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2020/01/06 17:06:22
Subject: + Space Marines 8th Edition Codex Mark II Tactica +
Automatically Appended Next Post: So I'm putting together a Salamanders deathstar list built around 4 Centurion Devastators with all lascannons, and maybe the missiles too. The idea is to use the Self Sacrifice stratagem to keep them from being targeted while they kill stuff from across the table. (I'm giving up on the idea of salamanders closing in to use flamers/meltas since I can't make that work.)
If you don't have the Salamanders FAQ in front of you, the rewrite of Self Sacrifice is like this: At the start of your opponent's shooting phase, you pick an infantry unit to be protected, and an infantry unit within 6" of it to be sacrificed. The protected unit can't be targeted by enemy shooting until the sacrificial unit is dead or otherwise forced to be completely more than 6" away from the protected unit.
So I need the toughest possible infantry unit to stand within 6" of my centurions and take the hits. What do you guys think would work best?
-Big units of Intercessors--individually not that tough, but point-for-point more wounds, and you can switch them out for a fresh one as they get reduced.
-Six aggressors, T5 and 3 wounds each is tasty
-Ten terminators, any flavor
-Something else?
The sacrificial unit(s) have to be infantry. It would be nice, but not vital, if they could also be doing something while they stand around, like shooting stalker bolt rifles or whatever.
Salamanders also have probably the best durability buffs in the SM arsenal. The sacrificial unit can get -1 to be hit, +1 toughness, +1 armor save, and 6+++ feel no pain.
If I sacrifice a multiwound unit, the Forgeworld character Hareth Shen can be used to bring back dead models more reliably than a regular apothecary.
Also I could take a Chief Apothecary with the 5++ aura power (six aggressor/terminator bases will fit within 1" of an apothecary) and possibly the heal-the-same-unit-twice relic to buff up the sacrificial unit.
So taking all that into account, what's the best sacrificial unit?
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2020/01/06 19:12:02
"The complete or partial destruction of the enemy must be regarded as the sole object of all engagements.... Direct annihilation of the enemy's forces must always be the dominant consideration." Karl von Clausewitz
2020/01/06 19:53:19
Subject: Re:+ Space Marines 8th Edition Codex Mark II Tactica +
zerosignal wrote: Just a quick question, after trawling through the MkII codex last night (good grief, there are a lot of units in that book...)
tartaros terminators just seem straight-up better than standard terminators, at the same price point. Did I miss something?
The only difference is the weapon options, and Tartaros don’t get the teleport homer ability. So it seems like a fair tradeoff.
"The complete or partial destruction of the enemy must be regarded as the sole object of all engagements.... Direct annihilation of the enemy's forces must always be the dominant consideration." Karl von Clausewitz
2020/01/07 00:54:59
Subject: + Space Marines 8th Edition Codex Mark II Tactica +
Flavius Infernus wrote: Automatically Appended Next Post: So I'm putting together a Salamanders deathstar list built around 4 Centurion Devastators with all lascannons, and maybe the missiles too. The idea is to use the Self Sacrifice stratagem to keep them from being targeted while they kill stuff from across the table. (I'm giving up on the idea of salamanders closing in to use flamers/meltas since I can't make that work.)
If you don't have the Salamanders FAQ in front of you, the rewrite of Self Sacrifice is like this: At the start of your opponent's shooting phase, you pick an infantry unit to be protected, and an infantry unit within 6" of it to be sacrificed. The protected unit can't be targeted by enemy shooting until the sacrificial unit is dead or otherwise forced to be completely more than 6" away from the protected unit.
So I need the toughest possible infantry unit to stand within 6" of my centurions and take the hits. What do you guys think would work best?
-Big units of Intercessors--individually not that tough, but point-for-point more wounds, and you can switch them out for a fresh one as they get reduced.
-Six aggressors, T5 and 3 wounds each is tasty
-Ten terminators, any flavor
-Something else?
The sacrificial unit(s) have to be infantry. It would be nice, but not vital, if they could also be doing something while they stand around, like shooting stalker bolt rifles or whatever.
Salamanders also have probably the best durability buffs in the SM arsenal. The sacrificial unit can get -1 to be hit, +1 toughness, +1 armor save, and 6+++ feel no pain.
If I sacrifice a multiwound unit, the Forgeworld character Hareth Shen can be used to bring back dead models more reliably than a regular apothecary.
