What happed to drop pods

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**zedsdead**

Make them free.

Strat: 1-3 CP buys 1-3 Drop Pods

*Ignore Stormbolter
* Can not be placed within 3" of an objective

fixed

**Insectum7**

tneva82 wrote:
Except DS doesn't add up all that much if at all. 1 pts at most

1 point to make a model immune to enemy fire, then set up within Rapid-Fire Plasma range? Yeah... no.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Blackie wrote:
Drop pods are the only models in my entire collection that I've bought only for gaming purpose since I found them ugly but very powerful rules wise in 7th.

What happened to them? SM of all kinds can deep strike in a thousand ways, they can't carry some units that may benefit from them anymore like wulfen, they can't arrive in flamers or melta ranges. They also cost twice the points (three times the points at index times) than they used to be.

Same, I bought mine for 6th Ed and loaded them with Sternguard and Command Squads, and they were rude AF. Nowadays I think we're back to Sternguard and Command Squads, though the loadout is a bit different.

Well, actually not much different. My Sternguard in 6th were all Combi-Plasma, too.

**Pandabeer**

Crimson wrote:
Well, that two point storm shield thing must be some bizarre accident. It is completely ludicrous.

It's probably due to the fact that Marines were hit the hardest by the transition to armor save modifiers and GW wanted to give them something to make them more durable without tweaking their statlines. So here we go, 2 pt SS (which, by the way, means nothing if that guard squad in RF range gets FRFSRF and obliterates your precious veterans anyway).

**Asherian Command**

Insectum7 wrote:
tneva82 wrote:
Except DS doesn't add up all that much if at all. 1 pts at most

1 point to make a model immune to enemy fire, then set up within Rapid-Fire Plasma range? Yeah... no.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Blackie wrote:
Drop pods are the only models in my entire collection that I've bought only for gaming purpose since I found them ugly but very powerful rules wise in 7th.

What happened to them? SM of all kinds can deep strike in a thousand ways, they can't carry some units that may benefit from them anymore like wulfen, they can't arrive in flamers or melta ranges. They also cost twice the points (three times the points at index times) than they used to be.

Same, I bought mine for 6th Ed and loaded them with Sternguard and Command Squads, and they were rude AF. Nowadays I think we're back to Sternguard and Command Squads, though the loadout is a bit different.

Well, actually not much different. My Sternguard in 6th were all Combi-Plasma, too.

I bought 1 drop pod and haven't used it since, i then took it apart and made it a terrain piece.

**Insectum7**

Pandabeer wrote:
Crimson wrote:
Well, that two point storm shield thing must be some bizarre accident. It is completely ludicrous.

It's probably due to the fact that Marines were hit the hardest by the transition to armor save modifiers and GW wanted to give them something to make them more durable without tweaking their statlines. So here we go, 2 pt SS (which, by the way, means nothing if that guard squad in RF range gets FRFSRF and obliterates your precious veterans anyway).

Really? Is that what's happening to you? The problem is not the power armor.

**Marmatag**

Drop Pods uselessness is exacerbated by the simple fact that your opponents giant infantry blobs can charge them, and spread out to control the map. Then, you can't shoot them, and they must be dealt with in melee. Yes you landed with your overpriced drop pod and maybe killed something, but you just made all of your opponents chaff effectively invincible. And it will sit there, until they decide they need a kill point or perhaps want to get Big Game Hunter.

They are horrible, bringing them is honestly a liability more than anything else.

They need new rules.

Allowing the contents to disembark and then move normally before acting would be a huge step in the right direction for them. Yeah, marines would have 3" charges out of pods. So what? The set of units that can actually ride in a pod is limited, and screens exist. Genestealer cults already get deep strike + move, so the game has already embraced the idea of guaranteed charges out of DS.

I would also make them fast attack, like they should be, and 35 points.

**Insectum7**

Marmatag wrote:
Drop Pods uselessness is exacerbated by the simple fact that your opponents giant infantry blobs can charge them, and spread out to control the map. Then, you can't shoot them, and they must be dealt with in melee. Yes you landed with your overpriced drop pod and maybe killed something, but you just made all of your opponents chaff effectively invincible.

