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Made in pl
Fixture of Dakka




pm713 wrote:
 Ishagu wrote:
In 5 years Cawl will be established, old lore.

Community needs more patience.

I doubt that. Centurions have been around long enough for me to call them old but the way they were introduced was and will always be rubbish and lazy in my view and the same is true of Primaris.


Considering more then 5 years passed since the GK codex that maybe people angry, does that mean GW is going to give a GK a good codex this time?


If you don't like Primaris, the Great Rift or Guilliman, simply play 41st K instead of 42nd K. Nothing changes for your Minis.

like besides what other armies are using, right?

If you don't like the setting now why are you returning to it?

because otherwise it would mean you spend a lot of real money on plastic toys, that are useless? playing the game is the only thing that adds value to them, and the lore is part of the things that is suppose to enhance the feeling.

If you have to kill, then kill in the best manner. If you slaughter, then slaughter in the best manner. Let one of you sharpen his knife so his animal feels no pain. 
   
Made in gb
Ultramarine Land Raider Pilot on Cruise Control





Holy Terra

So you don't like the lore. Congratulations on having an opinion.

Don't continue to whinge about it in every topic because the things you don't like aren't going to change. It will get more fleshed out of course, but there won't be a grand retcon because it has been very successful.

"I don't like it" is an opinion, but not a valid critique that can or should be actioned. You've said your peace.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/09/06 07:14:27


-~Ishagu~- 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





 Ishagu wrote:
So you don't like the lore. Congratulations on having an opinion.

Don't continue to whinge about it in every topic because the things you don't like aren't going to change. It will get more fleshed out of course, but there won't be a grand retcon because it has been very successful.

"I don't like it" is an opinion, but not a valid critique that can or should be actioned. You've said your peace.



Here you go again, saying someone can dislike it and it isn't valid.

What about all the valid points that have been spoken ? I mean aside from them, sure, no reason to quibble at all.

Brushing those reasons aside and citing it all as foolish, or pointless or any other way of discrediting it. I mean you do realize you can't win this yes ?

It isn't a battle to be fought, or a war to be won. It's people not liking the current direction and even if we typed up huge explanations it would just be shot down as wrong or told it'll take time for the issues to fade. Some may not have stances other than " I don't like them they are bad " is that any better than " I love them, so they are great ! " I really don't think so.

I can't speak for everyone, but I think the more you tell people they can't whinge and should basically just be quiet in every topic in which it arises simply promises they will whinge now in every single topic.

Heck, I'm pretty the over the top love it or leave it snipes and toxic primaris love you slap everyone down with has I'm sure made sure people will whinge more as opposed to less.

I'm also not sure you even realize what an opinion is and isn't. As really your love isn't any more founded than someone elses dislike of them. I'm sure to you it's of paramount importance but that doesn't make anyone elses dislike not valid and I've seen many valid critiques with dislike in them.

I'll close in saying, you don't ever get to tell someone when they've had their peace, sorry that isn't up to you. You can always choose not to comment yourself, that is up to you.
   
Made in cz
Longtime Dakkanaut




 Ishagu wrote:
So you don't like the lore. Congratulations on having an opinion.

Don't continue to whinge about it in every topic because the things you don't like aren't going to change. It will get more fleshed out of course, but there won't be a grand retcon because it has been very successful.

"I don't like it" is an opinion, but not a valid critique that can or should be actioned. You've said your peace.


Here we go again. Ain't nobody gonna say anything against your honeybunny while youre watching, right?

Primaris aside, I've asked before in this thread and I'll ask again: the hell do you think you are telling people they should not voice criticism and either just shut up and accept or leave the hobby? Also there have been brought up many points in this thread that were not just: "I just hate primaris, because!"
   
Made in ca
Commander of the Mysterious 2nd Legion





Tiberias wrote:
 Ishagu wrote:
So you don't like the lore. Congratulations on having an opinion.

