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I'm curious if anyone has tried any small games in 8th edition yet - around the 500 point size. How does it play?

Fine. Just pick some power level which units can't exceed and it's perfectly good.

rmeister0 wrote:
I'm curious if anyone has tried any small games in 8th edition yet - around the 500 point size. How does it play?

Very well. Watch out for salty players who expect to be able to use 7e deathstars to just delete the enemy.

 Selym wrote:

rmeister0 wrote:
I'm curious if anyone has tried any small games in 8th edition yet - around the 500 point size. How does it play?

Very well. Watch out for salty players who expect to be able to use 7e deathstars to just delete the enemy.

people not being able to adapt to the new edition is an old problem. althoug 8th ed is likely to be a bigger issue then in the past simply due to the scope of the changes.

Played two 500 point Maelstrom games on a 4x4 board so far, both fun and extremely close match ups. I'd say it works very well!

The games aren't bad, but they're pretty simple. The army really only consists of one thing, and you throw your one thing at their one thing to see whose one thing is better and gets to kill the floating chaff units.

Incredibly dull, but I like to play elite armies so I basically don't get to field anything fun at low points.

 Inquisitor Lord Katherine wrote:
The games aren't bad, but they're pretty simple. The army really only consists of one thing, and you throw your one thing at their one thing to see whose one thing is better and gets to kill the floating chaff units.

Play msu troopers. Much more fun. I had Eldar Guardians with Shuriken Platforms against Sternguard + some kit. Managed one win and one close loss by maneuvering properly.

500 pts doesn't let a lot of armies do too much. The game works much better at 1000 points though. I think 2v2 1000 point games are some of the most fun

 gossipmeng wrote:
500 pts doesn't let a lot of armies do too much. The game works much better at 1000 points though. I think 2v2 1000 point games are some of the most fun

Are the lists developed independently, or on collaboration?

Makes a difference to me.

 Selym wrote:

 gossipmeng wrote:
500 pts doesn't let a lot of armies do too much. The game works much better at 1000 points though. I think 2v2 1000 point games are some of the most fun

Are the lists developed independently, or on collaboration?

Makes a difference to me.

Generally they are created independently.

 gossipmeng wrote:

 Selym wrote:

 gossipmeng wrote:
500 pts doesn't let a lot of armies do too much. The game works much better at 1000 points though. I think 2v2 1000 point games are some of the most fun

Are the lists developed independently, or on collaboration?

Makes a difference to me.

Generally they are created independently.

I like it then

Yeah. 2vs2 games with two 1000 lists per player is some of the most fun type of game you can do!

But at the same time I was one of those that only played arcade and multiplayer battles in Starcraft, when the proper competitive game is 100% 1vs1 so...

500 pts isn't bad. Me and a buddy started a slow grow narritive campaign tonight starting with 500pt lists and faired pretty even even tho in the end he had sone bad rolls lol. No 1 shot on anything makes for a fun game!

500 points is easy for a small 4'x4' table. Some factions are able to fit in fun toys easier than others in such a small game.

Been playing lots of small-points 8e games, mostly Marines vs Tau, usually with a scenario and a special objective (assassinate the Ethereal, etc.). It works well. Actually, "kill team" with each model being a character works well too, as the target priority rule allows a lot of tactical decisions and makes maneuver more important.

pigasuspig wrote:
Been playing lots of small-points 8e games, mostly Marines vs Tau, usually with a scenario and a special objective (assassinate the Ethereal, etc.). It works well. Actually, "kill team" with each model being a character works well too, as the target priority rule allows a lot of tactical decisions and makes maneuver more important.

All of this sounds very cool. Gonna try that.

 DarknessEternal wrote:
Fine. Just pick some power level which units can't exceed and it's perfectly good.

That is a really interesting use for power level that I hadn't considered! Thank you for sharing .

I've played a 500 pt games of orks vs necrons.
Orks had a biker boss, a wierdboyz, 2*20 boyz and a kopta. Necrons had a cryptech, 2*10 warriors and a spider thing. The game was pretty close and fun to play. Though, it was all determined 3-d turn when a necron player made a mistake and disengaged the speder from boyz - allowing those to pile on to warriors and kill those in mellee.

Most of my games so far have been 25-50 powerlevel, they've been a blast!

500 points is usually the starting point for Escalation League. It's meant to really be about 2-3 squads and a few elites, but some manage a vehicle or two depending on the army. I find that it all depends on your play style, considering your choice for a 500 point army will likely be vastly different than your 1000 point army and so on. I enjoy it, but I enjoy just playing the game regardless of point value.

1000 pts have been really good. 500 pt is good for an hour or so game.

