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I am looking at a semi-competitive list using a mixture of models to shore up gaps. Thoughts? (The reason for Magnus over Morty is the psyker support and power - Dealing mortal wounds all over the place and buffing himself to get into melee ranges). I'm interested in any fine tuning ideas, because I might run this at an ITC event eventually.

++ Super-Heavy Detachment +3CP (Chaos - Questor Traitoris) [43 PL, 824pts] ++
+ Lord of War +

Renegade Armigers [9 PL, 174pts]
. Renegade Armiger: Heavy stubber, Two armiger autocannons

Renegade Armigers [9 PL, 174pts]
. Renegade Armiger: Heavy stubber, Two armiger autocannons

Renegade Knight [25 PL, 476pts]: Heavy stubber, Reaper chainsword, Stormspear Rocket Pod
. Avenger gatling cannon and heavy flamer: Heavy flamer

++ Super-Heavy Auxiliary Detachment (Chaos - Thousand Sons) [23 PL, 445pts] ++
+ Lord of War +

Magnus the Red [23 PL, 445pts]: Infernal Gateway, Warptime, Weaver of Fates

++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Chaos - Death Guard) [43 PL, 721pts] ++
+ HQ +

Daemon Prince of Nurgle [8 PL, 156pts]: 5. Putrescent Vitality, Malefic talon
Malignant Plaguecaster [6 PL, 110pts]: 1. Miasma of Pestilence, 4. Blades of Putrefaction

+ Troops +

Plague Marines [7 PL, 105pts]
. Plague Champion
. . Codex: Boltgun, Plague knife
. 2x Plague Marine w/ boltgun
. Plague Marine w/ Special Weapon: Blight launcher
. Plague Marine w/ Special Weapon: Blight launcher

Plague Marines [7 PL, 105pts]
. Plague Champion
. . Codex: Boltgun, Plague knife
. 2x Plague Marine w/ boltgun
. Plague Marine w/ Special Weapon: Blight launcher
. Plague Marine w/ Special Weapon: Blight launcher

Plague Marines [7 PL, 105pts]
. Plague Champion
. . Codex: Boltgun, Plague knife
. 2x Plague Marine w/ boltgun
. Plague Marine w/ Special Weapon: Blight launcher
. Plague Marine w/ Special Weapon: Blight launcher

+ Heavy Support +
Plagueburst Crawler [8 PL, 140pts]: 2x Plaguespitter, Heavy Slugger

++ Total: [109 PL, 1990pts] ++

Just a bump hoping to get feedback if there is any available. My thoughts on what each unit is for:

Plagueburst is targeted as running up mid field as a target to draw fire. Either deal with it before it gets to your lines, or focus other high priority targets and let it plow into your troops.

Knights lay down oppressive levels of fire and the armigers hold back field objectives.

Magnus is there to wade in with psyker goodness and anti-tank capabilities.

Marines are there to run to objectives or lay down blight launcher fire from afar. I expect they would be the least important targets on the field generally.

HQ would just support the most forward groups of marines from within cover when possible.

use a Nurgle demons battalion, cheaper and you get tons of resilient bodies, not sure about Magnus but of course it can fit in, i m going to play a similar list, but i will play the same super heavy det plus a Nurgle demons battalion with pb and nurglins and a supreme command with 2 Ts princes and Ahriman.
a thing like this


++ Supreme Command Detachment +1CP (Chaos - Thousand Sons) [27 PL, 526pts] ++

+ HQ +

Ahriman on Disc of Tzeentch [9 PL, 166pts]: Death Hex, Temporal Manipulation, Warptime

Daemon Prince of Tzeentch [9 PL, 180pts]: Gaze of Fate, Glamour of Tzeentch, Helm of the Third Eye, Malefic talon, Wings

Daemon Prince of Tzeentch [9 PL, 180pts]: 5. Otherworldly Prescience, Bolt of Change, Malefic talon, Warlord, Weaver of Fates, Wings

++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Chaos - Daemons) [35 PL, 653pts] ++

+ No Force Org Slot +

Chaos Allegiance: Nurgle

+ HQ +

Daemon Prince of Chaos [9 PL, 180pts]: Malefic talon, Wings
. Nurgle: Virulent Blessing

Poxbringer [4 PL, 70pts]: Miasma of Pestilence

Spoilpox Scrivener [4 PL, 75pts]

