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skyth wrote: It still points out a flaw in the system. My religion is older than those three. Yet people (And likely jurors/judges) would not think I'm serious about my beliefs.
It does, at least from the point of view of un-established minority religions. But from the point of view of the government, they have to draw the line on what is a religion and what is not somewhere, and no matter where they draw it some people are going to be left out and upset. Out of sheer curiosity, what are your beliefs? If it is older than the Abrahamic religions yet fails to get common acceptance I guess it is some kind of revived ancient polytheistic religion such as Asatru or Rodnovery?
I'm a witch, and as I teach in the Bible belt of the USA, I'm sure if I admitted that in school I'd be quietly transferred or nonrenewed (the gentle firing). Because I love my job, I remain firmly in the broom closet.
So I settle for answering that lovely question 'do you believe in God?' with Among other things, and leave it at that. Duotheistic also works, because students and staff are rarely curious enough to research it.
Klawz-Ramming is a subset of citrus fruit?
Gwar- "And everyone wants a bigger Spleen!"
Mercurial wrote:
I admire your aplomb and instate you as Baron of the Seas and Lord Marshall of Privateers.
Orkeosaurus wrote:Star Trek also said we'd have X-Wings by now. We all see how that prediction turned out.
Orkeosaurus, on homophobia, the nature of homosexuality, and the greatness of George Takei.
English doesn't borrow from other languages. It follows them down dark alleyways and mugs them for loose grammar.
skyth wrote: It still points out a flaw in the system. My religion is older than those three. Yet people (And likely jurors/judges) would not think I'm serious about my beliefs.
It does, at least from the point of view of un-established minority religions. But from the point of view of the government, they have to draw the line on what is a religion and what is not somewhere, and no matter where they draw it some people are going to be left out and upset. Out of sheer curiosity, what are your beliefs? If it is older than the Abrahamic religions yet fails to get common acceptance I guess it is some kind of revived ancient polytheistic religion such as Asatru or Rodnovery?
Hellenic Paganism.
As for the government drawing a line...technically they aren't allowed to in the US.
Gitzbitah wrote: I'm a witch, and as I teach in the Bible belt of the USA, I'm sure if I admitted that in school I'd be quietly transferred or nonrenewed (the gentle firing). Because I love my job, I remain firmly in the broom closet.
So I settle for answering that lovely question 'do you believe in God?' with Among other things, and leave it at that. Duotheistic also works, because students and staff are rarely curious enough to research it.
Gitzbitah wrote: I'm a witch, and as I teach in the Bible belt of the USA, I'm sure if I admitted that in school I'd be quietly transferred or nonrenewed (the gentle firing). Because I love my job, I remain firmly in the broom closet.
So I settle for answering that lovely question 'do you believe in God?' with Among other things, and leave it at that. Duotheistic also works, because students and staff are rarely curious enough to research it.
Prestor Jon wrote: Please read them and let me know what parts lead you to believe that any corporation can remove any health care coverage they want from any plan offered to their employees because Jesus.
I never said they could. In fact, my whole point is that they can't remove whatever they want for whatever reasons. There's a specific exception for certain ideological issues that right-wing Christianity cares about, allowing a standard that would be unacceptable in other contexts. And there is no compelling reason to allow that different standard, other than right-wing Christianity having excessive influence.
The issue is that minority religions (like mine) have a higher hurdle to overcome (that our religion and belief is real) whereas if someone says something is against (right wing) Christianity then that's easily accepted. No one ever considers that a 'religious belief' of someone claiming to be Christian might not be sincerely held even if it contradicts the teachings and behavior of their prophet.
My wife is an Alexandrian Wiccan - look up how long it took for the VA to even allow the pentacle on the tombstones of veterans and fallen soldiers, (And Good ol' Jeb Bush vowing to do everything in his power to prevent it.)
My wife and I met at a pagan retreat - where I was hired to run role playing games. (I'm Unitarian. Megan's High Priestess is married to my minister - who is also her High Priest. U/U and pagans getting into relationships is pretty much a cliche. The retreat is now run by PaganUnity.)
The Auld Grump
Kilkrazy wrote:When I was a young boy all my wargames were narratively based because I played with my toy soldiers and vehicles without the use of any rules.
The reason I bought rules and became a real wargamer was because I wanted a properly thought out structure to govern the action instead of just making things up as I went along.
Gitzbitah wrote: I'm a witch, and as I teach in the Bible belt of the USA, I'm sure if I admitted that in school I'd be quietly transferred or nonrenewed (the gentle firing). Because I love my job, I remain firmly in the broom closet.
So I settle for answering that lovely question 'do you believe in God?' with Among other things, and leave it at that. Duotheistic also works, because students and staff are rarely curious enough to research it.
Which is ironic given that communist principles are much closer to Christian teachings than the sort of teachings the kind of people who make "Godless commie" remarks tend to believe in.
skyth wrote: It still points out a flaw in the system. My religion is older than those three. Yet people (And likely jurors/judges) would not think I'm serious about my beliefs.
