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For 8th Edition I think it's fair to say that Necron players have been lamenting their army trait due to the built in tax over-blowing the cost of certain units, and more importantly, the difficulty of scaling it correctly across various game sizes. Either too powerful at low points where wiping out entire units is less common or almost worthless beyond 1500+ because damage across armies spikes exponentially for reasons I'm sure we're all aware of. In the end what should be a defining feature of the army is often at best reduced to a token gesture.
So before we start spit-balling ideas I do wanna clarify that yes, excessive lethality in 8th has led to the Necron trait suffering adversely but I don't want to focus on the rest of 8th for this topic. Specifically assuming GW plans to stay in 8th for the next 10+ years but is looking for ways to buff or alter RP what would you suggest?

A few common things I've noticed that I'll list here:

Roll for RP at the start of both player turns or,

At the end of each phase with dead models staying dead (5th Edition)

Conversely, RP at the start of the Necron player turn but models can be reanimated as long as there is a model of a similar type within 6", but not necessarily the same unit (Classic We'll Be Back)

Change it to FNP like Death Guard and the 7th Edition RP mechanic.

Add an innate FNP (6+++) to all current RP units which can be buffed by Crypteks etc.

Stratagem/Resurrection Orb to allow dead units to reanimate once per battle.

Personally I think I aligning more towards replicating the We'll Be Back from 3rd Edition as it solves the biggest issue of not getting to use the ability you're taxed for. While it doesn't help with scaling at lower points it does mean at higher games when a unit of 20 warriors for example is destroyed, those models can still roll for RP as long as there's another unit of warriors within 6". At which point any models that come back will join that unit from there on out till the end of the game while the failures are discarded.

Bonus if Canoptek Spyders and Ghost Arks borrowed this from the classic Tomb Spyders:
"If a Necron cannot self-repair because no model of the same type is within 6", it may still self-repair if there is both a Tomb Spyder within 12" and another model of the same type on the battlefield. If the Necron recovers then it will immediately join that model's unit as normal."

I'd veer more towards the 5th ed approach. It felt much more powerful to me back then, but that also was when every gun in the game turned armor saves into a mockery of their former glory. So technically, none of the above really...feel right?

With that being said. I think Necrons just need a 2-3CP strat to roll RP for a dead squad. Only usable once on a squad. And it still bears the risk of nothing getting back up. The successful reanimations stand up as close as possible to a marker placed where the squad was removed from, and more than 1 inch from the enemy.

Not well thought out, but I wouldn't mind something like this...

When the last model in a non-HQ NECRON INFANTRY unit is removed from the board, put down a Reanimation Nexus token within 1" of that model.

AND

On your turn, after all Reanimation Protocols rolls have been made, roll a D6 for each of your Reanimation Nexus tokens. For each unmodified 6, perform the following. Select a model from a destroyed non-HQ Necron Infantry unit and put it on the board, wholly within 1" of the Reanimation Nexus. Then, make a Reanimation Protocols roll for that model's unit. Last, remove that Reanimation Nexus token from the board.

I think this would be mostly unusable at low points costs as units rarely die, but would be helpful and allow dead units to SOMETIMES come back. The more units die, the more likely one of them is to come back.

The re-roll 1s stratagem in the codex should be changed to +1 to the RP roll, and it needs to be 1CP. A new stratagem for 2CP which allows to roll RP for a just destroyed unit is needed.

iGuy91 wrote:With that being said. I think Necrons just need a 2-3CP strat to roll RP for a dead squad. Only usable once on a squad. And it still bears the risk of nothing getting back up. The successful reanimations stand up as close as possible to a marker placed where the squad was removed from, and more than 1 inch from the enemy.

p5freak wrote:The re-roll 1s stratagem in the codex should be changed to +1 to the RP roll, and it needs to be 1CP. A new stratagem for 2CP which allows to roll RP for a just destroyed unit is needed.

Yeah I suppose a simple solution in this instance may be the best one, as well as the easier to implement for GW.

I'd put the RP in the morale phase. Any Unit with RP that suffered casualties that turn makes RP rolls before any morale checks are made.

 Kriswall wrote:
Not well thought out, but I wouldn't mind something like this...

When the last model in a non-HQ NECRON INFANTRY unit is removed from the board, put down a Reanimation Nexus token within 1" of that model.

AND

On your turn, after all Reanimation Protocols rolls have been made, roll a D6 for each of your Reanimation Nexus tokens. For each unmodified 6, perform the following. Select a model from a destroyed non-HQ Necron Infantry unit and put it on the board, wholly within 1" of the Reanimation Nexus. Then, make a Reanimation Protocols roll for that model's unit. Last, remove that Reanimation Nexus token from the board.

