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Made in be
Jealous that Horus is Warmaster






Brussels, Belgium

In the book "Lorgar, bearer of the word", when Kor Phaeron finds the young Lorgar, there is talk of the "Powers" who are the gods of the empyrean that the people of Colchis worship.

They are named as Khaane, Tezen, Slanat and Narag. So easily identifiable as the gods of chaos that we know and love.

Now here is the rub...

The timeline of the book puts those events around 850.M30, mere decades after the fall of the eldar and the birth of (take wresting announcer voice...) She who thirsts, the dark prince, the one, the only, Slaanesh...

How can he/she/it already be imbeded in the old religion of the people of Colchis?

Is it simply that "the ways of the warp are strange" and that Slaanesh, being born somewhere around 800.M30, was from that moment present in the past as well, or some timey-wimey thing like that?

Thoughts?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/01/27 19:23:43


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The ruins of the Palace of Thorns

The religion may be old, but maybe Slaanesh was a new addition, long prophecied, and now taking her/his rightful place in the pantheon.

Though guards may sleep and ships may lay at anchor, our foes know full well that big guns never tire.

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Fixture of Dakka




In the Warp Slaanesh is both new to the pantheon by comparison and always been part of it.

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Agile Revenant Titan






 Fifty wrote:
The religion may be old, but maybe Slaanesh was a new addition, long prophecied, and now taking her/his rightful place in the pantheon.


This could well be it. Slaanesh's birth might be new, but her gestation was tens of thousands of years in the making. Anyone with an ounce of warpcraft and knowledge of the Gods would be able to feel her burgeoning presence that close to her 'birth'.

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Grim Dark Angels Interrogator-Chaplain





Earth

It's odd but the gods are infinite entities, they exist in every reality that the warp touches, so they also exist in every reality, and since time doesn't flow the same way in the warp A isn't always followed by B, in fact B could be the thing that caused A to happen in the first place.

So once slaanesh came to the 40k warp, it's had always been there and could even be the very thing that created itself.
   
Made in gb
Insect-Infested Nurgle Chaos Lord






When Slaanesh came into existence it had always existed.

A guy on Reddit put it into the best analogy I've seen-

Imagine you've got a toy boat in a pool and it's sailing through the water and somewhere in the pool a pack of dye is dropped in. Even though you've not reached where the source of this thing is it if affecting everything as it spreads throughout the pool. Eventually you reach the source and see the ripples of how it has bled across the whole area.


Games Workshop Delenda Est.

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If I remember correctly gw retconned the Fall to be in M30 some years ago (around 2010-ish?), it used to be earlier. Slaanesh being mentioned could be a relic of the retconning.

Otoh it could simply be a mistake, like how the eldar in M30 (a short while after the fall) are depicted as being pretty much like they are now.
   
Made in be
Jealous that Horus is Warmaster






Brussels, Belgium

The general : "Once it came into existance, it was always there" idea seems to hold...

shortymcnostrill wrote:If I remember correctly gw retconned the Fall to be in M30 some years ago (around 2010-ish?), it used to be earlier. Slaanesh being mentioned could be a relic of the retconning.

Otoh it could simply be a mistake, like how the eldar in M30 (a short while after the fall) are depicted as being pretty much like they are now.


I've wondered about that too, when Eldrad talks to Fulgrim he seems to be like he his in 40k...


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 ChaosDad wrote:
The general : "Once it came into existance, it was always there" idea seems to hold...

shortymcnostrill wrote:If I remember correctly gw retconned the Fall to be in M30 some years ago (around 2010-ish?), it used to be earlier. Slaanesh being mentioned could be a relic of the retconning.

Otoh it could simply be a mistake, like how the eldar in M30 (a short while after the fall) are depicted as being pretty much like they are now.


I've wondered about that too, when Eldrad talks to Fulgrim he seems to be like he his in 40k...



