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Resipsa131 wrote:
[...]
Supreme Command Detachment +1CP (Imperium - Astra Militarum) [36 PL, 1CP, 516pts]

Tank Commander [12 PL, 172pts]: Battle Cannon, Heavy Bolter x3 36 PL 516pts.

Total: [120 PL, 10CP, 2,000pts]

I was wondering why you did not go for a Punisher (or two) for some heavy screen-clearing?
I have 3 unassembled Leman Russ' myself, and I am still not a 100% certain which weapons to give them, so I'm interested in hearing the reason why you went with straight Battle cannons.

Spiky Norman wrote:

Resipsa131 wrote:
[...]
Supreme Command Detachment +1CP (Imperium - Astra Militarum) [36 PL, 1CP, 516pts]

Tank Commander [12 PL, 172pts]: Battle Cannon, Heavy Bolter x3 36 PL 516pts.

Total: [120 PL, 10CP, 2,000pts]

I was wondering why you did not go for a Punisher (or two) for some heavy screen-clearing?
I have 3 unassembled Leman Russ' myself, and I am still not a 100% certain which weapons to give them, so I'm interested in hearing the reason why you went with straight Battle cannons.

Punishers are great for screen clearing but if you only have one its going to be a priority target. If you have three punishers they are really good and can kill screens and then you can drop in your rock saws and that's what most do. My list is about getting downfield with a unit of bikes and charging first turn or using Drive by demolitions. By Blocking movement you give your Battlecannons an easier time of firing. The Battlecannons are backline shooting that give me a decent first turn shooting to pick up first strike points. I think you do one or the other and dont mix and match.

Drills and rock cutters might as well be extra saws, and if it’s that huge an issue a Goliath kit comes with a ton of them on its Rockgrinder sprue you can use.

You need to find a friend with Orks - they have lots of saw parts that can be re-purposed, and they end up looking savage.

Caprican wrote:
So... do I have to scroll through all of this to find the tactica or is there another page?

Well Shuppet said he sold his army and was quitting 40k for good, so, I wouldn't hold my breath on the primer getting updated. Maybe Strat_N8 still feels like making one, hah.

Resipsa131 wrote:
Punishers are great for screen clearing but if you only have one its going to be a priority target. If you have three punishers they are really good and can kill screens and then you can drop in your rock saws and that's what most do. My list is about getting downfield with a unit of bikes and charging first turn or using Drive by demolitions. By Blocking movement you give your Battlecannons an easier time of firing. The Battlecannons are backline shooting that give me a decent first turn shooting to pick up first strike points. I think you do one or the other and dont mix and match.

Okay, that makes sense.
I was pondering doing 2 Punishers and 1 plasma tank initially, because I was thinking that Rusted Claw demo-bikes, a big rock saw unit plus some scattered mining lasers should be sufficient anti-tank. In that respects I looked at the Leman Russ battle cannon as anti-tank, but maybe it's more of an all-round weapon.

Iur_tae_mont wrote:How do we handle Phobos Armor?

Depends on where they are lurking. If they are deploying aggressively one can use Meticulous Uprising and Sensor Decoys to mitigate some of their deployment denial and then have a melee unit sweep them away. In the mid-field they are a bit more annoying to deal with, but I've generally found Autocannon fire clears them away quickly enough.

Vehicles in general are a good solution regardless of where the Infiltrators are deployed, but aren't everybody's proverbial cup of tea.

hangnailnz wrote:
So here's a question; especially in a smaller game, with less blips on the table - there is an opportunity to pull them all off the table during your first turn (They came from below and Return to the shadows). Would you do it? If so, under what conditions?

I think it might be worthwhile if your opponent is running a relatively static/slow army and you can use it to deny them offense on the first turn. I would not consider doing it against a hyper-mobile army or a board control/horde army as either can capitalize on your reduced board presence and deny landing zones by spreading out.

Resipsa131 wrote:
Do you think running the Acolytes in small squads really hurts them? They probably aren't coming in until Turn 3 when I can clear out all the screens and I should have +1 Charge rerolling which is about 2/3 success rate on charges.

The main vulnerability for small squads is that they don't have as many ablative bodies to protect their special weapons, making them a bit less cost efficient than in larger units where you can loose more grunts before risking a special guy. Demolition Charges aren't bad in 5-man units since it increases the number than can be thrown and their one-use nature makes the model more or less expendable once the damage is done.

I assume you are using Rusted Claw?

Khorzain wrote:
Well Shuppet said he sold his army and was quitting 40k for good

Where did he say that? That is a bit shocking and a shame.

