Total War: Three Kingdoms (Moving on to next game?)

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**LordofHats**

I'm really liking King Mulu but yeah. Once you've stacked all the bonuses for uniting the tribes the Nanman are crazy strong. Their generals are intense too. It's pretty easy to have multiple Lu Bu and Zhao Yun strength generals from the way the system is designed.

Elephants are also - shockingly - absolute murder machines.

**trexmeyer**

Does Three Kingdoms have the same siege issues as Warhammer 2?

**A Town Called Malus**

trexmeyer wrote:
Does Three Kingdoms have the same siege issues as Warhammer 2?

Not completely. The siege maps are not limited to only having 1 or 2 walls to attack. You can see it a bit in this video. If it is landlocked you can position your units anywhere around it, for coastal cities there is likely to be at least one side which is against the ocean and so is inaccessible. Minor settlement types such as mines have their own maps such as the one seen here.

Cities have towers around the walls and also within the cities itself, so just getting past the wall doesn't mean you are safe from arrow fire, as well as barricades which can be set up to block off streets and funnel the attackers through, exposing them to more towers and making it longer to reach the centre of the city. Fire is very much your friend as it can very quickly bring down arrow towers so making sure to bring along a strategist type general with flaming arrows and flaming shot (for trebuchets) unlocked is quite important.

The AI still has some serious issues with regards to sieges, though. They will still kinda stand there and let you shoot at them though they are not entirely dumb about it and will pull back and use formations and abilities to block your arrows if they can (such as turtle formation etc.). In general most ranged units in the game do not carry anywhere near the amount of ammunition that Warhammer units are packing though, and artillery is not accurate at long ranges, so you can't break the entire enemy army only using your artillery and archers as you can in Warhammer unless you brought nothing but it which would also leave you royally fethed i you didn't manage to break them or got caught by an army with heavy cavalry in the field..

**trexmeyer**

A Town Called Malus wrote:
trexmeyer wrote:
Does Three Kingdoms have the same siege issues as Warhammer 2?

Not completely. The siege maps are not limited to only having 1 or 2 walls to attack. You can see it a bit in this video. If it is landlocked you can position your units anywhere around it, for coastal cities there is likely to be at least one side which is against the ocean and so is inaccessible. Minor settlement types such as mines have their own maps such as the one seen here.

Cities have towers around the walls and also within the cities itself, so just getting past the wall doesn't mean you are safe from arrow fire, as well as barricades which can be set up to block off streets and funnel the attackers through, exposing them to more towers and making it longer to reach the centre of the city. Fire is very much your friend as it can very quickly bring down arrow towers so making sure to bring along a strategist type general with flaming arrows and flaming shot (for trebuchets) unlocked is quite important.

The AI still has some serious issues with regards to sieges, though. They will still kinda stand there and let you shoot at them though they are not entirely dumb about it and will pull back and use formations and abilities to block your arrows if they can (such as turtle formation etc.). In general most ranged units in the game do not carry anywhere near the amount of ammunition that Warhammer units are packing though, and artillery is not accurate at long ranges, so you can't break the entire enemy army only using your artillery and archers as you can in Warhammer unless you brought nothing but it which would also leave you royally fethed i you didn't manage to break them or got caught by an army with heavy cavalry in the field..

That layout just looks better.

WH2 is a slog in regards to sieges. Autoresolve against major settlements is completely fethed to the point where you can engage an army outside a settlement and have 3:1 odds, but attack that same army in the settlement and it drops down to 1:1 or worse. So I end up almost only fighting siege battles during campaigns because basically every faction has magic, artillery, monsters, ranged, or the rare god-tier lord that trivializes the battle.

The AI will reposition in WH2, but it just doesn't matter if you have magic or ranged to shoot over the walls. They need to update it so that they'll actually LOS you...

**Eumerin**

trexmeyer wrote:

WH2 is a slog in regards to sieges. Autoresolve against major settlements is completely fethed to the point where you can engage an army outside a settlement and have 3:1 odds, but attack that same army in the settlement and it drops down to 1:1 or worse. So I end up almost only fighting siege battles during campaigns because basically every faction has magic, artillery, monsters, ranged, or the rare god-tier lord that trivializes the battle.

I had one game in which I was playing Brettonia in the first game. I had taken Altdorf after the Empire lost it (though I can't remember who to; but needless to say, the Empire was *not* doing very well in that game), and massively fortified it. And I had a full stack of units defending it. The Chaos hordes hit it with three full-size armies, and I hit auto-resolve to see what would happen.

The auto-resolved battle had the computer not suffering a single loss.

**Overread**

Auto resolve has always had issues, its not really there for major fights, its there for when you've 12 units against 1 hero fleeting or the remnants of a crippled army etc... Ergo situations where its basically an automatic win/loss result and you don't want to load the map up. It's worse in Warhammer because there's a lot more diversity in the units than normal for a TW Game. You've got armies like skaven where clan rats are pretty rubbbish and will moral break easily; but they are supposed to break and return over and over whilst elite units are shielded by them and doing real damage.

