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2019/02/10 19:18:01
Subject: Update on Hive Fleet Tiamet and what they are building.
So I got the codex today and there is a host of new lore in there, it describes how cults can take over whole sectors if something happens to the hive fleet being guided towards it, it also notes how it may even take centuries or more for the nids to arrive at the world. Plus there is a story where cultists are fully aware of what the nids will do to them and are eager for when it's their turn to be killed by them. So yeah...go to town with your cults at the end of the day.
Still this topic is about tiamet and what they are building. The nid codex explained that they are calling cults to the world and now we are getting a small answer as to why and they are not being called to be killed. This was the last entry on the "timeline" part of the codex.
Here is excerpt
Tiamet Rising
"Ziaphoria, the repugnant and anomalous jungle planet claimed by Hive Fleet Tiamet, becomes a site of a disturbing new development in the curse of tyrannoforming, the hyper-accelerated biological process that overcomes the prey worlds of the Hive Mind. There the conquering hive fleets have constructed vast psychic resonators of fleshy, encephalitic material - some of the size of mountains, some large enough to cover entire continents.
The world forms the end point of a vast pilgrimage of genestealer cultists from the nearby Heinrich's march. Led by a blind prophet known as the Conduit, they depart from a world plagued by the Dark Gods, plying the stars to eventually land upon Ziaphoria's pulsating crust. Those who touch the corrupted earth with their bare flesh are instantly bought in thrall to it - an convince their brethren to go back into space as missionaries, carrying the Creed of Tiamet to as many imperial worlds as possible. They are first of dozens of interstellar pilgrimages that seek out Ziaphoria, and in doing so, add to its power. The Tyranids of Hive Fleet Tiamet defend the planet so ferociously it is declared Quaratine Extremis and abandoned entirely by the Imperium.
Only the Deathwatch of nearby Haltmoat and Inquisitor Kryptman, who comes out of exile to join them - have any inkling of the threat posed by the immense psychic resonator of Tiamet. The theories they discuss long into the night are so wild, and the other threats facing the Imperium so dire, that they are given little credence by the wider Inquisition."
So...I will start with my own thoughts which is all speculation by the way. It's obvious to me they are building a beacon, most likely to call the true face of the Tyranids. The interesting part to me was the fact Tiamet called the Genestealer Cultists, no to nom them but to essentially turn them into heralds, adding to the beacon since they allow them to leave the world.
Plus Kryptman is coming back into the plot that is clear going by GSC and the nid codex, I recall someone who attended LVO recently reported that GW are going to be making changes to the 40k setting, I wonder if this is a part of that? Or a hint? Who knows the Tyranids we see now might be only hunting dogs or animals of whatever is in charge of them.
If you remember the Silent King left the galaxy and came back stating the nids are the true threat and then went on a spree to wake up tomb worlds. Maybe this plot line will be developed with the Necrons as well?
Edit:I went back to the nid codex, this was the original entry on the Tiamet page. So the GSC codex it tells us what happened to the people, so Tiamet is calling GSC and then sending them away, but they kill and nom everyone else.
Here is the extract
Call to the Void
"Upon the world of Heinrich's March, worshippers of the Dark gods work their tortured slaves to death as they attempt to erect a monolithic ziggurat in honour of their foul patrons. A new and hidden cult propagates admist the persecuted masses: the Choir of the Void. it's leader, the blind prophet known as the Conduit, preaches that a savior race from beyond the stars awaits them in a far-off place, a paradise planet where they will find salvation. In a great uprising, millions of slaves overwhelm their masters and commander several dozen cargo hulks. The armada of the faithful makes for the nearby Tiamet System, guided by the visions of the Conduit."
Editosting the whole timeline together.
Spoiler:
Tyranids 8th edition
A nightmare unearthed
Far out on the northern edge of the galaxy lies the Tiamet System. This unremarkable region is home to one of the Hive Mind's most disturbing secrets, the truth of which is only now beginning to emerge...
Call to the Void
"Upon the world of Heinrich's March, worshippers of the Dark gods work their tortured slaves to death as they attempt to erect a monolithic ziggurat in honour of their foul patrons. A new and hidden cult propagates admist the persecuted masses: the Choir of the Void. it's leader, the blind prophet known as the Conduit, preaches that a savior race from beyond the stars awaits them in a far-off place, a paradise planet where they will find salvation. In a great uprising, millions of slaves overwhelm their masters and commander several dozen cargo hulks. The armada of the faithful makes for the nearby Tiamet System, guided by the visions of the Conduit."
Ominous Reports
More and more reports of missing ships and lost fleets drift in to Watch Fortress Haltmoat. The common denominator in each of these cases is that the vessels were last reported in the vicinity of the Tiamet System, far from safe haven. Watch Commander Vilnus orders an immediate survey of the area.
Dread Discovery
Kill team Gjynheim departs from Haltmoat to investigate the reports of missing trade fleets near the Tiamet system. (Lexicanum notes Tiamet are gathering ships for some reason.) The Deathwatch drift in-system unnoticed, and land upon Ziaphoria. There, they discover the xenos super-structure that covers the planet's largest continent. When the vast device pulses, sending a tsunami of psychic energy rolling across the planet, the Kill Team's Librarian suffers a catastrophic cranial rupture.
