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Do you think it will be for 40k scale or epic scale flyers?

More flyers would be great but limited to Aeronautica only.

Should be interesting at least.

If it's a reprint of the original Aeronautica Imperialis game (and please GW do not this up by making it anything else) then it's Epic scale with mechanics similar to X-Wing.

I’m guessing epic scale. I’m also guessing it will be a flop...it was always (IIRC) the least successful spin-off mini-game and forgeworld discontinued it a while back. Airplanes just aren’t 40K enough, unlike titans or hive city gangsters.

The real question is: WHY THE FETHING HOLY EMPEROR AREN’T THEY REBOOTING BATTLEFLEET GOTHIC INSTEAD?!

I'd prefer same scale as 40k, that way we could use the models we already own

DeathKorp_Rider wrote:
I'd prefer same scale as 40k, that way we could use the models we already own

Please no. Aircraft games are not playable at 28mm.


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 greyknight12 wrote:
it was always (IIRC) the least successful spin-off mini-game

It was also the least marketed, available for the shortest time, and never got plastic kits. It's easy to forget in the modern world of information everywhere, but in the old days a lot of people never even knew that the game existed because its marketing presence was so invisible.

 Peregrine wrote:

DeathKorp_Rider wrote:
I'd prefer same scale as 40k, that way we could use the models we already own

Please no. Aircraft games are not playable at 28mm.

Yeah but people don't want to have to but new models of something they already have

DeathKorp_Rider wrote:
Yeah but people don't want to have to but new models of something they already have

Then they can play something else. It's better to have a good game that requires new model purchases than an unplayable game that can use your existing collection. After all, who cares if the game can make use of your existing models if nobody is ever going to play it?

Knowing GW tho and their penchant for trying a little too hard makes me wonder? If they price it relatively similar to xwing
I would be down for multipart aircraft in epicish scale like titanicus.

Would it be too much to ask for Squat Zeppelins?

 greyknight12 wrote:
I’m guessing epic scale. I’m also guessing it will be a flop...it was always (IIRC) the least successful spin-off mini-game and forgeworld discontinued it a while back. Airplanes just aren’t 40K enough, unlike titans or hive city gangsters.

You mean aircraft like the thunderhawk gunship?

Honestly it makes sense, Aeronautica was a side game for Epic back in the day and Epic itself didn't survive well nor all that long. GW is doing things differently this time around and they bruoght back Adepticus Titanicus and tested the waters; this is likely another water testing and will add aircraft into the mix. You can bet if it does even half well that we'll either see combo rules for using aircraft in AT (likely coming alongside some anti-air titans); and even potential for GW expanding both games by adding ground units at some point in the future.

And if it does poorly GW likely only invested in minimal sculpts so they can retire it to the side; the game will sitll 100% work for the fans and it doesn't mean a huge layoff.

I would love to see a great 'game in a box' with epic scale fliers for a couple factions (Imperial Navy and Orks maybe?), some ground targets and maybe some ground anti-air units, all in plastic. Maybe include a couple bombers and 4-6 fighters per side.

 greyknight12 wrote:
I’m guessing epic scale. I’m also guessing it will be a flop...it was always (IIRC) the least successful spin-off mini-game and forgeworld discontinued it a while back. Airplanes just aren’t 40K enough, unlike titans or hive city gangsters.

The real question is: WHY THE FETHING HOLY EMPEROR AREN’T THEY REBOOTING BATTLEFLEET GOTHIC INSTEAD?!

That is the question isn't it.

No shortage of planes to use; the original was pre-5e flyer boom and had just the Forge World flyer models. These days the Imperial Navy may not have much more (though I'd love some AI-scale Avengers) but there's a smorgasbord of extra aircraft. These days you could do Navy, Space Marines, Chaos, Eldar, Dark Eldar, Orks, Tyranids, and Necrons at least with 5+ airplanes per faction and not be finished.

