the squad off, although the apothecary managed to bring a knight back and heal him to full wounds so they were able to grab an objective late game for me.

The other Apothecary kept Azreal at full health the full game allowing him to run rampant through though his squads.




So my takeaways were the dreads were amazingly resiliant and killed vehicles very fast, specially when focus firing. The re-rolls granted from Azreal and Belial basically gave my entire army re-rolls and that was very powerful. The knights were somewhat disappointing, I almost wish I had just brought another squad of shooty terms instead but some more games needed to really make my mind up. I was also surprised at just how much more resiliant than they used to be with the extra wound and changes to the wound chart making most stuff wound on 3's. Yeah it was one game, but they felt pretty good so far.

Last thing, I really think getting ezekiel in the list would be a huge boon as he can use aversion on things that are dangerous to terminators.

If you have more than one Terminator unit, you gotta consider a Deathwing Ancient. You're paying so much for those powerfists, so getting 50% more attacks is great value.

Thanks for talking about screen units complicating deep strike. that's an important mechanic and one that will separate good players from great. If screening units become commonplace, then Land Raiders become more valuable.

 axisofentropy wrote:
If you have more than one Terminator unit, you gotta consider a Deathwing Ancient. You're paying so much for those powerfists, so getting 50% more attacks is great value.

Thanks for talking about screen units complicating deep strike. that's an important mechanic and one that will separate good players from great. If screening units become commonplace, then Land Raiders become more valuable.

Agreed on both points. Even the LR Crusader would be good for sweeping Cultists or something out from in front of more valuable units that you might want to teleport next to on the following turn. On the Ancient, I've got one modelled with TH/SS, I assume this is a good loadout for him since he needs to stay alive?

I modeled my Ancient with hammer and shield.

 axisofentropy wrote:
If you have more than one Terminator unit, you gotta consider a Deathwing Ancient. You're paying so much for those powerfists, so getting 50% more attacks is great value.

Thanks for talking about screen units complicating deep strike. that's an important mechanic and one that will separate good players from great. If screening units become commonplace, then Land Raiders become more valuable.

I was hard pressed to choose between the champ, the ancient, or 2 apothecarys. I have 2 issues in my head with the ancient. 1. if you DS him and a unit in to get his bonus for assault, and the unit gets their charge and he doesn't, you could have an instance where he doesn't contribute his buff since he's 9" away, and my other thought was that he costs between 116-128 points, so i could almost just take 3 more terminators. I had a similar issue with the champ, although if he makes the charge and the squad doesn't, he can still wreck face by himself pretty well with 3+D3 attacks that hit on 2's, wound on 3's(most of the time), and allow no save other than invuls, but he provides no aura. The cool thing about the apoth, while you can't kit him out, which sucks, he doesn't really even want to be in CC so you can just run with him and only thing your losing is storm bolter shots. I want to get around and try all 3, they all have upside and downsides. then again, squeezing Ezekiel in to get aversion might be better than all 3!!

The Apothecary that pocket healed azreal all game was one of my MVPs, because he is what enabled Azreal to do the amount of damage he did.

Next up, I want to get the dual raiders list I've got onto the table and see how dual raiders work together.

I feel like deathwing can get too far out into the weeds with all of the character options available to them. I think list building will have to be disciplined, because it's easy to fill up our slots/points with characters and not bring enough meat and potatoes.

For my deathwing detachments I'll just bring Belial and an Ancient. Rerolling to hits, and +1 attack is about all of the force multiplication I need.

Whenever you charge around characters you can easily hang back one model to retain buff range. Just don't forget like I did yesterday!

Yes you could buy 2.5 more terminators, but the Ancient has 2.5 times the wounds of a Terminator, and more attacks, and character status to hide and heroic intervention. And we haven't even talked about his buff yet! Add up all those power fists you're paying for, how much is it worth for 50% more attacks with them?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Grimgold wrote:


For my deathwing detachments I'll just bring Belial and an Ancient. Rerolling to hits, and +1 attack is about all of the force multiplication I need.

I agree. Maybe a Land Raider.

 axisofentropy wrote:
Whenever you charge around characters you can easily hang back one model to retain buff range. Just don't forget like I did yesterday!

