Warstages Kickstarter, Terain from Raging Heroes (Last Day, 9 hours left)

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**highlord tamburlaine**

A pledge for only scatter terrain would be cool. I like those gothic terminals they showed off and are nowhere to be seen yet.

Almost funded at least. Hope the stretches add some more value to this.

**Ouze**

Alpharius wrote:Hopefully it really is 'affordable' and that the almost inevitable delays don't make delivery stretch out the near side of forever.

$185 to get in the door, and...

Geifer wrote:I'm not impressed. I am not normally interested in cardboard scenery, but even so, I think that console highlights one of the biggest problems of super awesome detailed texture: it all goes out of the window once you factor in reflecting light.

So much this. I'd be a hard pass if this was $40, let alone nearly 5 times that. I'm sure it looks terrific under very specific lighting (dim and offset), but I think in any normal playing conditions it's going to look exactly like what it is: a cardboard castle set with hard to see textures because of the high gloss finish you're sure to get.

I get that it's easy to transport, light, doesn't need to be painted, and all that jazz, but man you can buy a giant pile of Pegasus terrain for half that and I think it would look way better in actual playing conditions. I can see a good case for when you have limited storage space or travel a lot to play and there won't be terrain, of course.

I wish them the best of luck, which I am sure they don't need.

**Dark Severance**

Compared to Battle Systems, it is way pricey. Where battle systems gives you more useable square footage in terms of terrain, this is more about a look. There is a lot of the cardboard terrain that just looks and not useable because it goes high (which isn't necessarily a bad thing, but something that doesn't interest me). Given that it is limited edition, we have no idea how many are ordered for this "print run" then that means someone wanting to dip their toes in, then expand later could be out of luck.

I'll watch it but definitely seems like something that I won't be getting involved with.

**H.B.M.C.**

The interior terrain thing is more interesting to me than the other shell.

Nevertheless, I went for the "medium" one (my love of terrain compels me to get the XL, but I'm not made of money).

I hope that we start to see what else is included soon, especially this Daedalus Expansion they can't shut up about but isn't actually on the KS yet.

**Nostromodamus**

Initially grabbed a Medium EB, but upon further reflection (and checking competitor products) I decided to drop it.

I just vastly prefer actual 3d terrain, and seeing what I could get from the likes of Pegasus or Puppetswar for a similar price point, I couldn't justify this to myself.

**Ignatius-Grulgor**

H.B.M.C. wrote:
It's alive!!!

And expensive...

You're not kidding, maybe it's cause I've never used card stock before but that seems insanely high for what to me is just printed cardboard and some plastic clips.

**Tannhauser42**

I'm currently sitting on an EB medium pledge (ye gods, I would love that extra large), but I suspect I will have to drop it. The price really is a concern. I do have a lot of terrain already, and I could really use that money for expanding my Primaris marines army.

While some of y'all brought up the Pegasus Hobbies terrain as an alternative, you didn't mention who actually sells it, because it seems to be out of stock or overpriced everywhere I looked.

**Nostromodamus**

Tannhauser42 wrote:
I'm currently sitting on an EB medium pledge (ye gods, I would love that extra large), but I suspect I will have to drop it. The price really is a concern. I do have a lot of terrain already, and I could really use that money for expanding my Primaris marines army.

While some of y'all brought up the Pegasus Hobbies terrain as an alternative, you didn't mention who actually sells it, because it seems to be out of stock or overpriced everywhere I looked.

Right on their website.

**Tannhauser42**

Nostromodamus wrote:
Tannhauser42 wrote:
I'm currently sitting on an EB medium pledge (ye gods, I would love that extra large), but I suspect I will have to drop it. The price really is a concern. I do have a lot of terrain already, and I could really use that money for expanding my Primaris marines army.

While some of y'all brought up the Pegasus Hobbies terrain as an alternative, you didn't mention who actually sells it, because it seems to be out of stock or overpriced everywhere I looked.

Right on their website.

And what would "their" website be? One I did see is the website for a hobby store in California of the same name. Are you saying that the store in California and the company that makes the gothic cathedral kits are the same?

**Nostromodamus**

Tannhauser42 wrote:
Nostromodamus wrote:
Tannhauser42 wrote:
I'm currently sitting on an EB medium pledge (ye gods, I would love that extra large), but I suspect I will have to drop it. The price really is a concern. I do have a lot of terrain already, and I could really use that money for expanding my Primaris marines army.