It shouldn't as it's all a fantasy anyway, but this endlessly pisses me off. It's not difficult to put the least bit of research into the eldar background. Hell, just ask anyone who knows their stuff and they can tell you that the Fall happened in M30 so the eldar would be radically different (no Aspect Warriors, very unlikely they'd have resorted to using wraith constructs yet, whole society a refugee mess). They'd also know that the idea of Eldrad being alive during the Great Crusade traces back to one piece of fluff about an Eldar Ranger being tortured by an Imperial and trying to intimidate him by making him feel small and saying that his greatest leader (Eldrad) was around when the Imperial's god (Big E) was living, and thought he was puny and shortsighted. This directly after the entire rest of the codex hammers into you that you shouldn't trust a word that comes out of an eldar's mouth.

 Formosa wrote:
It's odd but the gods are infinite entities, they exist in every reality that the warp touches, so they also exist in every reality, and since time doesn't flow the same way in the warp A isn't always followed by B, in fact B could be the thing that caused A to happen in the first place.

So once slaanesh came to the 40k warp, it's had always been there and could even be the very thing that created itself.


I've always taken that slightly differently.

Slaanesh (and any Chaos God) is a product of emotions/souls swilling around the warp until there's enough of them to spontaneously create a consciousness. Like a colossal extra-dimensional Boltzmann Brain. So, the emotions that created Slaanesh have always existed, and since Slaanesh is these emotions Slaanesh has always existed. The emotions the created Slaanesh were creating Slaanesh before she was born, and since these emotions are Slaanesh then Slaanesh was creating herself before she was born. Still, could just be applying causal laws to an entity that exists in a non-causal dimension (although, considering she is fed by a causal dimension she is beholden to its laws to some extent as far as sustenance goes).

The thing about them existing in every reality (or more likely, a number of other realities where mortals feel analogous emotions) I do like. It's less that the Eldar created Slaanesh. It's more that the eldar attracted Slaanesh's attention. The eldar brought Slaanesh to this dimension as a potential feeding ground. Extra depth of Lovecraft which is always good

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Because GW writers forget that Slaanesh was a late addition. In the game 40k is based off, WHFB, there were more than 4 gods and they always existed.
   
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"Time is fluid here"

I'm in agreement with Ynneadwraith, something(s) like Slaanesh have always existed, its just the extremes of the pre-fall Eldar along with the whole race being psykers to one degree or other that focussed Slaanesh into one coherent power who most likely 'ate' all the other warp denizens within her remit

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Earth

 Ynneadwraith wrote:
 ChaosDad wrote:
The general : "Once it came into existance, it was always there" idea seems to hold...

shortymcnostrill wrote:If I remember correctly gw retconned the Fall to be in M30 some years ago (around 2010-ish?), it used to be earlier. Slaanesh being mentioned could be a relic of the retconning.

Otoh it could simply be a mistake, like how the eldar in M30 (a short while after the fall) are depicted as being pretty much like they are now.


I've wondered about that too, when Eldrad talks to Fulgrim he seems to be like he his in 40k...



It shouldn't as it's all a fantasy anyway, but this endlessly pisses me off. It's not difficult to put the least bit of research into the eldar background. Hell, just ask anyone who knows their stuff and they can tell you that the Fall happened in M30 so the eldar would be radically different (no Aspect Warriors, very unlikely they'd have resorted to using wraith constructs yet, whole society a refugee mess). They'd also know that the idea of Eldrad being alive during the Great Crusade traces back to one piece of fluff about an Eldar Ranger being tortured by an Imperial and trying to intimidate him by making him feel small and saying that his greatest leader (Eldrad) was around when the Imperial's god (Big E) was living, and thought he was puny and shortsighted. This directly after the entire rest of the codex hammers into you that you shouldn't trust a word that comes out of an eldar's mouth.

 Formosa wrote:
It's odd but the gods are infinite entities, they exist in every reality that the warp touches, so they also exist in every reality, and since time doesn't flow the same way in the warp A isn't always followed by B, in fact B could be the thing that caused A to happen in the first place.

So once slaanesh came to the 40k warp, it's had always been there and could even be the very thing that created itself.