Don't continue to whinge about it in every topic because the things you don't like aren't going to change. It will get more fleshed out of course, but there won't be a grand retcon because it has been very successful.

"I don't like it" is an opinion, but not a valid critique that can or should be actioned. You've said your peace.


Here we go again. Ain't nobody gonna say anything against your honeybunny while youre watching, right?

Primaris aside, I've asked before in this thread and I'll ask again: the hell do you think you are telling people they should not voice criticism and either just shut up and accept or leave the hobby? Also there have been brought up many points in this thread that were not just: "I just hate primaris, because!"


except most of those posts are "Hi I hate primaris because the sky is pink" and it turns out that they saw a single picture of a sunrise and thought the sky was perminantly pink. or that their professed reason doesn't upon any examination make any sense. we have had at this point a half dozen "primaris suck" threads within the last month.

As for Gulliman changing the setting by leading the Imperium, he doesn't not really. the high lords are rarely a factor in 40k events. Until "Watchers of the throne" mentioned some, had the name of even a SINGLE high lord gotten published? the over all leader of the Imperium... ISN'T IMPORTANT.

Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two 
   
Made in cz
Longtime Dakkanaut




BrianDavion wrote:
Tiberias wrote:
 Ishagu wrote:
So you don't like the lore. Congratulations on having an opinion.

Don't continue to whinge about it in every topic because the things you don't like aren't going to change. It will get more fleshed out of course, but there won't be a grand retcon because it has been very successful.

"I don't like it" is an opinion, but not a valid critique that can or should be actioned. You've said your peace.


Here we go again. Ain't nobody gonna say anything against your honeybunny while youre watching, right?

Primaris aside, I've asked before in this thread and I'll ask again: the hell do you think you are telling people they should not voice criticism and either just shut up and accept or leave the hobby? Also there have been brought up many points in this thread that were not just: "I just hate primaris, because!"


except most of those posts are "Hi I hate primaris because the sky is pink" and it turns out that they saw a single picture of a sunrise and thought the sky was perminantly pink. or that their professed reason doesn't upon any examination make any sense. we have had at this point a half dozen "primaris suck" threads within the last month.

As for Gulliman changing the setting by leading the Imperium, he doesn't not really. the high lords are rarely a factor in 40k events. Until "Watchers of the throne" mentioned some, had the name of even a SINGLE high lord gotten published? the over all leader of the Imperium... ISN'T IMPORTANT.


Eeeh, ok? The main issue was not robert girlyman, at least in the criticism I had presented.
   
Made in ch
The Dread Evil Lord Varlak





BrianDavion wrote:
Tiberias wrote:
 Ishagu wrote:
So you don't like the lore. Congratulations on having an opinion.

Don't continue to whinge about it in every topic because the things you don't like aren't going to change. It will get more fleshed out of course, but there won't be a grand retcon because it has been very successful.

"I don't like it" is an opinion, but not a valid critique that can or should be actioned. You've said your peace.


Here we go again. Ain't nobody gonna say anything against your honeybunny while youre watching, right?

Primaris aside, I've asked before in this thread and I'll ask again: the hell do you think you are telling people they should not voice criticism and either just shut up and accept or leave the hobby? Also there have been brought up many points in this thread that were not just: "I just hate primaris, because!"


except most of those posts are "Hi I hate primaris because the sky is pink" and it turns out that they saw a single picture of a sunrise and thought the sky was perminantly pink. or that their professed reason doesn't upon any examination make any sense. we have had at this point a half dozen "primaris suck" threads within the last month.

As for Gulliman changing the setting by leading the Imperium, he doesn't not really. the high lords are rarely a factor in 40k events. Until "Watchers of the throne" mentioned some, had the name of even a SINGLE high lord gotten published? the over all leader of the Imperium... ISN'T IMPORTANT.


