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2023/01/07 19:22:04
Subject: Dungeons And Dakkas! The Dakka DnD Thread!
Lance845 wrote: But further, depending on if big daddy Hasbro wants to take Pazio to court, even Pathfinder could need to make a 3rd edition abandoning it's dnd trappings.
This is extremely unlikely. Paizo designers have said in interviews that the OGL isn't necessary for Pathfinder, especially 2E, and that they mainly use it to put their *own* content out as usable under the OGL. They stripped out pretty much all of WotC's copyrightable stuff when Golarion was first released as a setting closing on two decades ago, and could cut out the OGL at any time they want.
2023/01/08 23:55:05
Subject: Dungeons And Dakkas! The Dakka DnD Thread!
Now some of this is just flat out unenforceable. You cannot stop people making fan art of the most generic fantasy things ever. But you COULD stop something like DnD is for Nerds or Critical Roll from producing TV series, tee shirts and merch, and other such stuff. In order for them to maintain their business while avoiding a court case they may need to find another game.
I found quite notable in the first series of Critical Role on prime, that they studiously avoided using D&D terms for races and suchlike. I expect Amazon Prime lawyering is more advanced than Hasbro.
Now some of this is just flat out unenforceable. You cannot stop people making fan art of the most generic fantasy things ever. But you COULD stop something like DnD is for Nerds or Critical Roll from producing TV series, tee shirts and merch, and other such stuff. In order for them to maintain their business while avoiding a court case they may need to find another game.
I found quite notable in the first series of Critical Role on prime, that they studiously avoided using D&D terms for races and suchlike. I expect Amazon Prime lawyering is more advanced than Hasbro.
I am not so sure how that would work. Vox Machina is now a book produced by Wizards.
To go so far as to have official books probably allows them to keep on keeping on with some other not OGL agreement. But it also probably means Wizards is already taking a slice of their profits.
These are my opinions. This is how I feel. Others may feel differently. This needs to be stated for some reason.
2023/01/10 16:05:20
Subject: Dungeons And Dakkas! The Dakka DnD Thread!
Now some of this is just flat out unenforceable. You cannot stop people making fan art of the most generic fantasy things ever. But you COULD stop something like DnD is for Nerds or Critical Roll from producing TV series, tee shirts and merch, and other such stuff. In order for them to maintain their business while avoiding a court case they may need to find another game.
I found quite notable in the first series of Critical Role on prime, that they studiously avoided using D&D terms for races and suchlike. I expect Amazon Prime lawyering is more advanced than Hasbro.
I watched some interesting videos over the past couple of days that noted other differences like not referring to gods by their dnd names but rather general titles instead. They were positing that if this current season (?) of the series ends with the gods being swapped or dying only to be replaced with new ones then that would be the last real vestiges of OGL in the shows. I don't actually watch them so can't confirm nor deny it though.
2023/01/10 16:35:56
Subject: Dungeons And Dakkas! The Dakka DnD Thread!
I hope they don't mess with it too much unlike what they did with Halo. With how wide open D&D is with the various settings, I hope they find that freedom to be enough to tell whatever story they want.
2023/01/11 02:49:18
Subject: Dungeons And Dakkas! The Dakka DnD Thread!
New systems are all well and good, but his whole OGL mess is still a kick in the teeth for 5e fans. Both Kobold Press and MCDM have routinely been putting out better 5e content than WOTC for a long time, and it'll be a shame to see that dry up for those of us planning to stick with 5e going forward. I admit I have half a horse in this race, as later this year I was planning to begin putting out content under the OGL, but even simply as a player and DM, I had hoped that while OneDnD inevitably took over the mainstream (as the newest edition of the biggest game always will) these fantastic third party publishers would keep the lights on for 5e.
I was already deeply unenthused by many of the proposed changes in the OneDnD playtest, but the OGL changes are the final nail in the coffin for me. I think it makes it pretty clear that the intent behind the new edition isn't to update or improve the game as it stands, but to tighten WOTC/Hasbro's grip on the brand and set the stage for a more GW-esque ecosystem where customers aren't ever encouraged to look beyond their own products or be creative in their own right. This is of course anethema to DnD and to the TTRPG hobby as a whole, but I imagine Hasbro really won't give a damn until it hits them in the wallet, which I kind of doubt it will; for all the talk online about this, and things like the #OpenDnD open letter picking up tens of thousands of signees, the vast majority of players aren't using much if any third party or indie stuff, even fewer have aspirations of creating their own work and publishing it, so this change won't really affect them.