I've always taken that slightly differently.

Slaanesh (and any Chaos God) is a product of emotions/souls swilling around the warp until there's enough of them to spontaneously create a consciousness. Like a colossal extra-dimensional Boltzmann Brain. So, the emotions that created Slaanesh have always existed, and since Slaanesh is these emotions Slaanesh has always existed. The emotions the created Slaanesh were creating Slaanesh before she was born, and since these emotions are Slaanesh then Slaanesh was creating herself before she was born. Still, could just be applying causal laws to an entity that exists in a non-causal dimension (although, considering she is fed by a causal dimension she is beholden to its laws to some extent as far as sustenance goes).

The thing about them existing in every reality (or more likely, a number of other realities where mortals feel analogous emotions) I do like. It's less that the Eldar created Slaanesh. It's more that the eldar attracted Slaanesh's attention. The eldar brought Slaanesh to this dimension as a potential feeding ground. Extra depth of Lovecraft which is always good



Yep that's pretty much how I see it too and rather oddly is completely supported by the fluff, and yet I have rarely seen it mentioned
   
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 Ynneadwraith wrote:
 ChaosDad wrote:
The general : "Once it came into existance, it was always there" idea seems to hold...

shortymcnostrill wrote:If I remember correctly gw retconned the Fall to be in M30 some years ago (around 2010-ish?), it used to be earlier. Slaanesh being mentioned could be a relic of the retconning.

Otoh it could simply be a mistake, like how the eldar in M30 (a short while after the fall) are depicted as being pretty much like they are now.


I've wondered about that too, when Eldrad talks to Fulgrim he seems to be like he his in 40k...



It shouldn't as it's all a fantasy anyway, but this endlessly pisses me off. It's not difficult to put the least bit of research into the eldar background. Hell, just ask anyone who knows their stuff and they can tell you that the Fall happened in M30 so the eldar would be radically different (no Aspect Warriors, very unlikely they'd have resorted to using wraith constructs yet, whole society a refugee mess). They'd also know that the idea of Eldrad being alive during the Great Crusade traces back to one piece of fluff about an Eldar Ranger being tortured by an Imperial and trying to intimidate him by making him feel small and saying that his greatest leader (Eldrad) was around when the Imperial's god (Big E) was living, and thought he was puny and shortsighted. This directly after the entire rest of the codex hammers into you that you shouldn't trust a word that comes out of an eldar's mouth.


This part about Eldrad actually fits in with the lore. Seeing how all Eldars are psykers and they invented the spirit stone before the fall (otherwise, why would you find the stuff in the crone worlds swallowed by the eye?) I wouldn't be surprised if the phoenix system was put into use long before the fall. As a matter of fact we have some in lore proof of the phoenix lords dating back to the war in heaven. With the phoenix system I mean the way of storing your soul in wargear. If Eldrad is actually a form of exharch who's died several times and had new eldars inhabit his armour/stone/gear then it makes perfect sense for him to act the way he does in Fulgrim. Also the aspect warrior shrines are about as old as the phoenix lords correct? So they should have been around during the decadent eldar empire. I'd assume they worked as a social counter to the common eldar decadence. The idea that some saw the impending doom of the Eldar and took meassures to prevent it before the fall has been around since codex craftworld in 3.5 (or possibly older). To me the eldar being similar to to 40k in 30k does make quite a bit of sense. I'm not sure about the wraith constructs, they could have been used for labour pre fall. I could of course be wrong about all of this, it's just how I always interpreted it.

As for the thread topic it could also be that slaanesh was simply added into the belief at some point after it's start, close to slaanesh's birth. if the religion had been around for 5000years and the slaanesh worshipp had been for... say 1000years then it'd still be considered ancient practices by human standards. Not sure how much into detail they go about the planets past or how it handled the DaoT or the AoS. One notewordy thing is that stuff about Ynnead had been around for quite a long time before all the recent stuff. Eldar farseers has been knowing of Ynnead for at least centuries before the current times. Unless I'm mistaken ynnead isn't born yet correct? And even so there's heralds and a whole faction dedicated to her. Would make sense for Slaanesh to have had similar stuff about he/she/it before the birth. I kind of don't buy the "always has been" argument because we know there was a time when the empyrian was calm. Of course time doesn't really exist in the warp but that doesn't mean not having exsited and always exsiting are the same thing.