His screams alert nearby Tyranids, and soon the remaining battle-brothers are surrounded by swarming xenos. Before he and his remaining battle-brothers are torn apart, Watch Sergeant Gjunheim manages to send one final vox transmission to the team's orbiting Corvus Blackstar, warning of the nightmare his men have uncovered.
The Butcher of Octarius
Haltmoat receives an unexpected guest - the exiled Inquisitor Kryptman. Watch Commander Vilnus agrees to an audience with the outcast, who has his own grim theories regarding the mysterious Hive Fleet Tiamet. Together, the two begin to formulate a plan that will see whatever the Tyranids are creating utterly obliterated.
Genestealer Cults 8th edition(The choir of the void was not mentioned at all in 7th)
Tiamet Rising
"Ziaphoria, the repugnant and anomalous jungle planet claimed by Hive Fleet Tiamet, becomes a site of a disturbing new development in the curse of tyrannoforming, the hyper-accelerated biological process that overcomes the prey worlds of the Hive Mind. There the conquering hive fleets have constructed vast psychic resonators of fleshy, encephalitic material - some of the size of mountains, some large enough to cover entire continents.
The world forms the end point of a vast pilgrimage of genestealer cultists from the nearby Heinrich's march. Led by a blind prophet known as the Conduit, they depart from a world plagued by the Dark Gods, plying the stars to eventually land upon Ziaphoria's pulsating crust. Those who touch the corrupted earth with their bare flesh are instantly bought in thrall to it - and convince their brethren to go back into space as missionaries, carrying the Creed of Tiamet to as many imperial worlds as possible. They are first of dozens of interstellar pilgrimages that seek out Ziaphoria, and in doing so, add to its power. The Tyranids of Hive Fleet Tiamet defend the planet so ferociously it is declared Quaratine Extremis and abandoned entirely by the Imperium.
Only the Deathwatch of nearby Haltmoat and Inquisitor Kryptman, who comes out of exile to join them - have any inkling of the threat posed by the immense psychic resonator of Tiamet. The theories they discuss long into the night are so wild, and the other threats facing the Imperium so dire, that they are given little credence by the wider Inquisition."
So there are theories this could be a beacon or an anti-warp weapon. Since it causes Eldar and psykers to explode due to the psychic shockwaves that pulse across the world. I assume the Conduit is a Magus, he seems to be fine and those GSC who journey to the world.
Now since the prophets name is conduit I will bring up the defination again.
A channel for conveying water or other fluid.
‘nearby springs supplied the conduit which ran into the brewery’
More example sentencesSynonyms
1.1 A person or organization that acts as a channel for the transmission of something.
‘as an actor you have to be a conduit for other people's words’
More example sentences
2A tube or trough for protecting electric wiring.
‘the gas pipe should not be close to any electrical conduit’
mass noun ‘the cable must be protected by conduit’
So perhaps the hive mind is using them to help guide the fleet to the galaxy or perhaps the hive mind wishes to channel itself through the conduit? Plus the extract notes that the pilgrims are the first among many.
This message was edited 8 times. Last update was at 2019/02/12 19:47:31
2019/02/10 20:06:11
Subject: Update on Hive Fleet Tiamet and what they are building.
Yeah the entire gsc codex seems to suggest they’re ramping up cults to be a real threat. Which I’m not sure if I’m happy about. If the cults aren’t ready for their day of ascension they’ll just get crushed...
2019/02/10 20:13:01
Subject: Update on Hive Fleet Tiamet and what they are building.
C4790M wrote: Yeah the entire gsc codex seems to suggest they’re ramping up cults to be a real threat. Which I’m not sure if I’m happy about. If the cults aren’t ready for their day of ascension they’ll just get crushed...
Well Tiamet is doing...something. Looking back at Tiamet page and in light of this new extract this is looking like a plot line. I think this is pretty hamfisted.
"Far out on the northern edge of the galaxy lies the Tiamet System. This unremarkable region is home to one of the Hive Mind's most disturbing secrets, the truth of which is only now beginning to emerge..."
So we now know that Tiamet/Hive mind is not eating the GSC.
So their current fluff is
1.Guiding GSC to the planet and sending them away as heralds after they touch the ground. This new entry answers the question of WHY they are calling them, they are not turning them into biomass or killing them for trespassing like other races.
2.Gather biomass to complete the structure hence why they have been seen in the Segmentum Obscurus and they are capturing ships around the Tiamet system.
Edit:Well...the GSC codex makes not that the cults can take over whole sectors. If the Patriarch can't sense a hive fleet he will just launch the uprising anyway hoping to draw their attention, he will keep attacking and expanding until the Tyranids hurry along to them.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2019/02/10 20:16:22
2019/02/10 22:53:27
Subject: Update on Hive Fleet Tiamet and what they are building.
C4790M wrote: Yeah the entire gsc codex seems to suggest they’re ramping up cults to be a real threat. Which I’m not sure if I’m happy about. If the cults aren’t ready for their day of ascension they’ll just get crushed...
The cults don’t need to take the planet to be successful. Obviously that’s the best result but the uprising does divert Imperial resources to that system instead of the hive fleets. Disrupting reinforcements and troops is still very valuable.