They are horrible, bringing them is honestly a liability more than anything else.

Guard maybe (depends on soup ingredients), Tyranids, sure. Eldar always seem to have exposure as their squads tend small.

**Asherian Command**

Insectum7 wrote:
Pandabeer wrote:
Crimson wrote:
Well, that two point storm shield thing must be some bizarre accident. It is completely ludicrous.

It's probably due to the fact that Marines were hit the hardest by the transition to armor save modifiers and GW wanted to give them something to make them more durable without tweaking their statlines. So here we go, 2 pt SS (which, by the way, means nothing if that guard squad in RF range gets FRFSRF and obliterates your precious veterans anyway).

Really? Is that what's happening to you? The problem is not the power armor.

I think it is the super prevalence of super heavies >.>

**Marmatag**

Insectum7 wrote:
Marmatag wrote:
Drop Pods uselessness is exacerbated by the simple fact that your opponents giant infantry blobs can charge them, and spread out to control the map. Then, you can't shoot them, and they must be dealt with in melee. Yes you landed with your overpriced drop pod and maybe killed something, but you just made all of your opponents chaff effectively invincible.

They are horrible, bringing them is honestly a liability more than anything else.

Guard maybe (depends on soup ingredients), Tyranids, sure. Eldar always seem to have exposure as their squads tend small.

Guard of course, people bring more than the loyal 32, and honestly, if you can make those guys invincible you do it. Their job is to block your opponent more than anything else. They might even charge it with a sentinel, their job is to deny area.

Tyranids of course. I would love to charge it with my GS. They can fall back and charge the next turn, so them being invincible to your shooting is always nice.

Genestealer cults of course.

Orks of course.

Anyone with chaff of any kind. A space wolves player with a Cyberwolf could charge the wolf into the pod and create a beautiful 9" denial bubble for 15 points.

Any army that has a model they want to protect from shooting.

Eldar would absolutely laugh at the pod. Thank you for the kill points. As a Dark Eldar player, i would charge that pod with a bunch of venoms and my ravagers. Guess what you can't shoot for a full turn, and guess what can shoot you on my turn? Any unit with FLY may as well charge the pod, in any army, because they can fall back and still shoot. Tau come to mind.

As a space wolves player you might want to charge the pod to pop a saga. Saga of the Beast Slayer i believe would pop from killing a pod.

Any army that can fall-back and still act would benefit from charging a pod.

This is a joke thread, and Drop Pods are gak.

**fe40k**

Drop Pods protect from stratagems that allow you to shoot a unit that arrives via deepstrike, so...

**Insectum7**

Marmatag wrote:
Insectum7 wrote:
Marmatag wrote:
Drop Pods uselessness is exacerbated by the simple fact that your opponents giant infantry blobs can charge them, and spread out to control the map. Then, you can't shoot them, and they must be dealt with in melee. Yes you landed with your overpriced drop pod and maybe killed something, but you just made all of your opponents chaff effectively invincible.

They are horrible, bringing them is honestly a liability more than anything else.

Guard maybe (depends on soup ingredients), Tyranids, sure. Eldar always seem to have exposure as their squads tend small.

Guard of course, people bring more than the loyal 32, and honestly, if you can make those guys invincible you do it. Their job is to block your opponent more than anything else. They might even charge it with a sentinel, their job is to deny area.

Tyranids of course. I would love to charge it with my GS. They can fall back and charge the next turn, so them being invincible to your shooting is always nice.

Genestealer cults of course.

Orks of course.

Anyone with chaff of any kind. A space wolves player with a Cyberwolf could charge the wolf into the pod and create a beautiful 9" denial bubble for 15 points.

Any army that has a model they want to protect from shooting.

Eldar would absolutely laugh at the pod. Thank you for the kill points. As a Dark Eldar player, i would charge that pod with a bunch of venoms and my ravagers. Guess what you can't shoot for a full turn, and guess what can shoot you on my turn? Any unit with FLY may as well charge the pod, in any army, because they can fall back and still shoot. Tau come to mind.