Considering most voiced like me the opinion that the models aren't bad but the lore. Just like centurions, which seems also not acceptable.
Because people here seem to be so dense that leaving an undersea trench would lead to spontanious combustion.

https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page
A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.
GW:"Space marines got too many options to balance, therefore we decided to legends HH units."
Players: "why?!? Now we finally got decent plastic kits and you cut them?"
Chaos marines players: "Since when are Daemonengines 30k models and why do i have NO droppods now?"
GW" MONEY.... erm i meant TOO MANY OPTIONS (to resell your army to you again by disalowing former units)! Do you want specific tyranid fighiting Primaris? Even a new sabotage lieutnant!"
Chaos players: Guess i stop playing or go to HH.  
   
Made in ca
Commander of the Mysterious 2nd Legion





Considering most voiced like me the opinion that the models aren't bad but the lore. Just like centurions, which seems also not acceptable.


given that centurions where introduced in the exact oppisite manner of Primaris, slide in not as something new, but as something Marines ahd actually had for milennia and was a found STC template. I have an honest question..

Since developing actual new weapons/equipment is "bad lore" and sliding in new weapons/equipment as something thats always been there is "bad lore" what is ACCEPTABLE Lore if you want to add something new to Space Marines?
Honest question, because I'm not sure I get it. Please keep in mind "not introducing new stuff" isn't an acceptable answer eaither.

Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two 
   
Made in se
Growlin' Guntrukk Driver with Killacannon





Sweden

 Ishagu wrote:
So you don't like the lore. Congratulations on having an opinion.

Don't continue to whinge about it in every topic because the things you don't like aren't going to change. It will get more fleshed out of course, but there won't be a grand retcon because it has been very successful.

"I don't like it" is an opinion, but not a valid critique that can or should be actioned. You've said your peace.



This is a forum, it's built on opinions. You trying to shut down everyone who dislike primaris and devalue their statements is not adding anything positive to dakkadakka or 40k.

Brutal, but kunning!  
   
Made in gb
Insect-Infested Nurgle Chaos Lord






Why do you think I have him on ignore? Stop quoting this clown so I don’t have to see his drivel and follow suit and let him scream into the void at no one.


Games Workshop Delenda Est.

Users on ignore- 53.

If you break apart my or anyone else's posts line by line I will not read them. 
   
Made in us
Archmagos Veneratus Extremis




On the Internet

BrianDavion wrote:
Tiberias wrote:
 Ishagu wrote:
So you don't like the lore. Congratulations on having an opinion.

Don't continue to whinge about it in every topic because the things you don't like aren't going to change. It will get more fleshed out of course, but there won't be a grand retcon because it has been very successful.

"I don't like it" is an opinion, but not a valid critique that can or should be actioned. You've said your peace.


Here we go again. Ain't nobody gonna say anything against your honeybunny while youre watching, right?

Primaris aside, I've asked before in this thread and I'll ask again: the hell do you think you are telling people they should not voice criticism and either just shut up and accept or leave the hobby? Also there have been brought up many points in this thread that were not just: "I just hate primaris, because!"


except most of those posts are "Hi I hate primaris because the sky is pink" and it turns out that they saw a single picture of a sunrise and thought the sky was perminantly pink. or that their professed reason doesn't upon any examination make any sense. we have had at this point a half dozen "primaris suck" threads within the last month.

As for Gulliman changing the setting by leading the Imperium, he doesn't not really. the high lords are rarely a factor in 40k events. Until "Watchers of the throne" mentioned some, had the name of even a SINGLE high lord gotten published? the over all leader of the Imperium... ISN'T IMPORTANT.

Goge Vandire.
   
Made in ch
The Dread Evil Lord Varlak





BrianDavion wrote:
Considering most voiced like me the opinion that the models aren't bad but the lore. Just like centurions, which seems also not acceptable.


given that centurions where introduced in the exact oppisite manner of Primaris, slide in not as something new, but as something Marines ahd actually had for milennia and was a found STC template. I have an honest question..