Yeah, thats true, i forgot you can conga line back a bit and still attack with 2 ranks worth of guys. These new assault rules are a little wonky. Still getting used to them, and all the little nuances that go along with them.

Has anyone looked hard into a Ravenwing list based on -1 to hit penalties? I'm basically thinking about stacking these 3.


-Dark Shroud
-Darktalon/Nephilim Jetfighter
-DA librarian and a Rune Priest (Supervising Agent for Gullimane), casting 2 different versions of -1 to hit on key enemy units.

The list I'm thinking about has something like this:
2k points - 1x Flyer Detachemnt, 2x Vanguard Detachments (6CPs)

Rune Priest - Bike, Rune sword
DA Librarian - Bike, Force Sword
RW Apothocary - Plasma Talon Covis Hammer
Techmrine on Bike- Power Sword Conversion beamer
Ravenwing DT - Rift Cannon, 2x Hur
Ravenwing DT - Rift Cannon, 2x Hur
Nephilim Jetfighter - AMB, 2xHB, 2x BSM
Nephilim Jetfighter - AMB, 2xHB, 2x BSM
RW Bikes - 2x Melta 3x Chain
RW Bikes - 2x Melta 3x Chain
RW Bikes - 2x Melta 3x Chain
RW Bikes - 2x Melta 3x Chain
Darkshroud - AC
Darkshroud - HB


This list is rather hard to shoot due all the -1 to hit, it's super mobile. and has a good about of both anit-infantry and anti-Bigstuff.

It seems little light on bodies, but mobility can really make up for that. I can split up into 2 different groups if needed and still maintain a good about of -1s to hit

What are your thoughts?

so what are you guys thinking a Deathwing list is going to look like? Trying to budget for what models I am likely to need if I start this army haha

Gibs55 wrote:
so what are you guys thinking a Deathwing list is going to look like? Trying to budget for what models I am likely to need if I start this army haha

looks like its going to be about 2 HQ's, a couple elite characters, 4 squads of terminators, then either 2-3 dreads, or 2 Land raiders. So far, i'm liking dreads over land raiders but it's still too early to make a call for me at least. I think Godhammer Land raiders or twin las Dreads are going to be a absolute must in this edition to deal with vehicles, monsters, characters etc.

bobafett012 wrote:

Gibs55 wrote:
so what are you guys thinking a Deathwing list is going to look like? Trying to budget for what models I am likely to need if I start this army haha

looks like its going to be about 2 HQ's, a couple elite characters, 4 squads of terminators, then either 2-3 dreads, or 2 Land raiders. So far, i'm liking dreads over land raiders but it's still too early to make a call for me at least. I think Godhammer Land raiders or twin las Dreads are going to be a absolute must in this edition to deal with vehicles, monsters, characters etc.

I agree with all except the Land Raiders. They are good, but all of them (especially the Godhammer) are really expensive. I think they'll be usable, but probably not optimal. For the cost of a LR, you could get 2 Dreads with Twin Lascannons and missile launchers and still have points left over. One or both of them could even be a Venerable Dread. It's possible that in a 2k point list you could have the best of both worlds and get a LR and some dreads along with your termies. I'll have to do some experimenting.

Speaking of Deathwing Termies, what is the best heavy weapon to give them? The Cyclone Launcher is amazing, but it's also expensive and paints a big bullseye on a squad that carries it. My gut feeling is perhaps a mix of those and Assault Cannons are going to be best. Plasma Cannons are too unreliable, and Heavy Flamers are too short-ranged. Also, are Chainfists worth it compared to a regular Powerfist? Finally, when considering running melee Termies, particularly TH/SS ones, is it better to just take Deathwing Knights instead? It seems like they do the same job, only better.

 ZergSmasher wrote:

I agree with all except the Land Raiders. They are good, but all of them (especially the Godhammer) are really expensive. I think they'll be usable, but probably not optimal. For the cost of a LR, you could get 2 Dreads with Twin Lascannons and missile launchers and still have points left over. One or both of them could even be a Venerable Dread. It's possible that in a 2k point list you could have the best of both worlds and get a LR and some dreads along with your termies. I'll have to do some experimenting.