As a space wolves player you might want to charge the pod to pop a saga. Saga of the Beast Slayer i believe would pop from killing a pod.

Any army that can fall-back and still act would benefit from charging a pod.

This is a joke thread, and Drop Pods are gak.

Yeah. . . m'ok.

I guess two can play at this game. There will be no Ravagers on the table to charge the Pods. There, that was easy.

**Marmatag**

That's a pretty weak answer to a very real problem. You can try to dismiss it offhand if you want. But it does make you appear clownish.

**Insectum7**

Marmatag wrote:
That's a pretty weak answer to a very real problem. You can try to dismiss it offhand if you want. But it does make you appear clownish.

Is that more or less clowninsh than: "My Ravagers will kill 30 Marines a turn."?

Fair enough that models can charge the Pod, it is an issue. But my post was more about the fact that Eldar don't screen as effectively as other armies, at least not that I've seen. While Tyranids, Guard and Orks can cover the board, the nature of the Eldar operation seems to always leave potential space to exploit.

Imo pods can be used in three main ways.
A: Bring in reinforcements into your own line to defend against enemy attack.
B: Exploit a gap in board control to make a new front.
C: Suicide attack.

As long as the matchup against the enemy army allows one of those responses, Pods might have a use. Against Eldar (/Elite armies), option C can be a real threat that the opponent has to defend against, which can sap some offensive output. Against Kraken Nids (for example) I'd expect to be using option A or B, rather than C. Against Eldar, in the past I've been able to use B and C. The points might be there to make it viable again.

**Bharring**

As for "3 inch Marine charges", I have an army full of Aspect Warriors who would be terrified of that. The Scorpions and Banshees might hold their own point-for-point if you don't shoot first. None of the other Aspects would have a fighting chance.

**Insectum7**

Bharring wrote:
As for "3 inch Marine charges", I have an army full of Aspect Warriors who would be terrified of that. The Scorpions and Banshees might hold their own point-for-point if you don't shoot first. None of the other Aspects would have a fighting chance.

Yeah I think we have to assume 3" charges are a no-go. Look for board control advantages and threat overload rather than "guaranteed insta-kill". Half the value of the Veterans with Storm Shields is the idea of soaking return fire and drawing it away from the rest of the army. Drop them in cover for a 2+, 3++ and they're going to take serious effort to git rid of. If that effort is spent against Veterans instead of Devastators/whatever, there's a good potential return value.

**Asherian Command**

Insectum7 wrote:
Bharring wrote:
As for "3 inch Marine charges", I have an army full of Aspect Warriors who would be terrified of that. The Scorpions and Banshees might hold their own point-for-point if you don't shoot first. None of the other Aspects would have a fighting chance.

Yeah I think we have to assume 3" charges are a no-go. Look for board control advantages and threat overload rather than "guaranteed insta-kill". Half the value of the Veterans with Storm Shields is the idea of soaking return fire and drawing it away from the rest of the army. Drop them in cover for a 2+, 3++ and they're going to take serious effort to git rid of. If that effort is spent against Veterans instead of Devastators/whatever, there's a good potential return value.

Potentially but i don't think people will ignore devastators if they are the closer target. Devastators are a glass cannon unit and should remain so. Dropping them in a drop pod is probably the dumbest move i've ever seen happen and i've seen it happen. Drop pod landed next to a squad of guardians. bye bye devastators.

If anything it should allow units to move and shoot, and allow other units (Such as vanguard) to charge that turn. (OP yes but they would be the only unit in the game to do so and would be their old ability they used to have which allowed them to do just that).

**Jaxler**

ZergSmasher wrote:
Pods would be worth it if there was a unit that was worth putting in one. Currently there is no such unit. Vanguard Vets can DS natively, as can Terminators. Assault Centurions come to mind, but they can't ride in a pod anymore. The only thing that comes to mind that can actually ride in a pod is a squad of Veterans (Sternguard or regular Company veterans) with melta or plasma, preferably plasma. Even then there are better ways to get them up the board. Now, if Primaris marines could take a pod, you could drop in a unit of Hellblasters or Aggressors and that might actually be useful, but even then I'm not sure I could justify the 65 points (although that is certainly better than the 100+ points they were at the start of 8th!).