**A Town Called Malus**

Oh another thing which helps in Three Kingdoms is that if a unit in your army gets completely wiped out then it will automatically replenish itself over a couple of turns as long as you are able to replenish.

And unit recruitment isn't limited by buildings but by your generals and their rank and your technology advances.

So having a unit get wiped out during an autoresolve doesn't mean a multiple turn slog back to a province with the buildings to recruit it, a couple turns recruiting it, and then multiple turns heading back to your front lines.

**nels1031**

Next Chapter in the Three Kingdoms saga:

ABOUT THIS CONTENT
Determine the fate of China in the new Chapter pack for Total War: Three Kingdoms. Grow Yuan Shao’s mighty army or stand in his way as Cao Cao and use strategy to achieve the grandest of ambitions.

In the Fates Divided Chapter Pack you begin at 200 CE, a period that finds Yuan Shao and Cao Cao at a crucial turning point. These childhood friends have borne witness to each other’s growing ambition, but Yuan Shao’s patience with Cao Cao is fast coming to an end – a childhood bond is about to break.

Fates Divided includes significant improvements to several in-game mechanics, a new faction, and new units, as well as new playstyles for established factions.

A Unique Start Date
The 200 CE start date throws players into a moment in history where the story’s main heroes are now developed and formidable forces. Will you continue Cao Cao’s march across the map or use Yuan Shao’s grand army to stop him in his tracks?

Whilst the conflict focuses on the warlords in the north, you can also play as characters such as Liu Bei and Ma Teng, helping them to achieve their lofty goals.

New Cross-Generational Faction
Play as Liu Yan, a man of great ambition and strategy, as he attempts to establish a lasting legacy for his family. Make best use of Liu Yan’s aspiration mechanic to set the stage for Liu Zhang’s eventual inheritance, and reap the rewards of your father’s hard work, or watch as his best laid plans crumble under your care.

New and Varied Units
With a host of new units for Cao Cao, Yuan Shao and Liu Yan, as well as the chance to gain the elite Northern Army units, this is a Chapter Pack that’s coming out fighting.

**LordofHats**

Finally adding the Liu Zhang faction I see. Was wondering when it would happen.

**Eumerin**

The release date is on the 11th. So just two weeks away.

That's a pretty short announcement cycle.

Liu Yan was the ruler of Yi Province. His fourth son, Liu Zhang, became his successor after the death of Liu Yan's three oldest sons. Liu Zhang's advisors recommended that Liu Bei be invited into the province, but those same advisors then treacherously conspired with Liu Bei to help the wandering warlord take control of the province. Liu Bei was successful in seizing control, and the Yi Province capitol of Chengdu ended up becoming the capitol of Liu Bei's Kingdom of Shu Han. After Guan Yu's death, Liu Zhang ended up joining the Kingdom of Wu, and died two years later.

Lady Wu, the widow of Liu Yan's third son, Liu Mao, ended up marrying Liu Bei, and became known as Empress Mu.

Liu Yan is a welcome addition. I've been wondering when they were finally going to put a playable warlord down in that region. It's an important region because that's where Liu Bei ultimately ended up. And now there's finally a playable faction down there.

**Eumerin**

Gameplay Reveal trailer here -

Most of the focus is in showing off Liu Yan's gameplay in Yi Province, and how his faction abilities work in preparing his domain for his heir and successor. The video ends with a clash that gives a brief glimpse of some of the new units potentially available to the northern armies of Cao Cao and Yuan Shao.

**Eumerin**

Here's an interview with a senior designer for the new DLC -

https://www.totalwar.com/blog/total-war-three-kingdoms-fates-divided-dev-interview/

There's a lot of new stuff mentioned in the interview that looks like it'll add some very interesting features to the game, and not all of it will be restricted to Year 200 starts (the year when the DLC opens).

For one thing, you now can start big instead of small.

Unlike our other Chapter Packs, we’ve got some big factions from the first turn. Cao Cao’s secured more than 30 regions, and many other warlords have over a dozen regions. This means we’ve got wars brewing on multiple fronts, and players can’t necessarily send all their armies together in a single doomstack.

The Emperor has come of age, and is going to start playing a more important role, as well.

We wanted the emperor (Liu Xie) to play a bigger role in this campaign, so we gave him the full main character treatment. This means he has new unique character art, and a new skill tree that better fits a non-deployable character. While he’s not initially a character on the map, it’s now possible to restore the Han Empire and reinstate him as the rightful ruler. This has been on the wish list for many players, so it’s great to expand his presence in this manner.

The interview notes later on that this will kick in when the Emperor comes of age, which is Year 197. Or in other words, it's not limited to Fates Divided chapter starts.