It needs to be it's own scale or played on a 20 foot table. 40k scale flyers are fairly large and having more than say three to five a side is going to swallow up the table and have them far closer than they should be and make any kind of weapon range restrictions be meaningless.

If the goal is to replicate a large scale dog fight then the individual models have to be smaller.

 Peregrine wrote:

DeathKorp_Rider wrote:
I'd prefer same scale as 40k, that way we could use the models we already own

Please no. Aircraft games are not playable at 28mm.

Sure they are. You just need the proper amount of space for them. Though I do agree that a smaller scale (say 1:144 or 1:100) is more practical for most gaming of that kind.


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 greyknight12 wrote:
it was always (IIRC) the least successful spin-off mini-game

It was also the least marketed, available for the shortest time, and never got plastic kits. It's easy to forget in the modern world of information everywhere, but in the old days a lot of people never even knew that the game existed because its marketing presence was so invisible.

ccs wrote:
Sure they are. You just need the proper amount of space for them. Though I do agree that a smaller scale (say 1:144 or 1:100) is more practical for most gaming of that kind.

Ok, fine, you can nitpick. 28mm aircraft games are not playable within the constraints of space that the vast majority of players deal with. Yes, you can play a 28mm air combat game if you have an entire basketball court for your "table". No, that is not a realistic situation.

1) I'm pretty sure that 2007 doesn't qualify as "the old days".
2) These modern things like the internet & gaming websites/forums were well & truly established at that point and Aeronautica was absolutely covered.

And after this re-launches initial push? It'll become just as invisible.

2007 was the old days, and even if websites/forums existed social media wasn't a thing. You had to go out and seek information, if you participated in online forums at all. You didn't have Twitter/Facebook/etc broadcasting news of every new GW release every time you log in. And you certainly didn't have GW making effective use of the tools they had at the time.

Anyway, I'm not sure why any of this is controversial. It's the generally accepted position that GW's lack of marketing and support led to poor sales for all of the specialist games lines, and that self-inflicted lack of sales was used as justification to kill them off entirely. The only difference between Epic and AI was that Epic was an old game that had a long time to generate players and sales before GW abandoned it while AI never had a chance to get going. If GW's other relaunches can be successful then there's no reason to assume that AI is doomed to fail.

I expect something close to X-wing. Planes, with little maneouver sticks and rulers.

 Peregrine wrote:
If it's a reprint of the original Aeronautica Imperialis game (and please GW do not this up by making it anything else) then it's Epic scale with mechanics similar to X-Wing.

Aeronautica minis were distinctly larger than the equivalent epic minis.

The Newman wrote:

 greyknight12 wrote:
I’m guessing epic scale. I’m also guessing it will be a flop...it was always (IIRC) the least successful spin-off mini-game and forgeworld discontinued it a while back. Airplanes just aren’t 40K enough, unlike titans or hive city gangsters.

The real question is: WHY THE FETHING HOLY EMPEROR AREN’T THEY REBOOTING BATTLEFLEET GOTHIC INSTEAD?!

That is the question isn't it.

They are doing BFG, but it will be a couple years out.

DeathKorp_Rider wrote:
I'd prefer same scale as 40k, that way we could use the models we already own

Who's "we", kemo sabe? I've got four Thunderbolt fighters, two Marauders and half a dozen Eldar planes in Epic scale, and one single Thunderbolt for 40k.


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 Scott-S6 wrote:

 Peregrine wrote:
If it's a reprint of the original Aeronautica Imperialis game (and please GW do not this up by making it anything else) then it's Epic scale with mechanics similar to X-Wing.

Aeronautica minis were distinctly larger than the equivalent epic minis.

As with the titans, the forge World Epic planes were "properly" 6mm (give or take a bit) while the metal Epic planes from Citadel were undersized.