I had hoped that some of the larger third party publishers would have come together on a joint project with its own open license, as I figured that was the best chance of 'doing a Pathfinder' and coming out with an actual comeptitor to OneDnD, based as closely on the D20 System as possible so their all their existing products would remain compatible. Instead, while I imagine all these new games will be well-designed, supported and open in their own right, I don't think any one publisher is going to be in a position to take on WOTC's market share with any real chance of sucess. Getting players to jump to a new game is always tricky, and if anything I think these projects will ultimately do little more than fracture chunks of the 5e fanbase rather than see widespread adoption. All power to them to design what they like, of course, and I'll be keeping a very close eye on MCDM's game in particular as I find Matt Colville's design work to very much align with the kind of things I want in a game/product, this does seem to be the end of the line for large-scale 5e support.
In other words, WOTC has basically killed that entire aspect of the industry overnight, for what will amounts to a tiny increase in their profits in exchange for a huge loss of support and goodwill (great timing two months before their flagship movie too ( ) and that's bloody awful. The fact they can do it is one thing, the fact they chose to is shortsighted, greedy and a massive middle finger to many of their most dedicated and enthusiastic players, supporters and fans. Feth WOTC, feth Hasbro and feth the OGL1.1.
If anyone else feels as strongly about this as I do, here is the aforementioned open letter to WOTC. It won't make any difference, I imagine, but it at least lets them know how many people are aghast at this debacle. https://www.opendnd.games/
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2023/01/11 12:19:25
2023/01/11 15:26:46
Subject: Dungeons And Dakkas! The Dakka DnD Thread!
Matt Colville of Critical Role now doing the same.
Random nitpick- Colville isn't part of Critical Role. He just talked about it a bunch.
But announcing just starting design work based on 'cinematic AND tactical' and 'weird dice' is a bad start. And weird dice is an annoying thing to tie to a theoretically open system, as you're inherently tying something you can limit the production of to an open system.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2023/01/11 15:30:13
Efficiency is the highest virtue.
2023/01/11 20:11:47
Subject: Re:Dungeons And Dakkas! The Dakka DnD Thread!
Paradigm wrote: New systems are all well and good, but his whole OGL mess is still a kick in the teeth for 5e fans. Both Kobold Press and MCDM have routinely been putting out better 5e content than WOTC for a long time, and it'll be a shame to see that dry up for those of us planning to stick with 5e going forward. I admit I have half a horse in this race, as later this year I was planning to begin putting out content under the OGL, but even simply as a player and DM, I had hoped that while OneDnD inevitably took over the mainstream (as the newest edition of the biggest game always will) these fantastic third party publishers would keep the lights on for 5e.
I was already deeply unenthused by many of the proposed changes in the OneDnD playtest, but the OGL changes are the final nail in the coffin for me. I think it makes it pretty clear that the intent behind the new edition isn't to update or improve the game as it stands, but to tighten WOTC/Hasbro's grip on the brand and set the stage for a more GW-esque ecosystem where customers aren't ever encouraged to look beyond their own products or be creative in their own right. This is of course anethema to DnD and to the TTRPG hobby as a whole, but I imagine Hasbro really won't give a damn until it hits them in the wallet, which I kind of doubt it will; for all the talk online about this, and things like the #OpenDnD open letter picking up tens of thousands of signees, the vast majority of players aren't using much if any third party or indie stuff, even fewer have aspirations of creating their own work and publishing it, so this change won't really affect them.
I had hoped that some of the larger third party publishers would have come together on a joint project with its own open license, as I figured that was the best chance of 'doing a Pathfinder' and coming out with an actual comeptitor to OneDnD, based as closely on the D20 System as possible so their all their existing products would remain compatible. Instead, while I imagine all these new games will be well-designed, supported and open in their own right, I don't think any one publisher is going to be in a position to take on WOTC's market share with any real chance of sucess. Getting players to jump to a new game is always tricky, and if anything I think these projects will ultimately do little more than fracture chunks of the 5e fanbase rather than see widespread adoption. All power to them to design what they like, of course, and I'll be keeping a very close eye on MCDM's game in particular as I find Matt Colville's design work to very much align with the kind of things I want in a game/product, this does seem to be the end of the line for large-scale 5e support.
