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I keep seeing comments of ‘no Superman as that’s a separate license’ and/or ‘no JL characters as it will unbalance the game’.

Have these things been ‘officially’ said?

Also, as much as I love this one so far, I’d REALLY love a Spider-Man version...

Well, when poots offered the game without the miniatures (almost) nobody bought it, so those complaining must have been just complaining to complain, or are not willing to put their money were their mouth is.

Moving from KDM and on the actual topic, they said in BoW videos that they could offer this and Conan on a level were it would be marketable to retailers and make a profit, but would not be the game they want to deliver, so, I guess they stand by their design standards?

I don't know I said a lot kickstarter might be a venue for games that cannot be marketed to retailers and stores and this might be an example of such game.

 Alpharius wrote:
I keep seeing comments of ‘no Superman as that’s a separate license’ and/or ‘no JL characters as it will unbalance the game’.

Have these things been ‘officially’ said?

Also, as much as I love this one so far, I’d REALLY love a Spider-Man version...

They confirmed on Facebook a few weeks ago that they have the licence for everything including non-Batman characters but decided on Batman as the focus of the game as it has the biggest market. That said, it would be foolish not to include a few of the bigger names such as Superman and especially Wonder Woman given her current popularity.

No, it's more like the traditional retailer-distributor model isn't any good for expensive high-end games. Distributors and retailers aren't going to risk carrying a $100+ boardgame, when they could stock two more boxes of Magic cards or Star Wars Destiny.

An alternative to a high-end KS game would be to split it into a base game and multiple expansions, which the retail industry has been doing for decades (eg. Settlers of Catan, Lord of the Rings boardgame). You'd have a FFG model, where the retail base game would be something like Batman vs. Joker and goons. Then you'd buy one expansion after another after another, and the total you'd pay would be more than the KS price.

I don't see this as poor game design. Indeed, the reason why some games are split into a base game and expansion is more for market demands than the game's design. I do see KS becoming an alternative to the traditional retailer-distributor model. We already have an audience of alpha game buyers who want deep discounts and will buy through online game stores. KS is the next step, with various second print-run projects, such as the 7th Continent and upcoming Conan KS, overcoming the limited window a KS project has.

Red Hood and Red Hood goons now unlocked. Confusingly the Red Hood model is a hero version which doesn't come with a villain tile (based upon the contents listed) so can't be used as a villain alongside the goons.

Red Hood (with a minigun, hoping for an alternate version with the iconic pistols later on) now locked in, Red Hood Gang thugs coming up next.

I'd totally be up for a Superman or Wonder Woman, even if they don't end up actually in the game and are just an extra, it'd be a cool addition.

 Paradigm wrote:
Red Hood (with a minigun, hoping for an alternate version with the iconic pistols later on) now locked in, Red Hood Gang thugs coming up next.

Not sure if it's a caching issue at my end but an alternate already funded villain Red Hood just popped up as already unlocked -



Still not the iconic version you were after though but instead the original possible Joker version.

 PsychoticStorm wrote:
I don't know I said a lot kickstarter might be a venue for games that cannot be marketed to retailers and stores and this might be an example of such game.

ced1106 wrote:
I do see KS becoming an alternative to the traditional retailer-distributor model. We already have an audience of alpha game buyers who want deep discounts and will buy through online game stores. KS is the next step, with various second print-run projects, such as the 7th Continent and upcoming Conan KS, overcoming the limited window a KS project has.

I had not thought about it in that aspect. I could see that as valid. I guess technically not all things produced on Kickstarter needs to have a retailer channel, although I do think there should be a channel available. If one doesn't want to have a to deal with distributor/retailer levels, that is fine, sell directly via the website. I guess technically they could still do this via Kickstarter... in a couple years create a new one and do a 2nd Edition version.

Actually thinking about it more... this might make more sense for an established IP model. Usually licensing are for X Years, then open to renew with some other conditions sprinkled in. This means they do one chunk, everyone gets their cut and then be done with it. Not really valid for building a game, which is usually tied to necessary action for a new IP but something that works for something which has an existing fan base already.

Damian Wayne up next. Hoping we get a Carrie Kelly Robin at some point to go with the DKR Batman.

Aeneades wrote:
Red Hood and Red Hood goons now unlocked. Confusingly the Red Hood model is a hero version which doesn't come with a villain tile (based upon the contents listed) so can't be used as a villain alongside the goons.

There's a villain Red Hood too, it was unlocked at 945k, it's just at the bottom because they messed up the graphic.

Damian unlocked, The Orphan (confusingly, not Orphan...) up next. I consider myself fairly clued up on Batman but I've not heard of this guy. Can someone fill me in?

Only found this about Orphan:
http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Batman_Vol_1_567
http://crusadapedia.wikia.com/wiki/Orphan
http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/David_Cain_(Prime_Earth)

Cheers. He's unlocked now, and up next is the Orphan I'd actually heard of (and that was previewed earlier), Cassandra Cain.

Why the jump to $85K for unlocks now?

I mean, I *know* why, but has there been an official explanation/excuse yet?