I think this would be mostly unusable at low points costs as units rarely die, but would be helpful and allow dead units to SOMETIMES come back. The more units die, the more likely one of them is to come back.

Personally, I'd do something like this, but I'd have RP rolls made at the end of every turn, rather than just the beginning of Necron turn, just after Moral checks are made. And allow RP rolls to be made for units that were completely wiped. Just place a token where the last model was removed and use it to measure where the return models go

Easy

This kind of changes in RP are very dangerous and cannot be done at the middle of an edition, because a little change in RP can change the whole meta and make necrons inmortal gods.

I, like others said above, would give a 6+++ to every unit with RP and a change in the stratagems, allowing the player to resurrect much more but with a CP waste (necrons cannot CP farm), so player should decide between resurrecting his army or wasting them in an aggresive way.

I really dislike having Reanimation Protocols being a FNP, because that doesn't give you the emotional cool-factor of seeing models coming back to the table. Instead, it just because another save. I also really like the idea of "kill them all dead so they don't come back!", which has been a staple of the ability in previous editions.

I think a simpler fix would be to follow the Orks and make it that RP rolls can be made so long as another model of the same type is nearby. This means that a unit supported by other units needs all the units taken out to deny RP, not just a single unit.

"So long as at least one model from this unit is on the battlefield, or this unit's reanimation marker is within 6" of another unit of the same name, roll a D6 for each slain model from this unit at the beginning of your turn. On a 5+, the model's reanimation protocols activate and it is returned to the battlefield within 1" of another of this unit's models or within 1" of the reanimation marker, and outside 1" of enemy models. Models that do not have their reanimation protocols activate or that cannot be set up this way remain inactive until your next turn. If the last model of this unit is slain, place a reanimation marker as close as possible to the last slain model. Then remove all reanimation markers from the battlefield. A Necron Character's reanimation marker is always considered to be within 6" of another unit of the same name."

I would make it a strategem, for 1 CP you can return a Reanimation Protocols unit to the board if it's wiped out.

I would transform it into a sort of "delayed FNP".

- Roll it once for any model (not repeatedly). If failed that's it (the necron teleport to safety).
- Roll it at the beginning of your turn (so it is different from a standard Feel No Pain). It would be weaker for board control but will make impossible to focus on a unit an remove it totally from the board (like is with a normal FNP).

And... that's it.

Nurglitch wrote:
I would make it a strategem, for 1 CP you can return a Reanimation Protocols unit to the board if it's wiped out.

So 1CP for 220 points of dead warriors to come back into play?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Cybtroll wrote:
I would transform it into a sort of "delayed FNP".

- Roll it once for any model (not repeatedly). If failed that's it (the necron teleport to safety).
- Roll it at the beginning of your turn (so it is different from a standard Feel No Pain). It would be weaker for board control but will make impossible to focus on a unit an remove it totally from the board (like is with a normal FNP).

And... that's it.

Isn't that... what we have now? But weaker because you can only attempt to bring a model back once?

What if we left it as-is but created a strat used when a necron unit is targeted for attacks that lets you do an immediate RP roll? So your opponent has killed off 15 of your 20 warriors, and he declares he's going to shoot some devastators at them. You pop your strat before he rolls to hit and get an average of 5 warriors back. It doesn't prevent your opponent from focus-firing them to death, but it ensures that you can benefit from RP on at least one unit a turn.

Resurrection dice: commanders get X number of Ressurection dice at the start of a turn. The dice can rolled to generate RP points to be spent to return slain necron models to the board within Y” of the commander model. Unless otherwise indicated, returned models revive in coherency with the unit they were lost from.

1 point. = 1 Necron Warrior
2 points = 1 Necron Immortal
3 points = 1 Necron Elite (Destroyer, Deathmarks, Lichegarde, etc.)
2 points = heal 1 wound or restore 1 hull points.

Just bring back the 4+ 'We'll Be Back' roll and bring back Phase Out.

Gary_1986 wrote:
Just bring back the 4+ 'We'll Be Back' roll and bring back Phase Out.

I'd adjust it so there's a degree of success in WBB.
6+ Pass
3-5 Damaged
1-2 Fail

A damaged cron could be a new model type like a blue horror is to a pink (or the flamey guys are to a blue). It would have reduced stats- particularly toughness OR be an extra wound counter for the squad. They'd get put onto recut sprues included with regular units.



The idea then is that you shoot a squad and half are casualties. They go down, as per WBB. They make WBB rolls, some get up, some phase out and some are replaced with shot up Necron models- which add visual interest to homogenous necron squads.

