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PimpMasterGeneral wrote: Has someone experience using the hell blade from forge world?
I consider getting one or two.
They seem to be really good against 2W or 3W models especially if they can fly.
What do you think?
They're not... bad.
Having to move and be at -1 to hit means they aren't exactly deadshots.
I’ve had one on my wishlist for a while. Given how many D3 you roll, it’ll probably have a pretty reliable number of shots. 48” range, better shooting when still, and D2 mean it does a similar role to Autocannons. Higher AP, more shots, and lower Str mean it’ll be somewhat comparable to Havoc Autocannons squad against tanks and the like. Ability to to ignore LOS will be a situational boon - pretty good in a metagames of hidden rhinos full of shock troops. But also no way to VotLW and EC or use IW trait. So, probably about the same in terms of efficiency. Which is nice.
It will, however, be significantly better against 2W models, which tend to have T that’s the same for S6 and S7, decent saves, and be more capable of avoiding LoS. Aggressor ambushes, Terminators, Primaris, etc are going to hate it.
I like it. It’s definitely viable.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/04/09 12:08:43
Latro_ wrote: Have any of you guys tried the hellforged scorpius? was thinking of a bit of no los needed chaffe clearance for my IW army.
Not sure 6d3 is worth 135 pts thou hmmm
oh lawd got the pts wrong thy are like 215pts.. prob not worth it
I have used Scorpius in my Death guard army many times. It's useful against bikers and IG heavy weapon teams. Sadly that's pretty much it. 5+ to wound and -2AP against vehicles is too unreliable. On the other hand those shots are wasted blasting regular T3 infantry as the Scorpius is so expensive.
I wanted to get the most out of my legion trait, so every unit is affected by it. Almost everything has some decent or good shooting. Spawns, Contemptor and the DP are for cqc. Cultists and Spawn are blockers.
The game went really well vs Tyranids even after going second. Although i thought at first the ignore cover trait is pretty bad (in a competetive way) it came up quite often and was a huge benefit. And made my Opponent quite salty
So i will definetly add more walkers (looking at you Leviathan) to that army.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/04/09 17:38:16
I wanted to get the most out of my legion trait, so every unit is affected by it.
Almost everything has some decent or good shooting.
Spawns, Contemptor and the DP are for cqc. Cultists and Spawn are blockers.
The game went really well vs Tyranids even after going second.
Although i thought at first the ignore cover trait is pretty bad (in a competetive way) it came up quite often and was a huge benefit. And made my Opponent quite salty
So i will definetly add more walkers (looking at you Leviathan) to that army.
Was the Tyranid list horde heavy? There doesn't look like there's enough anti-horde weaponry in that list, I could be wrong in practise though...
On the subject of lists, I've been trying to put together a more competitive list but keeping my WE warband as the core:
Spoiler:
World Eaters Battalion Detachment - HQ Chaos Lord: Plasma Pistol, Power Fist
Exalted Champion: Plasma Pistol, Power Axe
Terminator Lord: Combi-Plasma, Power Fist
Troops 3xBerzerkers: Plasma Pistol, Power Fist, 4xChainaxe+Chainsword, Icon of Wrath
Dedicated Transport 2xRhinos
Elites Terminators: 5xCombi-Plasma, 5xPower Fists, Icon of Wrath
Alpha Legion Battalion Detachment - HQ Sorcerer with Jump Pack: Bolt Pistol, Force Sword, Prescience, Warptime
Daemon Prince with Wings: 2xMalefic Talons, Intoxicating Elixir, Diabolical Strength (Warlord - I am Alpharius)
Troops 3xCultists
Daemons Battalion Detachment - HQ Herald of Khorne
Herald of Khorne
Got the 30 man unit charging with 3d6" re-rolling to charge and a Bloodmaster for S6 on the charge; they'll clean up any chaff and hold as many things as they can in close combat to allow the berzerkers bomb and the terminator bomb to strike. The berzerkers roll up in Rhinos and the Terminators drop in with the Lord and Sorcerer for +1 to hit, re-rolling to hit and much needed warptime. Cultists will act as buffers for deep strike to protect the rhinos and the other two bloodletter units will act as counter charge.
Going to field it against Nu-Crons this week and see how it does. (Last time I faced Nu-Crons I won by the skin of my teeth)
Ghorros wrote: The moral of the story: Don't park your Imperial Knight in a field of Gretchin carrying power tools.
Marmatag wrote: All the while, my opponent is furious, throwing his codex on the floor, trying to slash his wrists with safety scissors.
It was more a nidzilla list than a pure horde. Horde clearing seems to be more difficult with my list though. Maybe i should add some Rapier Batteries with Quadbolters for clearing chaff.
Looks like a nice list. I just dont like putting 5 power fists on the termies because that unit is pretty expensive and has the -1 to hit. It imo relies to much on casting Prescience to work.
PimpMasterGeneral wrote: It was more a nidzilla list than a pure horde. Horde clearing seems to be more difficult with my list though. Maybe i should add some Rapier Batteries with Quadbolters for clearing chaff.