Also I could take a Chief Apothecary with the 5++ aura power (six aggressor/terminator bases will fit within 1" of an apothecary) and possibly the heal-the-same-unit-twice relic to buff up the sacrificial unit.
So taking all that into account, what's the best sacrificial unit?
It depends on your opponent, but for 1217 points you can get your self:
4 DevCents with 2 Las and hurricanes
6 Aggressors with boltstorms
35 Intercessors (5x5 and 1x10)
Depending on the match-ups:
Lots of Str 6 2D Decent AP - Buff the Aggressors and use them to shield the centurions
Lots of Mortal Wounds - Don't bother buffing the intercessors but put them in front of the centurions and aggressors. Unless the MWs come from shooting, self sacrifice doesn't matter here
Lots of 1D Decent AP shots, you can either buff the aggressors and use Stand your ground (+1 save against 1 Damage weapons) or use the centurions to tank for your aggressors (as they are still incredibly durable to 1D weapons)
Lots of 3+D High AP shots, Buff intercessors and use them to shield for either the aggressors or DevCents depending on whats more important.
Consider taking a Chaplain for either the bubble 5+ FNP against MW for MW heavy armies or +1 to hit against everybody else.
If your getting removed by just too much High AP weaponry (like stalker bolt rifles, AP3 2D is nasty for Cents), I would then consider putting in 5 SS/TH terminators (10 is way to expensive to just soak hits).
Also, sometimes it will be better to just let your opponent hit your DevCents, They are the most durable thing on your board and if they are going to try and put their entire army into low efficiency attacks against the DevCents, your other models will be in a better position later on. Especially with Harath Shen and F&F your centurions will be resilient as long as they aren't wiped.
2020/01/08 02:57:00
Subject: + Space Marines 8th Edition Codex Mark II Tactica +
hi all,
i have 40 intercessor and try to build them as ultramarine so their weapon load out should be bolt rifle. but i have a couple question
1. which equipment will suit for their sergeant ? i think i saw someone using thunderhammer?
2. should i keep them as squad of 10?
2020/01/08 03:39:40
Subject: + Space Marines 8th Edition Codex Mark II Tactica +
kaiseric wrote: hi all,
i have 40 intercessor and try to build them as ultramarine so their weapon load out should be bolt rifle. but i have a couple question
1. which equipment will suit for their sergeant ? i think i saw someone using thunderhammer?
2. should i keep them as squad of 10?
1) Chainswords. Free, extra attack. Leave the heavy-hitting to other units.
2) One or two squads of 10 (for strat and litany usage), the rest 5.
Clocks for the clockmaker! Cogs for the cog throne!
2020/01/08 11:46:26
Subject: + Space Marines 8th Edition Codex Mark II Tactica +
Having one or two Sergeants armed with a Thunder Hammer isn't a bad idea, especially with that many intercessor models available. Thunder Hammers make the squad scary in close combat.
2020/01/08 12:35:08
Subject: + Space Marines 8th Edition Codex Mark II Tactica +
Especially for the squads you are planning to march forward to grab objectives, a CC toy for the sarge is not a bad investment. They get a healthy number of attacks.
Flavius Infernus wrote: Automatically Appended Next Post: So I'm putting together a Salamanders deathstar list built around 4 Centurion Devastators with all lascannons, and maybe the missiles too. The idea is to use the Self Sacrifice stratagem to keep them from being targeted while they kill stuff from across the table. (I'm giving up on the idea of salamanders closing in to use flamers/meltas since I can't make that work.)
If you don't have the Salamanders FAQ in front of you, the rewrite of Self Sacrifice is like this: At the start of your opponent's shooting phase, you pick an infantry unit to be protected, and an infantry unit within 6" of it to be sacrificed. The protected unit can't be targeted by enemy shooting until the sacrificial unit is dead or otherwise forced to be completely more than 6" away from the protected unit.
So I need the toughest possible infantry unit to stand within 6" of my centurions and take the hits. What do you guys think would work best?
-Big units of Intercessors--individually not that tough, but point-for-point more wounds, and you can switch them out for a fresh one as they get reduced.
-Six aggressors, T5 and 3 wounds each is tasty
-Ten terminators, any flavor
-Something else?
The sacrificial unit(s) have to be infantry. It would be nice, but not vital, if they could also be doing something while they stand around, like shooting stalker bolt rifles or whatever.