Some support characters or circumstances might allow damaged necrons to repair into full squad members again.

@=Angel=

Cool concept! I'm not sure it's the most practical solution though. A few thoughts:

* It would mean including a significant amount of extra plastic in each box. Even if they only provided 5 "damaged" 'crons in each box, I could still see it resulting in a hefty real world money increase per box.


* Mixed statlines in a unit can get slightly book keepy and complicated. Assuming damaged 'crons just had 1 worse WS/BS, for isntance, you'd end up doubling the number of to-hit pools you'd have to resolve .

I'd make a few changes, first of all.. every necron infantry unit would have an additional wound point (so necron warriors would have 2 wounds each) at the end of each turn you roll a 1d6, on a 5+ the unit heals 1d3 points, of which can be used to ressurect dead infantry. (so if I roll a 2 on 1d2 IU can ressurect 2 warriors at 1 HP each or 1 at full health) IMHO this'd make necron warriors INSANELY durable.

obviously points would have to be adjusted as you've basicly got intercessors with a built in apocathary.

Wyldhunt wrote:
@=Angel=

Cool concept! I'm not sure it's the most practical solution though. A few thoughts:

* It would mean including a significant amount of extra plastic in each box. Even if they only provided 5 "damaged" 'crons in each box, I could still see it resulting in a hefty real world money increase per box.


* Mixed statlines in a unit can get slightly book keepy and complicated. Assuming damaged 'crons just had 1 worse WS/BS, for isntance, you'd end up doubling the number of to-hit pools you'd have to resolve .

I think its a cool idea, not a practical solution.
To make it more practical rules wise, a damaged necron could just be an extra wound for the squad (unless and until repaired somehow) They would be the first casualty you pull because they can't fight in CC or Shoot.

There's a spectrum of possible complexity- from the simple FNP save, through the binary pass/fail that WBB used to be, right up to super impractical charts where individual necrons get their limbs blown off.
Scarabs were included as extra plastic, whether you liked them or not.

Honestly, I think bringing back a much closer version of WBB would be awesome, one shot, 4+, crypteks boost it to 3+, requires either models left in the unit, or a similar unit within 6", things that allow extra RP rolls still do so, making them far more valuable.
Bring back phase out.
Rather than the old 'Necron' status, it could be applied to all NECRON units except those with the VEHICLE and CANOPTEK keywords.

 Blndmage wrote:
Honestly, I think bringing back a much closer version of WBB would be awesome, one shot, 4+, crypteks boost it to 3+, requires either models left in the unit, or a similar unit within 6", things that allow extra RP rolls still do so, making them far more valuable.
Bring back phase out.
Rather than the old 'Necron' status, it could be applied to all NECRON units except those with the VEHICLE and CANOPTEK keywords.

The old decimator rule system might work out better for the vehicle side.

1 remove. 2-5 losses remain 6 revive with x ammount of W.

For infantry, i honestly think a FNP of some sorts might be actually what is needed.
That or a flat 5+ chance to recycle a lost squad?

 Yarium wrote:
I really dislike having Reanimation Protocols being a FNP, because that doesn't give you the emotional cool-factor of seeing models coming back to the table. Instead, it just because another save. I also really like the idea of "kill them all dead so they don't come back!", which has been a staple of the ability in previous editions.

I think a simpler fix would be to follow the Orks and make it that RP rolls can be made so long as another model of the same type is nearby. This means that a unit supported by other units needs all the units taken out to deny RP, not just a single unit.

"So long as at least one model from this unit is on the battlefield, or this unit's reanimation marker is within 6" of another unit of the same name, roll a D6 for each slain model from this unit at the beginning of your turn. On a 5+, the model's reanimation protocols activate and it is returned to the battlefield within 1" of another of this unit's models or within 1" of the reanimation marker, and outside 1" of enemy models. Models that do not have their reanimation protocols activate or that cannot be set up this way remain inactive until your next turn. If the last model of this unit is slain, place a reanimation marker as close as possible to the last slain model. Then remove all reanimation markers from the battlefield. A Necron Character's reanimation marker is always considered to be within 6" of another unit of the same name."

This. Thematically cool while still being open to counter play, specifically wiping a section of the board or getting close to the enemy reanimation markers so the opponent can't place any models over 1" away from your own models. Then a 2CP strat to make a reanimation marker count as within 6" for one turn.

I'd leave it as is, with the changes being to Res Orbs and Tomb Spyders.

When a unit is wiped out, leave a marker where its last model fell. If you get a Tomb Spyder/Character with Res Orb within 3", you can roll reanimations for the dead unit.