There's a lot of other good stuff in there too, including a mention of how the recipient of Liu Yan's faction ability doesn't have to be a blood relative.

**nels1031**

Patch Notes :

The 1.7.0 update is the next major update for Total War: THREE KINGDOMS, arriving alongside the Fates Divided DLC. The patch fixes issues raised by the community as well as introducing new campaign features, characters, and more.

Highlights of the 1.7.0 patch:

Imperial Intrigue and changes to the Emperor
Schemes faction mechanic for Cao Cao
Captain armoury mechanic for Yuan Shao
New faction council
New expanded faction ranks
New legendary characters
A plethora of bug fixes
SAVE GAME WARNING
It is strongly recommended you start a new campaign to experience the great new features which have been added to the campaign with the Fates Divided release. Please also disable mods until they have been updated to account for all the changes made. If you wish to finish your current campaigns before updating, please opt in to the old_1.6.1 beta.

In order to opt in to the old_1.6.1 beta:

Right-click on Total War: THREE KINGDOMS in your Steam library
Click Properties and click the Betas tab
In the drop-down menu, select the old_1.6.1 option
Close the window and your build will automatically update to old_1.6.1
THE 1.7.0 PATCH
IMPERIAL INTRIGUE
The new imperial intrigue mechanics determines how well each faction within the Han is seen by the Emperor. This mechanic comes into effect in the year 197 CE, when the Emperor comes of age at 16. In the new Fates Divided campaign, the mechanic is available from turn one, with Cao Cao in control of the Emperor.

The imperial intrigue mechanic sees each faction gain an imperial favour score, which is a measure of how much the Emperor likes that faction. Factions with high favour will gain boons from the Emperor, while factions with low favour may be declared an Enemy of the Han or face imperial sanctions.

While the Emperor holds sway in the imperial court, he will hand out missions, sanctions, and aid to those factions he feels are deserving of them. Each of these occur in events that have a small chance to happen each turn. Factions with high favour will have access to events like “Imperial Food Reserves” where, if your faction is running low on food, the Emperor will send some food supplies to your faction for 10 turns. Those with low favour might see events such as “The Emperor Demands Peace”, a decree which, if your faction is at war with another faction that has high imperial favour, sees the Emperor demand that you make peace with them within 10 turns. All Han factions also have access to the “Duty of the Han” events, which include events such as “The Defence of Our Allies”. In this event, if a faction with high imperial favour has an enemy army in their land, the Emperor will ask you to attack and defeat the enemy army.

Warlords that favour the current protectorate (the faction leader that has control of the Emperor) will actively work against the Enemy of the Han, whereas those who do not care for the protectorate are likely to ignore the Emperor’s decrees. If the protectorate’s favour drops too low, they will lose control of the Emperor.

THE EMPEROR
We have also added a bonus restoration of the Han mechanic to the endgame. The faction controlling the Emperor can reinstate the Emperor when they hit maximum prestige (Emperor) rank. This causes the current character to step down as faction leader, and Liu Xie to become the new faction leader. While not deployable in battle – he is the Emperor, after all – he does have new unique 2D artwork and a new skill tree. The player can also set their original faction leader up as the Emperor as before should they desire to depose the Han.

CAO CAO SCHEMES MECHANIC
Schemes are a new and powerful mechanic for Cao Cao’s faction that let you manipulate the ever-changing world around you to best suit your playstyle. Through enacting schemes, the player can make subtle changes to the campaign situation, such as influencing how others perceive Cao Cao’s enemies, or dramatic shifts, like turning certain defeat in battle into victory.

In order to facilitate this, the faction leader has access to individuals referred to as pawns that, using the spy network, deliver the messages of each scheme to any faction on the campaign map. The number of pawns available are linked to the available spy slots that the faction has developed. Once a scheme is complete, the pawn will again become available to complete the next machination.

Cao Cao’s credibility resource has also been expanded and can now be used in all deals in diplomacy. This makes it a far more powerful tool for manipulation. Credibility can now also be earned and spent through careful scheming.

Schemes and the reworked credibility system will be available in all start dates for Cao Cao.

YUAN SHAO’S CAPTAIN ARMOURY MECHANIC
The Captain Armoury is a new mechanic for Yuan Shao’s faction, focused on his captain retinues. The purpose of this mechanic is to expand captains into something that feels more unique, while not stepping on the toes of characters. The captains are intended to be powerful retinues with highly customisable abilities, but without the individualism of characters.

The player can build up lineage throughout the campaign, and this can be used to buy bonuses for captains. Each captain has their own armoury, and these give the player ways to rapidly expand the military potential of their armies. Some of the available bonuses include flaming arrows for all archers, the ability to fight all battles as ambush battles, or boosting the core stats of units above and beyond their normal values.

The player also has a series of missions for captains. These are milestones that gradually improve the performance of captains throughout the campaign. As part of this feature, we have also given players the ability to rename all captains within their army.