Also I would love to see this become the focus of a Xenos vs Xenos campaign. 40k could really use that right now. If it’s tyrannids and necrons you could even let it be completely results driven since those two factions don’t have an entrenched status quo.
Iron within, Iron without
2019/02/10 22:55:12
Subject: Update on Hive Fleet Tiamet and what they are building.
C4790M wrote: Yeah the entire gsc codex seems to suggest they’re ramping up cults to be a real threat. Which I’m not sure if I’m happy about. If the cults aren’t ready for their day of ascension they’ll just get crushed...
The cults don’t need to take the planet to be successful. Obviously that’s the best result but the uprising does divert Imperial resources to that system instead of the hive fleets. Disrupting reinforcements and troops is still very valuable.
Also I would love to see this become the focus of a Xenos vs Xenos campaign. 40k could really use that right now. If it’s tyrannids and necrons you could even let it be completely results driven since those two factions don’t have an entrenched status quo.
Funny enough a poster on bolter and chainsword mentioned something similar, have a part of the true face of the nids pop up and it's the necrons who then step up to hold the tide. Honestly after this I am even wondering if the true nids are even bug-like and monstrous.
2019/02/10 23:30:55
Subject: Update on Hive Fleet Tiamet and what they are building.
It's either a Tyranid version of the blackstone pylons that were on Cadia or it's an anti-daemon measure on a galactic scale.
'It is a source of constant consternation that my opponents cannot correlate their innate inferiority with their inevitable defeat. It would seem that stupidity is as eternal as war.'
- Nemesor Zahndrekh of the Sautekh Dynasty Overlord of the Crownworld of Gidrim
2019/02/10 23:53:04
Subject: Re:Update on Hive Fleet Tiamet and what they are building.
Ghaz wrote: It's either a Tyranid version of the blackstone pylons that were on Cadia or it's an anti-daemon measure on a galactic scale.
Possibly but the question is why aren't they nomming the GSC? They are calling them to the planet, they need biomass for the structure but instead of eating the hybrids they bond with it and then the nids allow them to leave. Tiamet eats and attacks anyone else who go near the world.
2019/02/11 00:00:20
Subject: Update on Hive Fleet Tiamet and what they are building.
Because they're carrying something away from the planet that the Tyranids themselves can not?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/02/11 00:00:39
'It is a source of constant consternation that my opponents cannot correlate their innate inferiority with their inevitable defeat. It would seem that stupidity is as eternal as war.'
- Nemesor Zahndrekh of the Sautekh Dynasty Overlord of the Crownworld of Gidrim
2019/02/11 00:17:26
Subject: Update on Hive Fleet Tiamet and what they are building.
Cultists are Tyranids so it wouldn't be a case of something others couldn't carry. However its more likely that what they could be taking away is able to spread and/or influence through the newly founded Cults.
Cultists are showing that Tyranids have game plans beyond purely nomming things. Cultists are a very advanced disruption and terrorist weapon that allows the Tyranid Hives to cause massive damage deep behind enemy lines. To infect worlds and systems; to leave damage that will scar generations of people and spread and infect the core of their enemies.
Cultists that arise and manage to take over whole systems are, at best, causing huge disruption and shutting down systems for the Imperium. Even if a Hive Fleet doesn't come to consume the Cult has done its work in weakening the giant of the Imperium.
The Tiamat structure world is still a mystery; its true purpose is still unknown. That said it appears that it doesn't seem to be a staging ground; or if it is then its got additional functions built into it.
One thought might be that its a huge anti-chaos beacon - a huge Shadow in the Warp generator. The idea being that Tyranids presume if they start to take the upper hand too much then the Warp, which relies upon non-Tyranid life in the Galaxy, might well unit. Orks and Chaos are both influenced heavily by Warp Gods and both have presented themselves as powerful opposing forces to Tyranids. The Tyranids might well be building this so that as they gain more ground the enemy has its ability to rise to counter hindered. A huge Shadow in the Warp influence over whole systems would give them a powerful staging ground where Chaos couldn't assail them easily; a power base to both assault from and retreat too.
Ps yes I'm aware Orks and Chaos are not good friends, but as Gork and Mork and the 4 Chaos Gods require emotions and life to sustain themselves it stands to reason if the Tyranids rose big enough then those Warp entities would take action. United Chaos forces and United Ork forces would be a vast powerbase. Heck a United Ork force under a huge Waargh and powerful Warlord would be a force to shatter the foundations of even the Imperium. And you can bet if Tyranids rose to be a big enough threat the Orks would unit to counter it - because it would be the BEST fight EVER!
Overread wrote: Cultists are Tyranids so it wouldn't be a case of something others couldn't carry. However its more likely that what they could be taking away is able to spread and/or influence through the newly founded Cults.
Cultists are showing that Tyranids have game plans beyond purely nomming things. Cultists are a very advanced disruption and terrorist weapon that allows the Tyranid Hives to cause massive damage deep behind enemy lines. To infect worlds and systems; to leave damage that will scar generations of people and spread and infect the core of their enemies.