I'll admit, back in 7th there were whole lists built around every unit arriving by Drop Pod, and they were unfun to play against. The so-called Null Deployment lists, where if you got stuck with first turn you literally lost a turn because there was nothing to shoot at. But at least the models had a purpose and were actually useful, and there were ways to beat a Pod-heavy list. Now, they only have a place in narrative or very casual games.

My tau ate drop pod lists like they were cereal back in 7th. If I went first, I /alwsys/ shot first.

**Insectum7**

Asherian Command wrote:
Insectum7 wrote:
Bharring wrote:
As for "3 inch Marine charges", I have an army full of Aspect Warriors who would be terrified of that. The Scorpions and Banshees might hold their own point-for-point if you don't shoot first. None of the other Aspects would have a fighting chance.

Yeah I think we have to assume 3" charges are a no-go. Look for board control advantages and threat overload rather than "guaranteed insta-kill". Half the value of the Veterans with Storm Shields is the idea of soaking return fire and drawing it away from the rest of the army. Drop them in cover for a 2+, 3++ and they're going to take serious effort to git rid of. If that effort is spent against Veterans instead of Devastators/whatever, there's a good potential return value.

Potentially but i don't think people will ignore devastators if they are the closer target. Devastators are a glass cannon unit and should remain so. Dropping them in a drop pod is probably the dumbest move i've ever seen happen and i've seen it happen. Drop pod landed next to a squad of guardians. bye bye devastators.

If anything it should allow units to move and shoot, and allow other units (Such as vanguard) to charge that turn. (OP yes but they would be the only unit in the game to do so and would be their old ability they used to have which allowed them to do just that).

Scenario I suggested was Devastators in backfield, Veterans with 3++ and Plasma Dropping up front.

I don't know what opponent drops Devastators next to Guardians, but sure, I wouldn't recommend that. I've definitely gotten value out of dropped Devastators though. You don't have to drop them near anything though, depending on your guns.

**Asherian Command**

Insectum7 wrote:
Asherian Command wrote:
Insectum7 wrote:
Bharring wrote:
As for "3 inch Marine charges", I have an army full of Aspect Warriors who would be terrified of that. The Scorpions and Banshees might hold their own point-for-point if you don't shoot first. None of the other Aspects would have a fighting chance.

Yeah I think we have to assume 3" charges are a no-go. Look for board control advantages and threat overload rather than "guaranteed insta-kill". Half the value of the Veterans with Storm Shields is the idea of soaking return fire and drawing it away from the rest of the army. Drop them in cover for a 2+, 3++ and they're going to take serious effort to git rid of. If that effort is spent against Veterans instead of Devastators/whatever, there's a good potential return value.

Potentially but i don't think people will ignore devastators if they are the closer target. Devastators are a glass cannon unit and should remain so. Dropping them in a drop pod is probably the dumbest move i've ever seen happen and i've seen it happen. Drop pod landed next to a squad of guardians. bye bye devastators.

If anything it should allow units to move and shoot, and allow other units (Such as vanguard) to charge that turn. (OP yes but they would be the only unit in the game to do so and would be their old ability they used to have which allowed them to do just that).

Scenario I suggested was Devastators in backfield, Veterans with 3++ and Plasma Dropping up front.

I don't know what opponent drops Devastators next to Guardians, but sure, I wouldn't recommend that. I've definitely gotten value out of dropped Devastators though. You don't have to drop them near anything though, depending on your guns.

Still the dumbest game i've ever played. "Oh space marines are so good!" *plops his whole army within range of my guardians*

*internal confusion*

Veterans with 3++ would be great. but they need at least +1 wound. Great choice though if only we could take a primaris unit with Bobby g that had stormshields and could deploy from drop pods :(

**Insectum7**

Asherian Command wrote:
. . .if only we could take a primaris unit with Bobby g that had stormshields and could deploy from drop pods :(

It's probably good that you can't.