In other words, WOTC has basically killed that entire aspect of the industry overnight, for what will amounts to a tiny increase in their profits in exchange for a huge loss of support and goodwill (great timing two months before their flagship movie too ( ) and that's bloody awful. The fact they can do it is one thing, the fact they chose to is shortsighted, greedy and a massive middle finger to many of their most dedicated and enthusiastic players, supporters and fans. Feth WOTC, feth Hasbro and feth the OGL1.1.
If anyone else feels as strongly about this as I do, here is the aforementioned open letter to WOTC. It won't make any difference, I imagine, but it at least lets them know how many people are aghast at this debacle.
https://www.opendnd.games/
While individuals feel this as a kick in the teeth now, it's still better for the industry as a whole. You and all the people who feel hurt will win out when the dust settles and we all have more better variety to pick from.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2023/01/11 20:12:07
These are my opinions. This is how I feel. Others may feel differently. This needs to be stated for some reason.
2023/01/11 22:45:36
Subject: Dungeons And Dakkas! The Dakka DnD Thread!
More variety is great, can't argue with that. We're going to see some really innovative design, cool new settings, new opportunities in game development and new voices in the industry, and that is all fantastic! In ten years time we could be looking at a thriving industry with dozens of new and exciting games... which will all have a playerbase a tenth of the size of any given edition of DnD, sadly. Short of something like Critical Role adopting and promoting a new system, or publishing their own, none of these companies are going to move the needle on DnD's dominance of the space no matter how good they are.
Lance, you and I have gone back and forth plenty of times here about the relative merits (or lack thereof) of 5e or D20 in general as a system, so I won't repeat all that, but the point I was making is that the rug is being pulled out from under the people who are perfectly happy with things they way they are. Those of us who play and enjoy 5e on its own merits are suddenly going to lose out on any kind of ongoing support or content if this goes as badly as it seems like it will, with no recourse for any publishers to pick up where WOTC leaves off (as we had been assuming they would under the OGL 1.0).
For better or worse, DnD 5e is by a great margin the most played TTRPG out there right now. It has the most exposure, the most accessible rules info (between the SRD/Basic Rules being free, DnDBeyond offering shareable content and tools, and the wealth of articles, podcasts and video content on every facet of playing and running the game) and if someone wants to get into the hobby, 9 times out of 10 it's what they're going to end up playing unless they already know a GM who is a big fan of another system and brings them into that game. That community is undoubtedly going to lose a lot of players when OneDnD rolls around, just as any edition before it, but the wealth of third party content gave me some hope that we'd see ongoing support and engagement even after WOTC pulls everything 5e related. Maybe a fool's hope, but it was something I genuinely thought we'd see before this OGL 1.1 fiasco.
Thing is, 5e may be far from a perfect system, but it's a very useful one, and that usefulness alone means it's hard for me to pivot wholesale into any of these alternative systems coming along, no matter how smart or original they might be. I run games for multiple groups multiple times a week, and while I have some players that are experienced and invested enough that they'd happily dip their toes into another game, I also have plenty for whom learning 5e has taken a lot of their limited time and effort, and for me as GM to suggest that they go and pick up a new game from scratch when 5e still has plenty they want to play with is a bit too much of an ask. Likewise, all my games are online and with people who are strangers at first, and finding players for any form of DnD is still an order of magnitude easier than for even things like Pathfinder or V:tM.
There's also the question of a game system's merits versus those of an individual instance of a game that someone plays. I happily concede that Fantasy Adventure Game XYZ might be more original, more dynamic or smarter than 5e, and starting from nothing, it'd be foolish not to play that. But s a DM that homebrews about 85% of what I use session to session, it would take me years to get as comfortable and familiar with a new system to do that like I do for 5e. This is where the 'just play/run/write for something else' arguement I've seen a lot over the last week falls down for me. Fantasy Adventure Game XYZ might be a better system, but I guarantee you the game I can run you right now with 5e is better than the game I can run you right now with that, because I know 5e like the back of my hand and understand its mechanics, systems, structures and style well enough to create high-quality content that in turn leads to a better play experience, because the homebrew monsters and magic items and feats and such work well within and alongside what already exists. One day, I might feel comfortable doing that for another system, but for the games I'm running at the moment I need that firm foundation of knowledge and experience to keep the quality up.