Salamanders also have probably the best durability buffs in the SM arsenal. The sacrificial unit can get -1 to be hit, +1 toughness, +1 armor save, and 6+++ feel no pain.
If I sacrifice a multiwound unit, the Forgeworld character Hareth Shen can be used to bring back dead models more reliably than a regular apothecary.
Also I could take a Chief Apothecary with the 5++ aura power (six aggressor/terminator bases will fit within 1" of an apothecary) and possibly the heal-the-same-unit-twice relic to buff up the sacrificial unit.
So taking all that into account, what's the best sacrificial unit?
It depends on your opponent, but for 1217 points you can get your self:
4 DevCents with 2 Las and hurricanes
6 Aggressors with boltstorms
35 Intercessors (5x5 and 1x10)
Depending on the match-ups:
Lots of Str 6 2D Decent AP - Buff the Aggressors and use them to shield the centurions
Lots of Mortal Wounds - Don't bother buffing the intercessors but put them in front of the centurions and aggressors. Unless the MWs come from shooting, self sacrifice doesn't matter here
Lots of 1D Decent AP shots, you can either buff the aggressors and use Stand your ground (+1 save against 1 Damage weapons) or use the centurions to tank for your aggressors (as they are still incredibly durable to 1D weapons)
Lots of 3+D High AP shots, Buff intercessors and use them to shield for either the aggressors or DevCents depending on whats more important.
Consider taking a Chaplain for either the bubble 5+ FNP against MW for MW heavy armies or +1 to hit against everybody else.
If your getting removed by just too much High AP weaponry (like stalker bolt rifles, AP3 2D is nasty for Cents), I would then consider putting in 5 SS/TH terminators (10 is way to expensive to just soak hits).
Also, sometimes it will be better to just let your opponent hit your DevCents, They are the most durable thing on your board and if they are going to try and put their entire army into low efficiency attacks against the DevCents, your other models will be in a better position later on. Especially with Harath Shen and F&F your centurions will be resilient as long as they aren't wiped.
Thanks for the feedback, especially on the pairings. It consistently looks like Aggressors are the best option to have available.
"The complete or partial destruction of the enemy must be regarded as the sole object of all engagements.... Direct annihilation of the enemy's forces must always be the dominant consideration." Karl von Clausewitz
2020/01/08 15:36:08
Subject: + Space Marines 8th Edition Codex Mark II Tactica +
kaiseric wrote: hi all,
i have 40 intercessor and try to build them as ultramarine so their weapon load out should be bolt rifle. but i have a couple question
1. which equipment will suit for their sergeant ? i think i saw someone using thunderhammer?
2. should i keep them as squad of 10?
I think the power fist is more realistic. If you are taking 1 thunder-hammer on a 5 man intercessors...that will just be the first one to die. Just take 2 powerfists instead. It is about the same price and the likelihood of actually using the weapon goes up drastically.
For example I take 25 intercessors on foot and I put 12 in impulsors. I give the 2 sarg typically a power sword on 1 and a power fist on the other. I don't think I've gotten them into combat once. I'm starting to think the melle weapons are a waste. You really only take them for matchups like custodes/eldar who want to jump on you with tough units like spears or jetbikes and it gives you better counter charge.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/01/08 17:14:54
If we fail to anticipate the unforeseen or expect the unexpected in a universe of infinite possibilities, we may find ourselves at the mercy of anyone or anything that cannot be programmed, categorized or easily referenced.
- Fox Mulder
2020/01/08 18:23:31
Subject: + Space Marines 8th Edition Codex Mark II Tactica +
Which factions are best for souping? I'm trying to soup up with Raven guard an blood angels. Both factions don't get that big debuff for losing the super doctrine, imho.
I wish the would be some long range faction who doesn't lean too much on super doctrine.
For my pure BA or RG lists I find it difficult to cover the long range support (no-FW). Am I missing something? My RG are pure primaris and bringing a single costly range threat feels just stupid.
2020/01/08 18:31:45
Subject: + Space Marines 8th Edition Codex Mark II Tactica +
Which factions are best for souping? I'm trying to soup up with Raven guard an blood angels. Both factions don't get that big debuff for losing the super doctrine, imho.
I wish the would be some long range faction who doesn't lean too much on super doctrine.
For my pure BA or RG lists I find it difficult to cover the long range support (no-FW). Am I missing something? My RG are pure primaris and bringing a single costly range threat feels just stupid.