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The Aspect Warriors and the entire Path system are explicitly post-Fall per the Eldar Phoenix Lord novels. Asurmen was the first to walk the Path of the Warrior, and quite possibly the first Path, with all other Paths being an adaptation of that idea of focusing on one part of life in order to avoid the temptation that an unfettered Eldar mind would be subject to.

The spirit stones are also a post-Fall thing according to the Asurmen novel, being a condensation of the psychic energy and possibly trapped souls of the pre-Fall Eldar.

Use of the Infinity Circuits as a means for soul storage is also post-Fall, and per the Iyanden supplement, was pioneered by Iyanden and then shared with the other Craftworlds.
   
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Iracundus wrote:
The Aspect Warriors and the entire Path system are explicitly post-Fall per the Eldar Phoenix Lord novels. Asurmen was the first to walk the Path of the Warrior, and quite possibly the first Path, with all other Paths being an adaptation of that idea of focusing on one part of life in order to avoid the temptation that an unfettered Eldar mind would be subject to.

The spirit stones are also a post-Fall thing according to the Asurmen novel, being a condensation of the psychic energy and possibly trapped souls of the pre-Fall Eldar.

Use of the Infinity Circuits as a means for soul storage is also post-Fall, and per the Iyanden supplement, was pioneered by Iyanden and then shared with the other Craftworlds.


my bad then.

Edit: nevermind, I must have gotten stuff mixed up. Is it possible this is a retcon? I could have sworn I read somewhere that Asurmen had a duel with Khaine (which Asurmen lost) and that the only post fall phoenix lord was Karandras.

This message was edited 6 times. Last update was at 2018/01/30 12:40:21


His pattern of returning alive after being declared dead occurred often enough during Cain's career that the Munitorum made a special ruling that Ciaphas Cain is to never be considered dead, despite evidence to the contrary. 
   
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The Phoenix Lords are immediately post Fall and I presume so are their early pupils.

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Lake County, Illinois

 Nerak wrote:
Iracundus wrote:
The Aspect Warriors and the entire Path system are explicitly post-Fall per the Eldar Phoenix Lord novels. Asurmen was the first to walk the Path of the Warrior, and quite possibly the first Path, with all other Paths being an adaptation of that idea of focusing on one part of life in order to avoid the temptation that an unfettered Eldar mind would be subject to.

The spirit stones are also a post-Fall thing according to the Asurmen novel, being a condensation of the psychic energy and possibly trapped souls of the pre-Fall Eldar.

Use of the Infinity Circuits as a means for soul storage is also post-Fall, and per the Iyanden supplement, was pioneered by Iyanden and then shared with the other Craftworlds.


my bad then.

Edit: nevermind, I must have gotten stuff mixed up. Is it possible this is a retcon? I could have sworn I read somewhere that Asurmen had a duel with Khaine (which Asurmen lost) and that the only post fall phoenix lord was Karandras.


You're getting him mixed up with the Eldar god Asuryan.
   
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"Time" is a concept of the material realm; the Warp all too frequently doesn't care.

(Spoilers for the Heresy novels follow, but they really shouldn't surprise anyone.)

The Primarchs' scattering by the Chaos Gods (approximately 800.M30), Argel Tal's venture into the Eye of Terror (approximately 940.M30), and Horus' healing on Davin (approximately 1.M31) take place over the span of two centuries, but in the Warp they all occurred simultaneously. Horus and Argel Tal weren't shown a vision of the past, they were brought in spirit to the lab in which the Primarchs were grown; they and the Emperor are all at least vaguely aware of each other, and when Argel Tal smashes the Gellar field that was the actual event that let Chaos get into the lab and scatter the Primarchs to the stars in the first place.