Khorzain wrote:
Maybe Strat_N8 still feels like making one, hah.

I do have one sitting on my computer actually. Needs to be updated to reflect the FAQ but I could have it ready in a couple days.

 Badablack wrote:
Drills and rock cutters might as well be extra saws, and if it’s that huge an issue a Goliath kit comes with a ton of them on its Rockgrinder sprue you can use.

How would you recommend kitbashing the saws from the goliath kit onto acolytes?

Sand down the sides of the end of a rock cutter, trim off the tips, and put saws on either side there. Can do the same thing with the seismic cannon guns. You can do similar stuff with other weapons but those are the 2 you’ll probably have spares of in your bits box since they’re kind of useless ruleswise.

 Badablack wrote:
Sand down the sides of the end of a rock cutter, trim off the tips, and put saws on either side there. Can do the same thing with the seismic cannon guns. You can do similar stuff with other weapons but those are the 2 you’ll probably have spares of in your bits box since they’re kind of useless ruleswise.

Going to try that tonight

So here's a silly question; I have part of a neophyte sprue but no instructions or anything. Can anyone tell me what part 79 is? It looks like a high tech cereal bowl at this stage... It is right beside the webber.

hangnailnz wrote:
So here's a silly question; I have part of a neophyte sprue but no instructions or anything. Can anyone tell me what part 79 is? It looks like a high tech cereal bowl at this stage... It is right beside the webber.

It is a pack of extra webber ammo. The part is designed to fit over one of the spherical grenades on the Neophyte's belt (instructions say leg set 04 or 07), hence the concave on one side.

Another question - the FAQ explains that if a vehicle deploys using Lying in Wait, occupants who disembark can't charge that round. I have been trying to work out how this situation could occur... Vehicles can't go underground, and LiW doesn't work in the first round, so this can't happen from blip reveals.
The only way I can see this happening is if you are playing a scenario that allows reserves reinforcements for units that dont have the rule natively. Am I missing something?
My other thought is that blip shenanigans look like even more fun when you go second, and you rearrange everything after someone pulls out all their favourite T1 movement tricks...

hangnailnz wrote:
Another question - the FAQ explains that if a vehicle deploys using Lying in Wait, occupants who disembark can't charge that round. I have been trying to work out how this situation could occur... Vehicles can't go underground, and LiW doesn't work in the first round, so this can't happen from blip reveals.
The only way I can see this happening is if you are playing a scenario that allows reserves reinforcements for units that dont have the rule natively. Am I missing something?

What FAQ are you reading? I don't see anything about vehicles deploying with Lying in Wait mentioned:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/02/warhammer_40000_genestealer_cults_en-1.pdf

But yeah, there's no way to set up a transport underground, so unless you're playing with custom rules then that couldn't happen.

Furthermore, units deep-strike from underground at the end of the movement phase — and those units count as being moved — so even if a transport could use Lying In Wait, it's passengers couldn't disembark until the next movement phase anyways, right?




On an unrelated note . . .

Who else is feeling really envious of all these new Vanguard Marine units getting Concealed Positions? hah

 Khorzain wrote:

On an unrelated note . . .

Who else is feeling really envious of all these new Vanguard Marine units getting Concealed Positions? hah

We have a lot more flexibility with Cult Ambush and the stratagems that manipulate it. Apart from maybe getting turn 1 charges again I don't think the new Vanguard infiltrate would do much for us. I will say though, it would be kinda neat if they suspended the matched play restriction on first turn deep strike for the next cycle and see how it plays with the new deep strike denial abilities in play.

Also as promised I posted the primer I had been working on for any who might be interested (link). I hope if nothing else it proves an enjoyable read.

Looks like I was using an out-of-date FAQ. My bad...

So thinking of converting my renegades and heretics to genestealer cult, and running them as rusted claw. Would mass neophytes be good?

WinterLantern wrote:
So thinking of converting my renegades and heretics to genestealer cult, and running them as rusted claw. Would mass neophytes be good?

I'm using mine as Brood Brothers but honestly they could be played as either depending on the list, just so long as they all represent the same thing

 Nitro Zeus wrote:
I'm using mine as Brood Brothers but honestly they could be played as either depending on the list, just so long as they all represent the same thing

I'm.... not really sure of the difference between brood brothers and neophytes. Do they still get cult traits?

WinterLantern wrote:

 Nitro Zeus wrote:
I'm using mine as Brood Brothers but honestly they could be played as either depending on the list, just so long as they all represent the same thing

I'm.... not really sure of the difference between brood brothers and neophytes. Do they still get cult traits?