+ Troops +

Nurglings [3 PL, 54pts]: 3x Nurgling Swarms

Nurglings [3 PL, 54pts]: 3x Nurgling Swarms

Plaguebearers [12 PL, 220pts]: Instrument of Chaos, 29x Plaguebearer, Plagueridden

++ Super-Heavy Detachment +3CP (Chaos - Questor Traitoris) [43 PL, 821pts] ++

+ Lord of War +

Renegade Armigers [9 PL, 174pts]
. Renegade Armiger: Heavy stubber, Two armiger autocannons

Renegade Armigers [9 PL, 174pts]
. Renegade Armiger: Heavy stubber, Two armiger autocannons

Renegade Knight [25 PL, 473pts]: Heavy stubber
. Avenger gatling cannon and heavy flamer: Heavy flamer
. Avenger gatling cannon and heavy flamer: Heavy flamer

++ Total: [105 PL, 2000pts] ++

I prefer use Ts princes+Ahriman for psychic support, Magnus is too easy to remove from table, nurgle gives me lot of resilience , 3 Dp's support CaC when needed.

valdier wrote:
I am looking at a semi-competitive list using a mixture of models to shore up gaps. Thoughts? (The reason for Magnus over Morty is the psyker support and power - Dealing mortal wounds all over the place and buffing himself to get into melee ranges). I'm interested in any fine tuning ideas, because I might run this at an ITC event eventually.

++ Super-Heavy Detachment +3CP (Chaos - Questor Traitoris) [43 PL, 824pts] ++
+ Lord of War +

Renegade Armigers [9 PL, 174pts]
. Renegade Armiger: Heavy stubber, Two armiger autocannons

Renegade Armigers [9 PL, 174pts]
. Renegade Armiger: Heavy stubber, Two armiger autocannons

Renegade Knight [25 PL, 476pts]: Heavy stubber, Reaper chainsword, Stormspear Rocket Pod
. Avenger gatling cannon and heavy flamer: Heavy flamer

++ Super-Heavy Auxiliary Detachment (Chaos - Thousand Sons) [23 PL, 445pts] ++
+ Lord of War +

Magnus the Red [23 PL, 445pts]: Infernal Gateway, Warptime, Weaver of Fates

++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Chaos - Death Guard) [43 PL, 721pts] ++
+ HQ +

Daemon Prince of Nurgle [8 PL, 156pts]: 5. Putrescent Vitality, Malefic talon
Malignant Plaguecaster [6 PL, 110pts]: 1. Miasma of Pestilence, 4. Blades of Putrefaction

+ Troops +

Plague Marines [7 PL, 105pts]
. Plague Champion
. . Codex: Boltgun, Plague knife
. 2x Plague Marine w/ boltgun
. Plague Marine w/ Special Weapon: Blight launcher
. Plague Marine w/ Special Weapon: Blight launcher

Plague Marines [7 PL, 105pts]
. Plague Champion
. . Codex: Boltgun, Plague knife
. 2x Plague Marine w/ boltgun
. Plague Marine w/ Special Weapon: Blight launcher
. Plague Marine w/ Special Weapon: Blight launcher

Plague Marines [7 PL, 105pts]
. Plague Champion
. . Codex: Boltgun, Plague knife
. 2x Plague Marine w/ boltgun
. Plague Marine w/ Special Weapon: Blight launcher
. Plague Marine w/ Special Weapon: Blight launcher

+ Heavy Support +
Plagueburst Crawler [8 PL, 140pts]: 2x Plaguespitter, Heavy Slugger

++ Total: [109 PL, 1990pts] ++

As a whole (especially an ITC list) it feels... disjointed. The order of operations on any given game will be: Kill magnus, kill knight, you lose. If your opponent fails the first you, you'll probably win. Armigers (in my experience) have a hell of a time with anything T8+, just like reaper AC or normal AC's. Especially because we don't get any of the neat stuff IK gets to circumvent this weakness, i.e. house traits.

That said, if you really, REALLY want to run a Knight + Armigers, Mortarian would be a better bet. Hes much harder to kill than Magnus, especially if dice get hot, and he benefits from all the great DG spells like blades. This is assuming you don't have access to Nurgle Demons which would be a much better frontline for some knights to hide behind.