For your BA take melle elements and your RG take shooty elements. RG can take a chapter master and ven dreads...works great. BA take sang gaurd and characters ect.
If we fail to anticipate the unforeseen or expect the unexpected in a universe of infinite possibilities, we may find ourselves at the mercy of anyone or anything that cannot be programmed, categorized or easily referenced.
- Fox Mulder
2020/01/08 19:57:09
Subject: + Space Marines 8th Edition Codex Mark II Tactica +
Which factions are best for souping? I'm trying to soup up with Raven guard an blood angels. Both factions don't get that big debuff for losing the super doctrine, imho.
I wish the would be some long range faction who doesn't lean too much on super doctrine.
For my pure BA or RG lists I find it difficult to cover the long range support (no-FW). Am I missing something? My RG are pure primaris and bringing a single costly range threat feels just stupid.
For long-range fire support:
Imperial Fists still get ignore cover in soup lists. That makes their indirect fire weapons better. Elsewhere in this thread you'll see references to an IF spearhead with a captain (with the Eye of Hypnoth) and three TFC/Whirlwinds. Since these weapons don't shoot at vehicles most of the time anyway, they're not losing anything.
Iron Hands still get the character dreadnought and iron stone in soup lists. Elsewhere on this thread you'll see references to an IH spearhead detachment with a chaplain dread, contemptor mortis dread, and two thunderfire cannons. The TFCs don't move anyway, so they don't suffer from loss of the superdoctrine, and the dreads are BS 2+, so they don't lose that much.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2020/01/08 19:58:29
"The complete or partial destruction of the enemy must be regarded as the sole object of all engagements.... Direct annihilation of the enemy's forces must always be the dominant consideration." Karl von Clausewitz
2020/01/08 20:39:01
Subject: + Space Marines 8th Edition Codex Mark II Tactica +
So in this list I would have a decent alpha strike and screen removal. A chance to drop down an invul. T1/T2 with the JP lib with MoA deploy. The above eldar soup is something from my meta and if I can give it a hard time, maybe I can compete with others as well. I don't have any FW so have to stick with regulars.
Any ideas/suggestions. My "RG" primaris is painted in black colour scheme, so it can be altered into something else.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2020/01/08 20:42:05
2020/01/08 22:45:59
Subject: + Space Marines 8th Edition Codex Mark II Tactica +
So in this list I would have a decent alpha strike and screen removal. A chance to drop down an invul. T1/T2 with the JP lib with MoA deploy. The above eldar soup is something from my meta and if I can give it a hard time, maybe I can compete with others as well. I don't have any FW so have to stick with regulars.
Any ideas/suggestions. My "RG" primaris is painted in black colour scheme, so it can be altered into something else.
I would suggest taking the tech marine with +1 to hit aura for vehicals with a chapter master for that RG detachment. Surrounded by redemptor dreads with gatling guns and missle pods and impuslors with the skytalon array. That will murder those Eldar. Just play RG successors with +3 inch range and always count in cover.
Another option is just spamming intercessors with autoboltguns with a chapter master. This negates the MW spam.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2020/01/08 22:56:26
If we fail to anticipate the unforeseen or expect the unexpected in a universe of infinite possibilities, we may find ourselves at the mercy of anyone or anything that cannot be programmed, categorized or easily referenced.
- Fox Mulder
2020/01/12 13:53:15
Subject: Re:+ Space Marines 8th Edition Codex Mark II Tactica +
Hi everyone, still fairly new to marines but trying to build somewhat competitively.
Are Impulsors any good?
Was thinking of adding one with 5 Auto bolt Intercessors and a Captain but have never seen/heard about anyone trying them. Was thinking of going either Orbital bombard or shield - guessing the shield is better!
Currently mostly a gun line army and I want something that can reach out!
Dont really want to buy it if its trash!
2020/01/12 17:06:18
Subject: Re:+ Space Marines 8th Edition Codex Mark II Tactica +
What would be a good purchase for her when birthdays come around to make her army slightly more competitive.
First thing that leaps out is you need one more troop pick for a battalion. A box of intercessors would give you some options, and more poses then what I assume is 2x the same mono-pose ones.
Alternatively, I might suggest the SC: vanguard marines box. It gives you another troop pic (infiltrators) another HQ (a LT, which matches better than 2 captains) and some long range firepower in the form of supressors and eliminators.