This is another reason the annihilation of 3rd oarty 5e stuff sucks. WOTC's books of late have been very underwhelming, but the stuff coming out from MCDM or Ghostfire or Kobold Press does interesting things with what most people are already playing, and are a great source of inspiration. I admit I don't often use their content wholesale, but nonetheless it's so valuable as a game designer (which all GMs who don't run purely by the book are, to some extent) to have a thriving community of third party content that can inspire with a new take on a system, or a new way to interact with a mechanic when creating content. For WOTC to pull the plug on that when their own output is increasingly bland and unimaginative is deeply annoying. It looks like Kobold's is going to be at least somewhat compatible, and MCDM still have things like their monster book for 5e in the works (unless this situation changes the development of that radically), but soon enough that well is going to dry up.
Apologies if this is all a bit ranty, folks! I feel very strongly about this and apparently I have A LOT of thoughts on the matter! I can't shake the feeling that Hasbro are throwing the baby out with the bathwater in pusuit of a tiny increase in profits and a tighter stranglehold on the consumers, and as someone who derives a great deal of joy and mental wellbeing from the games I run each week, and the community around them, this is all very frustrating. Sure, the industry as a whole might get better for the die-hard TTRPG veterans, but for a lot of people (speaking more for the people I run for than myself, perhaps), DnD is the hobby and a nosedive like this is going to leave a lot of people mad. In many ways I hope that in a couple of years something has come along with ease of access, visibility and a toolset to rival WOTC, but at the moment it's hard to imagine
2023/01/12 05:19:52
Subject: Dungeons And Dakkas! The Dakka DnD Thread!
Paradigm wrote: More variety is great, can't argue with that. We're going to see some really innovative design, cool new settings, new opportunities in game development and new voices in the industry, and that is all fantastic! In ten years time we could be looking at a thriving industry with dozens of new and exciting games... which will all have a playerbase a tenth of the size of any given edition of DnD, sadly. Short of something like Critical Role adopting and promoting a new system, or publishing their own, none of these companies are going to move the needle on DnD's dominance of the space no matter how good they are.
That all depends on how badly DnD Burns their own bridges. A huge factor in their success is the podcasts and live plays. THOSE groups have created a massive in flux of players. When/if those groups switch to other game systems because they are incapable of monetizing their podcast content any more we are going to see a massive amount of free advertising for other systems. THAT will move the needle. Take them off the top? Maybe not. Take a huge chunk? I think so.
Case in point, my main ttrpg podcast comes from the Sans Pants network, DnD Is For Nerds. The GM Adam, has a horror series he runs called Beyond The Map where he uses Chronicles of Darkness 2nd Ed (the system isn't advertised, I just recognized the mechanics). But on Reddit and Discord I have seen multiple people asking about the game he was using because they wanted to try it. That is exposure to new systems simply because people were listening to the stories.
What happens when Critical Role stops playing DnD? How much of their listener base who hear them having a good time want to try the new game?
Lance, you and I have gone back and forth plenty of times here about the relative merits (or lack thereof) of 5e or D20 in general as a system, so I won't repeat all that, but the point I was making is that the rug is being pulled out from under the people who are perfectly happy with things they way they are. Those of us who play and enjoy 5e on its own merits are suddenly going to lose out on any kind of ongoing support or content if this goes as badly as it seems like it will, with no recourse for any publishers to pick up where WOTC leaves off (as we had been assuming they would under the OGL 1.0).
I am not going to debate that people are going to feel hurt or some pain from this. Individuals absolutely will.
But I am going to argue these 2 points.
1) You still have the massive content library you already have. You can keep using it.
2) What is good for the industry in the long run is more important than the pain of the individual in the short term. It just simply doesn't matter if individuals have to suffer through some hard times over the next 6 months to a year. The shake up is going to pay off over and over again as we move forward.
These are my opinions. This is how I feel. Others may feel differently. This needs to be stated for some reason.