Knight, Mortarian, two armigers, and a battalion with cultists, demon princes, and maybe some PBC's or something else to support the knights.

yes Mortarion would be better and sure you need some more bodies, that's why i play a nurgle demon battalion, at tournaments i play there are too much firepower so i wont play Mortarion/Magnus

I could certainly drop Magnus for more bodies and swap DG to Chaos Nurge forces. Especially adding cultists and more troops in general.

I'm not sure that Mortarion is tougher than Magnus though, unless I'm missing something. Magnus is a 3++, Magnus is 4++ with 5+++ following yes?

Additionally, the Knight Gatling cannon dishes out pretty solid damage vs T8 (it's not dedicated anti-tank, but it beats most anything in DG).



Automatically Appended Next Post:

 blackmage wrote:
use a Nurgle demons battalion, cheaper and you get tons of resilient bodies, not sure about Magnus but of course it can fit in, i m going to play a similar list, but i will play the same super heavy det plus a Nurgle demons battalion with pb and nurglins and a supreme command with 2 Ts princes and Ahriman.
a thing like this


++ Super-Heavy Detachment +3CP (Chaos - Questor Traitoris) [43 PL, 821pts] ++

+ Lord of War +

Renegade Armigers [9 PL, 174pts]
. Renegade Armiger: Heavy stubber, Two armiger autocannons

Renegade Armigers [9 PL, 174pts]
. Renegade Armiger: Heavy stubber, Two armiger autocannons

Renegade Knight [25 PL, 473pts]: Heavy stubber
. Avenger gatling cannon and heavy flamer: Heavy flamer
. Avenger gatling cannon and heavy flamer: Heavy flamer

++ Total: [105 PL, 2000pts] ++

I'm pretty sure your renegade knight points are off, he should be 513 points with that load out, yes? I do see your point on psychic support, maybe I am over valuing the mortal wounds Magnus puts out.

no the cost is right
renegade Ik 285pts
2x gatling 75+75
2x flamers 17+17
heavy stubber 4
total 473
That supreme command can dish out lot of mortal wounds, depend what powers you give to Dp's/Ahriman.

Ok, based on feedback here...

How does this look in relation to the initial list? I've removed Magnus/Mortarion, increased the crawlers, dropped the marines and added 5 swarms of nurglings. To support them and their pre-"deploy" mischief makers ability, the Feculent Gnarlmaw makes the Nurglings much more annoying. Additionally the crawlers get a much more capable fall back and shoot cycle. The knights in this list will do most of the heavy lifting for damage dealing, focusing on any unit with S8 weaponry. The Nurglings are purely for objective control.


++ Super-Heavy Detachment +3CP (Chaos - Questor Traitoris) [43 PL, 821pts] ++
+ Lord of War +

Renegade Armigers [9 PL, 174pts]
. Renegade Armiger: Heavy stubber, Two armiger autocannons

Renegade Armigers [9 PL, 174pts]
. Renegade Armiger: Heavy stubber, Two armiger autocannons

Renegade Knight [25 PL, 473pts]: Heavy stubber
. Avenger gatling cannon and heavy flamer: Heavy flamer
. Avenger gatling cannon and heavy flamer: Heavy flamer

++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Chaos - Daemons) [57 PL, 1040pts] ++
Chaos Allegiance: Nurgle
+ HQ +

Daemon Prince of Nurgle [9 PL, 180pts]: 2. Living Plague, 5. Putrescent Vitality, Malefic talon, The Suppurating Plate, Warlord, Wings
Epidemius [5 PL, 100pts]
Poxbringer [4 PL, 70pts]: Shrivelling Pox

+ Troops +

Nurglings [3 PL, 54pts]: 3x Nurgling Swarms
Nurglings [3 PL, 54pts]: 3x Nurgling Swarms
Nurglings [3 PL, 54pts]: 3x Nurgling Swarms
Nurglings [3 PL, 54pts]: 3x Nurgling Swarms
Nurglings [3 PL, 54pts]: 3x Nurgling Swarms

+ Heavy Support +

Plagueburst Crawler [8 PL, 140pts]: 2x Plaguespitter, Heavy Slugger
Plagueburst Crawler [8 PL, 140pts]: 2x Plaguespitter, Heavy Slugger
Plagueburst Crawler [8 PL, 140pts]: 2x Plaguespitter, Heavy Slugger

++ Fortification Network (Chaos - Daemons) [3 PL, 85pts] ++

Feculent Gnarlmaws [3 PL, 85pts]: Feculent Gnarlmaw

++ Total: [103 PL, 1946pts] ++

the only thing i feel to say you is... take at least 1 unit of at least 25 Pb they are awesome. I dont understand why you knight cost 513pts, battlescribe gets wrong points for avenger cannon it still has the old cost 112pts not 92 like now, 40 less points.

 blackmage wrote:
the only thing i feel to say you is... take at least 1 unit of at least 25 Pb they are awesome. I dont understand why you knight cost 513pts, battlescribe gets wrong points for avenger cannon it still has the old cost 112pts not 92 like now, 40 less points.