(If you fan find/split the showdowspear box, that’s better deal, as you get 2 more HQs and the whole chaos side)
A lower cost option would be a new HQ. Doubling up on the captains doesn’t do a whole lot. Adding a librarian, Lt. or another option will give you more flexibility.
Tremble wrote: Hi everyone, still fairly new to marines but trying to build somewhat competitively.
Are Impulsors any good?
Was thinking of adding one with 5 Auto bolt Intercessors and a Captain but have never seen/heard about anyone trying them. Was thinking of going either Orbital bombard or shield - guessing the shield is better!
Currently mostly a gun line army and I want something that can reach out!
Dont really want to buy it if its trash!
It depends how many T7 or T8 vehicles you have in your list.
Against most shooty marine armies, you can expect to lose 1-3 T7 vehicles per turn. If you run the math on four Iron Hands lascannons (hitting on 2s, rerolling 1s, -4AP—a mortis contemptor dread or regular mortis dread supported by a master of the forge) you find that the median damage on a T7 vehicle with a 3+ save is about 8-10 wounds, with about 33% of the time scoring 11+ wounds. Giving it a 4+ invul cuts those wounds in half on average, but that just means the second dread (or flyer) has to shoot it too.
So just one impulsor, even with the shield, will probably be dead in turn 1 if it’s your only vehicle.
Two impulsors with shields, and one of them may last into turn 2-3.
If you really want to use impulsors, you need at least 4-5 vehicles with T7+ to have any chance of some making it into later turns.
I recently played in a couple of noncompetitive local RTs with an Eldar list with 5 wave serpents and 3 night spinners, and against shooty marine armies I lost a tank or two per turn (and wave serpents are tougher than impulsors). At a tournament yesterday, my Iron Hands opponent was able to take out one whirlwind per turn every time he got a shot at one (the terrain didn’t allow me to hide them all), and could easily have killed 2-3 in a turn if he’d had LoS.
So they work, but they will get killed and you need enough of them to still have some around in later turns when you’ve had a chance to deal with your opponent’s antitank shooting.
I keep hearing buzz about a theoretical impulsor spam list with 7-8 impulsors all armed with maximum guns and no shields, but I haven’t seen anybody actually field that yet.
"The complete or partial destruction of the enemy must be regarded as the sole object of all engagements.... Direct annihilation of the enemy's forces must always be the dominant consideration." Karl von Clausewitz
2020/01/13 01:02:39
Subject: Re:+ Space Marines 8th Edition Codex Mark II Tactica +
What would be a good purchase for her when birthdays come around to make her army slightly more competitive.
definatly more troops. I'll second the suggestion to snag the start collecting vanguard box.
that'll give ehr another unit of troops. a Leuitenant (giving her a differant type of HQ, which;ll be good) a unit of Eliminators which are REALLY nice. a unit of supressors which will give her some mobile heavy firepower, all for a, considering primaris marines, a pretty reasonable price tag.
Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two
2020/01/13 06:11:13
Subject: + Space Marines 8th Edition Codex Mark II Tactica +
Hope you might be able to help offer me some advice for my intecessors load outs. I have the 10 from DI and then another box. I only have two grenade launchers so I was thinking of sticking them on two of the DI mono-pose ones and then splitting the box between the other two weapon types and having
5 w/ Bolt Rifles, inc one Grenade launcher
5 w/ Bolt Rifles, inc one Grenade launcher
5 w/ Stalker Bolt Rifles
5 w/ Auto Bolt Rifles
And then just stick a chainsword on all the sergeants (this is free and has no downside from what I can see?)
Is this my best option? I'm more interested in flexibility then whats 100% the best loadout, but if one of the bolter types is far superior I'm happy to go with more of one type. I've only used normal bolt rifles so far so no idea how the others do on the battlefield
2020/01/13 08:23:11
Subject: Re:+ Space Marines 8th Edition Codex Mark II Tactica +
I always run 1 each of the little fliers and a Redemptor, sometimes dropping in another dread so it would not be the only mech.
Have not seen anyone buy/use an Impulsor at all yet which might be the hint I should stay away!
I have plenty of anti tank in my list but not sure I have enough anti-infantry so thought adding the auto bolt intercessors that can be in opponents face first turn would be helpful.