FACTION COUNCIL REWORK
Our previous faction council feature is no more, but something newer and shinier has replaced it. The new faction council is a proactive and reactive system driven by the characters in your court. Each year the council will convene, and each character will offer up to two suggestions based on their personality traits. These suggestions are triggered according to the current situation on the campaign map, with the council offering different options in an attempt to help solve any problems the player might be facing.

The player can choose to enact up to one suggestion per character per year, which immediately creates some interesting scenarios. These no longer trigger missions, but instead enact a suggestion that can shift your economic focus, repair public order, trigger rebellions in enemy land, or even give a big boost to character experience.

Our goal behind this change is to make it feel like the characters in your court are individuals with their own ideas – who are presenting those ideas to their leader for approval.

EXPANDED FACTION PROGRESSION RANKS
With the new expanded progression ranks system, progression bonuses have been switched from a passive bonus to an active customisation feature. When the player gains a new progression rank, they will receive prestige points, which can be spent to increase capacities for things like assignments, administrators, and trade agreements. With this feature, Han imperial factions can thus take the prestige they’ve gained from their exploits on the campaign map and use it to invest back in their own power bases in whichever area they see fit.

When the player invests certain amounts of prestige points into a capacity, they will also gain new bonuses at set milestones. This lets you tailor your faction to your own playstyle – play as Cao Cao and get the most out of spies, for example, or create a multitude of trade routes with Kong Rong.

Players can actively choose when to increase their faction’s progression rank, but once choices are made they’re permanent.

NEW LEGENDARY CHARACTERS
WEN CHOU

Wen Chou was a feared cavalry commander under Yuan Shao, and was sent to fight Cao Cao during their conflict in 200 CE.

Wen Chou’s Xiezhi Roar ability sees him fly into a rage on the battlefield, embodying the mighty Xiezhi, a mythical creature of great power. This activated debuff causes nearby enemies to lose morale as Wen Chou’s roar emits with such power that it sends out a shockwave, killing any soldiers who are too near.

He is available at the 190, 194 and 200 CE start dates.

YAN LIANG

Yan Liang was a fierce general in the employ of Yuan Shao, and fought against Guan Yu while the latter was serving under Cao Cao.

His Mighty Thrust ability sends him spurring on his horse, plowing into enemies with such a force that scores of men go flying. When this buff is activated, it causes terror in enemy units and increases the weight and damage of Yan Liang’s charge.

He is available at the 190, 194 and 200 CE start dates.

YUAN TAN

Yuan Tan was the eldest son of Yuan Shao. He battled against Kong Rong in 196 CE, and fought against Cao Cao in 200 CE. He had a rivalry with his younger brother Yuan Shang due to his brother being preferred in the succession.

The Familial Conflict ability allows Yuan Tan to rally the familial troops. When another of the Yuan Clan is on the field, a familial rivalry will push the other to greater feats. This passive buff inspires increased morale, melee attack rate, and melee damage for whichever Yuan family member has this ability.

He is now available at the 190 CE start date and is a faction leader in the 194 and 200 CE start dates as a vassal of Yuan Shao.

YUAN SHANG

Yuan Shang was the youngest son of Yuan Shao. Although younger and with less military accomplishments, he was still preferred by his parents due to his good looks. He succeeded his father after Yuan Shao died in 202 CE.

Yuan Shang also has the Familial Conflict ability described above.

He is available at the 190, 194 and 200 CE start dates.

ZHANG HE

Zhang He first made a name for himself fighting against rebels. He served under Yuan Shao for a brief period of time, but defected to Cao Cao after several disagreements with Yuan Shao.

Zhang He has a great understanding of geography, and can turn it to his advantage with the Geographic Mastery ability. This passive buff allows Zhang He to ignore terrain penalties and also increases his forest spotting range.

He is a character in Han Fu’s faction in the 182 and 190 CE start dates and then joins Yuan Shao’s faction in 194 and 200 CE start dates.

YU JIN

Yu Jin was a distinguished commander under Cao Cao’s command. He was given a leading role in the conflict against Yuan Shao, and blocked his enemies from approaching via the Yan Crossing.

Yu Jin’s Impenetrable Redoubt ability sees him become an immovable wall on the battlefield, inspiring his men to hold against much greater odds. This passive ability provides a defensive buff for all units on the field when in a defensive battle and outnumbered.

He is a character in the Han Empire in the 182 and 190 CE start dates and joins Cao Cao in the 194 and 200 CE start dates.

CAO REN

Cao Ren was a second cousin of Cao Cao, and served as a military general under him. He played a significant role in the formation of Wei, and was lauded for his role in the conquest of the north.

Cao Ren’s Heavenly Presence ability makes his very appearance on the battlefield a source of hope for his men, even when in the direst of situations. This active buff increases the morale of the units around Cao Ren, and also heals all nearby units and heroes by a small amount.

