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 chromedog wrote:
OTOH, a little olive oil, some bacon, some sauteeing ...

Going that route would make cedar chips edible, which isn't much of an argument for satan's vegetable.

I understand that some people are genetically predisposed to dislike brussel sprouts, like with cilantro. Even if one isn’t, it’s very easy to mess them up.

For disliking avocado, there is no excuse.

For Brussels Sprouts, if you really don't like them, then there's not much one can do. You probably don't much like Cabbage or Broccoli if you are really averse.

But if you have only ever had them boiled then a whole new world awaits when they have been roasted.

Parboil for 5mins (DO NOT CUT A CROSS IN THE BOTTOMS).

Refresh in cold water.

Put in a roasting pan with a little oil, some garlic, chestnuts or walnuts, coarse salt, pepper.

Shake to coat everything.

Then bang in the oven for 25 mins.

Milder sweeter and nuttier (even without added nuts) than boiled. More interesting texture as well.

I'm curious to see what you veggie boyz make of this:
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/jan/08/lab-grown-food-destroy-farming-save-planet
Dunno if it sounds too good to be true, but the author (M. Monbiot) presents it as both economically, environmetally and ethically superior to the current way of creating food.

 Kroem wrote:
I'm curious to see what you veggie boyz make of this:
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/jan/08/lab-grown-food-destroy-farming-save-planet
Dunno if it sounds too good to be true, but the author (M. Monbiot) presents it as both economically, environmetally and ethically superior to the current way of creating food.

This doesn't just impact veggie boyz.

As filler and to bulk out foods/foodstock for cattle this method of production will be an absolute boon. It will allow cheap and filling foodstuffs to continue to be produced.

Helping to move away from Palm OIl production would be a massive plus (obviously leaving countries currently producing it at a disadvantage).

Yea absolutely, it would change how we all eat.
I wonder if it is easier to convince people to eat lab food than take up veganism? To be a vegan must take a lot of dietery disclipline as the majority of foods aren't vegan, whilst I assume the lab food will supplant normal ingredients in most foods because of it being much cheaper to produce.

Doubtful, IMO.

We already have anti-GMO Luddites, Natural News and foodbabe; lab-grown meat is just going to set them all off all over again about 'frankenfoods'.

One of the most popular 'arguments' against Beyond Meat burgers is that they have a lot of ingredients (not bad ingredients, just a lot, which is bad because reasons) and they're not terribly healthy.

Unlike every other fast-food burger out there, natch.

As I said, I'm not hopeful. Dietary choices seem to be an area where almost everyone is happy to allow huge amounts of hypocrisy to govern. A Cavendish banana is good GMO, because reasons that they haven't fully thought through.

 Excommunicatus wrote:
Doubtful, IMO.

We already have anti-GMO Luddites, Natural News and foodbabe; lab-grown meat is just going to set them all off all over again about 'frankenfoods'.

One of the most popular 'arguments' against Beyond Meat burgers is that they have a lot of ingredients (not bad ingredients, just a lot, which is bad because reasons) and they're not terribly healthy.

Unlike every other fast-food burger out there, natch.

As I said, I'm not hopeful. Dietary choices seem to be an area where almost everyone is happy to allow huge amounts of hypocrisy to govern. A Cavendish banana is good GMO, because reasons that they haven't fully thought through.

I understand the reasons but still find meat alternatives odd.. especially those made to look like the products they replace. Yeah you have to convince the carnivores but is it ethical to eat something made to look as though Hilda the cow had to die to make it?

As for the Cavendish..yeah..monoculture at its finest...(don't mention disease).

Most vegan/PB-people spent many years eating an omnivorous diet and most of us don't quit eating animal products because we think they taste bad. I still get cravings for steak, bacon and cheese. Oh, the cheese cravings. Six years vegan.

