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Marine vehicles cannot take relics. It’s an explicit prohibition in the Codex and supplements.

Played against salamanders today with my crimson fists and I lost narrowly. I've lost my post few games with marines and I think I'm just too defensive with them. I always seem to sit back with my intercessors and shoot at stuff but I'm thinking now that moving forwards as a wall of infantry would be more effective.

For the first time ever as well I used a unit of 5 aggressors and they were pretty crap, we played the deployment which is lengthways and they basically got too shoot once then got smashed with stalker bolt rifles.

Really considering using a unit of 4 inceptors now for pure mobility and very handy firepower. I keep bouncing around different units and am now getting to grips now with what works best.

 Xenomancers wrote:

daismith906 wrote:
Has anyone used the sicarian punisher at all? Thinking of using it for my ultramarine successors

185pts with heavy bolter sponsons I think it would be good at clearing hordes and screening units with heavy doctrine first turn then ability to move and not suffer any penatly turn two with scions of gulliman

Ironhands works turn 1 with no penalty and you get reroll 1s too.

thats not what he asked.

JDarion wrote:
I know Chaplain dreads were eratted to not be able to take relics, but is there a rule that would prevent a Land Raider Excelsior (before it gets squatted)? Forgemaster + Salamanders Mantle seems to be amazingly unkillable. Low damage for the points, but immune to anything less than S6 is insane, and 6’s to wound from Lascannons (before mods, obvs). Take it further with Promethean Creed and Never Give Up and you’ve more or less locked your opponent out of slay the warlord and have Ob Sec to hold a point until 9th Ed drops.

First paragraph of the relics chapter in Sally (I think every supplement)

Named characters (such as Adrax
Agatone) and VEHICLE models cannot be given the following Relics.

Yeah Chaplain Dreads getting Relics would've been SOOOOO broken. Said nobody ever.

So for a Primaris IH list should I just load on heavy weapons anytime I can take them? Like always give my Intercessors Stalker bolt rifles and my Hellblasters Heavy Plasma Incinerators?

Stalker Intercessors get free rerolls and get to be on the move. So why wouldn't you ever take them?

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
Stalker Intercessors get free rerolls and get to be on the move. So why wouldn't you ever take them?

I'm thinking about horde armies like nids where all that AP and range would be wasted.

 Ferrum_Sanguinis wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
Stalker Intercessors get free rerolls and get to be on the move. So why wouldn't you ever take them?

I'm thinking about horde armies like nids where all that AP and range would be wasted.

Asscanbacks? Dakkapulsors? Stormtalons?

You can get that anti-horde in many other places I can assure you.

Thoughts on redemptor dreadnoughts?? I absolutely love mine and use him every game but I think he might have to be dropped through lack of effectiveness.
Past 3 games he has been relatively pants for me just sat at the back defending against anything that comes close which is gooyd main function. However if he moves he becomes very poor shooting wise and I can barely ever get him into combat. Im thinking of dropping him for an invictor to get me more board control!

Redemptor is only okay if you're Iron Hands. Otherwise Relic Contemptors would serve you a lot better.

Are there any restrictions on taking the same psychic power or the same chaplain canticle twice on different models?

You can take them as many times as you want but you can only use 1 of them per battle round. So in other words if you have 2 Chaplin's with the same litany only one can use the power, the other one is just there for redundancy.

Is that an ITC or format specific rule, or is it in the rulebook?

bmsattler wrote:
Is that an ITC or format specific rule, or is it in the rulebook?

For psychic powers it is a matched play rule called "Psychic Focus". For chaplains the restriction is listed in the unit entry.

Yeah it would've been pretty broken for two Chaplains to offer a charge bonus could you imagine???

I know the charge bonus from Chaplain's doesn't stack with anything. Thanks for the answers guys! Its appreciated.

Well, now I have 3 fully painted Invictors and I would like to field them.

Any hints how to use them. Raven Guard would be my first choice as this army can support their forward deployment properly.

Thoughts?

 wuestenfux wrote:
Well, now I have 3 fully painted Invictors and I would like to field them.

Any hints how to use them. Raven Guard would be my first choice as this army can support their forward deployment properly.

Thoughts?

I only have one up and painted so I've not been able to test it yet, but I think it could work well in any chapter because it's such a distraction carnifex that has the tools to deal with anything really. Very cost efficient. Ultramarines have a strat to re-deploy anything so that can help with pulling them back if you dont get first. Iron hands can move and shoot at no penalty and re-roll 1s + being more durable so they're an obvious choice. Salamanders can buff ones flamer to lay the hurt down. Raven guard can work for the reasons you mentioned.

Everyone but Ultramarines risk losing first turn and having them deployed in a way that lets the opponent sweep them off the board easily. This may buy the rest of your army time, but I really prefer to have the option of redeploying them back out of danger if I lose first turn.

Rogerio134134 wrote:
Played against salamanders today with my crimson fists and I lost narrowly. I've lost my post few games with marines and I think I'm just too defensive with them. I always seem to sit back with my intercessors and shoot at stuff but I'm thinking now that moving forwards as a wall of infantry would be more effective.

As a fellow Crimson Fist, I find they work well as an infantry horde that walks into the centre and holds it. Naturally it depends a lot on what units are in your list.
I haven't been impressed by aggressors yet either.

 wuestenfux wrote:
Well, now I have 3 fully painted Invictors and I would like to field them.

Any hints how to use them. Raven Guard would be my first choice as this army can support their forward deployment properly.

Thoughts?

Played several times against Invictors in ITC games, where you usually want to hold the center of the board.