He is available in the 182, 190, 194, and 200 CE start dates in Cao Cao’s faction.

CAO PI

Cao Pi was the eldest son of Cao Cao and Lady Bian. After succeeding his father he established the kingdom of Wei, a proclamation which led to the formation of Shu Han and Wu.

He is a child from 187 CE through to the 200 CE start date, but comes of age in 203 CE, three years after the start of Fates Divided.

LADY ZHEN

Lady Zhen was initially the wife of Yuan Shao’s son, Yuan Xi. During the conflict against the Yuan clan she was captured by Cao Cao, and later married his son Cao Pi.

She comes of age in 199 CE and is only available in Fates Divided.

FA ZHENG

Fa Zheng was the advisor to Liu Zhang, and earned recognition for his strategic brilliance from Zhuge Liang. He was dissatisfied with Liu Zhang’s rule so betrayed his master and defected to Liu Bei.

Fa Zheng’s Mock ability sees him accost the enemy hero, wounding their pride and shaking them to the core. This ability, when activated, targets an enemy hero and reduces their melee attack rate as well as lowering morale and doing a small amount of AP damage.

He is available in the 194 and 200 CE start dates.

BALANCING
CAMPAIGN
Changed Age of Adulthood to 16 years old across all campaigns. This was previously the case in 182 CE, but other campaigns had this at 18 years old. This brings it closer to the historical precedent
Gate Passes now give a bonus to commerce income in adjacent owned regions
BATTLE
Reduced tier 3 sentinel melee evasion from 80 to 60 in custom battle
Reduced tier 2 sentinel melee evasion from 48 to 28 in custom battle. This also effects tier 3 vanguards and commanders
Increased tier 2 and 3 champions melee evasions in custom battle to match vanguards and commanders
Increased Guan Yu’s Green Dragon Blade AP from 1152 to 1324
Units

Changed Chen Peacekeeper cost from 800 to 850
Increased speed of units when exhausted
Doubled damage against routing units
Any heroes with morale lower than 50 have had their morale increased in line with the morale of other heroes. There is now less variety in morale between heroes and overall they should now be less likely to rout
Reduced charge damage of Nanman Tiger Warriors from 535 to 164
Reduced charge damage of Nanman Tiger Slingers from 325 to 132
Halved the splash damage of Tigers
Morale and Fatigue Changes

Minor changes that will help solidify the rebalance of cavalry and missile troops below, with the aim of shifting the battle meta away from cavalry and missile shock damage and onto a more combined arms, attritional combat system.

All units now have reduced morale when fatigued, with a maximum of -12 morale when exhausted
Decreased the morale impact of a general’s death after the initial shock has worn off
Vastly increased the chances that one unit routing is likely to make another allied unit rout
Decreased morale impact from recent losses while increasing the morale impact from total losses
A unit is now only affected by terror when wavering, instead of shaken. This will decrease the power of terror
Slight reduction to damage when fatigued, with a maximum of -30% base and AP damage when exhausted
Increased fatigue regeneration when “idle” or “ready”, which should see units regain stamina when out of combat much quicker
Decrease fatigue rate during combat, which should see units tire less quickly due to being in combat
Cavalry and Missile

Cavalry and missile troops have been reduced in lethality across the board, with the intention of putting them in line with the current killing power of infantry.