Cultists that arise and manage to take over whole systems are, at best, causing huge disruption and shutting down systems for the Imperium. Even if a Hive Fleet doesn't come to consume the Cult has done its work in weakening the giant of the Imperium.
The Tiamat structure world is still a mystery; its true purpose is still unknown. That said it appears that it doesn't seem to be a staging ground; or if it is then its got additional functions built into it.
One thought might be that its a huge anti-chaos beacon - a huge Shadow in the Warp generator. The idea being that Tyranids presume if they start to take the upper hand too much then the Warp, which relies upon non-Tyranid life in the Galaxy, might well unit. Orks and Chaos are both influenced heavily by Warp Gods and both have presented themselves as powerful opposing forces to Tyranids. The Tyranids might well be building this so that as they gain more ground the enemy has its ability to rise to counter hindered. A huge Shadow in the Warp influence over whole systems would give them a powerful staging ground where Chaos couldn't assail them easily; a power base to both assault from and retreat too.
Ps yes I'm aware Orks and Chaos are not good friends, but as Gork and Mork and the 4 Chaos Gods require emotions and life to sustain themselves it stands to reason if the Tyranids rose big enough then those Warp entities would take action. United Chaos forces and United Ork forces would be a vast powerbase. Heck a United Ork force under a huge Waargh and powerful Warlord would be a force to shatter the foundations of even the Imperium. And you can bet if Tyranids rose to be a big enough threat the Orks would unit to counter it - because it would be the BEST fight EVER!
Honestly I think you are right on the ball, it seems that Tyranids do have a plan beyond eating things. Thinking about it, making a giant shadow in the warp zone would be a good idea.
Ghaz wrote: Because they're carrying something away from the planet that the Tyranids themselves can not?
But what could they be carrying away that's so valuable that puts them in the not eat camp? That's the mystery I think. What's quite interesting is the fact that these GSC have seen the face of their gods and the star children and I hope the Conduit becomes a named character in the future, that would be neat.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2019/02/11 00:34:54
2019/02/11 00:37:47
Subject: Update on Hive Fleet Tiamet and what they are building.
C4790M wrote: Yeah the entire gsc codex seems to suggest they’re ramping up cults to be a real threat. Which I’m not sure if I’m happy about. If the cults aren’t ready for their day of ascension they’ll just get crushed...
The cults don’t need to take the planet to be successful. Obviously that’s the best result but the uprising does divert Imperial resources to that system instead of the hive fleets. Disrupting reinforcements and troops is still very valuable.
Also I would love to see this become the focus of a Xenos vs Xenos campaign. 40k could really use that right now. If it’s tyrannids and necrons you could even let it be completely results driven since those two factions don’t have an entrenched status quo.
Honestly after this I am even wondering if the true nids are even bug-like and monstrous.
It would completely ruin the fluff if they are anything but bug-like monsters.
Tyranid fanboy.
Been around since 3rd edition.
2019/02/11 00:42:38
Subject: Update on Hive Fleet Tiamet and what they are building.
C4790M wrote: Yeah the entire gsc codex seems to suggest they’re ramping up cults to be a real threat. Which I’m not sure if I’m happy about. If the cults aren’t ready for their day of ascension they’ll just get crushed...
The cults don’t need to take the planet to be successful. Obviously that’s the best result but the uprising does divert Imperial resources to that system instead of the hive fleets. Disrupting reinforcements and troops is still very valuable.
Also I would love to see this become the focus of a Xenos vs Xenos campaign. 40k could really use that right now. If it’s tyrannids and necrons you could even let it be completely results driven since those two factions don’t have an entrenched status quo.
Honestly after this I am even wondering if the true nids are even bug-like and monstrous.
It would completely ruin the fluff if they are anything but bug-like monsters.
It's always been said that the Tyranids are the vanguard of something else, the Tiamet development overall shows that the Hive mind has other concerns than just eating things in my opinion. Hence why I came to that point, the Silent king has seen their true face and when he came back he considered the Tyranids the true threat facing the galaxy.
2019/02/11 01:05:26
Subject: Update on Hive Fleet Tiamet and what they are building.
C4790M wrote: Yeah the entire gsc codex seems to suggest they’re ramping up cults to be a real threat. Which I’m not sure if I’m happy about. If the cults aren’t ready for their day of ascension they’ll just get crushed...
The cults don’t need to take the planet to be successful. Obviously that’s the best result but the uprising does divert Imperial resources to that system instead of the hive fleets. Disrupting reinforcements and troops is still very valuable.
Also I would love to see this become the focus of a Xenos vs Xenos campaign. 40k could really use that right now. If it’s tyrannids and necrons you could even let it be completely results driven since those two factions don’t have an entrenched status quo.
Honestly after this I am even wondering if the true nids are even bug-like and monstrous.
It would completely ruin the fluff if they are anything but bug-like monsters.
It's always been said that the Tyranids are the vanguard of something else, the Tiamet development overall shows that the Hive mind has other concerns than just eating things in my opinion. Hence why I came to that point, the Silent king has seen their true face and when he came back he considered the Tyranids the true threat facing the galaxy.
Has it? It was generally implied that the nids are the vanguard of even more nids.
2019/02/11 01:10:11
Subject: Update on Hive Fleet Tiamet and what they are building.