Since developing actual new weapons/equipment is "bad lore" and sliding in new weapons/equipment as something thats always been there is "bad lore" what is ACCEPTABLE Lore if you want to add something new to Space Marines?
Honest question, because I'm not sure I get it. Please keep in mind "not introducing new stuff" isn't an acceptable answer eaither.



See take Cawl and his primaris.
I wouldn't have cared if the Primaris range would've just replaced the squat marine range.

Alternativly propperly introducing Cawl via admech codex and establishing him propperly beforehand wouldn't have killed GW aswell.

I would also not have been opposed to gw using the hh legion Arsenal more.

My point is, if you use plotdevice atleast use it propperly, no need to use a sledgehammer for a solution when you just needed a hammer and screwdriver.

https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page
A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.
GW:"Space marines got too many options to balance, therefore we decided to legends HH units."
Players: "why?!? Now we finally got decent plastic kits and you cut them?"
Chaos marines players: "Since when are Daemonengines 30k models and why do i have NO droppods now?"
GW" MONEY.... erm i meant TOO MANY OPTIONS (to resell your army to you again by disalowing former units)! Do you want specific tyranid fighiting Primaris? Even a new sabotage lieutnant!"
Chaos players: Guess i stop playing or go to HH.  
   
Made in us
Beautiful and Deadly Keeper of Secrets





 Grimtuff wrote:
Why do you think I have him on ignore? Stop quoting this clown so I don’t have to see his drivel and follow suit and let him scream into the void at no one.
Certainly an amount of vitriol going on here.


This is a forum, it's built on opinions. You trying to shut down everyone who dislike primaris and devalue their statements is not adding anything positive to dakkadakka or 40k.
People seem to be forgetting how often the people who actually like Primaris have been shut down each time they've liked it. At this point the constant negativity would just drone on people till they've decided to speak out against it.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/09/06 11:23:40


 
   
Made in fi
Courageous Space Marine Captain






BrianDavion wrote:


As for Gulliman changing the setting by leading the Imperium, he doesn't not really. the high lords are rarely a factor in 40k events. Until "Watchers of the throne" mentioned some, had the name of even a SINGLE high lord gotten published? the over all leader of the Imperium... ISN'T IMPORTANT.

It isn't important if you don't care about themes. It doesn't really matter who the High Lords were as people. But they were normal humans, nobles, ambitious priests and politicians. Now there is a noblebright demigod. It is fine that you don't care, it is even fine if you like this lame superhero running the Imperium. It is not fine to claim that a very significant change has not happened.

Cawl is similarly infuriating (albeit not quite so setting shattering.) It is one super tech pries that is farted into existence out of thin air that suddenly produces a ton of hitherto unknown setting altering tech.

And of course the Primaris are results of the actions of these bozos. They're introduced in a really jarring manner, so I fully understand why people don't like their lore. And I think GW understands too, as in the new codex they're trying to represent than as much like the old marines than they can. This is a good approach and how it should have been from the get go. I really like the Primaris models, and as this is mainly a modelling hobby for me that makes me forgive many sins. But butchering of the setting that has happened since Gathering Storm is really unfortunate, and it is not surprising if that has soured many people's opinion on the Primaris.

   
Made in us
Morally-Flexible Malleus Hearing Whispers




In DnD terms, Gman and Cawl conspiring is like to The Paladin hatching a plot with the Warlock to steal from the chantry.
   
Made in us
Ollanius Pius - Savior of the Emperor






Gathering the Informations.

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
In DnD terms, Gman and Cawl conspiring is like to The Paladin hatching a plot with the Warlock to steal from the chantry.

Not really?

It's more as if the Paladin hatched a plot with the Warlock to steal a relic from the chantry that might save the village at large but the chantry won't release it because the priests are liking the power they've been given over the village because of said relic.
   