There's two types, the first are several Brood Brother units that can be taken within a Genestealer Cult detachment — like infantry squads, Leman Russ's, Sentinels, etc — and the second is a Brood Brothers Detachment, which is essentially a separate Astra Militarum detachment without any Genestealer Cult units. I'd suggest a quick read over the rules for them here: http://wahapedia.ru/wh40k8ed/factions/genestealer-cults/#Brood-Brothers

tl;dr: All Brood Brothers units do not get cult traits, and are not affected by abilities that buff <cult> units.

Brood Brother Infantry Squads can still take a Heavy Weapons Team, and can be taken in units of 20 models rather than 10 if you want.They're only 1 point cheaper than Neophytes though, so unless you really need the points it's usually better to take Neophytes. Their one special use is that they can perform the Unquestioning Loyalty ability for Genestealer Cult characters regardless of what Cult Creed they have — while Neophytes and such can only perform Unquestioning Loyalty for characters within the same Cult — so if you're bringing several detachments with different Creeds then Brood Brothers can be used as universal bodyguards for all your characters. The Patriarch has a 6" morale-immunity aura that affects Brood Brothers units, although they also have a built-in morale re-roll if you want to spend 5 points on a Cult Voxcaster for the unit — both useful if you're taking big blobs of 20 to soak up wounds.

Just on the topic of Brood Brothers - how do you guys feel about Brood Brother mortar teams? They seem worth it to me, especially since screen clear/thinning is so useful for us, but just looking for other opinions.

 Nitro Zeus wrote:
Just on the topic of Brood Brothers - how do you guys feel about Brood Brother mortar teams? They seem worth it to me, especially since screen clear/thinning is so useful for us, but just looking for other opinions.

I bring them in most every list. They are not quite as good as the AM equivalent, but they do clear some screens and hold backfield space.

Mellon wrote:

 Nitro Zeus wrote:
Just on the topic of Brood Brothers - how do you guys feel about Brood Brother mortar teams? They seem worth it to me, especially since screen clear/thinning is so useful for us, but just looking for other opinions.

I bring them in most every list. They are not quite as good as the AM equivalent, but they do clear some screens and hold backfield space.

Yeah. I know they are on paper slightly less than the AM ones, but I'm also of the opinion that the strength of a unit depends on how well it fills a role for that particular army. AM ones might be better, but I suspect clearing out screens like that does more for us than it does for them, a point or two more and no regiment, I still suspect our Mortars are even better for us than theirs are for them.

Just to let you know, Marines can now deepstrike turn 1. They outright removed it for us to give it to marines

KurtAngle2 wrote:
Just to let you know, Marines can now deepstrike turn 1. They outright removed it for us to give it to marines

To be fair, if I’m reading the same rumors they have to pay a pretty penny for the ability (drop pods aren’t cheap and have negligible effect post drop). GSC should be one of the better off armies against pods since we can alter our deployment to minimize a pod alpha or spread out to deny landing zones (Jackals, Ridgerunners, and Sentinels are all good for this).

Hi Guys! I'm coming back playing GSC after a long period with my Black Legion. I have 2 major issue:

1st I can't decide if it's better to play bladed cog or rusted claw:RC seems more protective all around but there's a lot of Ap2 now so maybe it's better the BC, also their WL is really useful to shoot against an important screen with flamers and granades, what is your experience so far?

2nd how do you deal with Necrons, Mecanicus and Ultramarine? I feel like this codex suffers counters too much: one time 6 Kastellan Robots annihilated almost all my army in a single turn,while I was forced to charge screens; Necrons and especially Ultramarines can spam ap2 shots and fall back and shoot, completely destroying our units in a single turn

Overall I think that without a single powerful shooting unit we cannot destroy that vehicle which will be screened, infantry on top of ruins which is unchargable, and we are force to kill transport vehicles in CC having to endure the assault unit that comes out of it. The GSC units are powerful overall but we suffers the basic mechanics of the game. Am I wrong? Did I miss something?

Rusted claw def took a hit, I wouldn’t take them unless I planned on using Demo Charge Jackals.

I’ve been running 3 Battalions, TH, Cot4AE, and RC. Helix gets abberents, cult gets acolytes, claw gets Jackals and neophytes.

I use one Squad of Acolytes as a Flamer bomb to clear screens, then everyone else does their thing.

I’ve yet to play anyone using them, but I am concerned about Omniscramblers. I feel my list is gonna have to eventually change to have some turn one punch that can deal with them, invictor suits I’m also not super worried about because we can manipulate our deployment enough to feed them Brood Bros and slow them down.