Perhaps (that fits quite thematically with your army) but I must (I'm obligated by law) remind you that Khorne has two of the best horde killers in the game, the terror twins: Berzerkers and Bloodletters.
Looks like a nice list. I just dont like putting 5 power fists on the termies because that unit is pretty expensive and has the -1 to hit. It imo relies to much on casting Prescience to work.
You underestimate the power of WE terminators: I've taken them in Khorne only lists and they do a lot of work, if they get into combat they'll do an average of 7 wounds on big monsters and vehicles (or whipe out a 5 man unit of something elite) with an invul save without even taking into account damage from shooting.
In the past few games I've had they've killed the following:
2x Triarch Stalker +, Warrior Squad
Terminus Ultra + Intercessor squad + Tac Squad + Primaris Chaplain + Primaris Lieutenant
Immortal Squad + 6 man Destroyer unit
Cataphractii Terminator Squad + 1 wound on Guilliman (they drew Girlyman away from his shooty units so they did their job)
They've become a pretty nasty assassin team once the enemy bubblewrap goes down.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/04/09 21:34:50
Ghorros wrote: The moral of the story: Don't park your Imperial Knight in a field of Gretchin carrying power tools.
Marmatag wrote: All the while, my opponent is furious, throwing his codex on the floor, trying to slash his wrists with safety scissors.
I might underestimate them because whenever i try something like this it fails horribly. The last time i tried a Terminator Bomb my regular opponent had sudenly 20 Death Marks appear on the battlefield and the rest is history... It is something like trauma...
Sadly Berzerkers and Bloodletters dont really benefit from the IW trait and i want to play pure IW. I nevertheless already own some Berzerkers so they might see some use from time to time.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/04/09 22:15:55
PimpMasterGeneral wrote: I might underestimate them beacause whenever i try something like this it fails horribly.
The last time i tried a Terminator Bomb my regular opponent had sudenly 20 Death Marks appear on the battlefield and the rest is history...
It is something like trauma...
Sadly Berzerkers and Bloodletters dont really benefit from the IW trait and i want to play pure IW. I nevertheless already own some Berzerkers so they might see some use from time to time.
Technically Berserker Marines DO benefit from the Iron Warriors benefit if you supplement with Plasma Pistols (and I always do). It just isn't exactly a good benefit when everyone else has just the melee weapons.
Oh and they can throw a Grenade at least so...
CaptainStabby wrote: If Tyberos falls and needs to catch himself it's because the ground needed killing.
jy2 wrote: BTW, I can't wait to run Double-D-thirsters! Man, just thinking about it gets me Khorney.
vipoid wrote: Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?
MarsNZ wrote: ITT: SoB players upset that they're receiving the same condescending treatment that they've doled out in every CSM thread ever.
PimpMasterGeneral wrote: I might underestimate them because whenever i try something like this it fails horribly.
The last time i tried a Terminator Bomb my regular opponent had sudenly 20 Death Marks appear on the battlefield and the rest is history...
It is something like trauma...
Sadly Berzerkers and Bloodletters dont really benefit from the IW trait and i want to play pure IW. I nevertheless already own some Berzerkers so they might see some use from time to time.
Well that is a 400pt unit that they're dropping in so I'd expect it to do some damage. Though looking at the math, a 20 man unit should only kill 3 out of your 5 Termies.
Ghorros wrote: The moral of the story: Don't park your Imperial Knight in a field of Gretchin carrying power tools.
Marmatag wrote: All the while, my opponent is furious, throwing his codex on the floor, trying to slash his wrists with safety scissors.
Unholy amazeballs, made it through this thread. Time well spent I say. Thanks for all the ideas, it's been nice getting back into the hobby with this edition and reading up on the goods.
Some solid ideas in here, and some fun ones. I'm looking at building my Night Lords list to exploit the moral stuff. My group are super casual, but might head to the local games store once I've got a few more bits n bobs.
Basically I'm thinking MSU bikers as chaff clearers as they can get up close and shoot and put the moral pressure on (need to be within 6inches) with warp talons warptiming into something juicy or better still several juicy things, supported by Havocs and a predator (and a leviathan as soon as I can with butcher cannons for further morale pressure) with Raptors running interference and cultists doing their rinse and repeat shenanigans.
Nurgle Icon of Despair is super tempting but not super fluffy; might use it when it needs to be more competitive.
@the.cobb - Warp Talons want Warptime and/or Mark of Khorne + allied Herald (re-roll charges) to be effective. A really sneaky trick is to take two Sorcerers; one has Warptime, the o5er doesn’t. Have them a distance apart; your opponent assumes the WTime one is going to tag in the WTals and respond to that, then in your turn you use the Familiar Stratagem to give the other one Warptime and hit an area with less DTW coverage and screening that’s not prepared for WTals
A Daemons Patrol with Karanak and some cheap Bloodletters is a great source of Khornate Daemon Marines re-rolling charges. (I think a Decimator can take a Butcher Cannon? Great unit) Can even make him your Warlord for an additional Morale hit, though he’s not difficult to kill.