**Asherian Command**

Insectum7 wrote:
Asherian Command wrote:
. . .if only we could take a primaris unit with Bobby g that had stormshields and could deploy from drop pods :(

It's probably good that you can't.

I mean we have Vitrix guard now with stormshields and power weapons. But whether they are good or not is up for debate.

**Marmatag**

PRIMARIS as a restrictive keyword makes no sense at this point.

I would say flatten the whole thing out and just treat PRIMARIS in the same way TERMINATOR models are treated.

Your average marine of any kind can pay +4 points per model to become a primaris.

Primaris Veterans,
Primaris TAC marines,
Primaris devastator marines,

etc.

People instantly start buying primaris for conversions as well.

**Slayer-Fan123**

Asherian Command wrote:
Insectum7 wrote:
Asherian Command wrote:
. . .if only we could take a primaris unit with Bobby g that had stormshields and could deploy from drop pods :(

It's probably good that you can't.

I mean we have Vitrix guard now with stormshields and power weapons. But whether they are good or not is up for debate.

Eh I like them sorta, but not as Ultramarines.

**Racerguy180**

JohnnyHell wrote:Termites FTW

Hell yeah....as soon as they're $37. I have no problem paying extra for the FW tax, but I think they could make a very similar drill in plastic for 1/2 the price(not points just pure $).

I'm still looking to pick up a couple pods just for modeling/display. cant wait for the new forgeworld dreadpod & the eventual primaris pod.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
Asherian Command wrote:
Insectum7 wrote:
Asherian Command wrote:
. . .if only we could take a primaris unit with Bobby g that had stormshields and could deploy from drop pods :(

It's probably good that you can't.

I mean we have Vitrix guard now with stormshields and power weapons. But whether they are good or not is up for debate.

Eh I like them sorta, but not as Ultramarines.

I want primaris thunder hammers and those shields.

**bullyboy**

Crimson wrote:
Well, that two point storm shield thing must be some bizarre accident. It is completely ludicrous.

I think a combat shield is an add on though, right? So a Sgt could take a ranged weapon, melee weapon and then add a combat shield. That is pretty useful, especially if rest of sad have the SS

**Asherian Command**

bullyboy wrote:
Crimson wrote:
Well, that two point storm shield thing must be some bizarre accident. It is completely ludicrous.

I think a combat shield is an add on though, right? So a Sgt could take a ranged weapon, melee weapon and then add a combat shield. That is pretty useful, especially if rest of sad have the SS

so I have to pay more to have a worse invulnerable save? Having a stormshield is more valuable because ++3

**Blackie**

Pandabeer wrote:

Anyway, I was thinking that maybe a WG plasma squad + cheap Lord for the rerolls might be nice. Kit 5 out with combi-plasma and plasma pistol, 4 with Stormbolter/SS (to not break the bank and have some ablative wounds) and give your Lord his own combi-plasma (and maybe a solid melee weapon to dissuade would-be chargers). You basically pay 65 (?) points to save 2 CP (you don't have to use the outflank stratagem), the freedom to deploy wherever you want instead of being restricted to table edges and you are guaranteed to arrive safely (albeit in T2) because you want this glasscannon of a unit to arrive intact. Will cost you about 350-400 points but spitting out 17 overcharged plasma shots every turn in almost-safety is not something to be underestimated. You'll get a guaranteed umm... beta-strike? and your opponent will have to divert firepower to them to prevent his precious tanks and monsters from being reduced to ash. Which in turn allows your choppy stuff to get in charge range relatively safely.

Both wolf lords and WG can take jump packs though which give them free deep strike. Not only that also better movement and the FLY keyword. Those 10 jump packs also cost less than a drop pod.

At the moment only Grey hunters and blood claws may benefit from a pod since everything else cannot ride in it, have free access to deepstrike or doesn't need to leave their spot (long fangs). But why would you put troops in a pod? If you want the plasma combo, and don't have access to WG, you could bring 10 grey hunters with two plasma guns, one combi plasma and 2 plasma pistols in a pod with a jump packs lord that deep strikes near them eventually. I think it's the only use SW can think of a drop pod at the moment.