2023/01/12 20:27:19
Subject: Dungeons And Dakkas! The Dakka DnD Thread!
I can't link to Paizo's website because, well, the announcement has caused it to crash, so I'll repost the text here:
Paizo wrote:PAIZO ANNOUNCES SYSTEM-NEUTRAL OPEN RPG LICENSE
For the last several weeks, as rumors of Wizards of the Coast’s new version of the Open Game License began circulating among publishers and on social media, gamers across the world have been asking what Paizo plans to do in light of concerns regarding Wizards of the Coast’s rumored plan to de-authorize the existing OGL 1.0(a). We have been awaiting further information, hoping that Wizards would realize that, for more than 20 years, the OGL has been a mutually beneficial license which should not–and cannot–be revoked. While we continue to await an answer from Wizards, we strongly feel that Paizo can no longer delay making our own feelings about the importance of Open Gaming a part of the public discussion.
We believe that any interpretation that the OGL 1.0 or 1.0(a) were intended to be revocable or able to be deauthorized is incorrect, and with good reason.
We were there.
Paizo owner Lisa Stevens and Paizo president Jim Butler were leaders on the Dungeons & Dragons team at Wizards at the time. Brian Lewis, co-founder of Azora Law, the intellectual property law firm that Paizo uses, was the attorney at Wizards who came up with the legal framework for the OGL itself. Paizo has also worked very closely on OGL-related issues with Ryan Dancey, the visionary who conceived the OGL in the first place.
Paizo does not believe that the OGL 1.0a can be “deauthorized,” ever. While we are prepared to argue that point in a court of law if need be, we don’t want to have to do that, and we know that many of our fellow publishers are not in a position to do so.
We have no interest whatsoever in Wizards’ new OGL. Instead, we have a plan that we believe will irrevocably and unquestionably keep alive the spirit of the Open Game License.
As Paizo has evolved, the parts of the OGL that we ourselves value have changed. When we needed to quickly bring out Pathfinder First Edition to continue publishing our popular monthly adventures back in 2008, using Wizards’ language was important and expeditious. But in our non-RPG products, including our Pathfinder Tales novels, the Pathfinder Adventure Card Game, and others, we shifted our focus away from D&D tropes to lean harder into ideas from our own writers. By the time we went to work on Pathfinder Second Edition, Wizards of the Coast’s Open Game Content was significantly less important to us, and so our designers and developers wrote the new edition without using Wizards’ copyrighted expressions of any game mechanics. While we still published it under the OGL, the reason was no longer to allow Paizo to use Wizards’ expressions, but to allow other companies to use our expressions.
We believe, as we always have, that open gaming makes games better, improves profitability for all involved, and enriches the community of gamers who participate in this amazing hobby. And so we invite gamers from around the world to join us as we begin the next great chapter of open gaming with the release of a new open, perpetual, and irrevocable Open RPG Creative License (ORC).
The new Open RPG Creative License will be built system agnostic for independent game publishers under the legal guidance of Azora Law, an intellectual property law firm that represents Paizo and several other game publishers. Paizo will pay for this legal work. We invite game publishers worldwide to join us in support of this system-agnostic license that allows all games to provide their own unique open rules reference documents that open up their individual game systems to the world. To join the effort and provide feedback on the drafts of this license, please sign up by using this form.
In addition to Paizo, Kobold Press, Chaosium, Legendary Games, Rogue Genius, Green Ronin, and a growing list of publishers have already agreed to participate in the Open RPG Creative License, and in the coming days we hope and expect to add substantially to this group.
The ORC will not be owned by Paizo, nor will it be owned by any company who makes money publishing RPGs. Azora Law’s ownership of the process and stewardship should provide a safe harbor against any company being bought, sold, or changing management in the future and attempting to rescind rights or nullify sections of the license. Ultimately, we plan to find a nonprofit with a history of open source values to own this license (such as the Linux Foundation).
Of course, Paizo plans to continue publishing Pathfinder and Starfinder, even as we move away from the Open Gaming License. Since months’ worth of products are still at the printer, you’ll see the familiar OGL 1.0(a) in the back of our products for a while yet. While the Open RPG Creative License is being finalized, we’ll be printing Pathfinder and Starfinder products without any license, and we’ll add the finished license to those products when the new license is complete.