We have one necron guy but I never get to play him because of how our work schedules are.

landersloot wrote:

 Badablack wrote:
Drills and rock cutters might as well be extra saws, and if it’s that huge an issue a Goliath kit comes with a ton of them on its Rockgrinder sprue you can use.

How would you recommend kitbashing the saws from the goliath kit onto acolytes?

Back when my guard could take plasma guns for 7pts on BS3 models I wanted to take 4 scion command squads with plasma guns. Of course you only got one gun with a box of scions and I wanted a ton of them. I looked at GWs PGs but they were just the gun - no arms obviously. I bought the starter kit from smooth-on and made up a mold of the gun+arm from a scion and popped out plasma guns to my hearts content. Then the point cost doubled, you could only take 3 units and they had to be babysat by a prime so that didn't last very long. Still I have more than enough material to make additional weapons like lots of mining lasers for my neophytes that I have plans for

Okay I'll keep with bladed cog then thank you! I tend to play just one faction for narrative reasons.
Regarding the flamerbomb, do you mix them with grenades? I think it's better to do it, since it helps you against any target, but I see a lot of people run only flamers. Also, do you DS the rest together with them, or do you keep the CC hitters for the third round?

 DarklyDreaming wrote:
Hi Guys! I'm coming back playing GSC after a long period with my Black Legion. I have 2 major issue:

1st I can't decide if it's better to play bladed cog or rusted claw:RC seems more protective all around but there's a lot of Ap2 now so maybe it's better the BC, also their WL is really useful to shoot against an important screen with flamers and granades, what is your experience so far?

2nd how do you deal with Necrons, Mecanicus and Ultramarine? I feel like this codex suffers counters too much: one time 6 Kastellan Robots annihilated almost all my army in a single turn,while I was forced to charge screens; Necrons and especially Ultramarines can spam ap2 shots and fall back and shoot, completely destroying our units in a single turn

Overall I think that without a single powerful shooting unit we cannot destroy that vehicle which will be screened, infantry on top of ruins which is unchargable, and we are force to kill transport vehicles in CC having to endure the assault unit that comes out of it. The GSC units are powerful overall but we suffers the basic mechanics of the game. Am I wrong? Did I miss something?

***
Regarding the flamerbomb, do you mix them with grenades? I think it's better to do it, since it helps you against any target, but I see a lot of people run only flamers. Also, do you DS the rest together with them, or do you keep the CC hitters for the third round?

Welcome back to the cult!

1 The best thing with Bladed Cog is how they do not suffer movement penalties for heavy weapons. I run a detachment of Bladed Cog. Patriarch with the WL trait Single Minded Obsession. Jackal Alphus. 5 units of Neophytes with Mining Lasers. (this is a bit over 600p) They are a good insurance against flyers that my melee units cannot charge. Rusted Claw is better in defense imho, but that is less important. This is a good shooty gang that can handle a lot of the problems you mention.

2 I try to make sure my opponent has nothing valuable to shoot at turn one, and turn two if I am going second (which I like to do in scenarios where victory points are calculated at end of battle round). If they have screened properly I spend turn two killing off the screens with the bladed cog neophytes mentioned above, hand flamer acolytes, Brood brother mortar teams, or even bikers with 5x demo charges. Same for unchargeable units in ruins. Then turn three I charge with my rock saw acolytes and/or aberrants. Sometimes I place a unit of aberrants out of harms way and use Return to Shadows turn three so I can perfect ambush them turn four.

About transports. Best trick is to surround them with your models (Stay about 0.9" away from the transport with the closest models) and leave a small space on one side (3"x2" will fit one 25mm base) so a few of the transported models can get out and survive. Once they are out, you consolidate into that unit. If it is properly surrounded, it cannot fall back next turn so you cannot be shot at. Then you kill that unit in your opponents fight phase and in your turn you are free to move on. If the unit being transported is very hard to kill, you can surround the vehicle completely and have all the transported models die when they cannot be deployed.

I like my flamer bomb with only flamers. If they are attacking guardsmen each handflamer will kill 1,17 guardsmen and each demo charge will kill 1,46 guardsmen. Or each handflamer will kill 0,20 primaris marines and each demo charge will kill a bit less than 1 primaris marine. But since there are so many handflamers they will kill 7,8 primaris marines. And it is quite rare that they have the opportunity to target more than one unit. (I agree that sometimes you will fight someone with only tanks/knights/etc and no infantry to attack. Then the demo charges can be useful)

If you want to learn how to make it harder for enemies to fall back from assault, you should learn how to lock units in combat through "pinning", "three-point", "surround" or "hug". Look at this video from D6 Evolution. They explain it very well. (And their other videos are great too)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VUn3q8vFCCw