You’ll be wanting to hit several units a turn with multiple morale attacks, as focussing on one can be dealt with via Insane Bravery. Also, try to approach your morale sapping ability as a bonus, rather than a primary attack, as Tyranids and similar will laugh it off :(
PimpMasterGeneral wrote: A friend is getting forgebane soon and doesnt need the AdMech guys, so i thought about converting the Armiger to a Decimator.
Are they the same size?
A Decimator with a claw and butcher cannon seems to be pretty decent. Or are there better loadouts?
Yeah, they're just about the same size.
Despite how expensive it's gotten, I still think Soul burner Petards are the most fun out of the options option. Not necessarily better, but more fun.
Ghorros wrote: The moral of the story: Don't park your Imperial Knight in a field of Gretchin carrying power tools.
Marmatag wrote: All the while, my opponent is furious, throwing his codex on the floor, trying to slash his wrists with safety scissors.
PimpMasterGeneral wrote: A friend is getting forgebane soon and doesnt need the AdMech guys, so i thought about converting the Armiger to a Decimator.
Are they the same size?
A Decimator with a claw and butcher cannon seems to be pretty decent. Or are there better loadouts?
Yeah, they're just about the same size.
Despite how expensive it's gotten, I still think Soul burner Petards are the most fun out of the options option. Not necessarily better, but more fun.
That's perfect.
The Soul Burner is definetly the most fun choice but it bumps the Decimator up to almost 200 pts. Thats pretty much for just W8 and T7
Soul Burner is best used in an Epidemius army. Perfect for finishing off that one vehicle that's still holding together after three melta blasts. Otherwise, Butcher Cannon is a beast.
Pretty sure I did. It’s a useful tool for a popular niche army that wants to get complete unit kills, not leave a high T & Sv unit with one model alive or a couple of wounds remaining. In that context, it has particular advantages over the gun that makes the last survivor fail a morale check - which doesn’t feed Epidemius.
lindsay40k wrote: Pretty sure I did. It’s a useful tool for a popular niche army that wants to get complete unit kills, not leave a high T & Sv unit with one model alive or a couple of wounds remaining. In that context, it has particular advantages over the gun that makes the last survivor fail a morale check - which doesn’t feed Epidemius.
Ah, I see.
Automatically Appended Next Post: What's the general consensus for this particular predicament:
Daemons Battalion:
HQ Bloodmaster
Bloodmaster
Troops
30xBloodletters
....
What should I put as troops to fill out the detachment?
1. 2x units of Nurglings for 108pts - Cheap option and gives me board control with infiltration.
2. 2x units of Bloodletters for 140pts - Gives me re-rolls to charge for the battalion and two units that can counter charge alpha strike.
Keeping a pure Khorne detachment appeals to me both from a thematic and situational stand point but guaranteeing a space for my deepstriking units to come down and/or denying enemy deepstriking forces also appeals to me.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/04/13 22:02:18
Ghorros wrote: The moral of the story: Don't park your Imperial Knight in a field of Gretchin carrying power tools.
Marmatag wrote: All the while, my opponent is furious, throwing his codex on the floor, trying to slash his wrists with safety scissors.
A Decimator with dual conversion beamers parked in the far corner of your zone does some good work when daemonforge’d, and can survive a lot longer than a close up version. I used to run double petards but you only get one game before your opponent wises up and focuses it down first every time. It just puts out too much damage to leave such a fragile platform alive.
I have always loved Khorne, and World Eaters armies, and considered to do one. I have grown up with Blood Pact stories, and now, I have just realized that I have tens of Imperial Guards models unplayed, ready to be converted and painted.
Is it possible, from the Chaos Marines codex to play World Eaters (Kharn, beserkers, etc...) + cultists / renegades ?
What would the FW book offers me that the codex wouldn't ?
godardc wrote: I have always loved Khorne, and World Eaters armies, and considered to do one. I have grown up with Blood Pact stories, and now, I have just realized that I have tens of Imperial Guards models unplayed, ready to be converted and painted.
Is it possible, from the Chaos Marines codex to play World Eaters (Kharn, beserkers, etc...) + cultists / renegades ?
What would the FW book offers me that the codex wouldn't ?
Yes, you can play World Eaters with the CSM codex and for the first time since several editions berzerkers are actually a pretty strong choice. In the CSM codex you also get the Cultist option. Cultists are very cheap which makes them a viable unit. However, the World eater trait is used best when you use them for CC with pistol/hand weapon, but I assume your IG troops don't have that loadout.
The renegade rules from FW seem to be widely seen as underwhelming this edition so unless you also want to field IG tanks or heavy weapon teams I'd say field your IG squads as Cultists. It's the best use for them right now, it may change with a new Imperial armour book of course, but my impression is that will take a while as FW has too many projects.