We hope that you will continue to support Paizo and other game publishers in this difficult time for the entire hobby. You can do your part by supporting the many companies that have provided content under the OGL. Support Pathfinder and Starfinder by visiting your local game store, subscribing to Pathfinder and Starfinder, or taking advantage of discount code OpenGaming during checkout for 25% off your purchase of the Core Rulebook, Core Rulebook Pocket Edition, or Pathfinder Beginner Box. Support Kobold Press, Green Ronin, Legendary Games, Roll for Combat, Rogue Genius Games, and other publishers working to preserve a prosperous future for Open Gaming that is both perpetual AND irrevocable.
We’ll be there at your side. You can count on us not to go back on our word.
Good on them and I hope that they don't have to defend it in court. That being said... they're probably the only company that is "big" enough to do so against a behemoth like Hasbro and not immediately go out of business though I don't doubt it will still hurt their bottom line. That being said... if they don't stand up and instead cave if WOTC/Hasbro press the issue, their business is likely done for regardless.
2023/01/13 00:26:12
Subject: Dungeons And Dakkas! The Dakka DnD Thread!
Lance845 wrote: Good for them. Though i don't understand why there is so much investment in a new open license when creative commons exists and is super modular.
Creative Commons is just a generic open licence anyone can use, but it has no foundation in any one setting.
The idea of DnD is a common core set of rules, structure and building blocks. So an open RPG system establishes a unified style of play and mechanics. Everything else bolts onto it. So its like Creative Commons, but with it being attached to a specific set of building blocks.
Lance845 wrote: Good for them. Though i don't understand why there is so much investment in a new open license when creative commons exists and is super modular.
Creative Commons is just a generic open licence anyone can use, but it has no foundation in any one setting.
The idea of DnD is a common core set of rules, structure and building blocks. So an open RPG system establishes a unified style of play and mechanics. Everything else bolts onto it. So its like Creative Commons, but with it being attached to a specific set of building blocks.
I understand why DnD made the OGL. I don't understand why Pazio and these other companies would create the ORC when it's system neutral and doesn't unify anything. Creative Commons already has them covered.
These are my opinions. This is how I feel. Others may feel differently. This needs to be stated for some reason.
2023/01/13 02:06:09
Subject: Dungeons And Dakkas! The Dakka DnD Thread!
Because they're a competitor and they see an opportunity for free (literally) good will.
A cynic would say that they're just doing it to draw new customers to themselves, but I think that they're genuine about this, partly because, as they say, some of Paizo's people are people who worked on the original OGL and don't want to see their idea sullied, partly because it does draw in new customers (and why not?), partly because what WotC is proposing could hurt them, and partly because they've got a bunch of other gaming studios jumping on board.
It's one thing to have competitors. It's another to do something that causes all your major competitors to rally against you and go "No thanks!".
Yes, but, instead of the presumably expensive ORC that they need to find a home for, they could have drafted a version of the creative commons that does all the same things in the way they wanted it and posted it on their site to be copied and used by all.
It is PR and does unify people in an act of good will. But it's also not free and those lawyers are definitely getting paid.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2023/01/13 02:21:06
These are my opinions. This is how I feel. Others may feel differently. This needs to be stated for some reason.
2023/01/13 09:27:41
Subject: Dungeons And Dakkas! The Dakka DnD Thread!
The investment is creating for themselves an open market system whilst being at the forefront.
Basically they see how Wizards have done well with the original licence and DnD and they are going to emulate that model in their own way. They know that many customers only go for the official stuff or the main company stuff and never look far outside of it.
Even those that do, the vast majority will begin their journey with the core business.
They can see that they can emulate Wizards position with DnD, by being the powerhouse behind the creation of a new system.
It's also a passion to recreate the open licence and nature of the RPG market in general. This is a market where many working within it do so because its a passion. Sure they earn a living and they want a good wage at the end of the day; but they chose to work in a creative industry that provides a purely luxury entertainment to the world.
So they likely want to re-create it because its what they grew up with; its what they helped create the first time and they want that back.
Wizard's have put up their own statement, starting with a mealy-mouthed "We just wanted to protect you guys from racism and NFTs!".