Cavalry charges do less damage initially but now run further into the unit than they did previously
AP damage and accuracy of all bows has been reduced
Reload speed reduced slightly for bows and crossbows
Reduced chance for units to friendly fire with missiles
Missile units should now be less likely to run forwards when their line of sight is blocked
Cataphracts have higher mass, and should now be able to smash through enemy lines
ABILITIES
Reduced the lethality of caltrops by 90%
Reduced morale impact from flaming maces from -15 to -10
Guan Yu’s Unstoppable ability now additionally grants 20% increase in AP damage, 10 melee defense and makes Guan Yu unbreakable
UI QUALITY OF LIFE IMPROVEMENTS
CAMPAIGN
When you reach the capacity for a unit type, they will now be shown in the recruitment list but as invalid with a tooltip explaining why
Fixed an issue where the notification suppression options wouldn’t function correctly
Fixed an issue where the notification toggle button would get out of sync with the current state
BUG FIXES
CAMPAIGN
Fixed a rare bug where characters would be adults but still have their child portrait
Meng Huo’s Silver Pit Ravine event now provides a 25% reduction to building costs in the region
Fixed the Assignments panel showing fewer slots available for each character on assignment in the province than there should be
Fixed Wei Yan’s armour so it is now unequippable (as this is his personal armour)
Fixed Nanman tier 5 Regional Palace giving bonus to peasantry income instead of bonus to all income
Fix for character used for Yang Hong’s name in Chinese; 洪 replaced with 弘
Fix for Liu Bei’s character trait that increases militia unit rank so that it applies when regionless as well
Fix for Yuan Shao’s duke rank having the wrong captain retinue bonus
Fix for some of Shi Xie’s tribute chests having the wrong effect scopes, causing the bonuses to not apply
Fix for Nanman players being spammed with untradeable common ancillaries. They were wrongly set so it was possible to gain them after battles – this is no longer true
Fix for some characters wrongly getting the Miasma buff:
Wei Yan
Li Ru
Xun You
Fix for Xu Shu not being able to equip the correct weapon types (Twin Axes, Twin Swords, Twin Maces)
Fixed discrepancies between front-end traits and in-game traits for Shi Xie
Career trait bonuses for Dong Zhuo, Lady Zhurong, and Meng Huo now match between front-end and campaign
Fixed issue where Xiahou Dun and Xiahou Yuan could spawn randomly before events
Fixed issue where the experience bonuses for Xun You were wrongly mixed up between Romance mode and Records mode
Fixed some effect bundles using incorrect icons for unit melee stats
Fixed issue where Lü Bu’s Momentum mechanic was not properly counting successful duels
Fixed issue for Lü Bu and Sun Ce where the sub-objectives for their mechanics were not being ticked off properly on the UI
Sun Ce’s Ambitions will now correctly track if the player gains regions in ways other than military occupation after a siege
Fixed issue where exiting the quick diplomacy screen would reset the campaign camera angle
Fixed issue where the title button was appearing for Yellow Turban characters
Fixed issue where famous characters could be born to the wrong parents
Weapons can no longer be “stolen” from characters post battle if they were not captured
Fixed issue where Liu Biao’s vassals were not giving Governance at campaign start in the 190 CE campaign
Fixed issue where Mercenary Contracts were not working correctly and players were not receiving rewards for them
Fixed an issue that could cause Gan Ning to spawn multiple times in the same campaign
Fixed issue where annex was not working correctly for Liu Hong when he has Dynasty tier 3
Fixed issue where only one title would be shown as unlocked per turn, even if multiple were actually unlocked
Fixed issue where peace with a faction was unavailable if the target faction joined a military alliance while having an alliance war
Fixed issue where rebels wouldn’t spawn for Nanman-owned regions outside of Nanman lands
Burning Mace weapon now has correct stats in Records mode
King Mulu will no longer lose his 25% Family Estates income bonus when saving/loading
BATTLE
Fixed issue where melee units were not properly attacking barricades
Fixed issue where multiple building levels were appearing on top of each other in siege battles
Increased infantry turn rate – this should fix issues where certain cavalry units couldn’t remount
Fixed issues with the reload rate not being correctly applied by the Miasma ability
Fix for the following characters missing weapons in battles:
Huang Gai
Guo Jia
Jia Xu
Pang Tong
Diao Chan
Xun Yu
Xun Yu and Diao Chan now can correctly use their abilities in battles
Varied the armour values of the unique Nanman characters (Meng Huo, Wutugu, Shamoke, Lady Zhurong)
Fixed the range of Imperial Palace Crossbowmen – this is now 250
Fixed issue where upkeep costs for White Horse Fellows and White Horse Raiders were the wrong way round
Fixed Wolf Pack unit special ability not correctly triggering when in range of another Wolf Pack unit
Xun You now correctly gives formations in custom battles
Fixed an issue where you could stack the Flaming Mace ability when using a hero and a unit against a single target, creating a -100 melee defence and -30 morale debuff.
Fixed a placeholder icon that appeared on Lady Zhurong’s Flying Daggers ability
Removed caltrops from Azure Dragons due to an issue where the unit would become stuck when trying to deploy them while in Mixed Spear formation
Fix for Rending Strike ability not working when character is equipped with a short weapon
Fixed issue where Wutugu had 100% melee evasion in custom battles
Defensive Siege AI behaviour slightly improved on some maps where there were mistakes in the logic markup

**LordofHats**

Ah, nice to see some of these names getting fleshed out into full legendary characters!

**A Town Called Malus**

Welp, now I'll need to start a new Zheng Jiang campaign to collect Zhang He from Han Fu.

Honestly, whoever came up with the idea of adding a collect 'em all aspect to Total War is a genius

**nels1031**

Anyone else have a habit of not executing Legendary Lords? Like if they age out, thats fine. But when an entire faction is nothing but the same old borderline faceless yellow/blue/purp/green/red dude, alot of narrative fun is gone for me.

I assume the next DLC will be the actual formation of the titular Three Kingdoms? Isn’t that next chronologically?

**LordofHats**

I only do it when playing Yellow Turbans, because of course I would kill them all XD

**Eumerin**

nels1031 wrote:
Anyone else have a habit of not executing Legendary Lords? Like if they age out, thats fine. But when an entire faction is nothing but the same old borderline faceless yellow/blue/purp/green/red dude, alot of narrative fun is gone for me.

I assume the next DLC will be the actual formation of the titular Three Kingdoms? Isn’t that next chronologically?