Yeah, i just played a game sunday and ran tri Venerable dreads with twin las cannons and twin auto cannons, and let me tell you, they did MAJOR work. I sat Azreal within 6" of them so they got 3+/4++/6+ saves, re-rolling all misses and wow, they were great. My only thought during the game was at one point, I would have liked to have a DCCW on maybe at least 1 of them to counter charge a bit more effectively, considering I got charged by Kharn, a squad of berzerkers, a demon prince and a big squad of bikers at the same time. Cool story though, Azreal, the 3 dreads and an apothecary wiped every single one of them over a couple turns, would have been faster with a DCCW though!

So yeah, thus far, the 3 dread setup was awesome, but still, small sample size so...

 ZergSmasher wrote:
Speaking of Deathwing Termies, what is the best heavy weapon to give them? The Cyclone Launcher is amazing, but it's also expensive and paints a big bullseye on a squad that carries it. My gut feeling is perhaps a mix of those and Assault Cannons are going to be best. Plasma Cannons are too unreliable, and Heavy Flamers are too short-ranged. Also, are Chainfists worth it compared to a regular Powerfist? Finally, when considering running melee Termies, particularly TH/SS ones, is it better to just take Deathwing Knights instead? It seems like they do the same job, only better.

I got to go with assault cannons. Thing is, Cyclones are 2.5 times more expensive than the assault cannon. so what are you paying for, the krak missiles, because the assault cannon far out weighs the frag missiles, and as far as krak missiles, thats what the 3 dreads putting out 18 anti-vehicle shots a turn are for. Heavy flamers, at least on terminators, I think leave a lot to be desired. You can DS and flame squads anymore since your outside of 8", and your likely hoping to get the charge off so, yeah, if you fail your charge, then you got a nice little weapon for over watch, but terms are just too slow for it to be effective imo. I'm still super disappointed with the plasma option for Deathwing, i mean couldn't it have been something a little better than your base plasma cannon? you have so few models, you just need more effective shooting than what the plasma cannon offers imo.

As far as Knights vs TH/SS terms, imo, there is ZERO reason for DA players to take TH/SS terms over the knights. The knights maces are literally TH that do 1 less damage but have no penalty to hit, and that Knight captains Flail....that thing is sick as hell with wounds spilling over like a poor man's mortal wounds. The one place I can maybe see TH/SS terms is maybe 1 in a shooty squad to soak the big hits.

Chain fists are DEFINITELY worth it, they are 2 points more than fists now for -4 AP and more consistent damage. I load up on them if I have extra points. Definitely put them on your cyclones/assault cannons etc etc since they are the last models to die.

bobafett012 wrote:

 ZergSmasher wrote:

I agree with all except the Land Raiders. They are good, but all of them (especially the Godhammer) are really expensive. I think they'll be usable, but probably not optimal. For the cost of a LR, you could get 2 Dreads with Twin Lascannons and missile launchers and still have points left over. One or both of them could even be a Venerable Dread. It's possible that in a 2k point list you could have the best of both worlds and get a LR and some dreads along with your termies. I'll have to do some experimenting.

Yeah, i just played a game sunday and ran tri Venerable dreads with twin las cannons and twin auto cannons, and let me tell you, they did MAJOR work. I sat Azreal within 6" of them so they got 3+/4++/6+ saves, re-rolling all misses and wow, they were great. My only thought during the game was at one point, I would have liked to have a DCCW on maybe at least 1 of them to counter charge a bit more effectively, considering I got charged by Kharn, a squad of berzerkers, a demon prince and a big squad of bikers at the same time. Cool story though, Azreal, the 3 dreads and an apothecary wiped every single one of them over a couple turns, would have been faster with a DCCW though!

So yeah, thus far, the 3 dread setup was awesome, but still, small sample size so...

 ZergSmasher wrote:
Speaking of Deathwing Termies, what is the best heavy weapon to give them? The Cyclone Launcher is amazing, but it's also expensive and paints a big bullseye on a squad that carries it. My gut feeling is perhaps a mix of those and Assault Cannons are going to be best. Plasma Cannons are too unreliable, and Heavy Flamers are too short-ranged. Also, are Chainfists worth it compared to a regular Powerfist? Finally, when considering running melee Termies, particularly TH/SS ones, is it better to just take Deathwing Knights instead? It seems like they do the same job, only better.