Uh-huh. Can't unring a bell, idiots. You got caught trying to steal the cookie jar, and are now engaging in some borderline gas-lighting about it just being a draft and that "We really wanted feedback, and we got that, so we all won!" nonsense.
And this ain't crashin' their website.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2023/01/13 17:01:16
Lol. They were just trying to fight istaphobes, fellow gamers! We swear it was all in the name of social justice! I can't recall ever seeing any actually racist content in d20 or OGL reported on other than the insane re-definition that WOTC themselves thrust upon their own work in the last couple of years.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2023/01/13 17:16:13
2023/01/13 17:15:16
Subject: Dungeons And Dakkas! The Dakka DnD Thread!
It isn't a terrible statement as such things go. Real sincerity isn't an achievable goal in such things (many will never believe it), so publicly backing down is pretty much the only reasonable option.
Its going to be an internet gaslighting adventure in both directions for the next couple months but will ultimately largely be forgotten. (By all but the most riled).
The immediate effects are that for the next couple months, the D&D One playtest feedback is going to be absolute garbage.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2023/01/13 19:25:08
Efficiency is the highest virtue.
2023/01/13 18:23:13
Subject: Dungeons And Dakkas! The Dakka DnD Thread!
A predictably pathetic and patronising statement from WOTC, then, but a statement nonetheless.
Seems at least that they're backing down on the royalties, the ability to apply the new license to previously published products, and most importantly the clause where they can claim ownership or anything made under the OGL, be it a $2m dollar kickstarter supplement or a pay-what-you-want PDF. I think there is still a need to be wary, and to scrutinise the new license to hell and back when it does emerge to make sure they're held accountable, but still this is a rare and somewhat inspiring example of a community fightback against a corporation succeeding. I'm sure the only thing they paid any heed to was the vast number of people cancelling DnD Beyond subs, but even then it's cool to see people putting their money where their mouth is and actually forcing a positive change.
One could argue that between all the new plans and products announced by various third party publishers over the last week of radio silence, they've still got exactly what they want with regards to diverting or eliminating direct 'competition' (in the loosest sense of the word), but it's still good to have these assurances on paper for when the license does come through, so we as a community can make sure they follow up on this and don't just assume we'll all forget. They've burned a lot of bridges and a lot of trust, and despite their rhetoric in the announcement, this is a win for us, and absolutely a defeat for them.
2023/01/13 18:29:45
Subject: Dungeons And Dakkas! The Dakka DnD Thread!
According to the new leaker, this is a stalling tactic to (Hopefully) get the fans to even forget this ever happened, and then do it on the sly in 2-3 months. I will remain un-subbed until I see the new system put out by Kobold Press.
2023/01/13 18:33:12
Subject: Dungeons And Dakkas! The Dakka DnD Thread!
FezzikDaBullgryn wrote: According to the new leaker, this is a stalling tactic to (Hopefully) get the fans to even forget this ever happened, and then do it on the sly in 2-3 months. I will remain un-subbed until I see the new system put out by Kobold Press.
Why "until"?
Lets be real here. This isn't wizards first attempt at this it won't be their last. Under what circumstances do you feel like resubbing to wizards or giving them any more of your money is even an option compared to what made you unsub in the first place?
When, ever, is DnD worth any more of your investment instead of all these other companies that make better games with less bs?
Take what you already own and move on.
These are my opinions. This is how I feel. Others may feel differently. This needs to be stated for some reason.
2023/01/14 16:00:32
Subject: Dungeons And Dakkas! The Dakka DnD Thread!
I guess this is one of the things that upsets me. Am I legally allowed now to download PDF copies of all my books that I purchased? Because Beyond doesn't allow me to, I have to go through other methods.
) and that's bloody awful. The fact they can do it is one thing, the fact they chose to is shortsighted, greedy and a massive middle finger to many of their most dedicated and enthusiastic players, supporters and fans. Feth WOTC, feth Hasbro and feth the OGL1.1. 
I can't shake the feeling that Hasbro are throwing the baby out with the bathwater in pusuit of a tiny increase in profits and a tighter stranglehold on the consumers, and as someone who derives a great deal of joy and mental wellbeing from the games I run each week, and the community around them, this is all very frustrating. Sure, the industry as a whole might get better for the die-hard TTRPG veterans, but for a lot of people (speaking more for the people I run for than myself, perhaps), 