Sell me on plague bearers, why are they better than poxwalkers? What benefit do they get that I am missing?

poxwalkers need buffs to do something, outside Thypus range and/or without putrescent vitality they have str 3 t3, they have only fnp they dont have invulnerable save (and that mean a lot), unit of Pb with scrivener near move faster and hit pretty fine, they re roll any wound, they can save at 4++. deliver 2-3 wound for each hit, when you face a shooty army you see the difference between pox and pb, i cant convince you here pb are pretty superior to poxes right now (remember after Faq you must pay for every poxwalker you generate beyond starting number) you must play them and judge yourself, ask urself why Nurgle demons (with average 60 Pb) are so good performing right now.

 blackmage wrote:
poxwalkers need buffs to do something, outside Thypus range and/or without putrescent vitality they have str 3 t3, they have only fnp they dont have invulnerable save (and that mean a lot), unit of Pb with scrivener near move faster and hit pretty fine, they re roll any wound, they can save at 4++. deliver 2-3 wound for each hit, when you face a shooty army you see the difference between pox and pb, i cant convince you here pb are pretty superior to poxes right now (remember after Faq you must pay for every poxwalker you generate beyond starting number) you must play them and judge yourself, ask urself why Nurgle demons (with average 60 Pb) are so good performing right now.

I definitely understand where you are coming from now. I'm so used to running Poxwalkers with Tally, that I hadn't even considered them as a separate option. It's funny how our brains sometimes make those assumptions. Ok, I'm working on a 3rd revision, will post shortly


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Ok, list version 3:

Updated again, I dropped Epidimius and just went with the daemon prince instead. I think I will get more consistent mileage out of him.


++ Super-Heavy Detachment +3CP (Chaos - Questor Traitoris) [43 PL, 821pts] ++
+ Lord of War +

Renegade Armigers [9 PL, 174pts]
. Renegade Armiger: Heavy stubber, Two armiger autocannons

Renegade Armigers [9 PL, 174pts]
. Renegade Armiger: Heavy stubber, Two armiger autocannons

Renegade Knight [25 PL, 473pts]: Heavy stubber
. Avenger gatling cannon and heavy flamer: Avenger gatling cannon, Heavy flamer
. Avenger gatling cannon and heavy flamer: Avenger gatling cannon, Heavy flamer

++ Fortification Network (Chaos - Daemons) [3 PL, 85pts] ++
Chaos Allegiance: Nurgle
+ Fortification +

Feculent Gnarlmaws [3 PL, 85pts]: Feculent Gnarlmaw

++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Chaos - Daemons) [65 PL, 1092pts] ++
Chaos Allegiance: Nurgle
+ HQ +

Daemon Prince of Nurgle [9 PL, 180pts]: 2. Living Plague, 5. Putrescent Vitality, Malefic talon, The Suppurating Plate, Warlord, Wings
Poxbringer [4 PL, 70pts]: Miasma of Pestilence
Spoilpox Scrivener [4 PL, 75pts]

+ Troops +

Nurglings [6 PL, 72pts]: 4x Nurgling Swarms
Nurglings [6 PL, 72pts]: 4x Nurgling Swarms
Plaguebearers [12 PL, 203pts]: 28x Plaguebearer, Plagueridden

+ Heavy Support +

Plagueburst Crawler [8 PL, 140pts]: 2x Plaguespitter, Heavy Slugger
Plagueburst Crawler [8 PL, 140pts]: 2x Plaguespitter, Heavy Slugger
Plagueburst Crawler [8 PL, 140pts]: 2x Plaguespitter, Heavy Slugger

++ Total: [111 PL, 1998pts] ++

 blackmage wrote:
poxwalkers need buffs to do something, outside Thypus range and/or without putrescent vitality they have str 3 t3, they have only fnp they dont have invulnerable save (and that mean a lot), unit of Pb with scrivener near move faster and hit pretty fine, they re roll any wound, they can save at 4++. deliver 2-3 wound for each hit, when you face a shooty army you see the difference between pox and pb, i cant convince you here pb are pretty superior to poxes right now (remember after Faq you must pay for every poxwalker you generate beyond starting number) you must play them and judge yourself, ask urself why Nurgle demons (with average 60 Pb) are so good performing right now.