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Wings of War/Glory is a closer comparison than its Star Wars spin-off. In AI, planes moved forward in a straight line according to their speed, then followed a manoeuvre printed on a card - a turn, altitude change, sideslip, etc. IIRC the initiative order was fixed to a degree - more agile planes moved after less agile ones. There were 10 altitude levels, and some planes had a higher ceiling than others, so Nightwings could cruise over the heads of Valkyries.

All weapons had ammocounts (IIRC the thunderbolt's twin lascannon only had two or three shots), and all gamers had a 12-turn time limit before both sides had to disengage.

I expect a new game will have stratagems and/or orders, different squadron types (by analogy with the Maniple types), and perhaps a more flexible approach to loading your planes.

DeathKorp_Rider wrote:
I'd prefer same scale as 40k, that way we could use the models we already own

That was done as Stormcloud Attack, and it is a horrible version of Wings of War/X-Wing.

 AndrewGPaul wrote:

As with the titans, the forge World Epic planes were "properly" 6mm (give or take a bit) while the metal Epic planes from Citadel were undersized.

Their scale was pretty wonky. If you compared the minis to the dimensions in the book the scale definitely fluctuated quite a bit with the thunderbolt being one of the worst examples.

It would be pretty sweet if it uses the same scale and weapon profiles as Titanicus. Robots vs. Jets!

 Scott-S6 wrote:

 AndrewGPaul wrote:

As with the titans, the forge World Epic planes were "properly" 6mm (give or take a bit) while the metal Epic planes from Citadel were undersized.

Their scale was pretty wonky. If you compared the minis to the dimensions in the book the scale definitely fluctuated quite a bit with the thunderbolt being one of the worst examples.

True, but they were all roughly 6mm, unlike the citadel planes which were all sort of roughly 3mm or so (in scale with the titans, I suppose )


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 Stormonu wrote:

DeathKorp_Rider wrote:
I'd prefer same scale as 40k, that way we could use the models we already own

That was done as Stormcloud Attack, and it is a horrible version of Wings of War/X-Wing.

The Stormcloud Attack rules were not bad, I thought. It was definitely hampered by having to use 40k-scale planes on a 40k-sized board, though; it'd be more fun scaled down to Epic (but with movement distances increased compared to the model size).

I think if they did a Wings of War type game, but with all the stuff that flys it would be okay and fun.

Still wouldn't buy it though. Too many games GW put out and stopped supporting already in my closet.

My guess is a reprint of Stormcloud Attack

My $0.02

SG

 greyknight12 wrote:
I’m guessing epic scale. I’m also guessing it will be a flop...it was always (IIRC) the least successful spin-off mini-game and forgeworld discontinued it a while back. Airplanes just aren’t 40K enough, unlike titans or hive city gangsters.

I thought AT was going to flop, but it's actually doing well and it's a fun game. If AI has good rules like AT, and cool models, it will sell.

 ServiceGames wrote:
My guess is a reprint of Stormcloud Attack

My $0.02

SG

Unlikely. I imagine it will be a streamlined Aeronautica Imperialus, with bolted on stratagems faction abilities- with LOTs of dice rolling.

Back when it first came out there were not a lot of aircraft to choose from, now we have lots more but still, not a lot, if it's 28mm then it's DOA as far as I concerned, tables will be far too small to play a proper game, this needs to be GWs bid to enter the xwing market.

If it's for the Heresy only (as I expect), then Forge World currently offer the Storm Eagle, Fire Raptor, Xiphon Interceptor, Thunderhawk Gunship, Stormbird, Caestus Assault Ram and the Kharybdis and Anvillus drop pods for Space Marines, the Thunderbolt, Lightning Strike, Avenger, Marauder, Marauder Destroyer and Arvus Lighter for the Army/Navy and the Orion for the Custodes in 28mm size. I would expect those to make up the first waves of releases, with other variants (the original AI had photo-reconnaissance and "dambusters" variants for the Marauder, for example), and possibly other planes such as the Valkyrie, Sky Talon and Vulture and perhaps the Storm Talon, Stormraven, etc.