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I listened to the video at the different times originally posted by the Englishman (see spoiler), and the translation is correct. I haven't watched the whole 5 hours video, tho... Some of it seemed like the guy "knew" the information (2 of the buggies being OP, 32mm bases for boys, 7 pts boys, grot still 3 pts, grot shield strategem, clan traits, no Ghazghkull new model, trukk boyz being viable, nobz being bad, BW being 120 pts) and at other times he seemed to be wishlisting (weirdboy stratagem for level 2, wartrike stats, teleporta stratagem) . But it could still be true. Seemed like educated guesses.

Hello everyone. I'm a french long time lurker and I'd like to give you a some informations regarding the french youtube channel everyone is talking about to give you some context.

The channel is called "French Wargame Studio" and it began as a fan-made channel by a passionate Warhammer player : Heavy (that's his name). Overtime, his channel became quite well-known in France because, well, they are not a lot of french speaking youtube channel about Warhammer

Some time ago, he contacted GW asking for something like a partnership (because it's not exactly a partnership, he doesn't work for GW but I can't find the appropriate english word for that) and GW was really impressed with the channel overall but wanted him to reach a specific number of susbscribers (if I remember correctly, I think it was 10K subscribers).

Since then the channel grew quite a bit and he has access to some sources inside GW and GW gives him access to new Codexes and releases (AoS V2, Killteam) very quickly so that he can put up reviews and make "unboxing" videos etc. Of course he doesn't know everything and of course he has to be careful about what he says. Nevertheless, everytime he gave a couple of informations about an upcoming release, he was right.

Therefore, I think you can mostly trust him.

Tastyfish wrote:

SemperMortis wrote:

Tastyfish wrote:
That extra point covers boyz getting a Klan trait and strategem access too. DDD might not be worth a point, and could easily be seen as a bugfix so that -2 to hit doesn't make ork shooting pointless (and hence make orks reluctant to advance), but a 6++ on a 6 point model would be worth a point.

As pointed out before, no other faction received a price hike on their troops simply because they gained access to Klan Trait (equivalents) or strategems. DDD isn't worth anything since its such a MINOR increase in shooting, if boyz went to 4+ to hit then yeah maybe a 1pt bump would be needed, but not for DDD, that was simply a way to make ork shooting at least not worthless against some armies/units. A 6+++ on a 6pt model is not worth a point either and as mentioned that is a Klan trait.

I said DDD was a bugfix, not something that would warrant a price change. 6+++ is definitely worth around a 1 point on a 6 point model - it'll save you 1pts worth of Ork per Ork just from saves, as well as likely saving another ork or two from morale if you had taken enough casualties for that to be an issue (say 12 guys from a unit of 24 - Snakebites only lose 10 and will lose another ork or two on a 5 or 6. Index orks will lose 12 and then D6 more Orks!) - plus it's a toughness boost on a tough horde infantry unit.

Assuming that the other traits are close to this, then a codex ork boy could well be worth 7 points once strats/psychics/traits are taken into account. What happened to other factions is irrelevant, as is how much they costed in the index - what matters is how much an Ork boy is worth in the new codex. And if you're going to write off playtesting by the development team, then not a lot to say - Codex Orks is a different list from Index Orks, no reason to expect things to stay the same.

Whether the boosts from other elements of the codex outweighs the increase in cost is what's going to determine whether Boyz have been buffed or nerfed. If I had to guess whether a Codex list with 7pt boyz would beat an index list with 6pt ones, both going boy heavy even - I'd put my money on the Codex Ladz.

You're saying that as if Ravenguard spends one extra ppm for a far superior -1 to hit.

Or Iron Hands.

Please advise of any faction or unit in the game that is priced based on unit synergy, chapter or warlord traits.

Ashkayel wrote:

 lolman1c wrote:
yeah, i feel like the translation needs context. He could be wish-listing and people are miss translating. However, out of all of them only 1 or two of the leaks are new so he could be getting them for the same source or just talking about stuff he has read.

Well like I said, sometimes he was saying it like he was wishlisting (see my previous post), but at other times (and most of the time), he was saying it like he had read the codex or playtested or spoke to someone who had. He was sure of the info.

Trust my native language, I'm not miss translating

Now it could still be false info. We shall see.

Hahaha, I was more saying that's you're more believable than others who post from a script. You hear the context of it... a bit like if someone was sarcastic but the translator never picked up on that and it sounds like the president is declaring war.


Automatically Appended Next Post:


thanks for the info mate!

 lolman1c wrote:
Hahaha, I was more saying that's you're more believable than others who post from a script. You hear the context of it... a bit like if someone was sarcastic but the translator never picked up on that and it sounds like the president is declaring war.

Haha right!

Can't wait to see the codex, I hope trukk boyz are a thing again! I'm really not a fan of green tides... And for me a green tide is bringing 60-90 boyz

I don't want to get into the big debate "is getting boyz at 7 ppm a nerf" but I'll say this (and I'm probably not the first one to say it), it may very well be deserved:

What we know:
- Boyz right now are decent, if not good;
- Boyz get DDD;
- Boyz get clan traits;
- Boyz get strategems;
What could happen:
- Boyz might get upgrades in stats or armor (like when they went S+1 in 8th index);
- Boyz might get more special rules;
- Boyz might get free/cheaper heavy weapons;
- Boyz might get access to more auras from units or relics;
- Boyz might get cheaper transports;
- Boyz will probably get 32mm bases, but it might never be enforced;
- Choppas might get better;
- Free boss nobz might get better;
- Other infantry units might get cost increase in the next CA;

Seriously, I don't care if other infantry units didn't get cost increase when they received traits and strategems in their codexes. What I care about is having a solid ork codex, with good balance overall and fun units.

I'd pay 7pts if there were two options like in the older codex. 6pts for the now boyz or 7pts for 4+ armour save boyz.

 lolman1c wrote:
I'd pay 7pts if there were two options like in the older codex. 6pts for the now boyz or 7pts for 4+ armour save boyz.

I can guarantee you they will not be giving us 4+ armor for 7pts, at most they might give us 5+ but that is a stretch. A 4+ would cost at least 2ppm, probably 3.

SemperMortis wrote:

 lolman1c wrote:
I'd pay 7pts if there were two options like in the older codex. 6pts for the now boyz or 7pts for 4+ armour save boyz.

I can guarantee you they will not be giving us 4+ armor for 7pts, at most they might give us 5+ but that is a stretch. A 4+ would cost at least 2ppm, probably 3.

AN ORK CAN DREAM! Also the leaked strat about us getting 4+ armour only if a vehicle blows up close by is kinda a tell tail sign we won't get 4+ armour.

I'd take 7ppm Boys if we got 5+ save. I can't see it though. Feel our resident Frenchman would have told us if Boys had changed further? Could be wrong though.

You Ork players are ridiculous regarding Boyz just like the IG players defending Infantry squads. You got a consistent S4, an extra attack, and the fact your 6+ save isn't just ignored by everything but Lasguns for no point increase, and now you got Klan rules and the Dakka rule. Yeah you go up a point. Deal with it.

That isn't even considering what units got price cuts which will likely do more than even out.

Also regarding troops that went up in price, I think Daemons got that treatment and then Grey Knight Terminators did as well with their codices.

Disappointment so far is the Grot Shield thing apparently being a strategem, would be ok if you play it on the Grots, but guessing its played on an Ork unit (so grots can only shield one), hoping it lasts for the remainder of the turn and its played when the shots come in.

Pity, it sounded something useful for Grots to have as an actual rule

 lolman1c wrote:

SemperMortis wrote:

 lolman1c wrote:
I'd pay 7pts if there were two options like in the older codex. 6pts for the now boyz or 7pts for 4+ armour save boyz.

I can guarantee you they will not be giving us 4+ armor for 7pts, at most they might give us 5+ but that is a stretch. A 4+ would cost at least 2ppm, probably 3.

AN ORK CAN DREAM! Also the leaked strat about us getting 4+ armour only if a vehicle blows up close by is kinda a tell tail sign we won't get 4+ armour.

I really hope we are getting 4+ or my 'ard boyz are going to have to go away!! That maybe the worst thing I have heard about this codex if true.

My 'ard boyz do well enough in their trukk at 10ppm, hope that doesn't change too.

leopard wrote:
Disappointment so far is the Grot Shield thing apparently being a strategem, would be ok if you play it on the Grots, but guessing its played on an Ork unit (so grots can only shield one), hoping it lasts for the remainder of the turn and its played when the shots come in.

Pity, it sounded something useful for Grots to have as an actual rule

It would've been a cool rule to have in general I agree, but at least the idea is there. I wish Cultists did the same thing for the CSM army.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
You Ork players are ridiculous regarding Boyz just like the IG players defending Infantry squads. You got a consistent S4, an extra attack, and the fact your 6+ save isn't just ignored by everything but Lasguns for no point increase, and now you got Klan rules and the Dakka rule. Yeah you go up a point. Deal with it.

That isn't even considering what units got price cuts which will likely do more than even out.

Also regarding troops that went up in price, I think Daemons got that treatment and then Grey Knight Terminators did as well with their codices.

wut? our 6+ save is always vulnerable to AP weapons, when did it become invulnerable? I mean I've entered a few tournaments now where my Boyz are all off the table turn one by marine flyers and aggressors. Especially the DA ones. Once they're gone I have no way to output any damage...

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
You Ork players are ridiculous regarding Boyz just like the IG players defending Infantry squads. You got a consistent S4, an extra attack, and the fact your 6+ save isn't just ignored by everything but Lasguns for no point increase, and now you got Klan rules and the Dakka rule. Yeah you go up a point. Deal with it.

That isn't even considering what units got price cuts which will likely do more than even out.

Also regarding troops that went up in price, I think Daemons got that treatment and then Grey Knight Terminators did as well with their codices.

Can't wait for Cultists to get that price increase they so obviously deserve.

Not all Daemon troops went up in cost, you're thinking of Brimstones and Blues, that were horribly, brokenly undercosted.

Anyway, doesn't matter... What will happen will happen and like the real Orks we will adapt to it. Worst case scenario is we will be in the same place as the index. Everything will suck apart from our Boyz but now they're 30pts more expensive for a blob of them... but it won't matter because orks pretty much sucked in the index anyway.

best case scenario, boyz are still okay for 7pts each and everything else is okay.

I highly doubt they will change the boys stat line. The increase to 7pts is probably in anticipation of CA increasing the cost of a lot of cheap infantry

 lolman1c wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
You Ork players are ridiculous regarding Boyz just like the IG players defending Infantry squads. You got a consistent S4, an extra attack, and the fact your 6+ save isn't just ignored by everything but Lasguns for no point increase, and now you got Klan rules and the Dakka rule. Yeah you go up a point. Deal with it.

That isn't even considering what units got price cuts which will likely do more than even out.

Also regarding troops that went up in price, I think Daemons got that treatment and then Grey Knight Terminators did as well with their codices.

wut? our 6+ save is always vulnerable to AP weapons, when did it become invulnerable? I mean I've entered a few tournaments now where my Boyz are all off the table turn one by marine flyers and aggressors. Especially the DA ones. Once they're gone I have no way to output any damage...

I'm not saying it's a Invul, but compared to how many weapons used to ignore the save and the new wounding system making most weapons hurt you less, it was a significant durability increase.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

 lolman1c wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
You Ork players are ridiculous regarding Boyz just like the IG players defending Infantry squads. You got a consistent S4, an extra attack, and the fact your 6+ save isn't just ignored by everything but Lasguns for no point increase, and now you got Klan rules and the Dakka rule. Yeah you go up a point. Deal with it.

That isn't even considering what units got price cuts which will likely do more than even out.

Also regarding troops that went up in price, I think Daemons got that treatment and then Grey Knight Terminators did as well with their codices.

wut? our 6+ save is always vulnerable to AP weapons, when did it become invulnerable? I mean I've entered a few tournaments now where my Boyz are all off the table turn one by marine flyers and aggressors. Especially the DA ones. Once they're gone I have no way to output any damage...

I'm not saying it's a Invul, but compared to how many weapons used to ignore the save and the new wounding system making most weapons hurt you less, it was a significant durability increase.

Comparing this edition to last is like comparing apples to iphones.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

 lolman1c wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
You Ork players are ridiculous regarding Boyz just like the IG players defending Infantry squads. You got a consistent S4, an extra attack, and the fact your 6+ save isn't just ignored by everything but Lasguns for no point increase, and now you got Klan rules and the Dakka rule. Yeah you go up a point. Deal with it.

That isn't even considering what units got price cuts which will likely do more than even out.

Also regarding troops that went up in price, I think Daemons got that treatment and then Grey Knight Terminators did as well with their codices.

wut? our 6+ save is always vulnerable to AP weapons, when did it become invulnerable? I mean I've entered a few tournaments now where my Boyz are all off the table turn one by marine flyers and aggressors. Especially the DA ones. Once they're gone I have no way to output any damage...

I'm not saying it's a Invul, but compared to how many weapons used to ignore the save and the new wounding system making most weapons hurt you less, it was a significant durability increase.

Everything you're saying is based on a bias and isn't taking into consideration all the factors.

Ork boys don't exist in a vacuum.

The 6+ gets ignored by anything with an AP value, which is nearly the same as last Ed, except for boltguns losing their AP.

The permanent S4 is an improvement. Free nobs is an improvement. Loss of eavy armor on nob and on the boys mob is bad. Cost increases on special weapons were bad.

Loss of 1" of base movement speed was really bad.

If they stay as is, plus chapter tactics (bringing them to par), and DDD, with cost savings on trukks and battlewagons, plus 1 ppm - they aren't exactly going to be overpowered.

What will be the big determining factor is transports, synergy/auras, wargear and options and cost changes on those, and the strategems making it easier to get to the assault with controlled model bleed.

And we just don't have enough data on that given the leaks currently. The +1 ppm is currently bad news until we see other mitigating factors. The 32mm base thing is also concerning. But we can't really have hyperbole in either direction until more info hits.

So let's stay neutral, read the news as it is, and go forward based on that lack of bias for or against the faction. Some of the language you used made me question the impartiality of the analysis.

I agree with the above

 Billagio wrote:
I highly doubt they will change the boys stat line. The increase to 7pts is probably in anticipation of CA increasing the cost of a lot of cheap infantry

I suspect as much. I expect there will be 0 Points Changes to Orks in CA2018, with everything already baked into the codex.

The real questions are:
1. Boyz are going up, but is anything coming down?
2. How widespread will points changes for other Codexes be in Chapter Approved.

Only once both set of questions are answered will the true place for Orks in the codex power curve be determined.

Right.

Now I’m good and drunk, I’m back to the mentality of a much younger gamer.

These models? Ace.

Their rules? Provided they’re stupid fast, and the rules reflect that (some kind of negative mod to enemy BS), reckon I’m all good. Single Krak should probably bollocks up their day. Just had to hit first!

Their Dakka? Don’t care if it’s inaccurate, long as there’s loadsa dice involved, and the hits actual matter a damn.

 TedNugent wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

 lolman1c wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
You Ork players are ridiculous regarding Boyz just like the IG players defending Infantry squads. You got a consistent S4, an extra attack, and the fact your 6+ save isn't just ignored by everything but Lasguns for no point increase, and now you got Klan rules and the Dakka rule. Yeah you go up a point. Deal with it.

That isn't even considering what units got price cuts which will likely do more than even out.

Also regarding troops that went up in price, I think Daemons got that treatment and then Grey Knight Terminators did as well with their codices.

wut? our 6+ save is always vulnerable to AP weapons, when did it become invulnerable? I mean I've entered a few tournaments now where my Boyz are all off the table turn one by marine flyers and aggressors. Especially the DA ones. Once they're gone I have no way to output any damage...

I'm not saying it's a Invul, but compared to how many weapons used to ignore the save and the new wounding system making most weapons hurt you less, it was a significant durability increase.

Everything you're saying is based on a bias and isn't taking into consideration all the factors.

Ork boys don't exist in a vacuum.

The 6+ gets ignored by anything with an AP value, which is nearly the same as last Ed, except for boltguns losing their AP.

The permanent S4 is an improvement. Free nobs is an improvement. Loss of eavy armor on nob and on the boys mob is bad. Cost increases on special weapons were bad.

Loss of 1" of base movement speed was really bad.

If they stay as is, plus chapter tactics (bringing them to par), and DDD, with cost savings on trukks and battlewagons, plus 1 ppm - they aren't exactly going to be overpowered.

What will be the big determining factor is transports, synergy/auras, wargear and options and cost changes on those, and the strategems making it easier to get to the assault with controlled model bleed.