The Fall of the Eldar and Slaanesh's 'creation' is a thing that existed at a point in time in the material world, but the concept of Slaanesh isn't bound to a linear point in material time and the ancient priests of Colchis could easily have been aware of it as a power before its 'birth'.

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All this talk of nonlinear time and cosmic retcons is cool and all, but where are you getting this stuff about Slaanesh being born in year 800 M30?

I had always presumed Slaanesh' birth resulted in the massive increase of warp storm activity that effectively shattered the DaoT humanity into fragments and caused the Age of Strife, but apparently her actual birth coincides with the end of that period (somewhere before, during, or just at the end of the very last biggest baddest storm?) and the storms leading up to it were the early tremors.

The latest date I've heard for the birth of Slaanesh was a nebulous 'Early M30' which would give you at least a few centuries of wiggle room for the dogma to adapt and, beyond that, preceding the Fall the Eldar still had visions of Slaanesh well before her 'birth'.

   
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 Captain Joystick wrote:
All this talk of nonlinear time and cosmic retcons is cool and all, but where are you getting this stuff about Slaanesh being born in year 800 M30?

I had always presumed Slaanesh' birth resulted in the massive increase of warp storm activity that effectively shattered the DaoT humanity into fragments and caused the Age of Strife, but apparently her actual birth coincides with the end of that period (somewhere before, during, or just at the end of the very last biggest baddest storm?) and the storms leading up to it were the early tremors.

The latest date I've heard for the birth of Slaanesh was a nebulous 'Early M30' which would give you at least a few centuries of wiggle room for the dogma to adapt and, beyond that, preceding the Fall the Eldar still had visions of Slaanesh well before her 'birth'.


I'm pegging the Primarchs' dispersal across the galaxy as 800.M30. Not the 'birth' of Slaanesh. Canon is vague about putting that in the very distant past, near the end of the Age of Strife, or near the beginning of the Age of Strife.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/01/31 19:26:51


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Slaanesh's birth caused and ended the Age of Strife. The increased Warp Storms is like the pregnancy and the actual birth ended the Storms.

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 AnomanderRake wrote:
 Captain Joystick wrote:
All this talk of nonlinear time and cosmic retcons is cool and all, but where are you getting this stuff about Slaanesh being born in year 800 M30?

I had always presumed Slaanesh' birth resulted in the massive increase of warp storm activity that effectively shattered the DaoT humanity into fragments and caused the Age of Strife, but apparently her actual birth coincides with the end of that period (somewhere before, during, or just at the end of the very last biggest baddest storm?) and the storms leading up to it were the early tremors.

The latest date I've heard for the birth of Slaanesh was a nebulous 'Early M30' which would give you at least a few centuries of wiggle room for the dogma to adapt and, beyond that, preceding the Fall the Eldar still had visions of Slaanesh well before her 'birth'.


I'm pegging the Primarchs' dispersal across the galaxy as 800.M30. Not the 'birth' of Slaanesh. Canon is vague about putting that in the very distant past, near the end of the Age of Strife, or near the beginning of the Age of Strife.


Sorry, what I wrote was meant to be I relation to the OP's reckoning that Slaanesh was born in year 800, scant decades before the time in the book where they talk about him as part of their pantheon. I'm just saying that 'early M30' is at least 300 years off from that, which is plenty of time for Slaanesh to assert himself in the Colchis dogma.

   
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 Captain Joystick wrote:


Sorry, what I wrote was meant to be I relation to the OP's reckoning that Slaanesh was born in year 800, scant decades before the time in the book where they talk about him as part of their pantheon. I'm just saying that 'early M30' is at least 300 years off from that, which is plenty of time for Slaanesh to assert himself in the Colchis dogma.