Also the reroll 1s strat blows, change that to +1

We'll Be Back! 1-3 CP
When one of your Necron units with the Reanimation Protocols rule is destroyed, place a marker at the location of the last removed model. At the start of your next turn, roll for Reanimation Protocols for the unit as if it were on the battlefield, placing the first model as close as possible to the marker. This stratagem cost 1 CP for units Power Level 1-7, 2 CP for Power Level 8-14, and 3 CP for Power Level 15+. It may only be used once per game on any specific unit.

IanVanCheese wrote:
I'd leave it as is, with the changes being to Res Orbs and Tomb Spyders.

When a unit is wiped out, leave a marker where its last model fell. If you get a Tomb Spyder/Character with Res Orb within 3", you can roll reanimations for the dead unit.

Also the reroll 1s strat blows, change that to +1

So you can resurrect the whole army at turn 4 just sending a tomb spyder?

What about 4+ WBB at full unit strength, 5+ WBB at half strength or less and finally a 6+ WBB irregardless of a unit wipe.

It's still long odds, but once a few stand back up, there is a better chance in the following turn of more following if they can get into cover or something?

Kebabcito wrote:

IanVanCheese wrote:
I'd leave it as is, with the changes being to Res Orbs and Tomb Spyders.

When a unit is wiped out, leave a marker where its last model fell. If you get a Tomb Spyder/Character with Res Orb within 3", you can roll reanimations for the dead unit.

Also the reroll 1s strat blows, change that to +1

So you can resurrect the whole army at turn 4 just sending a tomb spyder?

Unit can only come back once. Res Orb once per game, Tomb Spyders one revive per turn. Since Tomb Spyders are targetable, it would make them priority targets with a use, rather than their current role as paperweights. Characters can hide, so they gotta pay for res orb and can only do it once.

Change the enhanced reanimation to be army-wide re-rolls of 1 for reanimation for the turn instead of for 1 unit.

Its a headache - subtle changes could make it appallingly unfun to play against if there are too many opportunities to reanimate.

Changing it to a FNP would be simple but dull and remove flavour from a Codex that already has little in the way of fluffy rules (in my opinion at least)

There are intermediate changes that could be suggested: allow resurrection orbs to offer a once per game reanimation roll for a destroyed unit. Strategems could offer something similar.

I'd like there to be more synergy with the concept of the Tomb World - who knows, maybe we could fix two busted systems at once? When Necrons Phase Out they return to the Tomb World... who's to say they can't come back from there once repaired, or have reinforcements sent from there instead?

BrianDavion wrote:
I'd make a few changes, first of all.. every necron infantry unit would have an additional wound point (so necron warriors would have 2 wounds each) at the end of each turn you roll a 1d6, on a 5+ the unit heals 1d3 points, of which can be used to ressurect dead infantry. (so if I roll a 2 on 1d2 IU can ressurect 2 warriors at 1 HP each or 1 at full health) IMHO this'd make necron warriors INSANELY durable.

obviously points would have to be adjusted as you've basicly got intercessors with a built in apocathary.

I like this idea, with a slight modification.

Keeping in mind that 8th edition likes to have wounds on a single model in a multi-wound unit.

Warriors Stay at 1 wound each, Immortals go to 2 wounds each.

5+ Reanimation protocol activation at start of Player turns for each unit that is under starting amount of Models in the unit. Cryptek +1 to the roll within 6", Res Orb is Re-roll 1s within 6". Relic Orb is always re-roll 1 within 6", but an extra Once per game to re-roll Reanimation Protocol for a single unit within 6". Stratagem to attempt a Reanimation Protocol Activation at Start of Opponent's Turn.

Once Reanimation Protocol is active, roll a D6, creating a Wound Pool for that unit. First heal any wounded Models, then Restore a model to the unit with a Single wound, bring that model to full wounds, bring another model back at 1W, keep following that process until either the unit is at full starting strength or no more Wounds are in the Pool. Stratagem to double result of the D6, activated before the roll.

And, yes I do understand that this is a buff to the weaker units, but a slight nerf to Destroyers. Maybe 2D3 might be better, someone can crunch numbers if they want.

 alextroy wrote:
We'll Be Back! 1-3 CP
When one of your Necron units with the Reanimation Protocols rule is destroyed, place a marker at the location of the last removed model. At the start of your next turn, roll for Reanimation Protocols for the unit as if it were on the battlefield, placing the first model as close as possible to the marker. This stratagem cost 1 CP for units Power Level 1-7, 2 CP for Power Level 8-14, and 3 CP for Power Level 15+. It may only be used once per game on any specific unit.

I like this one best. It's like mine, but better thought out!