The most effective way I've seen them used in ITC is to deploy them forward, out of LoS if possible, in spots where they can walk to the center of the board in turn 1 (whether you get turn one or not). 10" of movement means you can put them pretty far back and still cover the center objectives with your movement. A screen of phobos/scout infantry as far forward as possible helps keep the area they're moving into clear.

Once they're at the center, they work as blockers and screeners, hugging LoS blocking terrain and using autocannons to either sweep enemy screens or reach vulnerable units at the back. They can be wrapped, but are surprisingly resilient with all those wounds. You expect them all to be destroyed, but they buy your army enough time to score the easy kills and objective captures that put your score out front while your long-range guns do damage to the opponent.

Down the line I hope to get three for my salamanders army, to run interference for the flamer units moving up the table.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 ultimentra wrote:
How does a space marine army kill a Riptide?

1. You gotta kill the drones first, otherwise there's no point. Start at one end of the gunline and saturate drones with str 4+ massed fire. Personally I find Vengeance Whirlwinds better than Thunderfires for killing drones. Fewer shots, but forcing them to pass two ignore-wound save nets more actual dead drones I think.

2. Continue to ignore the riptides mostly. Once drones are reduced, take one potshot at a riptide to force the Tau player to take wounds giving it a 3+ invul, then focus fire on other units. If there are broadsides especially, focus on them before riptides. Snipe out the characters as soon as they're out of reach of savior protocols.

2.5 Get the markerlight guys first, and try to make the riptides move so they need high rolls to hit. If you have powers or abilities that cause -1 to hit to enemy units (there's an RG librarian power, for example) use that.

3. After you've killed everything else and all the riptides are hurting from all the wounds they've taken from boosting their saves, and when the Tau player is out of CPs, charge in with overwatch-ignoring relics/powers and kill them with thunderhammers. But you've probably won the game by that point.

1. You gotta kill the drones first, otherwise there's no point. Start at one end of the gunline and saturate drones with str 4+ massed fire. Personally I find Vengeance Whirlwinds better than Thunderfires for killing drones. Fewer shots, but forcing them to pass two ignore-wound save nets more actual dead drones I think.

But if you actually do the maths rather than guessing you'll find that on average a thunderfire kills almost twice as many drones on average

The thunderfire gets about 1.5 drones and the vengeance whirlwind about 0.8 when no rerolls / modifiers on either. Drones are tough...

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
Redemptor is only okay if you're Iron Hands. Otherwise Relic Contemptors would serve you a lot better.

what do you load them out with? They seem way more expensive with half the guns. What am I missing?

footfoe wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
Redemptor is only okay if you're Iron Hands. Otherwise Relic Contemptors would serve you a lot better.

what do you load them out with? They seem way more expensive with half the guns. What am I missing?

You give them las or autocannon.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 DoomMouse wrote:

1. You gotta kill the drones first, otherwise there's no point. Start at one end of the gunline and saturate drones with str 4+ massed fire. Personally I find Vengeance Whirlwinds better than Thunderfires for killing drones. Fewer shots, but forcing them to pass two ignore-wound save nets more actual dead drones I think.

But if you actually do the maths rather than guessing you'll find that on average a thunderfire kills almost twice as many drones on average

The thunderfire gets about 1.5 drones and the vengeance whirlwind about 0.8 when no rerolls / modifiers on either. Drones are tough...

It's not his fault his opponent doesn't play the drones right. SP states all damage is reduced to 1 mortal wound (probably the dumbest part of the SP rule) but that is the way it works. If you had to make 2 FNP for a 2 damage weapon tau drone might actually not be so broken.

Pretty sure he was targeting the drones directly? Sounded like it.

To be fair now I've looked a whirlwind with vengeance does kill very slightly more drones by targeting the riptide directly. (0.9 rather than that 0.8 presuming savior protocols are passed)

Any idea of how to play the Inquisition with our marines ? Anything that looks particularly good ?
Btw, which chapter has a way to make an opponent spend another CP on a 5+ when he uses stratagems ? I think I remember this from somewhere

Bare bones Ordo Xenos gives a 5+ CP farm and a cast/deny for 55 points and 1CP. Ordo Malleus gives two casts/denies for the same. I’d probably spring for the targeted smite vs leadership and/or the CP snatch powers.

 Ferrum_Sanguinis wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
Stalker Intercessors get free rerolls and get to be on the move. So why wouldn't you ever take them?

I'm thinking about horde armies like nids where all that AP and range would be wasted.

I think youll find the ap and range are more than satisfactory for killing hordes. Obviously the ABR does it a lot better BUT.
FNP? Dont care. 4+ save? Nope. Stalker is just fine for killing infantry. In a game that goes full/many turns just think how useless your opponents troops feel sitting on objectives doing nothing while your popping 5 shots a turn that completely ignore their saves and force a leadership check. Plus they are fantastic against things like admech destroyers and ofc...primaris marines. IMO the stalker is actually pretty OP. AP-3 on your standard weapon with 36" range should not be free compared to the bolt rifle.

Also don't forget - intercessors are pretty good at clearing hordes in melle. Space marines have an absurd amount of anti horde killing already...you can afford to give your troops a more anti elite weapon.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 godardc wrote:
Any idea of how to play the Inquisition with our marines ? Anything that looks particularly good ?
Btw, which chapter has a way to make an opponent spend another CP on a 5+ when he uses stratagems ? I think I remember this from somewhere

Nothing looks good considering it shuts of doctrines. Right?

It might shut off super Doctrines, but not Doctrines themselves. Since I don't approve of the Super Doctrines existing in the first place I approve.

Nice way for me to fit in a dude for CP farming. Just need to make room is all...