Hmm... my understanding of the timeline goes a bit like this:

Warpsorms rage on, Emperor unites terra in preparation of his foreseen crusade to get humanity back together.
Emperor creates thunder warriors, than custodes, then primarchs, which get scattered around the galaxy.
Big E creates the legions, conquers Mars, and is in the starting blocks for galactic conquest when the eldar, in an acpocalyptic last revel, destroy themselves and create Slaanesh, clearing the warp storms and letting the legions conquer the galaxy...

But now, reading the responses to this thread, I'm a bit fuzzier on the sequence of events than I was...

Am I completely wrong?

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 Albino Squirrel wrote:
You're getting him mixed up with the Eldar god Asuryan.

You know what? Next time I'll just do a quick online search before I make a fool out of myself. Thanks for clearing it up anyway. My bad.

Edit:
pm713 wrote:
Slaanesh's birth caused and ended the Age of Strife. The increased Warp Storms is like the pregnancy and the actual birth ended the Storms.

The age of strife lasted for a few thousand years. Or maybe you ment it in a "the timeline is contradictory" sense?

Edit 2: @ChaosDad After my earlier failure I'm not entirely sure on the current timeline anymore. I have always found the warp storms surrounding Terra to be an odd thing. If travel was impossible then how did all the recruits that would become the Space Marines get there? How did all the materials get there? How did the constructions of the fleets get done? But also we know humanity spread through the galaxy long before the warp storms where in place, since the great crusade didn't so much settle as unite human colonies. They must not have been there for a very long time, or humanity could travel in some way that let them pass the warp storms. Maybe with warp gates (old 3ed fluff, big portals made during the DaoT). Anyone else find it weird that humanity settled the galaxy while the Eldar had their empire? We don't know much about it tbh. Did ancient 10k-20k era humans kick the ancient Eldars asses in war or was the Eldar empire just very small?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/02/01 20:03:28


His pattern of returning alive after being declared dead occurred often enough during Cain's career that the Munitorum made a special ruling that Ciaphas Cain is to never be considered dead, despite evidence to the contrary. 
   
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Preacher of the Emperor






Mars sent expeditions out during the Age of Strife during the many lulls in the warp storms. Some were annihilated but others founded forgeworlds throughout the galaxy. The remaining worlds (the vast majority of those reclaimed by the Great Crusade) we're colonized during the DAoT, or by survivors of colonies founded during the DAoT.

Just because the Eldar were the galactic power at that time does not mean they were as aggressive in enforcing that as they or the Imperium are by 40k, either. All indications seem to be that DAoT humans spread out far and wide but didn't really keep unified politically, while the Eldar had a massive unified empire but plenty of space for Craftworlds to eventually run away to.

As for the Legions I was under the impression their founding numbers were all from Terra.

   
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As far as I can recall, all the original space marines troops were from Terra.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/02/02 14:00:55


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It is indeed well established in the Horus Heresy books and novels that the original legions were all of Terran stock. The conflict between the 'old terrans' and the new legionnaires who come from the primarchs' homeworlds is at the heart of the stories of the Death Guard and Garro and of the Dark Angels, amongst others...

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 Nerak wrote:
 Albino Squirrel wrote:
You're getting him mixed up with the Eldar god Asuryan.

You know what? Next time I'll just do a quick online search before I make a fool out of myself. Thanks for clearing it up anyway. My bad.

Edit:
pm713 wrote:
Slaanesh's birth caused and ended the Age of Strife. The increased Warp Storms is like the pregnancy and the actual birth ended the Storms.

The age of strife lasted for a few thousand years. Or maybe you ment it in a "the timeline is contradictory" sense?

Edit 2: @ChaosDad After my earlier failure I'm not entirely sure on the current timeline anymore. I have always found the warp storms surrounding Terra to be an odd thing. If travel was impossible then how did all the recruits that would become the Space Marines get there? How did all the materials get there? How did the constructions of the fleets get done? But also we know humanity spread through the galaxy long before the warp storms where in place, since the great crusade didn't so much settle as unite human colonies. They must not have been there for a very long time, or humanity could travel in some way that let them pass the warp storms. Maybe with warp gates (old 3ed fluff, big portals made during the DaoT). Anyone else find it weird that humanity settled the galaxy while the Eldar had their empire? We don't know much about it tbh. Did ancient 10k-20k era humans kick the ancient Eldars asses in war or was the Eldar empire just very small?