Made in us
Ultramarine Chaplain with Hate to Spare






BrianDavion wrote:
Tiberias wrote:
 Ishagu wrote:
So you don't like the lore. Congratulations on having an opinion.

Don't continue to whinge about it in every topic because the things you don't like aren't going to change. It will get more fleshed out of course, but there won't be a grand retcon because it has been very successful.

"I don't like it" is an opinion, but not a valid critique that can or should be actioned. You've said your peace.


Here we go again. Ain't nobody gonna say anything against your honeybunny while youre watching, right?

Primaris aside, I've asked before in this thread and I'll ask again: the hell do you think you are telling people they should not voice criticism and either just shut up and accept or leave the hobby? Also there have been brought up many points in this thread that were not just: "I just hate primaris, because!"


except most of those posts are "Hi I hate primaris because the sky is pink" and it turns out that they saw a single picture of a sunrise and thought the sky was perminantly pink. or that their professed reason doesn't upon any examination make any sense.


Important question: Are there any points made by the anti-primaris camp that you think ARE valid?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/09/06 16:36:52


And They Shall Not Fit Through Doors!!!

Tyranid Army Progress -- With Classic Warriors!:
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/743240.page#9671598 
   
Made in gb
Sadistic Inquisitorial Excruciator




The point of having unnamed High Lords of Terra is they are mysterious background characters because it's not about them.
It's about you and your Dudes, and their struggles and not the High Lords of Terra being on every battlefield to personally fight Khorne incarnate because every battle decides the fate of the universe.

It's about the fact that in the grim darkness of the future there is only pointless war between people with no names who die on unremember on a thousand battlefields.

Or it was, anyway.

Disclaimer - I am a Games Workshop Shareholder. 
   
Made in fi
Courageous Space Marine Captain






AdmiralHalsey wrote:
The point of having unnamed High Lords of Terra is they are mysterious background characters because it's not about them.
It's about you and your Dudes, and their struggles and not the High Lords of Terra being on every battlefield to personally fight Khorne incarnate because every battle decides the fate of the universe.

It's about the fact that in the grim darkness of the future there is only pointless war between people with no names who die on unremember on a thousand battlefields.

Or it was, anyway.

Thank you!

   
Made in ca
Commander of the Mysterious 2nd Legion





 Crimson wrote:
BrianDavion wrote:


As for Gulliman changing the setting by leading the Imperium, he doesn't not really. the high lords are rarely a factor in 40k events. Until "Watchers of the throne" mentioned some, had the name of even a SINGLE high lord gotten published? the over all leader of the Imperium... ISN'T IMPORTANT.

It isn't important if you don't care about themes. It doesn't really matter who the High Lords were as people. But they were normal humans, nobles, ambitious priests and politicians. Now there is a noblebright demigod. It is fine that you don't care, it is even fine if you like this lame superhero running the Imperium. It is not fine to claim that a very significant change has not happened.




SOOO NOBLE BRIGHT

Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two 
   
Made in fi
Courageous Space Marine Captain






The guy himself is noblebright. He is a noble hero lamenting the current state of the Imperium, and a considerable (though perhaps insufficient) power to change things.

Also, superpowered immortals who are worshipped as divine and wield ultimate authority lamenting how hard their lot in life is isn't particularly endearing.

Though I agree with Guilliman on something: it indeed would have been better had he stayed dead.

   
Made in ca
Commander of the Mysterious 2nd Legion





 Insectum7 wrote:
BrianDavion wrote:
Tiberias wrote:
 Ishagu wrote:
So you don't like the lore. Congratulations on having an opinion.

Don't continue to whinge about it in every topic because the things you don't like aren't going to change. It will get more fleshed out of course, but there won't be a grand retcon because it has been very successful.

"I don't like it" is an opinion, but not a valid critique that can or should be actioned. You've said your peace.


Here we go again. Ain't nobody gonna say anything against your honeybunny while youre watching, right?