Probably not quite yet.

Chi Bi (Red Cliffs) is coming up. But since that was a huge naval battle (likely the biggest ever), it might get skipped. Instead, the next DLC might start immediately afterwards. After Chi Bi, you have Liu Bei moving west to acquire a territory of his own. There's some friction with Wu during this period, though the alliance between the two still holds. Cao Cao, on the other hand, has intentionally pulled his armies back, and abandons Jing Province (which he acquired when Liu Biao's heir swore fealty to him). Not only does Cao Cao need to rebuild his armies after the disaster at Chi Bi, but he correctly guesses that without immediate danger from Cao Cao's armies, his two enemies will start to squabble over Jing Province. Liu Bei supports the claim of Liu Biao's other son (who didn't join Cao Cao) to Jing Province, but that son dies childless not long afterwards. Liu Bei then claims the province for himself, but this angers the Sun family, who also want the province. An agreement is reached in which Liu Bei agrees to relinquish the province to the unhappy Wu after he establishes his own territory. He then heads west to Chengdu. He is initially invited into Chengdu by Liu Zhang, who is the ruler of the region. But Liu Bei ends up betraying his host and seizing it for his own. This marks the establishment of the third kingdom of Shu Han.

However, even after establishing his new kingdom, Liu Bei still continues to come up with excuses whenever Wu asks for Jing Province to be turned over to them. This will eventually cause Wu to accept a secret alliance with Wei, and launch a surprise attack against Guan Yu in Jing Province. Liu Bei's two sworn brothers will both be killed in the ensuing campaign. Guan Yu will die at the hands of the armies of Wei and Wu, while Zhang Fei will be killed by his own men.

Meanwhile, in Wei, Cao Cao has recruited a new advisor named Sima Yi...

**A Town Called Malus**

LordofHats wrote:
I only do it when playing Yellow Turbans, because of course I would kill them all XD

I do it as Zheng Jiang, for certain generals at least. Faction leaders? Execute them. Legendary generals? Maybe, if they are unlikely to ever join me and to add their weapon to my collection.

**nels1031**

New video up from Total War dev's.

Titled "Moving on from Total War: Three Kingdoms".

At work right now, so can't listen, but judging by the comments it seems no more DLC coming for 3K, but another game is coming in the 3K setting.
Seems kind of odd, given that we haven't even gotten to the "Three Kingdoms" part of the narrative in the game titled "Three Kingdoms".

Kind of lame to be honest (if thats truly the case) and makes the 8 Princes DLC seem even more like a waste of time\/resources. Would've definitely preferred a DLC that kept the story closer to the main game, rather than them skipping 100ish years.

**Eumerin**

Saw that. The devs have confirmed that the game is done. No more releases.

Thing is, there had been word that the next DLC was supposed to include the northern nomads. So I'm inclined to think that this was a surprise to the team. I'm guessing that the original plan was to lead with the Eight Princes DLC, and then roll back to "How did we get here?". Obviously, that plan got cut short. And probably the two most important foreign groups - the Koreans and the Turkic nomads - got left out.

They've already said that another game is planned, that won't be a sequel. That makes me wonder whether they found something in the game that made it impossible to implement some of the planned development. Or perhaps the bugs were getting too difficult to control, and a fresh start will help fix this. Either way, it's disappointing, and also means that they currently don't have a major (i.e. non-Saga) historical title for the public to look forward to

**Overread**

I think it might just be that whilst the game had phenomenal early sales, its not maintained the active playerbase that CA were hoping for in the medium and long term. Warhammer TW still totally dominates the active player market.

It might be that they feel something was wrong with the formula and approach to the game; so rather than try and make fundamental changes through an expansion (which might backfire); they are instead working on a new title instead.

Let's also not forget that CA don't tend to DLC milk their titles that often; in fact Warhammer TW is the only one that they've ever really done that for. Typically most of their games get one or two expansions; a few unit/faction packs and then they move onto a new game. So if anything Three Kingdoms is just being a normal CA TW game

**LordofHats**

I suspect Overread is right. Some of their DLC choices have been particularly odd, and while I have no complaints about them it is weird that they've mostly prioritized different start dates and even the War of Eight Princes over more substantial content. The Nanman also seemed to hit a bit lacklusterly, least of all because they leaned heavily into the more fantastic element of the setting.

**Overread**

I think in a sense they didn't quite know what way to take it. We also have to remember that whilst Three Kingdoms might only really have Dynasty Warrior games in the Western market (which are fantasy); the Chinese market has a lot lot more. I'd wager its as prolific there as WW2 is as a setting is in the west for games.

So I think in a way CA were experimenting with Three Kingdoms and doing a more fantasy expansion was perhaps part of that in seeing what might or might not work for them.

I'm not surprised they are giving it another shot with a new game; the initial sales are certainly very powerful and a sequel will likely do very well. A second go in a new market for them might give them the chance to maximise on the aspects that work and those that work for their competition in that market.