I don't really see how the shape of a, say, Beyond Meat burger can be unethical, personally. I play Skyrim when I could just go out in the street and attack people with an axe. Course, doing that would make a murderer. I eat Beyond Meat burgers when I could just go out and get a Baconator, but of course that would make me a...

I think the shape and presentation of meat-substitutes is an almost totally irrelevant consideration, personally. I just don't see how it could hold any importance.

'Why do you want something like meat?' has always struck me as an odd criticism. I presume people who ask it have no issue with alcohol free beer and decaf coffee.

nfe wrote:
'Why do you want something like meat?' has always struck me as an odd criticism. I presume people who ask it have no issue with alcohol free beer and decaf coffee.

Like I said I understand completely why. Its an easy sell and a great stepping stone for meat eaters, like me. It has always struck me as funny though.

I still don't really see why. Do you giggle at alcohol-free beer? Decaf coffee? Fat-free yoghurt?

Exactly the same concept. X, but without Y.

I don't think anyone argues that the Cavendish is good GMO - quite the opposite. I think it's commonly known that it's a banana apocalypse in waiting that could go off at any moment.

 Excommunicatus wrote:
I still don't really see why. Do you giggle at alcohol-free beer?

I gag at it. It's an abomination. Same with decaf.

It's like a strip club, but without strippers. At that point you're just in a weird dark bar with a bunch of perverts.

 Ouze wrote:
I don't think anyone argues that the Cavendish is good GMO - quite the opposite. I think it's commonly known that it's a banana apocalypse in waiting that could go off at any moment.

Not all that commonly and almost never by the same sort of people who bang on about GMOs and watch foodbabe videos.

 Excommunicatus wrote:
Overpopulation is an absolute myth, dreamed up by people who want to restrict how many non-white people are born.

The Earth at current capacity can feed 10bn people. It doesn't, because capitalism does not allocate the resources efficiently.

There is no overpopulation. It's just a socially-acceptable way to say that you think there's too many foreigners.

------------------------------------------------------------------------

EDIT - How vegan do I personally want everyone to be? In my ideal world, everybody would be an ethical vegan, so very vegan indeed.

Always a great way to shut down the debate without having to actually address the points made.

It's like a strip club, but without strippers. At that point you're just in a weird dark bar with a bunch of perverts.

Haha brilliant.

Some of the pushback against “fake meat” like the impossible meat I have seen has come from Vegans or Vegetarians. There was an interview on NPR with someone who seemed to have difficulty with understanding how someone would want to eat something that tastes and feels like meat. She said something to the effect of “at that point just eat meat, it’s stupid to want fake meat, just be vegetarian”.

There is a fair number of us folks who enjoy meat and like to eat meat, and who are concerned about the environmental impact of raising meat or the concerns about the ethical treatment of the animals who are the source of our meat.

If I can have my “meat” without worrying about it having suffered to get on my plate, then that’s a good thing for me. I wouldn’t want “fake meat” because I’m a vegetarian, I would want fake meat because I want “ethical meat”.

Better meat substitutes are one way to get there, lab grown meats are another. None of them are really there yet I think, but it’s an option to explore.

 Adeptus Doritos wrote:
At that point you're just in a weird dark bar with a bunch of perverts.

It is called the FLGS and where most hobby gaming happens.

Which month are we devoting to vegetarianism? To being an omnivore? To only eating meat? I'm trying to build my calendar for the upcoming year.

 Ahtman wrote:
It is called the FLGS and where most hobby gaming happens.

Wait.

You just gave me a business plan. I'm gonna need some poles and some terrain.

Bran Dawri wrote:


Always a great way to shut down the debate without having to actually address the points made.

They were addressed and debunked very early on in the thread.

 Excommunicatus wrote:
They were addressed and debunked very early on in the thread.

You literally said the concern was racist.

And blamed capitalism.

If that's debunking, then humans can't vegan because space slippers banana doggy.