I got to go with assault cannons. Thing is, Cyclones are 2.5 times more expensive than the assault cannon. so what are you paying for, the krak missiles, because the assault cannon far out weighs the frag missiles, and as far as krak missiles, thats what the 3 dreads putting out 18 anti-vehicle shots a turn are for. Heavy flamers, at least on terminators, I think leave a lot to be desired. You can DS and flame squads anymore since your outside of 8", and your likely hoping to get the charge off so, yeah, if you fail your charge, then you got a nice little weapon for over watch, but terms are just too slow for it to be effective imo. I'm still super disappointed with the plasma option for Deathwing, i mean couldn't it have been something a little better than your base plasma cannon? you have so few models, you just need more effective shooting than what the plasma cannon offers imo.

As far as Knights vs TH/SS terms, imo, there is ZERO reason for DA players to take TH/SS terms over the knights. The knights maces are literally TH that do 1 less damage but have no penalty to hit, and that Knight captains Flail....that thing is sick as hell with wounds spilling over like a poor man's mortal wounds. The one place I can maybe see TH/SS terms is maybe 1 in a shooty squad to soak the big hits.

Chain fists are DEFINITELY worth it, they are 2 points more than fists now for -4 AP and more consistent damage. I load up on them if I have extra points. Definitely put them on your cyclones/assault cannons etc etc since they are the last models to die.

What is your list looking like now after the learnings from that game?

Thoughts on running 2xDreads and a LR (which one?)

Actually, the list completely crushed my opponents army. He played a chaos army with Khorn elements. Final score was 12 VP to 3 VP. So before I change up the list, I want a couple more games in with it too see if it was a fluke or terminators are actually good now...

The only thing I'd like to add in right now is Ezekiel if I could swing it but I'm not sure I can good the points without cutting Azreal, belial, or both apothecarys. I'll play around with some numbers.

I think you could do very well with 2 dreads and a LR. The LR definitely needs to be Godhammer. Here's the thing, the LRC has assault cannons and bolters, what does the rest of your army have, assault cannons and bolters, so the anti-tank/monster/flyer etc is really needed because vehicles are extremely tough now. With the new detachments, there's going to be some heavy mech armies out there and terminators are too slow to chase down vehicles and their weapons take for too long to take them out.

Warhammer Community Faction Focus article up for "non-codex" Space Marines, including Dark Angels: https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/06/14/warhammer-40000-faction-focus-non-codex-space-marines/

relevant bits:

I have always had a soft spot in my heart for the First Legion; the Dark Angels. My first miniature was a Dark Angels Captain from way back when. The Dark Angels have had a long and storied history in the lore but a bumpy ride in terms of their performance on the tabletop. They’ve often struggled to find their niche when compared to Chapters like Blood Angels and Space Wolves, who are fairly easily defined in comparison to Codex Chapters and have often been top contenders.

Dark Angels in new Warhammer 40,000 are simply exceptional. They have so many tools, so many different ways to play effectively, that the Dark Angels player’s biggest problem will be choosing which of his units to use! Azrael, Chapter Master of the Dark Angels, is hands down one of my favourite characters in the game now. He’s got a plethora of tools with his only shortcoming being his relatively slow speed – but even that is easily mitigated by using a Transport vehicle. What he provides though, is fantastic. He gives Dark Angels models within 6″ a 4+ invulnerable save which by itself is incredible. But on top of that, as with other Chapter Masters, he gives a ‘re-roll misses’ aura that works in the Shooting and Fight phases for friendly Dark Angels. Additionally, he grants you a bonus Command Point and packs an almighty wallop in both shooting and melee.

He is just one of many character options available to the Dark Angels player as well. Dark Angels also have a host of specialised units to choose from. Deathwing Knights are one of my favourite melee units available to any Space Marines Chapter, and Black Knights as ever, will strike fear into your opponent with their vicious Plasma Talons and Corvus Hammers.

I'll add this to the OP.

Getting very excited for 8th!

I have all but decided the DA (Deathwing) are going to be my 40K army, after reading their history and the fact you can run a heavy Terminator army. Given I do not own much 40K 'stuff' and have mainly be invested in AOS/Fantasy for the past decade I need to start from scratch. Also I have about a month off work coming up so now is the perfect time to build a new army...