C4790M wrote: Yeah the entire gsc codex seems to suggest they’re ramping up cults to be a real threat. Which I’m not sure if I’m happy about. If the cults aren’t ready for their day of ascension they’ll just get crushed...
The cults don’t need to take the planet to be successful. Obviously that’s the best result but the uprising does divert Imperial resources to that system instead of the hive fleets. Disrupting reinforcements and troops is still very valuable.
Also I would love to see this become the focus of a Xenos vs Xenos campaign. 40k could really use that right now. If it’s tyrannids and necrons you could even let it be completely results driven since those two factions don’t have an entrenched status quo.
Honestly after this I am even wondering if the true nids are even bug-like and monstrous.
It would completely ruin the fluff if they are anything but bug-like monsters.
It's always been said that the Tyranids are the vanguard of something else, the Tiamet development overall shows that the Hive mind has other concerns than just eating things in my opinion. Hence why I came to that point, the Silent king has seen their true face and when he came back he considered the Tyranids the true threat facing the galaxy.
Has it? It was generally implied that the nids are the vanguard of even more nids.
Oops correction, I meant to say that they are the vanguard for more nids BUT the nids that are outside the galaxy are not like the ones we see here. That's my theory, since now we are seeing that the hive mind has larger concerns than just eating. Sorry about that I should of clarified.
Edit:The reason why I think this is because Tiamet are calling the GSC for an unknown reason. Before this extract supposedly people thought from my observation that they are going to be eaten, but that's not the case. It's stated they need biomass for this structure so it would make sense to call food towards you, but instead the Hive mind is using the GSC for something else entirely. Since this event was placed at the end of the GSC "timeline" section it must of been a recent event. This to me shows the Hive mind is incredibly Malign and perhaps it's goal is not just to eat people. Now I could be entirely wrong this is just speculation/theories.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2019/02/11 01:14:03
2019/02/11 01:26:12
Subject: Update on Hive Fleet Tiamet and what they are building.
Hmm, interesting. I actually really like the Tiamet development in general (and colour scheme), so I would definitely be behind a huge Necron vs Tyranid campaign.
I doubt the "true face" of the Tyranids is anything surprising though- considering how immense the Hive Mind is, it is probably simply some truly colossal Hive ships that function as the core brain of the fleet- any lesser structure is likely to be unable to contain such a monstrous mind. To be fair, the Tyranids have enough genetic material that they can probably make creatures that look like almost anything if they want to, which is why I suspect the core is simply a (or multiple) huge amorphous blob of nervous tissue surrounded by life-support functions, likely constantly updating itself as it absorbs new species and analyses their neurological functions. Truly faceless.
The Silent King could easily have simply seen the huge amount of biomass heading to the galaxy, and that could've been enough to put the wind up him.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/02/11 01:26:55
ChargerIIC wrote: If algae farm paste with a little bit of your grandfather in it isn't Grimdark I don't know what is.
2019/02/11 01:30:21
Subject: Update on Hive Fleet Tiamet and what they are building.
Haighus wrote: Hmm, interesting. I actually really like the Tiamet development in general (and colour scheme), so I would definitely be behind a huge Necron vs Tyranid campaign.
I doubt the "true face" of the Tyranids is anything surprising though- considering how immense the Hive Mind is, it is probably simply some truly colossal Hive ships that function as the core brain of the fleet- any lesser structure is likely to be unable to contain such a monstrous mind. To be fair, the Tyranids have enough genetic material that they can probably make creatures that look like almost anything if they want to, which is why I suspect the core is simply a (or multiple) huge amorphous blob of nervous tissue surrounded by life-support functions, likely constantly updating itself as it absorbs new species and analyses their neurological functions. Truly faceless.
The Silent King could easily have simply seen the huge amount of biomass heading to the galaxy, and that could've been enough to put the wind up him.
That's quite logical, maybe it has decided that GSC is worthy to join the proper tyranid club like the vanguard creatures?
Edit:Oh yeah I forgot to add the Hive mind is might be targeting humanity chiefly when it comes to GSC since it's more easier to spread among them compared to the other species. (I am going to double check that point)
"The orks have proven troublesome as hosts, for they can sense a wrongness in those infected, something disturbs the strange gestalt of the greenskin mind. The kroot are much the same, though their avoidance of infected members of their society comes from their ability to taste pheromones, and the wisdom of the Shapers who guide their people's evolution. The Aeldari have such lengthy gestation cycles that they are simply not viable biological hosts; furthermore, their psychic abilities are so well developed they can often see the shadow of the curse even before it can manifest, and avoid it accordingly. The T'au have a connection with their Ethereal caste that makes infection by Genestealers difficult. Only Humanity, so manifold and unruly in its civilisations, has as yet provided an ideal host."
So what do you think? Essentially GW are confirming that others races suck as hosts, even the T'au are poor hosts of the taint now.
This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2019/02/11 01:44:14
2019/02/11 04:26:19
Subject: Update on Hive Fleet Tiamet and what they are building.
C4790M wrote: Yeah the entire gsc codex seems to suggest they’re ramping up cults to be a real threat. Which I’m not sure if I’m happy about. If the cults aren’t ready for their day of ascension they’ll just get crushed...