It's up to $100k for the next lot (4x Prisoners). No 'explanation' as such, I imagine it's just a case of them wanting to pace themselves and not blow through all their goals in the first few days, which I don't really mind; keeps it exciting if they're revealing stuff all the way through.

Let's be honest we're probably going to get through everything they have planned anyway. They've already added upwards of 30 models for free and there's loads of stuff previewed earlier that's not been formally announced yet.

Also, don't forget the math behind it. The more backers that join, the more of each freebie that needs to be made....thus increasing costs of each stretch goal. Several KS projects have overlooked this and later had to face the consequences.

BigDaddio wrote:
Also, don't forget the math behind it. The more backers that join, the more of each freebie that needs to be made....thus increasing costs of each stretch goal. Several KS projects have overlooked this and later had to face the consequences.

I knew I was forgetting something!

BUT...the real cost in 'new' miniatures is in the sculpting and the mold - the material is negligible, as is the labor, mostly.

So if you could 'add' in a 'new' miniature for an extra $50K, you really don't need to double that later on.

But yes, it is most likely to slow down the pace here, and....stretch out the stretch goals, I suppose.

Well you have to factor in assembly if required, packaging, volume, shipping, weight, inventory replacements.

Anything extra adds a lot of small steps that need to be made.

And anything counts in large amounts.

Yeah, but not that much.

It is very much an artificial speed bump and/or governor to help smooth out the lulls which will happen here - especially when a project blasts out of the gate like this one!

 Alpharius wrote:
Yeah, but not that much.

It is very much an artificial speed bump and/or governor to help smooth out the lulls which will happen here - especially when a project blasts out of the gate like this one!

The other thing is, Monolith needs to get paid on this. On something going to be an evergreen product, you can afford to make less on the KS because you'recreating a retail item that will sell in the future for more. You subsidize the KS backer discount with higher priced retail sales. This is a one shot, probably because the license was easier/cheaper to obtain that way, so they need to make their part in one go.

 Bossk_Hogg wrote:

 Alpharius wrote:
Yeah, but not that much.

It is very much an artificial speed bump and/or governor to help smooth out the lulls which will happen here - especially when a project blasts out of the gate like this one!

The other thing is, Monolith needs to get paid on this. On something going to be an evergreen product, you can afford to make less on the KS because you'recreating a retail item that will sell in the future for more. You subsidize the KS backer discount with higher priced retail sales. This is a one shot, probably because the license was easier/cheaper to obtain that way, so they need to make their part in one go.

It may be a Kickstarter exclusive, but they could always come back to it again and again like they have done at least once with Conan. Making it slightly more expensive the next time around.

 Theophony wrote:

 Bossk_Hogg wrote:

 Alpharius wrote:
Yeah, but not that much.

It is very much an artificial speed bump and/or governor to help smooth out the lulls which will happen here - especially when a project blasts out of the gate like this one!

The other thing is, Monolith needs to get paid on this. On something going to be an evergreen product, you can afford to make less on the KS because you'recreating a retail item that will sell in the future for more. You subsidize the KS backer discount with higher priced retail sales. This is a one shot, probably because the license was easier/cheaper to obtain that way, so they need to make their part in one go.

It may be a Kickstarter exclusive, but they could always come back to it again and again like they have done at least once with Conan. Making it slightly more expensive the next time around.

Maaaybe, depends on what they were licensed for. Conan was supposed to be a product sold in stores from my understanding.

Yes, it was - and it...was.

But it wasn't making them any money that way (they claim they were losing money on each retail sale), so, here we are with Batman!

NM, wrong thread

So what's the over/under on Condiment King making an appearance?

Hopefully not happening, but if the comments section get's wind of it and attempts to Brian Blessed it into being? Who knows...

And I think we're up to $110K between stretch goals now.

Kickstarters have a ton more value then most things retail. I think it really allows them to focus more on development early on and try to get the best bang for their buck. This project got a good drive and they did a really great job with the models from Mythic Battles which made me want to go all in on this. There still could be more expansions and such I know Mythic battles started out basic but then went into massive amounts of expansions and such before the end of the kick starter.

Agreed. I was all in with conan, and conan turned out great. Love the game mechanics, which have been perfected for batman. Also backed all in with mythic battles... their minis have gotten better, and are a true joy to paint, game with, and display.

Really looking forward to batman, as I never was a conan or Greek themed fan (still love those games, so this game will be ace!!!).

All in. Question is should I get two copies so I have a backup if something happens... (Want the game to outlast me )

Mythic battles I wanted to go all in with but the all in cost was a little too high for me. The all in cost for Batman is a good fit and seems to be a very fair value. I thought about getting a second one so i have one for painting/ display and the other for playing but considering the amount of models I have to paint at any given time would take me two lifetimes, I am going to just go with one copy.

I didn't really notice anything too crazy with Mythic battles that would lead me to believe the game wouldn't hold up. I know with other board games I have backed through kickstarter I have a tendency to laminate most larger paper items and card sleeve cards. with how these cards fit into the holder though lamination may not work.

Two-face is in!



Next up, some 3D bombs to replace tokens: