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so i bought dullcote for the first time because people swear by it being a really good flat finnish well then...... i got 3 cans , i shook the hell out of the can to make sure it well mixed and tested it on a warhammer figure painted with citadel paints and it comes out with a shine to it definitely not like people have been saying its far from matt. i tested it again on 2 figure by doing a thick layer on one and then a few thin layers on another and both still look more like a satin finnish. thoughts?

I use a satin varnish on all of my minis - it does look like crap, but after it dries I spray Army Painter Anti-Shine on it. It's one of the few products the company makes that isn't crap. However, it IS crap at protecting a paint job on its own. It's really only good for dulling down the shine.

I've previously used a glossy finish - thinking it would protect it better than satin, but it takes alot of anti-shine to dull down.

SirWeeble wrote:
I use a satin varnish on all of my minis - it does look like crap, but after it dries I spray Army Painter Anti-Shine on it. It's one of the few products the company makes that isn't crap. However, it IS crap at protecting a paint job on its own. It's really only good for dulling down the shine.

I've previously used a glossy finish - thinking it would protect it better than satin, but it takes alot of anti-shine to dull down.

ok ill have a look, have you used testors i want to know why people think its good because what ive seen using it it sucks.

Used tons of cans of Dullcote in the past and never had a problem with it. There's a reason why it has a good reputation. Sorry it didn't work in your one instance.

 Elbows wrote:
Used tons of cans of Dullcote in the past and never had a problem with it. There's a reason why it has a good reputation. Sorry it didn't work in your one instance.

well i tried the second can and its not matt, is there a difference between ea and us versions?

lethalsnake wrote:

 Elbows wrote:
Used tons of cans of Dullcote in the past and never had a problem with it. There's a reason why it has a good reputation. Sorry it didn't work in your one instance.

well i tried the second can and its not matt, is there a difference between ea and us versions?

Yes. The formula changed about a decade ago as there was a chemical in it that is not legal in the EU.

Could be environmental conditions, too. If it's too cold or too damp that'll affect the result.

Interesting. Generally people complain that Dullcote is TOO flat, and it kills the shine of their metallic paints.

Eh, I don’t love dullcote. At its best it’s okay, but I’ve found it’s too prone to frosting or hazing.

I also tried Vallejo matte airbrush varnish but I didn’t really like that either.

I went back to krylon matte. It’s a bit more towards satin, but everything seems to look better with it.

I don't know where this common perception that Dullcote is a super flat finish comes from.

I have used Dullcote spray before the reformulation that removed toluene, and after the reformulation. I've used the airbrush-on lacquer in a bottle as well. This has been several times over a roughly fifteen-year period.

In all that time, with all those permutations, it has never been as matte as my Vallejo Model Color paints. It's not satin, but it's not matte either. It'll dull down the shine of metallics, but the rest of the model gets a toylike sheen that I can't stand.

I now use AK Interactive Ultra Matte through an airbrush, and the difference is night and day. I still use Dullcote, but only to provide a protective layer before the Ultra Matte.

It's called 'dull coat'...

When it comes to Testors Dullcote, there are a few caveats you need to be aware of.
The most important of which is that Testors Dullcote is a lacquer based spray. Because of this it uses a thinning agent that may not react well with certain paints. I've found the results to be very hit and miss. I've seen it react negativity to Micron pens on one project and not on the other. Other models have reported similarly mixed experiences with Gundam Markers.
On one project the spray resulted in a weird, blotchy look which I've never experienced before. By using light coats you can help reduce the impact of the thinning agent.

In addition it's easy to be so light with your sprays that you achieve an uneven consistency. When I top coat I always look at my pieces very closely under harsh light to make sure I've coated everything properly. If you're not careful the cost of cans can quickly add up. Once you get a full coat with Testors Dullcote additional coats don't really add any benefit to the look.

It's also got a rather narrow window where it's optimal to use it. Not too dry, too humid, too windy, too hot or too cold. Here that leaves me around 4 days a year in which to use it.

We're working on an additive that you can add to any paint that takes the shine straight out of it just by mixing it in, current tests are proving positive with colours going extremely flat.

We're trying to balance up the consistency as at the moment you only have to add a pinhead amount to the paint to make it extreme matte

 Supershandy wrote:
We're working on an additive that you can add to any paint that takes the shine straight out of it just by mixing it in, current tests are proving positive with colours going extremely flat.