The cults don’t need to take the planet to be successful. Obviously that’s the best result but the uprising does divert Imperial resources to that system instead of the hive fleets. Disrupting reinforcements and troops is still very valuable.
Also I would love to see this become the focus of a Xenos vs Xenos campaign. 40k could really use that right now. If it’s tyrannids and necrons you could even let it be completely results driven since those two factions don’t have an entrenched status quo.
Honestly after this I am even wondering if the true nids are even bug-like and monstrous.
It would completely ruin the fluff if they are anything but bug-like monsters.
It's always been said that the Tyranids are the vanguard of something else, the Tiamet development overall shows that the Hive mind has other concerns than just eating things in my opinion. Hence why I came to that point, the Silent king has seen their true face and when he came back he considered the Tyranids the true threat facing the galaxy.
Has it? It was generally implied that the nids are the vanguard of even more nids.
Oops correction, I meant to say that they are the vanguard for more nids BUT the nids that are outside the galaxy are not like the ones we see here. That's my theory, since now we are seeing that the hive mind has larger concerns than just eating. Sorry about that I should of clarified.
We know what the hive mind is - the gestalt collective consciousness of every single tyranid organism - and all it wants to do is nom nom nom.
And what is unknown about the GSC pilgrimage? The answer is given to you: "Those who touch the corrupted earth with their bare flesh are instantly bought in thrall to it - an convince their brethren to go back into space as missionaries, carrying the Creed of Tiamet to as many imperial worlds as possible."
They are just spreading the gift (infection) that is the GSC.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2019/02/11 04:31:14
Tyranid fanboy.
Been around since 3rd edition.
2019/02/11 10:34:36
Subject: Update on Hive Fleet Tiamet and what they are building.
Tyranids have never been simplistic in their long term plans. It's at the individual gaunt level and at their war level where they are quite basic in terms of "nom nom".
Also don't forget all the lore we have for them is basically Imperial reports of encounters. We've no idea what the Hive Mind really thinks or conceptualises or wants or even has any desire for. All we know is that they devour worlds; it might be that they are not even hungry! That the great beast the devours is but a childish interpretation of Tyranid activity.
As for what's out there in the black of space between Galaxies no one knows. Are Tyranids a vanguard, are they a scouting fleet like how the mongols whipped the Romans with an exploratory force and never game in their full masses. Are they running from something; are they the agents of some greater power; are there tiers of Tyranids and this is the first wave.
Also Tyranids were never buglike to start with, they became buglike. Early Tyranid designs were more organic with considerably less armour on many. Furthermore most of their weapons then were free held in hands and claws; over time they've evolved a more warlike design. Weapons are far more flesh melded into the body; armour has got thicker and more hunched. The only one that has not actually evolved much at all is the Genestealer - though even they have extra carapace plates now.
As for Cults the idea that Tyranids can have a long term plan and use for them beyond just consuming them makes sense. Why invest resources and then waste them; clearly they are re-using the best of them to help spread their infection faster and more fully through Imperial worlds. Humanity is wide spread and makes an ideal target.
Eldar (all forms including dark) and Tau are very small corners and small populations; orks are more wide spread but its noted above why they prove to be unsuitable hosts. So its Humans who, from their own xenophobic spread through the Galaxy, dominate both in terms of population and ease of infestation. Even then it might take many generations before a Cult is ready to rise up - so the further into Imperial lines the cult can be pushed, then all the better for seeding more and more worlds.
Plus they can be used to knock out key worlds. A huge manufacturing world might be beyond the Hives reach, but if Cultists can infect, infest and disrupt then it means less manufacture for the war engine.
Whilst those fluff reasons for other major species being poor hosts are reasonable... it is still clearly a reason for not producing xenos-genestealer hybrids
I still think Tau are the most likely candidate after humans- the Farsight Enclaves in particular are Ethereal-free and much more likely to harbour an insidious cult me thinks.
Could be a fun conversion project!
ChargerIIC wrote: If algae farm paste with a little bit of your grandfather in it isn't Grimdark I don't know what is.
2019/02/11 15:00:48
Subject: Update on Hive Fleet Tiamet and what they are building.
C4790M wrote: Yeah the entire gsc codex seems to suggest they’re ramping up cults to be a real threat. Which I’m not sure if I’m happy about. If the cults aren’t ready for their day of ascension they’ll just get crushed...
The cults don’t need to take the planet to be successful. Obviously that’s the best result but the uprising does divert Imperial resources to that system instead of the hive fleets. Disrupting reinforcements and troops is still very valuable.
Also I would love to see this become the focus of a Xenos vs Xenos campaign. 40k could really use that right now. If it’s tyrannids and necrons you could even let it be completely results driven since those two factions don’t have an entrenched status quo.
Honestly after this I am even wondering if the true nids are even bug-like and monstrous.
It would completely ruin the fluff if they are anything but bug-like monsters.
It's always been said that the Tyranids are the vanguard of something else, the Tiamet development overall shows that the Hive mind has other concerns than just eating things in my opinion. Hence why I came to that point, the Silent king has seen their true face and when he came back he considered the Tyranids the true threat facing the galaxy.