**cmspano**

Insectum7 wrote:
Marmatag wrote:
Drop Pods uselessness is exacerbated by the simple fact that your opponents giant infantry blobs can charge them, and spread out to control the map. Then, you can't shoot them, and they must be dealt with in melee. Yes you landed with your overpriced drop pod and maybe killed something, but you just made all of your opponents chaff effectively invincible.

They are horrible, bringing them is honestly a liability more than anything else.

Guard maybe (depends on soup ingredients), Tyranids, sure. Eldar always seem to have exposure as their squads tend small.

This is the best argument against drop pods from a purely tactical standpoint, and not just their outrageous points cost. Every faction has access to hordes of chaff, except maybe necrons.

Imperium -> guardsmen
Chaos -> cultists
Eldar -> Guardians(8ppm, 10-20) and Warriors(6 ppm 5-15or20 don't remember), Kind of Wyches but Wyches are a little too expensive and fragile to put a 20 man mob on the table and sit there.
Nids -> Gaunts, the cheap GSC unit, don't know the name.
Tau -> Fire Warriors. Same Price as a boy. Roughly equal in survivability(T3 4+ is close to T4 5++, and definitely is if no KFF)
Orks -> Grots, Boyz if the grots die, but Boyz are better spent killing. Plus Boyz will wipe the pod
Necrons -> Warriors? Scarabs? I know very little about necron profiles and points.

**Slayer-Fan123**

cmspano wrote:
Insectum7 wrote:
Marmatag wrote:
Drop Pods uselessness is exacerbated by the simple fact that your opponents giant infantry blobs can charge them, and spread out to control the map. Then, you can't shoot them, and they must be dealt with in melee. Yes you landed with your overpriced drop pod and maybe killed something, but you just made all of your opponents chaff effectively invincible.

They are horrible, bringing them is honestly a liability more than anything else.

Guard maybe (depends on soup ingredients), Tyranids, sure. Eldar always seem to have exposure as their squads tend small.

This is the best argument against drop pods from a purely tactical standpoint, and not just their outrageous points cost. Every faction has access to hordes of chaff, except maybe necrons.

Imperium -> guardsmen
Chaos -> cultists
Eldar -> Guardians(8ppm, 10-20) and Warriors(6 ppm 5-15or20 don't remember), Kind of Wyches but Wyches are a little too expensive and fragile to put a 20 man mob on the table and sit there.
Nids -> Gaunts, the cheap GSC unit, don't know the name.
Tau -> Fire Warriors. Same Price as a boy. Roughly equal in survivability(T3 4+ is close to T4 5++, and definitely is if no KFF)
Orks -> Grots, Boyz if the grots die, but Boyz are better spent killing. Plus Boyz will wipe the pod
Necrons -> Warriors? Scarabs? I know very little about necron profiles and points.

Only Scarabs would do that. 39 points for 3 bases with 9 wounds total can do okay blocking landing areas.

**Lord Clinto**

Marmatag wrote:
PRIMARIS as a restrictive keyword makes no sense at this point.

I would say flatten the whole thing out and just treat PRIMARIS in the same way TERMINATOR models are treated.

Your average marine of any kind can pay +4 points per model to become a primaris.

Primaris Veterans,
Primaris TAC marines,
Primaris devastator marines,

etc.

People instantly start buying primaris for conversions as well.

I can see GW doing this in the near future

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Racerguy180 wrote:
JohnnyHell wrote:Termites FTW

Hell yeah....as soon as they're $37. I have no problem paying extra for the FW tax, but I think they could make a very similar drill in plastic for 1/2 the price(not points just pure $).

I'm still looking to pick up a couple pods just for modeling/display. cant wait for the new forgeworld dreadpod & the eventual primaris pod.

Anybody looking for Termites but think FW is too pricy, check out:

http://www.manticgames.com/mantic-shop/warpath/veer-myn/product/tunneller.html

$30-40 US, easy as hell to assemble (they don't even give you instructions), scaled for 28mm, and already cut off of the sprues.