No I mean Slaanesh beginning to form in the Warp caused all the Warp Storms that caused the Age of Strife and when it became conscious and aware that was the event that killed most of the Eldar and cleared up the Warp Storms.

The original Marines came from people on Terra as did the ships that existed before unifying with Mars.

Humanity settled the Galaxy because the Eldar didn't care because they didn't think Humanity was important as they weren't a threat.

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pm713 wrote:

No I mean Slaanesh beginning to form in the Warp caused all the Warp Storms that caused the Age of Strife and when it became conscious and aware that was the event that killed most of the Eldar and cleared up the Warp Storms.

The original Marines came from people on Terra as did the ships that existed before unifying with Mars.

Humanity settled the Galaxy because the Eldar didn't care because they didn't think Humanity was important as they weren't a threat.

Sources are very conflicting regarding the age of strife. The dates are contradictory wherever you look, but generally speaking what lead to the age of strife was two things. First was the rebellion of the men of iron (which lead to the AI ban in the Imperium). Second was the emerging psykers in the Imperium. According to the 3ed rulebook (page 378) the timeline goes like this:
0-20.000: golden age of mankind. Two races, the "golden race" and the "stone race" of man go into Space and settle it. The "golden race" of man goes extinct.
20.000-25.000: Dark age of technology. The "stone race" of man brings forth the "Iron race" of man. Little to nothing is known of this time except increased expansion of humanity and a war between the "Iron race" and the "Stone race".
25.000-30.000: Age of strife. The "stone race" empire crumbles and mankind lives in a shadow of its former glory. Without the "Iron men" the race of man crumbles. Anarchy reigns, aliens rampage and deamons emerge.
30.000-40.000: The age of the Imperium. The Emperor stabalizes mankind, bans artificial intelligence, restricts psykers, raises armies and creates a new warrior race. The Imperium of man is formed.

As I said sources are very contradictory here. Some say that the golden age of mankind only lasted for 5000years ish and the dark age of Imperium was around for 20.000years. No matter how you change around it though there's some constants. The Eldar empire was around at the time, as was the orks. Mankind fought a war with the men of iron. The ammount of psykers in mankind increased exponentially during the age of strife. The birth of Slaanesh happened close to the great crusade and the warpstorms around Terra was blocking it right before the great crusade.

Now why I found it weird is because to build a fleet cappable of transporting 20 legions of Space marines, as well as the gear and genetic materials for every legion (even if recruits wheren't a problem) you'd probably need way more reasources then is available in the Sol system. I guess the ships could already have been there or the original legions where actually considerably smaller before the Primarch reunion happened. They probably where smaller and then grew as contact was made and worlds re-conquored.

I still don't quite buy that the Eldar empire just sat back and went "eh, whatever" when humanity settled the entire galaxy. There must have been orks practically everywhere as well as other minor alien empires if so. We know titans, battleships and robots herald from this time. Humanity probably had a very diffrent form of warfare foccused on robots fighting for them at the time. All Eldars are psykers so a few of them should have noted that humanity might become something scary. Also the Emperor was around at the time, though we don't at all know what he did. He might have secured some kind of diplomatic deal with the Eldar empire.

Anyway, on topic: Since the birth of Slaanesh happened in M30 and there seems to be merit to the puddle ripple theory it's likely that Slaanesh conception had something to do with the age of strife. Maybe the increased psykers among mankind where a direct result of Slaanesh birth comming closer. Timewise it does fit that Colchis worshipped Slaanesh in their pantheon long before the great crusade.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2018/02/02 13:12:00


His pattern of returning alive after being declared dead occurred often enough during Cain's career that the Munitorum made a special ruling that Ciaphas Cain is to never be considered dead, despite evidence to the contrary. 
   
 
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