It does, at least from the point of view of un-established minority religions. But from the point of view of the government, they have to draw the line on what is a religion and what is not somewhere, and no matter where they draw it some people are going to be left out and upset. Out of sheer curiosity, what are your beliefs? If it is older than the Abrahamic religions yet fails to get common acceptance I guess it is some kind of revived ancient polytheistic religion such as Asatru or Rodnovery?
Hellenic Paganism.
As for the government drawing a line...technically they aren't allowed to in the US.
That is pretty interesting. In fact, given that I am an archaeologist with a very keen interest in Ancient Greece, this is awesome. Now I can actually ask that one question I have always wanted to ask someone who believed in Zeus: How do you feel about swans?
That is pretty interesting. In fact, given that I am an archaeologist with a very keen interest in Ancient Greece, this is awesome. Now I can actually ask that one question I have always wanted to ask someone who believed in Zeus: How do you feel about swans?
How does the Tsarina feel about horses?
I'm told she enjoys the saddle.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2018/08/31 01:26:12
Fate is in heaven, armor is on the chest, accomplishment is in the feet. - Nagao Kagetora
That is pretty interesting. In fact, given that I am an archaeologist with a very keen interest in Ancient Greece, this is awesome. Now I can actually ask that one question I have always wanted to ask someone who believed in Zeus: How do you feel about swans?
How does the Tsarina feel about horses?
I have been told she feels about horses the way the pope feels about young teen boys.
That is pretty interesting. In fact, given that I am an archaeologist with a very keen interest in Ancient Greece, this is awesome. Now I can actually ask that one question I have always wanted to ask someone who believed in Zeus: How do you feel about swans?
.
We're getting a bit off topic But I think they're beautiful animals though I've heard they can be a bit vicious. I also don't take the myths as being literal but rather allegorical. Plus I have more of a connection with Athena and Hermes than Zeus. (Not that I don't believe in him...and he is the boss after all ). I see the gods as more like archetypes of certain things. I'm also not a recon and have my own unique take on the worship, etc.
Doesn't make it not a deeply held belief though and worthy of protection under the law. Problem is making the law believe that it deserves equal protection. I consider playing strategy games and communicating on the internet to religious activities for me. How hard would it be for me to convince a judge/jury that I am serious when I say that? Last time I brought this up here someone on this forum scoffed at the idea.
We've had a president (Bush Jr) claim that Wicca wasn't a real religion. But following a JCI religion gives you special unearned privileges in this society. It's kind of like being white as opposed to black or having rich parents. Only thing is, it's something that you theoretically choose. (It's really more a calling...but still...)
That's why I'm opposed to special protections for religion that is allowed to affect others and special privileges for it. Like starting government meetings with a prayer. There was a court case locally that made it to the Supreme Court allowing for the town council to start with a prayer. Of course, they crafted the rules for who can give a prayer to basically be a JCI prayer. I would be excluded from giving one even if I lived in the town (As opposed to the next one over).
As for the government drawing a line...technically they aren't allowed to in the US.
Just quoting here as while I agree principally that the US isn't allowed to draw a line, if still must.
since we've been discussing often "dead" or disused religions, should someone come under the legal system for their belief in say, Huitzilopochtli, then clearly some lines need to have been drawn.
Surely there would "need" to be a modernizing effort done by practitioners so that actual human/animal sacrifices are not needed to be performed (as these acts would undoubtedly fall afoul of certain laws)
Religious freedom must be used as a shield not as a sword. Problem is it is used by those in power as a sword against those out of power way too often.
I would put the Huitzilopochtli case in the same case as Hobby Lobby. It is making a harmful imposition on someone else due to the religion in question. (Obviously the amount of harmful imposition is different but it is similar in nature.)
Automatically Appended Next Post: A little further about the sword and shield.
Say your religion prohibits you from handling apples. You run a grocery store and the locals love apple pies so they mandate all grocery stores must sell apples and pie crusts.
The law should act as a shield and say you are not required to sell apples. However you would still be required to sell pie crusts even if you believe they will be used in apple pies. You are not allowed to use your faith as a sword to try to impose it on other people.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/08/31 02:51:30
All of this can of course be solved by leaving religion completely out of the picture and affording it NO special privileges.
I realise that this will be very hard to implement in a country as deeply damaged by religion as the US.
A country where Christianity has enjoyed such a privileged and sacred position for so long, that any attempt to equalise and afford equal rights will be proclaimed; "an attack on Christianity" by religious zealots.
-------------------------------------------------------
"He died because he had no honor. He had no honor and the Emperor was watching."
Since we are talking about religion I suppose we can touch on the subject of funerals.
Tomorrow looks like a bad day for Trump, unless of course you think this is all part of the necessary campaign to smash the corrupt system of the US federal government.
Kilkrazy wrote: Since we are talking about religion I suppose we can touch on the subject of funerals.
Tomorrow looks like a bad day for Trump, unless of course you think this is all part of the necessary campaign to smash the corrupt system of the US federal government.
It will be inyeresting to see what tweets go out during the service. Will his handlers have taken his phone away to try and prevent a twitter rant whilst people are paying their respects, I wonder?
