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 Hulksmash wrote:
Meh, that's an argument to have in another topic.

So anyone else making 85pts of space for the assassin of their choice each game?

Definitively! The flexibility you get is just too good to pass on imo and the best thing is that you don't need to sacrifice a detachment anymore.
Which ones do you like most? I feel like the Sniper dude is still pretty poor, but oh lord is the eversor a murder machine.

 Hulksmash wrote:
So anyone else making 85pts of space for the assassin of their choice each game?

Wouldn’t you need at least 170?

At least looking at the strategem and based on my (very possibly flawed) understanding of how that line under the strategem name works, wouldn’t you first need an Assassin in your list before you could use the Officio Assassinorum Strategem that gives you an(other) Assassin?

Pomguo wrote:

 deffrekka wrote:

Im hoping whenever we get a new codex again they fully revamp us from the ground up, the earlier codexes are just bad. And whilst im enjoying Vigilus Defiant my army still feels lacking and if you cant tell im getting burnt out hahaha If we were done in light of how well written Tyranids and Dark Eldar codexes are that would be a dream come true to me. Those 2 books have crazy good internal balance and character, you can use 90% of units in the book and not feel like your gimping yourself.

No argument that Nids have a super strong single codex, but isn’t it famous for having like half a book of useless crap? Spore nonsense and whatnot? Even a unit that suicides by re-deepstriking turn 3 if you try to use its pop-up mobility more than once? I was under the impression that it was half fantastic and half “don’t bother”, just that the fantastic half is still like twice as long as our entire codex due to being a much older army.

In the past it was famous for that but not anymore. Of the top my head only the Maleceptor and Hauraspex is bad there rest of the units are playable.

Pomguo wrote:

 Hulksmash wrote:
So anyone else making 85pts of space for the assassin of their choice each game?

Wouldn’t you need at least 170?

At least looking at the strategem and based on my (very possibly flawed) understanding of how that line under the strategem name works, wouldn’t you first need an Assassin in your list before you could use the Officio Assassinorum Strategem that gives you an(other) Assassin?

Nah you just need an Imperium detachment to gain access to the stratagems.

Pomguo wrote:

 Hulksmash wrote:
So anyone else making 85pts of space for the assassin of their choice each game?

Wouldn’t you need at least 170?

At least looking at the strategem and based on my (very possibly flawed) understanding of how that line under the strategem name works, wouldn’t you first need an Assassin in your list before you could use the Officio Assassinorum Strategem that gives you an(other) Assassin?

You just need an Imperium detachment to have access to the Officio Assassinorum stratagems.

That’s definitely how it seemed to be intended - but is there a line I can be pointed to where it says that? Or is it for now hidden in WD scans?

I think it's too good to pass up the Assassin. It's 85 points (or more!) that you definitely know are going to be good against your opponent. They're also clearly better than our Sicarans given their ridiculous rules.

@Pomguo
Just take a look at the WD leaks. It's on the first page of the index under the point stratagems.

@Suzuteo
Unfortunately you can only use this stratagem once, so max 1 Assassin this way.

What’s folks pick for best one?

I quite like the idea of subbing in a CP drain machine to put the pressure on stratagem heavy armies - Callidus

 Ideasweasel wrote:
What’s folks pick for best one?

I quite like the idea of subbing in a CP drain machine to put the pressure on stratagem heavy armies - Callidus

The Callidus will be important vs any army using a Castellan or Slamguinus'. Eversor for horses of some kind, Culexus is self explanatory, and lastly Vindicares more for helping finish off characters outside facing Genestealer Cults.

They all have a use now you can side board

Callidus killing elites + hitting CP
Culexus killing psykers + Support CC units + Tanking
Eversor killing infantry
Vindicare killing weak characters

I would rank them in that order for how frequently I would use them.

That's actually an important point you bring up about tanking. If the army doesn't have rerolls upon rerolls, a Culexus can effectively stop a bunch of Boyz or Gaunts in their tracks.

Going back a discussion for a moment the list document for the GT i'm attending this weekend has been published

for primary detachments (Most points)
Adeptus mechanicus 4
Astra militarum 3
Total players with at least one detatchment
Astra militarum 10
Adeptus mechanicus 8

That for me shows the huge shift from Guard to mechanicus at least within Scotland and I think their were 0 Admech primaries and only about 2 players prior to CA18


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
That's actually an important point you bring up about tanking. If the army doesn't have rerolls upon rerolls, a Culexus can effectively stop a bunch of Boyz or Gaunts in their tracks.

I've had one slowly beat up a CC dreadnaught

Just beware with the Cullexus if you soup in some psykers on your own, since her debuff now also effects allied psykers.

Regarding tankiness: How do you rate the Eversors? 4++ and 4+ fnp seems legit!

 lash92 wrote:
@Pomguo
Just take a look at the WD leaks. It's on the first page of the index under the point stratagems.