Has it? It was generally implied that the nids are the vanguard of even more nids.
Oops correction, I meant to say that they are the vanguard for more nids BUT the nids that are outside the galaxy are not like the ones we see here. That's my theory, since now we are seeing that the hive mind has larger concerns than just eating. Sorry about that I should of clarified.
We know what the hive mind is - the gestalt collective consciousness of every single tyranid organism - and all it wants to do is nom nom nom.
And what is unknown about the GSC pilgrimage? The answer is given to you: "Those who touch the corrupted earth with their bare flesh are instantly bought in thrall to it - an convince their brethren to go back into space as missionaries, carrying the Creed of Tiamet to as many imperial worlds as possible."
They are just spreading the gift (infection) that is the GSC.
I disagree, I think it's more than that. So someone named the Conduit receives visions of paradise, instead of weakning the worlds around them they be-line right for the world Tiamet guards viciously. In all encounters with Tyranids the hive mind devours the GSC, nor do they give them visions. So they land on this world, the Tyranids allow them to do this in order to bond with it and then leave. As Overread said I think there is a long-term plan with these guys, they are not being used to just weaken worlds for consumption, with this story I think we are getting to see the hive mind plan beyond just eating people in my opinion.
At the end of the day we will see if they push this plot forward, as you said it could be just infection but there could be more going on in the background.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2019/02/11 15:01:59
2019/02/11 15:46:48
Subject: Update on Hive Fleet Tiamet and what they are building.
In recent lore we know Tyranids never faced anything like Daemons in previous galaxies.
So maybe they are harnessing the human psy potential to instead neutralize the warp use it for it's advantage and Tiamat it's trying to give a physical form to the Hive mind itself powered by the Psy power of all the Cultist gathered into a massive functioning planet wide psyker brain.
2019/02/11 15:50:51
Subject: Update on Hive Fleet Tiamet and what they are building.
Lord Perversor wrote: In recent lore we know Tyranids never faced anything like Daemons in previous galaxies.
So maybe they are harnessing the human psy potential to instead neutralize the warp use it for it's advantage and Tiamat it's trying to give a physical form to the Hive mind itself powered by the Psy power of all the Cultist gathered into a massive functioning planet wide psyker brain.
A 'Nid counterpart to Big E would be an interesting development.
2019/02/11 16:08:32
Subject: Update on Hive Fleet Tiamet and what they are building.
Lord Perversor wrote: In recent lore we know Tyranids never faced anything like Daemons in previous galaxies.
So maybe they are harnessing the human psy potential to instead neutralize the warp use it for it's advantage and Tiamat it's trying to give a physical form to the Hive mind itself powered by the Psy power of all the Cultist gathered into a massive functioning planet wide psyker brain.
That would be interesting, afterall something similar happened to the T'au. The races who have the potential to be a pysker spawned an avatar of the greater good.
Also the GSC makes note that in the wake of the great rift more psykers are awakening. Its getting to the point that the black ships are being overtaxed.
2019/02/11 16:29:03
Subject: Update on Hive Fleet Tiamet and what they are building.
The weird thing is that the Tyranid Hive Fleet Kronos is the active anti-chaos fleet, preferring to engage from afar, negative invulnerable saves, and both dampen the warp and repair the Great Rift.
I'm hoping Ouroborous and Tiament are the kind of 'loose-end' things that GW used to populate their boosk with, so players could use their imaginations.
2019/02/11 19:19:53
Subject: Update on Hive Fleet Tiamet and what they are building.
Nurglitch wrote: The weird thing is that the Tyranid Hive Fleet Kronos is the active anti-chaos fleet, preferring to engage from afar, negative invulnerable saves, and both dampen the warp and repair the Great Rift.
I'm hoping Ouroborous and Tiament are the kind of 'loose-end' things that GW used to populate their boosk with, so players could use their imaginations.
That might be another reason, overall I think its cool that GSC have a "shrine" world.
2019/02/11 20:04:23
Subject: Update on Hive Fleet Tiamet and what they are building.
Overread wrote: Tyranids have never been simplistic in their long term plans. It's at the individual gaunt level and at their war level where they are quite basic in terms of "nom nom".
What the hell are you talking about? They have come to nom nom nom. Thats it.
Also don't forget all the lore we have for them is basically Imperial reports of encounters. We've no idea what the Hive Mind really thinks or conceptualises or wants or even has any desire for.
Actually we do. From the devastation of baal.
"The hive mind did not know and did not care what its food called itself, but noted, in its alien way, the strangeness of this prey-cluster; an environment where the realities of the mind and form were intermingled. There was risk there, but good hunting in the dangerous shoals. The galaxy teemed with life, and the hive mind glutted itself on a staggering array of biological abundance.
From the human point of view, the tyrannic wars had raged for close to a half millennium. In that time, hundreds of Imperial worlds had been devoured. Several minor races had been consumed. Thousands of unknown planets outside the Imperium’s notice had been turned from living orbs to rocky spheres that would never bear life again."
"The hive mind looked out of its innumerable eyes towards the dull red star of Baal. It apprehended that this was the hive of the warriors that had hurt it so grievously, who had burned its feeding grounds and scattered its fleets. It hated the red prey, and it coveted them. Tasting their exotic genomes it had seen potential for new and terrible war beasts.