500 points basically means no tanks except maybe a barebones transport or two. Anything with firepower is in the 200 point range, and that's just way too much for such low totals. Elite armies really struggle to do more than a few barebones squads.

I found 800 was the smallest me and my friend could go and fit in enough to make the forces varied.

Seems you would want more detailed cover and terrain rules, operative at the model rather than the unit level, and more realism re vehicles and cover, vehicles in CC with infantry, and so on. Basically, all of the simplification abstraction should be restored to higher granularity to suit the smaller scale. Something more like 2nd ed, but pretty easily house-rulable from 8th.

So about "Kill Team": is this the same KT that came out earlier, or are there KT rules specific to 8th? Or do you just take "x" points and treat each model as a unit of 1?

SilverAlien wrote:
500 points basically means no tanks except maybe a barebones transport or two. Anything with firepower is in the 200 point range, and that's just way too much for such low totals. Elite armies really struggle to do more than a few barebones squads.

I found 800 was the smallest me and my friend could go and fit in enough to make the forces varied.

I brought 2 Leman Russ Tanks in 500 points.

Pask Battle Tank, Lascannon, Multimeltas
Leman Russ Punisher, Heavy Bolter, Heavy Bolters
Stormtroopers


You can definitely roll out some of your heavy armor at 500 points. Two Leman Russes at 500 is a great way to not have friends, for the record.

 Inquisitor Lord Katherine wrote:
Two Leman Russes at 500 is a great way to not have friends, for the record.

Well, guard functions incredibly well at lower point values. Partially because things are undercosted, and also because you have so many cheap options, whereas a lot of anti-tank to other armies is rather pricey.

 Marmatag wrote:

 Inquisitor Lord Katherine wrote:
Two Leman Russes at 500 is a great way to not have friends, for the record.

Well, guard functions incredibly well at lower point values. Partially because things are undercosted, and also because you have so many cheap options, whereas a lot of anti-tank to other armies is rather pricey.

For example, an Eldar AT choice can easily set you back a good 300-600 points.

- Fire Dragons or Wraithguard
- Wave Serpent
- Farseer or Yvraine

 Selym wrote:

 Marmatag wrote:

 Inquisitor Lord Katherine wrote:
Two Leman Russes at 500 is a great way to not have friends, for the record.

Well, guard functions incredibly well at lower point values. Partially because things are undercosted, and also because you have so many cheap options, whereas a lot of anti-tank to other armies is rather pricey.

For example, an Eldar AT choice can easily set you back a good 300-600 points.

- Fire Dragons or Wraithguard
- Wave Serpent
- Farseer or Yvraine

I could see Eldar being bottom tier in a 500 point game. Speed matters basically not at all in a 4'x4' game. There's really nowhere to hide from a 48" range gun. If i was playing against Eldar, and it was 500 points on a 4'x4', i'd park an Imperial Knight in the center of the map and laugh. Well, if i had a Knight.

 Marmatag wrote:

 Inquisitor Lord Katherine wrote:
Two Leman Russes at 500 is a great way to not have friends, for the record.

Well, guard functions incredibly well at lower point values. Partially because things are undercosted, and also because you have so many cheap options, whereas a lot of anti-tank to other armies is rather pricey.

It's definitely possible to get an adequate number of antitank weapons into a 500 point list, but by making your only available targets tanks, you effectively render the portion of their army that's designed to hunt infantry a non-factor in the battle, so it's effectively a 500 points of Imperial Guard versus 100 points of enemy models that can participate and 400 points of enemy models that take up space.

A list like:
200-Celestine, 1x Gemini Superior
137-Dominions, 4x Meltagun, 1x Combi-Melta
107-Repressor, Heavy Flamer
51-Battle Sisters, 3x Storm Bolter

will absolutely rip the Pask+Punisher list up.

I actually saw a lot of 500 point lists with 2 armored vehicles. I saw quite a few Razorback+Dreadnought lists for SM, Rhino+Hellbrute for Chaos, as well as a Harlequins list of 2 Starweavers full of guys, an Ork list of a Battewagon full of Burnas, and a Necron list with two Annihation Barges.

Vehicle saturation is very effective at 500 points, and not just if you're Guard.

The thing is, you have to be careful, because an over-dedication to vehicle hunting will leave you open to the other kind of lists I saw, which were tides of Orks, tides of 'gaunts, and tides of Guardsmen. The Sister's list I proposed meets an antitank quota very well, and will wreck lists that focused on tanks, but get overrun by infantry. The Sisters list I actually used traded out the Meltaguns for Storm Bolters, leaving Celestine the only antitank unit and relying on getting the Repressor into CQC with the enemy to lock up a hypothetical second tank until Celestine can get around to it.