Primaris aside, I've asked before in this thread and I'll ask again: the hell do you think you are telling people they should not voice criticism and either just shut up and accept or leave the hobby? Also there have been brought up many points in this thread that were not just: "I just hate primaris, because!"


except most of those posts are "Hi I hate primaris because the sky is pink" and it turns out that they saw a single picture of a sunrise and thought the sky was perminantly pink. or that their professed reason doesn't upon any examination make any sense.


Important question: Are there any points made by the anti-primaris camp that you think ARE valid?


sure it's fine to say "Not a fan of the aestetics" (claiming they're not space Marines however) I mean you can even justly say you dislike the aestetics of a single partriuclar unit. Likewise One complaint I've heard was that Marines suffer from a certain.. "uncanny valley" when they're close to Marines but are just differant eneugh to trigger a bit of a "uhh no" but in my experiance a lot of the anti-primaris "reasons" feel reactionary. like they've decided they hate primaris and are now looking for a reason. but the problem is in part the degree of venom. god knows we all have models we dislike and bits of lore that are "thats stupid" but I can't think of anything else people act like this on. most people seem content to live and elt live and reckongize that 40k's a big setting with things for all people.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/09/06 17:25:42


Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two 
   
Made in us
Wicked Warp Spider





 Crimson wrote:
The guy himself is noblebright. He is a noble hero lamenting the current state of the Imperium, and a considerable (though perhaps insufficient) power to change things.

Also, superpowered immortals who are worshipped as divine and wield ultimate authority lamenting how hard their lot in life is isn't particularly endearing.

Though I agree with Guilliman on something: it indeed would have been better had he stayed dead.

That picture is also an example of someone that did not get the "show, don't tell" memo.

Generic characters disappearing? Elite units of your army losing options and customizations? No longer finding that motivation to convert?
Your army could suffer Post-Chapterhouse Stress Disorder (PCSD)! If you think that your army is suffering one or more of the aforementioned symptoms, call us at 789-666-1982 for a quick diagnosis! 
   
Made in us
Archmagos Veneratus Extremis




On the Internet

AdmiralHalsey wrote:
The point of having unnamed High Lords of Terra is they are mysterious background characters because it's not about them.
It's about you and your Dudes, and their struggles and not the High Lords of Terra being on every battlefield to personally fight Khorne incarnate because every battle decides the fate of the universe.

It's about the fact that in the grim darkness of the future there is only pointless war between people with no names who die on unremember on a thousand battlefields.

Or it was, anyway.

Except we've had named High Lords in the past. Goge Vandire, Drakan Vangorich, Gastaph Hediatrix, and this list I just got from Lexicanum of notable High Lords:
Decius XXIII — Ecclesiarch as of 945.M41
Veneris II – First Ecclesiarch to sit in the Senatorum
Umberto II — Ecclesiarch around the time of the 11th Black Crusade
Sarius Gorki — Paternoval Envoy in M41
Sabrina — Abbess of the Adepta Sororitas. Currently missing
Javor — Lord High Admiral of the Imperial Navy in M32
Iulia Lestia — Inquisitorial Representative in 989.M41
Uixot — Fabricator-General of Mars in the 8th Black Crusade
Sennaca — Traitor who conspired to murder the Emperor, sometime between M40 and M41
Aesoth Koumadra — Captain-General of the Adeptus Custodes
Tybanus Lencilius — Captain-General of the Adeptus Custodes
Galahoth — Captain-General of the Adeptus Custodes in M41
Andros Launceddre — Captain-General of the Adeptus Custodes in M41
Vult - Inquisitorial Representative in M41
Skito Gavalles - Master of the Administratum in the 500s.M41
Saviona
Veynd
Xanthius

So yeah, we've had the High Lords involved on the plot before plenty of times.