@Suzuteo
Unfortunately you can only use this stratagem once, so max 1 Assassin this way.

Really? Isn't it pregame? You can use pregame stratagems any number of times.

 Suzuteo wrote:

 lash92 wrote:
@Pomguo
Just take a look at the WD leaks. It's on the first page of the index under the point stratagems.

@Suzuteo
Unfortunately you can only use this stratagem once, so max 1 Assassin this way.

Really? Isn't it pregame? You can use pregame stratagems any number of times.

::: sigh :::

If you read the link it specifically states it can be used once per game.

 lash92 wrote:
Just beware with the Cullexus if you soup in some psykers on your own, since her debuff now also effects allied psykers.

Regarding tankiness: How do you rate the Eversors? 4++ and 4+ fnp seems legit!

as a character its not terrible its not likely to get overwatched to death and it has an extra Wound and the 4+ fnp over other assassins making the second toughest but caught in the open it will still go down fair quick if your opponent wants it dead. Remember to be usefull its operateing ahead of the rest of your army and so is often easily targetable (its fight twice has a 50% chance of costing it a wound and your probably useing this) also remember the fnp costs CP each phase so to cover it vs overwatch then their CC then their shooting could be 3 cp / battle round.

as to the psyckers this is the mechanicus thread as a faction renound for its excessive use of psychic powers I beleive many of us will take the risk.

@ Suzuteo
Yup, it is specifically stated in the last sentence of the stratagem.

@ U02dah4
Please read again what I wrote: "Just beware [...] if you soup in some psykers [....]" ;-)

Ah. Can't believe I missed that. So just one Assassin. Still a very impactful 85 points. Even the Callidus as a default choice can really screw up a lot of lists.

Yeah, they also changed her sword to be a flat 2 damage, so you could also use her for character assasinations with her -3 invuln ignoring d2 sword.

You can still legitimately take 3 assassins in a vanguard without an HQ. or take 1 of each assassin in a Vanguard to gain the 1 CP still.

Sure but I need all of my 3 detachment slots. Like most of us I guess.

I like it from both a gaming perspective and a fluff a single assassin randomly turns up geared to the situation at hand on only a rare occasion is a more serious comitment made and then its a big investment

Agreed. I would always take an Assassin for 1 CP over a detachment slot. If you take an Execution Force, you may also have dead points.

This is my current list:

Wondering if cutting a Robot for Assassin and upgrading my Styrix melee weapon is worth it. Feet and Reaper are both better than the Claw (the former against <T6, Titanics, and T8 5++ or better; the latter for T6-7; Ravager is the ideal Leman Russ killer), but the Rad-cleanser is a pretty solid flamer weapon.

Interesting list. I like that it has a knight in it, in fact it’s got a bit of everything really.

Have you had much luck using the dagger of Tu?

It's great. I actually wrote a BR a few pages back when I faced off against Triptides Tripsides. I lost 4 Robots turn one, but capped majority of the objectives. He was forced to move up to contest. My Ryzaphrons came in turn two and killed two Riptides and essentially ended the game.

I created an Army List thread for it:
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/771801.page#10353488

One thing that I sort of struggle with is the fact that I can't get both formations. I also am not sure what to cut for the Assassin and what relic I should take.

 lash92 wrote:

 Hulksmash wrote:
Meh, that's an argument to have in another topic.

So anyone else making 85pts of space for the assassin of their choice each game?

Definitively! The flexibility you get is just too good to pass on imo and the best thing is that you don't need to sacrifice a detachment anymore.
Which ones do you like most? I feel like the Sniper dude is still pretty poor, but oh lord is the eversor a murder machine.

The Vindicare with strategem can kill 2 Ork characters in one turn alone. He is awesome. Culexus got worse, Calidus still strong, Eversor...well, I dont like it.
But all my lists are 1915 points now at base

Can kill 2 but often wont more likely to than he was but can still fail to hit fail to wound or not deal enough damage

The eversor kills hoards hes a sideboard choice

Callidus got better in CC anf can now kill a smash cpt as well as make its pts in cp denial

In what way is the culexus worse life drain was made better (now ignores void shields) you really take it for the 6+BS which is still there and it can now make the enemy fight last which is huge when supporting other assaulters.

Iago40k wrote:

 lash92 wrote:

 Hulksmash wrote:
Meh, that's an argument to have in another topic.

So anyone else making 85pts of space for the assassin of their choice each game?

Definitively! The flexibility you get is just too good to pass on imo and the best thing is that you don't need to sacrifice a detachment anymore.
Which ones do you like most? I feel like the Sniper dude is still pretty poor, but oh lord is the eversor a murder machine.