We're trying to balance up the consistency as at the moment you only have to add a pinhead amount to the paint to make it extreme matte

Which is nice and all, but doesn't protect the paint job from chipping and wear. It doesn't matter how flat the paint is if the varnish is at best, semi-gloss.

You might be able to add the Instar product to acrylic medium or some other transparent coating.

 Vulcan wrote:

Which is nice and all, but doesn't protect the paint job from chipping and wear. It doesn't matter how flat the paint is if the varnish is at best, semi-gloss.

I've never varnished my gaming figures. Unless you're awfully rough with them, decent quality acrylics shouldn't really need sealing.

 insaniak wrote:

 Vulcan wrote:

Which is nice and all, but doesn't protect the paint job from chipping and wear. It doesn't matter how flat the paint is if the varnish is at best, semi-gloss.

I've never varnished my gaming figures. Unless you're awfully rough with them, decent quality acrylics shouldn't really need sealing.

Not the case with the one true casting medium, metal. I am pretty delicate with my ACTA stuff and even with three coats of varnish there has been some chipping.

I've noticed that in times of direct sun, my ultra flat primer will be shiney. Also noticed ambient humidity affects sprays. That could be it...

 ingtaer wrote:

Not the case with the one true casting medium, metal. I am pretty delicate with my ACTA stuff and even with three coats of varnish there has been some chipping.

I have metal models that I've been using for 20 years that are still doing just fine without varnish.

 insaniak wrote:

 Vulcan wrote:

Which is nice and all, but doesn't protect the paint job from chipping and wear. It doesn't matter how flat the paint is if the varnish is at best, semi-gloss.

I've never varnished my gaming figures. Unless you're awfully rough with them, decent quality acrylics shouldn't really need sealing.

I've heard a few people say this, and I'm sure they're all liars. One of them also tells me not to wear my seat belt.

I was told to use a regular, glossy spray varnish as the main coat for protecting the paint then use the dull coat lightly to cut down the gloss.

Any metal figures I've ever seen eventually lose chips of paint at the sharper edges, unless the paint is something other than acrylic. Acrylic paint just doesn't seem to ever really stick to metal; it just seems to sort of stick to itself as a single continuous layer, kind of "surrounding" the model. Not that I find the effect particularly bothersome. It sometimes takes years for chips to appear, and on really old figurines, I find the look to be a kind of endearing.

 Elbows wrote:
Used tons of cans of Dullcote in the past and never had a problem with it. There's a reason why it has a good reputation. Sorry it didn't work in your one instance.

Same here. I've been using it for over a decade now, first on my G.I.Joe customs and since a year on Warhammer stuff.

 Salabasama wrote:
You might be able to add the Instar product to acrylic medium or some other transparent coating.

It's already an acrylic We're just trying to find the best carrier and ratio for the best working experience.

just being honest i tested testors on a range of figures and in different conditions still not as good as people would make out. i actually picked up the tamiya ts80 flat clear spray and it blasted testors out the water on the first spray test gave metal and plastics a very nice matt/flat Finnish id really recommended it it was flat over just the paint and turn the hycote car lacquer on another figure matt to.

Used it all the time. But nowhere to buy it anymore. Never had issues and was always super super matt. Always got rid of the nasty shine on metallic

Try using watered down Elmers glue. I've used it a few times and it leaves a really nice dull finish

 Breotan wrote:
I was told to use a regular, glossy spray varnish as the main coat for protecting the paint then use the dull coat lightly to cut down the gloss.

I've heard that too, but I've also heard that gloss varnish isn't actually any tougher than matt; the increase in protection is down to using two layers of varnish. What it does do is make it easier to see if you've completely covered the model; firstly with the gloss you'll see if you missed a bit because it'll be dull, then with the matt, any bits you miss will remain shiny. Also it'll give you advance warning if the varnish is wearing off; it a section goes shiny it means the top layer of varnish is wearing away so you can re-apply before it affects the paint.

I personally use a coat of Pledge Floor Care floor polish (it used to be called Future), and then a coat of Army Painter anti-shine to get rid of the shine. Overall I think it works really well.

 KingCracker wrote:
Try using watered down Elmers glue. I've used it a few times and it leaves a really nice dull finish

The problem with this is that Elmers (PVA) glue is hydroscopic - In humid weather it can go milky due to absorbing water from the air. And over time it will slowly go yellow.