And we just don't have enough data on that given the leaks currently. The +1 ppm is currently bad news until we see other mitigating factors. The 32mm base thing is also concerning. But we can't really have hyperbole in either direction until more info hits.

So let's stay neutral, read the news as it is, and go forward based on that lack of bias for or against the faction. Some of the language you used made me question the impartiality of the analysis.

1. The AP is nearly the same? LOL. Have you really seen the weapon profiles this edition or not? It's not everything "except for boltguns".
2. Everyone got the same special weapon treatments and then costs went down with the codices. Same applies here.
3. The +1 point isn't bad news considering Boyz didn't get worse in any area and improved significantly if anything.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Right.

Now I’m good and drunk, I’m back to the mentality of a much younger gamer.

These models? Ace.

Their rules? Provided they’re stupid fast, and the rules reflect that (some kind of negative mod to enemy BS), reckon I’m all good. Single Krak should probably bollocks up their day. Just had to hit first!

Their Dakka? Don’t care if it’s inaccurate, long as there’s loadsa dice involved, and the hits actual matter a damn.

This is about where I am right now.. drunk, just want fun models.

Tested some of the traits today.

Bad moonz + dakkadakkadakka is really annoying. It really slows down the rolls.

We were trying to figure out the order of operations.

Roll some twin big shootas.

Bunch of 1's, bunch of 6's.

Re-roll the 1's, get some 6's, does dakka dakka activate?

Get a dakka dakka dakka 6, then roll a 1, that is a "seperate" to hit roll, so would you then get a reroll from that for the bad moonz trait?

So it was possible to roll a 1, then roll a 6, which generates another shot, which you roll a 1 from, which you then reroll. (because it is a separate to hit roll).

Deathskullz was my favorite so far. 6++ was fantastic. Really helped save cp by having the free 1 reroll to hit or damage (saved all for damage rolls).

(Of course this is all not fully confirmed, just reporting to change up some of the chattin and get some feedback).

 greggles wrote:
Tested some of the traits today.

Bad moonz + dakkadakkadakka is really annoying. It really slows down the rolls.

We were trying to figure out the order of operations.

Roll some twin big shootas.

Bunch of 1's, bunch of 6's.

Re-roll the 1's, get some 6's, does dakka dakka activate?

Get a dakka dakka dakka 6, then roll a 1, that is a "seperate" to hit roll, so would you then get a reroll from that for the bad moonz trait?

So it was possible to roll a 1, then roll a 6, which generates another shot, which you roll a 1 from, which you then reroll. (because it is a separate to hit roll).

Isn't DDD just another autohit on a 6? You don't roll for it as far as I know.

It's not an auto hit, it generates an additional shot, which you then roll for, thus creating the cycle again. The only thing listed in the DDD is that a DDD can not explode into another DDD.

 greggles wrote:
It's not an auto hit, it generates an additional shot, which you then roll for, thus creating the cycle again. The only thing listed in the DDD is that a DDD can not explode into another DDD.

Ah, went and looked at the rule again. That does seem pretty clunky.

new video from bob

 greggles wrote:
Tested some of the traits today.

Bad moonz + dakkadakkadakka is really annoying. It really slows down the rolls.

We were trying to figure out the order of operations.

Roll some twin big shootas.

Bunch of 1's, bunch of 6's.

Re-roll the 1's, get some 6's, does dakka dakka activate?

Get a dakka dakka dakka 6, then roll a 1, that is a "seperate" to hit roll, so would you then get a reroll from that for the bad moonz trait?

So it was possible to roll a 1, then roll a 6, which generates another shot, which you roll a 1 from, which you then reroll. (because it is a separate to hit roll).

Deathskullz was my favorite so far. 6++ was fantastic. Really helped save cp by having the free 1 reroll to hit or damage (saved all for damage rolls).

(Of course this is all not fully confirmed, just reporting to change up some of the chattin and get some feedback).

Yeah, roll to hit, reroll those 1s, then roll additional dice for your 6s, then reroll the new 1s. Pretty long. I've started using Assault Dice app for this, I'm getting the hang of it.

The sad thing about this whole thing? Even with the trait and DDD, it STILL isn't as good as BS 4+ ...