So I had a girlfriend a few years ago who was into the whole Vegan thing. She started it when the first came to college, and within 6 months she had so many health issues that her Doctor told her to go back to eating a balanced diet or risk dying.

She ignored him and ended up with permanent neurological damage thanks to a B12 deficiency.

She had to keep track of so much stuff Iron, Calcium etc that it became almost a full time job for her. She also ended up losing about 45 lbs in the first 6 months and the mood swings became so unbearable that we split up.

So. No, thanks. I'll stick with enjoying the foods that I like.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Ahtman wrote:

 Adeptus Doritos wrote:
At that point you're just in a weird dark bar with a bunch of perverts.

It is called the FLGS and where most hobby gaming happens.

Which month are we devoting to vegetarianism? To being an omnivore? To only eating meat? I'm trying to build my calendar for the upcoming year.

Excuse me, but June is "autovore" month. If you've never tried eating a jeep before, I highly recommend it. Jeeps are neigh indestructible. If you eat one, you will be too!

 Togusa wrote:
So I had a girlfriend a few years ago who was into the whole Vegan thing. She started it when the first came to college, and within 6 months she had so many health issues that her Doctor told her to go back to eating a balanced diet or risk dying.

She ignored him and ended up with permanent neurological damage thanks to a B12 deficiency.

You never change your diet without going to a doctor first. I know that's retrospect, but she should have consulted her physician. Which is one of the things I'm not sure the vegans have said in here, and I've even neglected to think about.

Although the people I know that eat meat, they were able to supplement that deficiency other ways. One thing I won't say is that there's no way around eating meat. It can be done, but it's not always cheap and easy.

Adeptus Doritos wrote:

 Excommunicatus wrote:
They were addressed and debunked very early on in the thread.

You literally said the concern was racist.

And blamed capitalism.

If that's debunking, then humans can't vegan because space slippers banana doggy.

That was not the first time the racist overpopulation myth had been brought up. IIRC, it came up initially on the very first page.

Togusa wrote:So I had a girlfriend a few years ago who was into the whole Vegan thing. She started it when the first came to college, and within 6 months she had so many health issues that her Doctor told her to go back to eating a balanced diet or risk dying.

She ignored him and ended up with permanent neurological damage thanks to a B12 deficiency.

She had to keep track of so much stuff Iron, Calcium etc that it became almost a full time job for her. She also ended up losing about 45 lbs in the first 6 months and the mood swings became so unbearable that we split up.

r/thathappened

 Excommunicatus wrote:
That was not the first time the racist overpopulation myth had been brought up. IIRC, it came up initially on the very first page.

So, do you speak some language where 'racist' just means "I dislike this"?

 Excommunicatus wrote:


r/thathappened

Cults often dismiss anything that disrupts their religious beliefs.

Mate, it's nobody's fault but your own that you're in here flailing wildly at what you think is being said.

Read the thread. Then some Kant.

 Excommunicatus wrote:
Mate, it's nobody's fault but your own that you're in here flailing wildly at what you think is being said.

You literally just dismissed this guy's experience because it didn't align with your belief system.

No. I don't believe I will be reading Kant.

If any one person's writings alter your life this much, you are a cultist.

Anything that is asserted without evidence can be dismissed without it as well.

Kant is literally just the basic fundamentals of logic and reason. It isn't governing or defining. At a minimum, you'd learn why claiming a high-ground while throwing irrelevant ad hominens around isn't going to work for you.

 Excommunicatus wrote:
Anything that is asserted without evidence can be dismissed without it as well.

I bet that's an argument you're very selective about using, and only bring up when it's in your favor.

Now, let's see what happens when someone comes in with a big sob story about the FLGS...

 Excommunicatus wrote:
Kant is literally just the basic fundamentals of logic and reason. It isn't governing or defining. At a minimum, you'd learn why claiming a high-ground while throwing irrelevant ad hominens around isn't going to work for you.

My Jesus can beat up your Jesus.