Have heard mention of hellblasters in Impulsors as well but they are mega expensive, and they need a captain and the banner and a lieutenant which means 3 impulsors to get everyone there with a unit each!
2020/01/16 08:14:05
Subject: Re:+ Space Marines 8th Edition Codex Mark II Tactica +
I always run 1 each of the little fliers and a Redemptor, sometimes dropping in another dread so it would not be the only mech.
Have not seen anyone buy/use an Impulsor at all yet which might be the hint I should stay away!
I have plenty of anti tank in my list but not sure I have enough anti-infantry so thought adding the auto bolt intercessors that can be in opponents face first turn would be helpful.
Have heard mention of hellblasters in Impulsors as well but they are mega expensive, and they need a captain and the banner and a lieutenant which means 3 impulsors to get everyone there with a unit each!
I have been considering the following package as a mobile strike force:
2 Impulsors with 5 Hellbasters each
Smash Captain on bike to follow up with speed
A Lieutenant and Ancient each ride in one vehicle
Comes up at around 40% of a 2000pts list. Expensive but looks like packing a real punch and well protected until firing. Any thought?
2020/01/16 15:22:44
Subject: + Space Marines 8th Edition Codex Mark II Tactica +
Most of the competitive lists I've seen wouldn't have trouble killing two Impulsors and 10 primaris marines in a single turn. So I think you might be disappointed with the results.
I'm another one of those marine players who has piles of unused hellblasters because of the way they come with every boxed set, and I've tried to make them work, but without any success personally.
It's not only that they can't do as much damage as other, much more devastating units like centurions or even devastators, and it's not only needing all those support characters just to get a measly 2 points of damage per shot. I think the major problem is that they're still priced according to the early 8th-edition value of plasma, and the meta has changed around them to make them now ridiculously overpriced.
For the cost of one hellblaster you can get two intercessors with stalker bolt rifles. The intercessors have the same damage output, same number of shots, twice the wounds, obsec, longer range, and similar AP depending on doctrine. Hellblasters at their current cost don't make any sense.
Impulsors can work as a shooting/flying/screening vehicle, similar to how wave serpents work in an Eldar army. But Impulsors, IMHO, don't currently have anything that they can carry that's going to be super hard-hitting (which can be good, though, because then they become less of a target).
"The complete or partial destruction of the enemy must be regarded as the sole object of all engagements.... Direct annihilation of the enemy's forces must always be the dominant consideration." Karl von Clausewitz
2020/01/17 09:16:04
Subject: Re:+ Space Marines 8th Edition Codex Mark II Tactica +
my biggest sucess with hellblasters came from someone who'd never fought em before, hellblasters are just plasma gun marines and thus it's easy to under estimate em if you don't realize how potent a full squad of em is. I one shooted his redemptor dread.
Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two
2020/01/17 20:58:09
Subject: + Space Marines 8th Edition Codex Mark II Tactica +
Are there anyways to get Tactical Doctrine T1? There is the stratagem, but thats only 1 unit. Trying to get both aggressors units T1. Im looking at taking Ultramarine Aggressors (2x6) with Chaptaer anceient, chaplian, Calgar and tiggy as a death ball in the middle of the board. Would like to be able to get into Tac Dotrcrine T1.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/01/17 21:13:53
10000+
10000+
8500+
3000+
8000+
3500+ IK Plus 1x Warhound, Reaver, Warlord Titans
Dynas wrote: Are there anyways to get Tactical Doctrine T1? Im looking at taking Ultramarine Aggressors (2x6) with Chaptaer anceient, chaplian, Calgar and tiggy as a death ball in the middle of the board. Would like to be able to get into Tac Dotrcrine T1.
There are 2 ways.
1 stratagem allows you to pick your doctrine for an infantry or biker unit.
Tiggy's warlord trait allows you to put 1 unit in the tactical doctrine I believe at the start of the turn within 6".
So you can get both of them in the tactical doctrine turn 1 with that build. No problem.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/01/17 21:07:36
If we fail to anticipate the unforeseen or expect the unexpected in a universe of infinite possibilities, we may find ourselves at the mercy of anyone or anything that cannot be programmed, categorized or easily referenced.
- Fox Mulder
Ultramarines, 3rd Co. and friends, 16k+ 
4k 
4k Points
Competition Index
10000+
8500+
3000+
8000+
3500+ IK Plus 1x Warhound, Reaver, Warlord Titans