**LordofHats**

I highly suspect whatever game comes next is probably going to be more focused on what was profitable in TW3K, though I have no idea what that'll mean for the end product. 3K was the best total war in years imo, but it was definitely controversial in the audience (western audience at least) for how it embraced more fantastical game elements.

**Overread**

CA have an advantage in that the RTS market is basically dead at present from AAA and high grade independent developers producing games for it.

However this also means that the fantasy and historical markets are both coming to CA for a game and that means CA has two very powerful market groups who want different things. One group wants historical games the other wants historical battles with fantasy.

It means no matter what they deliver, some segment is going to be unhappy and loud about it. That said so long as they keep releasing quality games they'll still make up for it with pure sales power.

I'd love for others to step into the market and we are seeing a few. Microsoft keeps dabbling with remasters and there's a new Age of Empires on the horizon

**nels1031**

Just got home and watched it.

After finishing it, I’m definitely not as negative about it as I was. Serves me right for reading Youtube comments.

Would have enjoyed a few more DLCs for the base game, for sure, but if they feel its time to stick a fork in it, I’m cool with it. Just feels like they are leaving the story half finished, I suppose.

My only worry after watching the video is that the scope of the next 3K games will be reduced. Time will tell.

As an aside....

Yesterday, via Three Kingdoms facebook group, I learned there was a “build instantly” option for building. Yep, 600+ hours in and just discovered that.

**LordofHats**

I suspect they might try to cash in on Dynasty Warriors taking a nose dive and offer an alternative game that really goes ham on the more heroic elements of 3K. More focus on the main characters of the Romantic novel and the events of it, less on a 4x game. Not like a 3d action game mind you, but kind of like their Saga titles, which focus more on action and fantasy and less on strategy.

**Eumerin**

LordofHats wrote:
I suspect they might try to cash in on Dynasty Warriors taking a nose dive and offer an alternative game that really goes ham on the more heroic elements of 3K. More focus on the main characters of the Romantic novel and the events of it, less on a 4x game. Not like a 3d action game mind you, but kind of like their Saga titles, which focus more on action and fantasy and less on strategy.

The only Dynasty Warriors game that's done poorly of late is 9, the most recent one. 8 was well-received. And it's generally accepted that many of the flaws of 9 were largely a result of the new open world aspect of that game. Riding across all of Three Kingdoms Era China can be fun... once. While Koei-Tecmo has had a rocky reception for some of the company's other recent muso games (Warriors All-Stars comes to mind), the genre as a whole seems to be expanding right now, with even Persona getting a recent muso title (Persona 5 Strikers).

nels1031 wrote:Just feels like they are leaving the story half finished, I suppose.

I'm pretty sure that they are, and I'm pretty sure that this announcement was a surprise to the team working on the game. We knew the northern nomad tribes were being worked on, and that means that at least one more release was planned. Further, the excuse for the Eight Princes DLC, which was the first real DLC (ignoring the Yellow Turban early purchase reward DLC), was essentially "We're showing you where it all ends up." That strongly implies that there was an intent to show us how it got there. Instead, we got left in a "Who are all of these Sima people?" situation, as the founder of the dynasty - Sima Yi - hasn't even appeared in a start yet (he was hired by Cao Cao right around the same time as Red Cliffs).

Oh, well. It's not in my hands.

My only worry after watching the video is that the scope of the next 3K games will be reduced.

The impression that I got is that the Three Kingdoms team is now going to make up a new China-focused (or possibly Asian-focused; Shogun might move under their umbrella) team that will produce historical games that focus on China (or, again, possibly Asia in general). Presumably there will be a different team that will be responsible for creating new historical games set in the West. If true, hopefully this means that posts about Asian and Warhammer games will no longer be filled with whining comments demanding that the game in question be dropped immediately so that work can commence on Medieval 3 or Empire 2. If true, that would mean (for the time being) a fantasy team (Warhammer at the moment), an Asian historical team, a Western historical team, and a Saga team.

Overread wrote:We also have to remember that whilst Three Kingdoms might only really have Dynasty Warrior games in the Western market (which are fantasy); the Chinese market has a lot lot more. I'd wager its as prolific there as WW2 is as a setting is in the west for games.

Ironically, the only major publisher releasing Three Kingdoms games in the West is a Japanese company. On a more serious note, the company in question - Koei-Tecmo - actually has two Three Kingdoms franchises. Dynasty Warriors is by far the better known. But Koei-Tecmo also produces the very serious "Romance of the Three Kingdoms" strategy game. I haven't played it, but I have played a couple of iterations of their similar Sengoku-Jidai franchise strategy game, Nobunaga's Ambition.

**Eumerin**

The game is getting massively review bombed on Steam right now. Fans (while decrying the bombing) are joking about the game having lost the mandate of heaven.

^^;