While some of y'all brought up the Pegasus Hobbies terrain as an alternative, you didn't mention who actually sells it, because it seems to be out of stock or overpriced everywhere I looked.

Right on their website.

And what would "their" website be? One I did see is the website for a hobby store in California of the same name. Are you saying that the store in California and the company that makes the gothic cathedral kits are the same?

http://pegasushobbies.net/catalog/Gaming/c9/index.html?osCsid=e4pk3nh2mddln8r76oia9ptgf5

**highlord tamburlaine**

The Pegasus store in Montclair, California is the same company as the one who does the plastic scenery.

They made all kinds of stuff besides scenery over the years, especially in regards to SciFi movie related plastic kits. There was a prepainted resin terrain line they made as well as the plastic gothic stuff.

Just saw a new War of the Worlds diorama kit based on the Spielberg movie in there today.

They actually have quiet a bit of stuff they've put out over the years.

**Bi'ios**

This terrain, while it is very very cool, is just way too pricey here. Almost 200 for the minimum, and that's just enough for a skirmish-sized setup

**Gamingdog**

Bi'ios wrote:
This terrain, while it is very very cool, is just way too pricey here. Almost 200 for the minimum, and that's just enough for a skirmish-sized setup

I don't know based on the pictures the terrain, even the small set looks like it would fill up a table. obviously everyone has a differant opion of what alot of terrain is but for me the small set would cover a 4'x4' area nicely

**Bi'ios**

Gamingdog wrote:
Bi'ios wrote:
This terrain, while it is very very cool, is just way too pricey here. Almost 200 for the minimum, and that's just enough for a skirmish-sized setup

I don't know based on the pictures the terrain, even the small set looks like it would fill up a table. obviously everyone has a differant opion of what alot of terrain is but for me the small set would cover a 4'x4' area nicely

It does look like if you broke it up into its various components, it'd fill the area up, but I suppose I see terrain like this being built into a large something. I think breaking it up and spreading it around like that kinda makes it loose it's appeal. The "cinematic" nature of a set like this is both a strength and weakness.

I really do think it's very nice in appearance, and is probably worth what they're asking for it. I just think it's a pretty high buy-in for something that's use is more or less limited to skirmish usage, narrative gameplay (D&D type stuff), or diorama/display. It's way too busy and large of use with a "full-size" wargame (40k, AoS, etc)

All this being strictly my opinion, of course. If I played SWA/Necromunda, or Infinity, I'd be all over this in a heartbeat, no doubt.

**lord_blackfang**

Hilariously overpriced and the layout is mostly nonfunctional for normal gaming. Pass.

**John Prins**

A bit more expensive than the Battle Systems stuff was at kickstarter, though Battle Systems was a few years ago. Most of the cost of these kits seems to be sunk into vertical space - high walls and towers that look good, but don't offer huge amounts of useful terrain space.

So, less practical than Battle Systems, but definitely shinier kit. The Daedelus Extension is definitely the winner of the offerings, too bad you have to buy a full kit before the expansion. It would be interesting to see the full Medium kit broken down to make lots of smaller, shorter buildings.

The Pegasus Hobbies stuff looks great and decent prices for plastic buildings. Mantic's modular line isn't cheap at retail prices but it's pretty versatile and rock solid and heavy in a way card terrain never will be. Battle Systems Sci-Fi 2 set should be available soon as well.

That said, I don't think the WarStages is super overpriced - again, you're buying vertical space more than anything, but it's definitely not discounted for kickstarter.

I

**RoninXiC**

Well, after going over the project a few times.. I don't think we're actually considering the size/dimensions correctly.

Yes, the biggest one is 765$.. but it is also ONE METER AND SIXTY CM tall. That is as tall as my wife. Even the medium one is 80 cm tall. If you put it on a table, you'll have the top close to your eyes.

That is super tall. Is it neccessary? NO! But tall indeed. And hight can only be done with more cardboard. There will be hundreds or more cardboard DinA4 boards for the bigger cathedrals. IF NOT MORE. DinA4 is ~30cm. So you need 6 boards just for getting the height done.

The amount of "free" extra stuff you get is insane as well.
http://i.imgur.com/6Xme7lZ.jpg
XL gets 87 boxes/crates. EIGHTY SIX BOXES/CRATES. Thats way more than a dozend cardboard sheets.

Again: Do you need all of it? Absolutely no. It is Raging Heroes.. excessive is in their nature.

But: I think we need to appreciate the magnitude of it.

**kestral**

The interior add on would be tempting if it was available alone, but as has been said I don't really need tall shiny cardboard walls with a million tiny details that repeat over and over again. Kudos on the effort though, I hope to see one someday.

**OrlandotheTechnicoloured**

the extras so far as funding comes close to 3x target

**Yodhrin**

Alpharius wrote:
The full piece (as there's lots of...good stuff in there):

JULY 26 UPDATE: One-Week WarStages Kickstarter Launches July 29 at 6PM (Paris, France time)

It’s finally happening! We are launching this Saturday! It will be a VERY SHORT campaign, full of FREEBIES, and with exciting EARLY BIRD Pledges.

Time and Date Worldwide: To know exactly the hour at which it launches in your city/country, click here.

And keep your eye on our countdown clock.

A 7-day Campaign!

You read this right! The Campaign will only run for ONE WEEK. It will end between Saturday August 5th and Sunday August 5th (depending on where you live in the world).

Why So Short?

If you’ve already experienced a Kickstarter campaign, you know that there’s a lot of excitement at the beginning, a lot of excitement at the end, and not so much happening in the middle. Usually, project creators plan longer campaigns in the hope of attracting more people during that time. This is a wise strategy on specific project types that are more geared to the general public such as technology or music projects.

But in the Games category and with the backers we are looking for, we know that people are aware of the project’s existence and we don’t need to wait for several weeks for the general media to pick up on the campaign.

We thought about this long and hard. If you're concerned about this, remember that our first campaign was about 34 days and did $698,000. Our second campaign was about 16 days and was even more successful with $801,000.

In truth, we realise now that A LOT of the excitement has already been happening in the past few days with our revealing new info and images on this project. And so we thought we’d cut to the chase and shorten the quiet days between the beginning and the end of the campaign, especially since it is summer. So let's have this blitzkrieg!
Stretch Goals: Freebies and More Freebies

95% of the Stretch Goals planned for this campaign will be Freebies, so get ready for the ride! The better the campaign does, the more Freebies you’ll get as part of your pledge.

And that’s not all. The bigger you pledge, the more Freebies you’ll get!

In this campaign, we have the opportunity to give you more free stuff when you choose a higher tier, so that’s what we’ll be doing.

In fact, it will be fun for you to come back daily and watch your pledge get more and more Rewards!

And there's lots more info on our WarStages page...

Am I the only one that's starting to "hear" their press releases in a comedian-parodying-Trump voice?

EDIT: $200+ for printed carboard terrain...

**Nostromodamus**

Yodhrin wrote:
Am I the only one that's starting to "hear" their press releases in a comedian-parodying-Trump voice?

We have all the best cardboard, cavfefe. Our terrain is huuuuuge

**Breotan**

JULY 18 UPDATE: OUR QUEST FOR THE PERFECT MATERIAL
First it looks awesome! Right out of the box, you get a super detailed building full of complex textures, details and color. It allows for a crazy level of details. On top of that, we use many visual tricks in the assembly of the structures to give them even more volume. When you set it on your table, it is hard to believe that it's just cardboard, it has so much tri-dimensionality and texture and depth! And all the accessories give so much life to it! It's just great!

So, the perfect material amounts to artwork printed on pre-punched cardboard, eh?

**Nostromodamus**

I think "tri-dimensionality" is my new favorite word.

**MadCowCrazy**

Geifer wrote:
I'm not impressed. I am not normally interested in cardboard scenery, but even so, I think that console highlights one of the biggest problems of super awesome detailed texture: it all goes out of the window once you factor in reflecting light. I have a few old GW cardboard buildings and the best thing about them is that, by and large, the texture is reasonably refrained, even and boring. It blends pretty well. Shine some light on that console up there and see how flat it all looks.

You talking about the glossy shine? If that's the case why not just spray the terrain with a matt varnish?
Does it even matter once you play? You're not going to be staring at the terrain all the time nor look at it close up.
I think the idea is that you focus on the minis and your eyes simply blend in the background, the background of most cartoons are horrible yet people hardly notice because the focus is on the characters.

Terrain feels a bit flat though, especially those side panel walls.

Would have loved this terrain to be resin but then the cost of the basic stuff would probably have been 2-3x as high.

**Geifer**

MadCowCrazy wrote:
Geifer wrote:
I'm not impressed. I am not normally interested in cardboard scenery, but even so, I think that console highlights one of the biggest problems of super awesome detailed texture: it all goes out of the window once you factor in reflecting light. I have a few old GW cardboard buildings and the best thing about them is that, by and large, the texture is reasonably refrained, even and boring. It blends pretty well. Shine some light on that console up there and see how flat it all looks.

You talking about the glossy shine? If that's the case why not just spray the terrain with a matt varnish?
Does it even matter once you play? You're not going to be staring at the terrain all the time nor look at it close up.
I think the idea is that you focus on the minis and your eyes simply blend in the background, the background of most cartoons are horrible yet people hardly notice because the focus is on the characters.

Terrain feels a bit flat though, especially those side panel walls.

Would have loved this terrain to be resin but then the cost of the basic stuff would probably have been 2-3x as high.

As mentioned before, I'm not normally interested in cardboard terrain. The only reason I'm following this because I usually like Raging Heroes' work and I was curious how their scenery kickstarter turned out. But since I don't do cardboard scenery, adding work on top of it to remove flaws as best as possible is not an enticing idea. Plus, while I'm not sure and I guess it's worth a try, depending on lighting matt varnish may not actually do anything.

Is there any word on what these are printed on? Because unless it's black cardboard, you'd have to paint the edges as well and that's just something I wouldn't be able to do without losing the will to live.

Does it matter? To me, yes. You're not going to believe this, but I am easily distracted during games and enjoy the view a lot more than I should. I would get hung up on the look of the scenery. No doubt about it.

**Ouze**

MadCowCrazy wrote:
[You talking about the glossy shine? If that's the case why not just spray the terrain with a matt varnish?
Does it even matter once you play? You're not going to be staring at the terrain all the time nor look at it close up.
I think the idea is that you focus on the minis and your eyes simply blend in the background

This isn't a particularly vigorous selling point - "buy our terrain for hundreds of dollars, but you'll barely even look at it"

Anyway, in my limited experience, I got the Space Hulk re-release a few years back, and I imagine it's very similar if not identical. The shine on the material makes the graphics pop but it also obscures a lot of detail at the same time, it's really reflective. I'd be hesitant to spray it with any kind of matte sealant - I'm not sure how it would react with cardboard. Best case, you go really light, and it wears off very fast with normal play. Worst case, you go really heavy, and it warps as it dries.

Which is another observation: my Space Hulk tiles all started to warp a little after about a year or so. It's nothing awful, just kind of a gentle arc to some pieces - but this is stored flat, in a box, in the dark. I would definitely be concerned about the long-term longevity of a cardboard terrain set like this.

This just seems like a swing and a miss from me, and I've gotten up on the previous Raging Heroes kickstarters, and I was happy with what I got from those.

**Sarouan**

Well, the project is safe since it already founded. Guess the short campaign with limited edition was a good call, after all. All rushed to secure their early bird pledge.

To me, this terrain is more suited to have an easy and awesome background for the occasionnal striking game, especially in clubs for conventions. It is indeed more intended to look impressive in height and could be interesting for big games with titans hiding behind the highest point of the cathedral itself.

The price is killing my envy, though I do have a big army of sisters of battle and that terrain would be just perfect for them. So far, what they're saying about posting costs isn't really encouraging. We're not that far from buying something equivalent in GW hard plastic gothic terrain.

Expected for June 2018...One year before expecting something to come, in something Raging Heroes never made before. Hm. That's a lot of unknown factors.

I still struggle (it would look cool on the pictures I could take with this...), but Reason is having quite strong arguments to win over Heart. Let's see what will be said in the next days.

**Ouze**

Sarouan wrote:
Expected for June 2018...One year before expecting something to come, in something Raging Heroes never made before. Hm. That's a lot of unknown factors.

I expect a lot of delays, and a lot of condescending posts about said the delays, but I am sure they will (eventually) ship exactly what they promise to, and it will look exactly like they promise it will. If you like the product and can stomach the price you definitely should buy in, I think, because I think they will definitely deliver. Eventually.

**RoninXiC**

They're handing out "freebies" after "freebies"... but it got stuck at about 175,500 for a few days.

My wife wants me to buy one... she doesnt even play any wargames... guess I have to .. DARN!

**H.B.M.C.**

I think all the internal terrain, and the computers with multiple-screens, and various furniture items look great.