Heck Vandire was the sole reason the Sisters of Battle came into being. And that's from -second- edition. This insistance of "facts" about the way the lore used to be is demonstratably false and honestly a bit of a joke.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/09/06 17:32:58


 
   
Made in us
Wicked Warp Spider





Spoiler:
BrianDavion wrote:
 Insectum7 wrote:
BrianDavion wrote:
Tiberias wrote:
 Ishagu wrote:
So you don't like the lore. Congratulations on having an opinion.

Don't continue to whinge about it in every topic because the things you don't like aren't going to change. It will get more fleshed out of course, but there won't be a grand retcon because it has been very successful.

"I don't like it" is an opinion, but not a valid critique that can or should be actioned. You've said your peace.


Here we go again. Ain't nobody gonna say anything against your honeybunny while youre watching, right?

Primaris aside, I've asked before in this thread and I'll ask again: the hell do you think you are telling people they should not voice criticism and either just shut up and accept or leave the hobby? Also there have been brought up many points in this thread that were not just: "I just hate primaris, because!"


except most of those posts are "Hi I hate primaris because the sky is pink" and it turns out that they saw a single picture of a sunrise and thought the sky was perminantly pink. or that their professed reason doesn't upon any examination make any sense.


Important question: Are there any points made by the anti-primaris camp that you think ARE valid?


sure it's fine to say "Not a fan of the aestetics" (claiming they're not space Marines however) I mean you can even justly say you dislike the aestetics of a single partriuclar unit. Likewise One complaint I've heard was that Marines suffer from a certain.. "uncanny valley" when they're close to Marines but are just differant eneugh to trigger a bit of a "uhh no" but in my experiance a lot of the anti-primaris "reasons" feel reactionary. like they've decided they hate primaris and are now looking for a reason. but the problem is in part the degree of venom. god knows we all have models we dislike and bits of lore that are "thats stupid" but I can't think of anything else people act like this on. most people seem content to live and elt live and reckongize that 40k's a big setting with things for all people.

So.. what's the most likely scenario
A) people dislike the Primaris for the reasons they explicitly describe to you
B) People DECIDED to dislike a new incarnation of the most popular 40k line because they felt like to do that, and are coming up with reasons to justify their decision.
You are not sounding really rational here. There is no conspiracy, just people disliking a number of design directions and the correlated fluff.

This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2019/09/06 17:35:48


Generic characters disappearing? Elite units of your army losing options and customizations? No longer finding that motivation to convert?
Your army could suffer Post-Chapterhouse Stress Disorder (PCSD)! If you think that your army is suffering one or more of the aforementioned symptoms, call us at 789-666-1982 for a quick diagnosis! 
   
Made in ca
Commander of the Mysterious 2nd Legion





 Kaiyanwang wrote:
 Crimson wrote:
The guy himself is noblebright. He is a noble hero lamenting the current state of the Imperium, and a considerable (though perhaps insufficient) power to change things.

Also, superpowered immortals who are worshipped as divine and wield ultimate authority lamenting how hard their lot in life is isn't particularly endearing.

Though I agree with Guilliman on something: it indeed would have been better had he stayed dead.

That picture is also an example of someone that did not get the "show, don't tell" memo.


it would be if that was the only time we saw it but that quote is from a differant source, and every post Gathering storm book dealing with Gulliman does explore this theme. Of Gulliman grappling with the hellscape the IoM has become

Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two 
   
Made in us
Wicked Warp Spider





BrianDavion wrote:
 Kaiyanwang wrote:
 Crimson wrote:
The guy himself is noblebright. He is a noble hero lamenting the current state of the Imperium, and a considerable (though perhaps insufficient) power to change things.

Also, superpowered immortals who are worshipped as divine and wield ultimate authority lamenting how hard their lot in life is isn't particularly endearing.

Though I agree with Guilliman on something: it indeed would have been better had he stayed dead.

That picture is also an example of someone that did not get the "show, don't tell" memo.


it would be if that was the only time we saw it but that quote is from a differant source, and every post Gathering storm book dealing with Gulliman does explore this theme. Of Gulliman grappling with the hellscape the IoM has become

The number of times it appears has nothing to do with its nature.