The Laws of Thermodynamics:
1) You cannot win. 2) You cannot break even. 3) You cannot stop playing the game.
Colonel Flagg wrote:You think you're real smart. But you're not smart; you're dumb. Very dumb. But you've met your match in me.
President Donald Trump has threatened to withdraw the US from the World Trade Organization (WTO), claiming it treats the country unfairly.
"If they don't shape up, I would withdraw from the WTO," Mr Trump said in an interview with Bloomberg News.
The WTO was established to provide rules for global trade and resolve disputes between countries.
Mr Trump says the body too often rules against the US, although he concedes it has won some recent judgments.
He claimed on Fox News earlier this year that the WTO was set up "to benefit everybody but us", adding: "We lose the lawsuits, almost all of the lawsuits in the WTO."
However, some analysis shows the US wins about 90% when it is the complainant and loses about the same percentage when it is complained against.
Mr Trump's warning about a possible US pull-out from the organisation highlights the conflict between the president's protectionist trade policies and the open trade system that the WTO oversees
.. ohh.
Still keeps the white nationalists, the Q-anon believers and the other vocal idiots cheering eh ?
The poor man really has a stake in the country. The rich man hasn't; he can go away to New Guinea in a yacht. The poor have sometimes objected to being governed badly; the rich have always objected to being governed at all
We love our superheroes because they refuse to give up on us. We can analyze them out of existence, kill them, ban them, mock them, and still they return, patiently reminding us of who we are and what we wish we could be.
"the play's the thing wherein I'll catch the conscience of the king,
After Mr. Pozner succeeded in getting an Infowars video casting doubt on the shooting removed from YouTube, Mr. Jones showed his audience Mr. Pozner’s personal information and maps to addresses associated with his family, court documents say. Mr. Jones also falsely accused Ms. De La Rosa of participating in a faked interview with Anderson Cooper of CNN after the shooting, according to court documents.
Subsequent death threats and harassment have forced the Pozner family to move seven times. They currently live in hiding.
Truly Alex Jones is an ethical and professional journalist who deserves to have platforms on social media to carry on with his ethical and professional journalism.
The Laws of Thermodynamics:
1) You cannot win. 2) You cannot break even. 3) You cannot stop playing the game.
Colonel Flagg wrote:You think you're real smart. But you're not smart; you're dumb. Very dumb. But you've met your match in me.
NinthMusketeer wrote: You seem to be implying that saying the results could be invalid makes the results valid.
Just trying to point out the study acknowledged these flaws and said they needed more data before their hypothesis was proven for the people who skimmed it instead of reading the entire study.
NinthMusketeer wrote: You seem to be implying that saying the results could be invalid makes the results valid.
Just trying to point out the study acknowledged these flaws and said they needed more data before their hypothesis was proven for the people who skimmed it instead of reading the entire study.
In any case, I think it's safe to say the objection to the study is on legitimate scientific grounds, whether or not you agree with the objections. The Ben Shapiro/Fox News outrage machine is just that: lying and raging for ideological reasons.
There is no such thing as a hobby without politics. "Leave politics at the door" is itself a political statement, an endorsement of the status quo and an attempt to silence dissenting voices.
After Mr. Pozner succeeded in getting an Infowars video casting doubt on the shooting removed from YouTube, Mr. Jones showed his audience Mr. Pozner’s personal information and maps to addresses associated with his family, court documents say. Mr. Jones also falsely accused Ms. De La Rosa of participating in a faked interview with Anderson Cooper of CNN after the shooting, according to court documents.
Subsequent death threats and harassment have forced the Pozner family to move seven times. They currently live in hiding.
Truly Alex Jones is an ethical and professional journalist who deserves to have platforms on social media to carry on with his ethical and professional journalism.
Good. Free speech is meaningless claptrap if it’s stretched so thin as to allow the kind of garbage Alex Jones tries to throw out there.
Kind of disappointing this case is still dragging on in a way. Alex Jones pulled that garbage nearly 7 years ago and their still in the motions phase. Makes me lament the court system can be so slow. A more prompt response to this kind of crap would probably discourage it more instead of letting it spill into some whine fest about how Alex Jones isn’t being fairly treated. Even Dakkas most die hard conservatives found his comments disgusting back when he made them and Fox News practically scrambled to counter the guy. A far cry from today where he’s treated like a martyr for being a complete waste of human potential.
. Memory is short.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/08/31 14:09:47
No, in some places around here that's much better than being Catholic.
Not politically. Atheist are the most discriminated group in politics. It is considered political suicide. Where is the outrage?
Automatically Appended Next Post:
d-usa wrote: I’m a former “evangelical” and now I’m just a plain old normal Christian. I am always tickled pink when the satanists challenge some absurd new law that tries to justify the 10 commandments as some kind of monument by simply trying to put their own statue next to it.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/08/31 14:27:58
If we fail to anticipate the unforeseen or expect the unexpected in a universe of infinite possibilities, we may find ourselves at the mercy of anyone or anything that cannot be programmed, categorized or easily referenced.
- Fox Mulder
The retreat is now run by PaganUnity.)
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