The Vindicare with strategem can kill 2 Ork characters in one turn alone. He is awesome. Culexus got worse, Calidus still strong, Eversor...well, I dont like it.
But all my lists are 1915 points now at base

I think you overestimate his probabilities. First of all he needs to hit and wound which has a combined chance of just 70%, after this you need to do enough damage. Just calculate it for yourself, but even with the possibility of MW you don't reliable kill one, let even two chars. And that is not even considering things like line of sight or FnPs.

U02DAH4 sums it up quite nice imo. Just imagine 40 Genestealers crashing in your Catachan screen and all of them having to fight last lol.

Gotta take side with Suzuteo not only cause it was unfair and below polite many posts vs him but also cause we got like 500 pages of ad mech talking and testing and many should show some more respect .

To the point after moniring both list and the lvo pro wanna be and Suzuteo list it's obvious Suzuteo is the winner and you can test it your self facing the lists vs each other and more.

The fact you did good at lvo does not mean as much as you claim for your list and the fact you faced maiinly same enemies proves your matchup luck.

Still I got many to say for both lists .

List one lvo champ.

Don't get me wrong I agree with Suzuteo I wish you did finshed first in lvo with pure ad mech. I wish but if I'm correct you claim ad mech purity and you go a stationary gun line where

A) even breachers need to be close to Cawl for the buff so what xactly did you do. Removed Robots and onagers to circle 3 robotts with Terminator like breachers so what?? Robots are not good onagers not cheap. If I am to take Cawl Mars etc then I need Mars Gun line.

B) oh I'm gonna remove guad hla bla . Yeah right you gonna remove mortars 9D6 Los and find it where?? In solo ad mech . You talking mcho when you can sit back and mortar enemies Los. And that is the only reason you got some proper function in your list . Ofc 7 breachers able to fight revive heal T5 3w 1+/4++ it's superb body guards but mortars gve you the ability to remove enemy campping units . That's why you can play with 3 robots only bla bla.

C) pure ad mech k let me first see you remove the 40 shot moving T8 punisher and wee LL see your stationary other options why you took the rush and not a Robot spare us your grand strategy we know it as well.

D) ofc you don't need more than 5 infiltrators cause you got also guard let me see you as the rest of us having to play 10 infiltrators and loose them trying to actually bring results.

E) I'm sorry but from you list I can see you are. Not an ad mech pure . Split units like balistsri 3 robots 5 infiltrators none benefit from our buffs same as a Cawl buffing arrc breachers . It's not refined ad mech it's your plan and you made it work no question about it but will not have consistency without guard . Even is you bring some results eventually if you remove guard you will become a classic ad mech lossimg from vp and vs a refined like like a guard list no your expensive 8 man ranger omnispecx won't wiin cause high tier full competitive guard infantry have mobility options and melee options fixed in their build and you don't.

Ad mech pure list with no vanguard has no clue . Vanguard one unit only can advance shoot and provide -1 T. If you don't know how to use this then breachers melee benefits talks come later.


For Suzuteo.

Your list has mobility and I congrats you for making a superb list especially making the catachan vanguard v v good combo ec.

Unfortunately beyond that combo again we result in same talks.
If we are to make a soup list then we need to get some things basic.
A) limitation on detachments . Is vital to understand you need more detachments to make ad mech work full or you most likely dont play ad mech and you don't .
Guard knights combo is now already known and tested . Why take styrx why not take mortars .
You can't claim seriously that the winning list at lvo s not refined .
Castllan guard that's it. You will not gain anything with styrix even the mobility won't matter cause he is alone and won't make the results in melee you dream of vs other knighs. While castellan even 50+ points increase you know castellan is best shooting unit. You take guard and can't find 99 points for a mortar come on. Why we had earthshakers please. Can't chase all eenemy scouts on all hills . Still your list has a flavor of old times and it's superb overall great job.

As for the ad mech talk. Pure ad mech ok I'm with you. Pure can't be solo competitive . Maybe team lsts solo list able to face all can happen cause ad mech does not have all options yet.( Psych.fly.transport.hq.
What I suggest ad mech so you don't read my crap

2 detachment ad mch so you can make one mixed for all options and assassin's . If you go for knights you will be forced to go lots of knghtd or castellan solo with guard.

Assassin's can provide what you need for each enemy and still make a proper list . If you don't get a mxd battalion you can benefit from all options .

Main detachmen
A) Mars if you going for robots Cawl
B) Stygis for mblit dragoon balistsarii heavy


Second dtach mixed with highlits
A) ryza destreyers
B) vangqrd graia
C)Agripiina breaches

You need to master for results.

Mving 5+ dragoons
Using 10 infiltrators as Mars split fire deep strik properly
Utilize vanguard and breachers ( don't forget buffs)
If you don't go Cawl you most likely need manipulus and lasc balistarii.

As always even if rread my post as offensive I'm only suggesting things and it's not m native language . My suggestions not to offend none hf.