Couldn't have said it better myself.

One note, Poxwalkers can still bulk themselves back to max; but they need Typhus, necrosius, and a Blightbringer to be pretty good still. PB's are superior out the gate


Automatically Appended Next Post:

valdier wrote:

 blackmage wrote:
poxwalkers need buffs to do something, outside Thypus range and/or without putrescent vitality they have str 3 t3, they have only fnp they dont have invulnerable save (and that mean a lot), unit of Pb with scrivener near move faster and hit pretty fine, they re roll any wound, they can save at 4++. deliver 2-3 wound for each hit, when you face a shooty army you see the difference between pox and pb, i cant convince you here pb are pretty superior to poxes right now (remember after Faq you must pay for every poxwalker you generate beyond starting number) you must play them and judge yourself, ask urself why Nurgle demons (with average 60 Pb) are so good performing right now.

I definitely understand where you are coming from now. I'm so used to running Poxwalkers with Tally, that I hadn't even considered them as a separate option. It's funny how our brains sometimes make those assumptions. Ok, I'm working on a 3rd revision, will post shortly


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Ok, list version 3:

Updated again, I dropped Epidimius and just went with the daemon prince instead. I think I will get more consistent mileage out of him.


++ Super-Heavy Detachment +3CP (Chaos - Questor Traitoris) [43 PL, 821pts] ++
+ Lord of War +

Renegade Armigers [9 PL, 174pts]
. Renegade Armiger: Heavy stubber, Two armiger autocannons

Renegade Armigers [9 PL, 174pts]
. Renegade Armiger: Heavy stubber, Two armiger autocannons

Renegade Knight [25 PL, 473pts]: Heavy stubber
. Avenger gatling cannon and heavy flamer: Avenger gatling cannon, Heavy flamer
. Avenger gatling cannon and heavy flamer: Avenger gatling cannon, Heavy flamer

++ Fortification Network (Chaos - Daemons) [3 PL, 85pts] ++
Chaos Allegiance: Nurgle
+ Fortification +

Feculent Gnarlmaws [3 PL, 85pts]: Feculent Gnarlmaw

++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Chaos - Daemons) [65 PL, 1092pts] ++
Chaos Allegiance: Nurgle
+ HQ +

Daemon Prince of Nurgle [9 PL, 180pts]: 2. Living Plague, 5. Putrescent Vitality, Malefic talon, The Suppurating Plate, Warlord, Wings
Poxbringer [4 PL, 70pts]: Miasma of Pestilence
Spoilpox Scrivener [4 PL, 75pts]

+ Troops +

Nurglings [6 PL, 72pts]: 4x Nurgling Swarms
Nurglings [6 PL, 72pts]: 4x Nurgling Swarms
Plaguebearers [12 PL, 203pts]: 28x Plaguebearer, Plagueridden

+ Heavy Support +

Plagueburst Crawler [8 PL, 140pts]: 2x Plaguespitter, Heavy Slugger
Plagueburst Crawler [8 PL, 140pts]: 2x Plaguespitter, Heavy Slugger
Plagueburst Crawler [8 PL, 140pts]: 2x Plaguespitter, Heavy Slugger

++ Total: [111 PL, 1998pts] ++

Personally, I actually like the list. Myself I'd take the biggest knight (because I love the flamer... its sooooo good), but I like this one; probably the best Knights heavy list I've seen for ITC.

 Zid wrote:


Personally, I actually like the list. Myself I'd take the biggest knight (because I love the flamer... its sooooo good), but I like this one; probably the best Knights heavy list I've seen for ITC.

Thank you,

I've clearly gotten a great amount of feedback from people on this (and I appreciate all of it). I know the list could be more optimal without the knights, but I feel like they will be fun either way

Because I ran into a question when playing the list...

I have deathguard embedded in daemons... (same battalion detachment), this means... no Locus of Virulence and no relic on any unit in this army, right?