Please tell me if I am on the right track for the models I am looking at buying for 8th Edition. I like to get everything at once as it helps me focus and keep on top of the project

HQ
Azrael
Belial
Ezekiel
Tech marine
Librarian (Terminator)

Elites
Deathwing Apothecary x2
Deathwing Ancient x2

Deathwing Troops
Deathwing Knights x2 units (5)
Deathwing terminators x2 units (5)

Is this enough Terminators for regular sized and competitive games ?

Heavy Support
Venerable Dreadnaught x3
Landraider

Am I missing anything critical?

Still trying to workout what the loadouts for each unit should be which is challenging as I have very little 40k background. I assume I can magnetise the Dreads and LR weapons which opens up options.


Gibs55 wrote:
Getting very excited for 8th!

I have all but decided the DA (Deathwing) are going to be my 40K army, after reading their history and the fact you can run a heavy Terminator army. Given I do not own much 40K 'stuff' and have mainly be invested in AOS/Fantasy for the past decade I need to start from scratch. Also I have about a month off work coming up so now is the perfect time to build a new army...

Please tell me if I am on the right track for the models I am looking at buying for 8th Edition. I like to get everything at once as it helps me focus and keep on top of the project

HQ
Azrael
Belial
Ezekiel
Tech marine
Librarian (Terminator)

Elites
Deathwing Apothecary x2
Deathwing Ancient x2

Deathwing Troops
Deathwing Knights x2 units (5)
Deathwing terminators x2 units (5)

Is this enough Terminators for regular sized and competitive games ?

Heavy Support
Venerable Dreadnaught x3
Landraider

Am I missing anything critical?

Still trying to workout what the loadouts for each unit should be which is challenging as I have very little 40k background. I assume I can magnetise the Dreads and LR weapons which opens up options.
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Looks good, but you can only take 1 Deathwing Ancient.

Gibs55 wrote:
Getting very excited for 8th!

I have all but decided the DA (Deathwing) are going to be my 40K army, after reading their history and the fact you can run a heavy Terminator army. Given I do not own much 40K 'stuff' and have mainly be invested in AOS/Fantasy for the past decade I need to start from scratch. Also I have about a month off work coming up so now is the perfect time to build a new army...

Please tell me if I am on the right track for the models I am looking at buying for 8th Edition. I like to get everything at once as it helps me focus and keep on top of the project

HQ
Azrael
Belial
Ezekiel
Tech marine
Librarian (Terminator)

Elites
Deathwing Apothecary x2
Deathwing Ancient x2

Deathwing Troops
Deathwing Knights x2 units (5)
Deathwing terminators x2 units (5)

Is this enough Terminators for regular sized and competitive games ?

Heavy Support
Venerable Dreadnaught x3
Landraider

Am I missing anything critical?

Still trying to workout what the loadouts for each unit should be which is challenging as I have very little 40k background. I assume I can magnetise the Dreads and LR weapons which opens up options.


I would go more than 2 squads of regular terminators, other than that, looks like a great start.

bobafett012 wrote:

Gibs55 wrote:
Getting very excited for 8th!

I have all but decided the DA (Deathwing) are going to be my 40K army, after reading their history and the fact you can run a heavy Terminator army. Given I do not own much 40K 'stuff' and have mainly be invested in AOS/Fantasy for the past decade I need to start from scratch. Also I have about a month off work coming up so now is the perfect time to build a new army...

Please tell me if I am on the right track for the models I am looking at buying for 8th Edition. I like to get everything at once as it helps me focus and keep on top of the project

HQ
Azrael
Belial
Ezekiel
Tech marine
Librarian (Terminator)

Elites
Deathwing Apothecary x2
Deathwing Ancient x2

Deathwing Troops
Deathwing Knights x2 units (5)
Deathwing terminators x2 units (5)

Is this enough Terminators for regular sized and competitive games ?

Heavy Support
Venerable Dreadnaught x3
Landraider

Am I missing anything critical?

Still trying to workout what the loadouts for each unit should be which is challenging as I have very little 40k background. I assume I can magnetise the Dreads and LR weapons which opens up options.


I would go more than 2 squads of regular terminators, other than that, looks like a great start.

More as in three or four squads?