And so it drew its plans, and it set in motion its trillion trillion bodies towards the consumption of the creatures in red metal, so that their secrets might be plundered, and reemployed in the sating of the hive mind’s endless hunger. This was deliberate, considered, and done in malice.
The hive mind was aware, and it desired vengeance."
Hunting, prey, feeding grounds.. etc.. they are predators and they are here to feed... There are more similar quotes in the book from the nids point of view.
Also:
"They take even the metal,’ said Erwin.
The Servile of the Watch looked up from his podium over the augur pits, where baseline humans less fortunate than he laboured in unbreakable communion with the ship, their eyes and ears removed and sensory cortexes plugged directly into the auspectoria’s cogitators.
‘They take minerals of every kind, my lord,’ said the servile. ‘I have compared spectrographic analysis of this world with records of how it was. It shows massive depletion of all main range elements. The devourer remakes the worlds it consumes. Although I notice a small inconsistency with the oldest records of tyrannic-stripped worlds.’
‘Small enough for me to ignore?’ asked Erwin. The Servile of the Watch was an earnest fellow, genuinely fascinated with his work. He had been known to bore his masters with unnecessary detail.
The servile pulled a neutral expression, making his slave tattoos shift across his face, a sense of motion exaggerated by the low light of the command deck. The Servile of the Watch was unusually expressive for one of his breed. ‘Whether it is relevant or not I shall leave to your deep percipience, my lord.’
Erwin grunted. ‘Edify me then.’
‘The older worlds show a larger loss of mass. The tyranids spent longer on each, digesting parts of the planetary crust. They do not remain so long as they once did. Once the biological components of the world have been devoured, they target only sources of refined metals, such as the Mechanicus station here, in preference to the source minerals.’
‘Then they are running scared, feeding, moving on before they can be interrupted,’ said Erwin. ‘Commander Dante has them afraid.’
‘Or, my lord, they are presented with a surfeit of food. They have nothing to fear. They have too much choice. The Imperium is a banquet to them. They have become fussy eaters"
#nomnomnom
As for Cults the idea that Tyranids can have a long term plan and use for them beyond just consuming them makes sense. Why invest resources and then waste them; clearly they are re-using the best of them to help spread their infection faster and more fully through Imperial worlds. Humanity is wide spread and makes an ideal target.
At the end of the day we will see if they push this plot forward, as you said it could be just infection but there could be more going on in the background.
They are probably send ahead to scout for the best deals on real estate.
This message was edited 6 times. Last update was at 2019/02/11 20:21:16
Tyranid fanboy.
Been around since 3rd edition.
2019/02/11 20:15:45
Subject: Update on Hive Fleet Tiamet and what they are building.
Overread wrote: Tyranids have never been simplistic in their long term plans. It's at the individual gaunt level and at their war level where they are quite basic in terms of "nom nom".
What the hell are you talking about? The have come to nom nom nom. Thats it.
Devouring worlds is one facet of their behaviour; however it doesn't mean that the overarching total and only goal of the swarm is consumption. Even if it is the Swarm is clearly advanced enough that it will have complex plans and strategies toward achieving its end goal.
What I'm saying is that you can't view Tyrainds purely as an eating machine; they are more than capable of changing behaviour; of adapting and evolving and using new methods to achieve their end goal; with their objective(s); motivation; concepts; thinking being mostly unknown. You are right in that there are a few instances where we get a near first person view from their side; but they are few and far between and, like in your example, purely display one facet of themselves not a comprehensive one.
Overread wrote: Tyranids have never been simplistic in their long term plans. It's at the individual gaunt level and at their war level where they are quite basic in terms of "nom nom".
What the hell are you talking about? The have come to nom nom nom. Thats it.
Devouring worlds is one facet of their behaviour; however it doesn't mean that the overarching total and only goal of the swarm is consumption. Even if it is the Swarm is clearly advanced enough that it will have complex plans and strategies toward achieving its end goal.
What I'm saying is that you can't view Tyrainds purely as an eating machine; they are more than capable of changing behaviour; of adapting and evolving and using new methods to achieve their end goal; with their objective(s); motivation; concepts; thinking being mostly unknown. You are right in that there are a few instances where we get a near first person view from their side; but they are few and far between and, like in your example, purely display one facet of themselves not a comprehensive one.
So what is this other "goal" of theirs that I have somehow managed to completely miss?
And like you stated, the models might have evolved since 2nd edition, but the basic lore sure hasent...
This is from the 2nd edition codex:
Tyranid fanboy.
Been around since 3rd edition.
2019/02/11 20:51:48
Subject: Update on Hive Fleet Tiamet and what they are building.
A lot can change inbetween editions. For example Tiamet, the hive mind did not linger and build things until that hive fleet popped up. Now GW looks to be exploring why that is the case, now with the gsc and the conduit the hive mind is showing further abnormal behaviour.
Edit:Also BL writers have stated not to take their works as gospel, gw can turn around and contradict them. Like for example in the case of tiamet unleashed info. I mean we all remember what GW did to necrons right?
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2019/02/11 21:08:29
osting the whole timeline together.