Generic characters disappearing? Elite units of your army losing options and customizations? No longer finding that motivation to convert?
Your army could suffer Post-Chapterhouse Stress Disorder (PCSD)! If you think that your army is suffering one or more of the aforementioned symptoms, call us at 789-666-1982 for a quick diagnosis! 
   
Made in us
Archmagos Veneratus Extremis




On the Internet

 Kaiyanwang wrote:

So.. what's the most likely scenario
A) people dislike the Primaris for the reasons they explicitly describe to you
B) People DECIDED to dislike a new incarnation of the most popular 40k line because they felt to do that, and are coming up with reasons.
You are not sounding really rational here. There is no conspiracy, just people disliking a number of design decisions and the correlated fluff.

Most likely scenario is that people like/dislike Primaris for purely emotional reasons and have been rationalizing it since they've picked their camp.

I feel like this rationalization is the problem as instead of approaching the problem acknowledging biases (such as mine that revolve around my enjoyment of painting Primaris versus my lack of enjoyment painting standard Marines) leads to things like making up facts about the lore, or looking for justifications to claim that the Primaris ruined 40k, or acting like the only logical option is to like something new and bash everyone who doesn't like it.

I never want to say a person can't feel a certain way about models, I mean I can't seem to enjoy painting Tau for reasons I've never been able to articulate, but I will happily point out where people got things wrong where they lay out their rationalizations of the old setting versuses the new (like the High Lords being unimportant to the setting in the old lore).

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2019/09/06 17:43:45


 
   
Made in us
Wicked Warp Spider





 ClockworkZion wrote:

Most likely scenario is that people like/dislike Primaris for purely emotional reasons and have been rationalizing it since they've picked their camp.

I feel like this rationalization is the problem as instead of approaching the problem acknowledging biases (such as mine that revolve around my enjoyment of painting Primaris versus my lack of enjoyment painting standard Marines) leads to things like making up facts about the lore, or looking for justifications to claim that the Primaris ruined 40k, or acting like the only logical option is to like something new and bash everyone who doesn't like it.

I never want to say a person can't feel a certain way about models, I mean I can't seem to enjoy painting Tau for reasons I've never been able to articulate, but I will happily point out where people got things wrong where they lay out their rationalizations of the old setting versuses the new (like the High Lords being unimportant to thensetting in the old lore).

This is downright insulting, especially in light of the fact that many voiced with points and examples their concerns.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2019/09/06 17:44:04


Generic characters disappearing? Elite units of your army losing options and customizations? No longer finding that motivation to convert?
Your army could suffer Post-Chapterhouse Stress Disorder (PCSD)! If you think that your army is suffering one or more of the aforementioned symptoms, call us at 789-666-1982 for a quick diagnosis! 
   
Made in ca
Commander of the Mysterious 2nd Legion





 Kaiyanwang wrote:
BrianDavion wrote:
 Kaiyanwang wrote:
 Crimson wrote:
The guy himself is noblebright. He is a noble hero lamenting the current state of the Imperium, and a considerable (though perhaps insufficient) power to change things.

Also, superpowered immortals who are worshipped as divine and wield ultimate authority lamenting how hard their lot in life is isn't particularly endearing.

Though I agree with Guilliman on something: it indeed would have been better had he stayed dead.

That picture is also an example of someone that did not get the "show, don't tell" memo.


it would be if that was the only time we saw it but that quote is from a differant source, and every post Gathering storm book dealing with Gulliman does explore this theme. Of Gulliman grappling with the hellscape the IoM has become

The number of times it appears has nothing to do with its nature.


"ohh GW doesn't show but tells!" "well actually they show it plenty" "the number of times it appers (and is thus shown) is irrelevant"

ok we're done here.

Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two 
   
 
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