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 Monkeysloth wrote:
I Having the +/- in the profile is also amazing too.....as our games always went for 3-4 hours.

Soooo..... minus one hours?

 SlaveToDorkness wrote:
I think we will see cards for each unit detailing the skills, weapons, and stats.

Personally I would be very happy if that happened. I don't feel that it's too likely though; feels like too big a change from the way CB works to me?

They already put cards with the unit picture on it in the blister....just put the infos on it!

 .Mikes. wrote:

 Monkeysloth wrote:
I Having the +/- in the profile is also amazing too.....as our games always went for 3-4 hours.

Soooo..... minus one hours?

The modifier the skill adds/subtracts.

 SlaveToDorkness wrote:
They already put cards with the unit picture on it in the blister....just put the infos on it!

That would be great, I keep all those cards even though they have no in-game purpose. I dunno what CB's policy is on updating/modifying profiles post-release though? Privateer Press used to include the cards in the boxes (at the start of MkIII I spent a bit of money buying the new MKIII faction card decks), but ultimately they had to discontinue that and develop an online card database allow people to print out the newest versions instead.

I keep the cards too.

I don't think that there will be unit cards like one finds in Malifaux. CB may have something in the Army builder that will allow the player to print cards, or something analogous, along with the army list. Printing cards in various languages, etc, will be too costly.

 SlaveToDorkness wrote:
I think we will see cards for each unit detailing the skills, weapons, and stats.

I do not believe CB will make physical cards for C1/N4, since that will inherently be difficult to errata or change. They already invested a bunch of money into the app, I do not see them regressing to physical cards.

 Red_Five wrote:

 SlaveToDorkness wrote:
I think we will see cards for each unit detailing the skills, weapons, and stats.

I do not believe CB will make physical cards for C1/N4, since that will inherently be difficult to errata or change. They already invested a bunch of money into the app, I do not see them regressing to physical cards.

That would be my guess as to why they won't *print* cards - but I do like the idea of being able to print our own, constantly up to date cards somehow, off of their excellent army builder!

The main issue is really just the compiled nature of what a unit profile is. You could do a card for every profile, but that would get rather unwieldy even before considering errata.

So are they planning on simplifying the rules and/or nomenclature in the core rulebook? Or just printing out just the parts of the rules that are applicable to the model in question? Or both? FWIW, I'm one of the folks who tried to get into Infinity and the onion layer rules that required cross referencing turned me off.

 Alpharius wrote:

 Red_Five wrote:

 SlaveToDorkness wrote:
I think we will see cards for each unit detailing the skills, weapons, and stats.

I do not believe CB will make physical cards for C1/N4, since that will inherently be difficult to errata or change. They already invested a bunch of money into the app, I do not see them regressing to physical cards.

That would be my guess as to why they won't *print* cards - but I do like the idea of being able to print our own, constantly up to date cards somehow, off of their excellent army builder!

Oh, yeah, totally doable! All it would take is a feature to pull the relevant data and organize it onto a card-sized piece of paper. Now that hard, especially since the main army builder does almost all of that already.

I'm happy to see people agreeing with this. I've mentioned many times here that army should do that (including range bands) and usually I was told that I was just trying to dumb down the game and ruin it (though not by any currently here) by making information easier to access and that if people couldn't learn to play it the way CB wanted you too with the lists you shouldn't play.

There's a HUGE difference between "CB should make cards for all the units" and having an option to print units form the armybuilder as a card.

Unit cards are one of those things that get brought up every few months, but aren't feasible since the same profile often has multiple weapon options that each change the points and sometimes the special rules. But an option for the armybuilder to print a profile as a unit card would be fantastic.

 Monkeysloth wrote:
I'm happy to see people agreeing with this. I've mentioned many times here that army should do that (including range bands) and usually I was told that I was just trying to dumb down the game and ruin it (though not by any currently here) by making information easier to access and that if people couldn't learn to play it the way CB wanted you too with the lists you shouldn't play.

What the...?!?

I'm #TeamMonkeysloth on this one!

Where is my "Monkeysloth was right!" t-shirt!!!

 LunarSol wrote:
The main issue is really just the compiled nature of what a unit profile is. You could do a card for every profile, but that would get rather unwieldy even before considering errata.

WarCry does it currently. It's entirely doable.

Indubitably!

But the question remains - will CB implement it?

(I'm guessing "probably not" but I'm willing to be pleasantly surprised.)

God I hope not.

Kalamadea wrote:There's a HUGE difference between "CB should make cards for all the units" and having an option to print units form the armybuilder as a card.

Unit cards are one of those things that get brought up every few months, but aren't feasible since the same profile often has multiple weapon options that each change the points and sometimes the special rules. But an option for the armybuilder to print a profile as a unit card would be fantastic.

Alpharius wrote:

 Monkeysloth wrote:
I'm happy to see people agreeing with this. I've mentioned many times here that army should do that (including range bands) and usually I was told that I was just trying to dumb down the game and ruin it (though not by any currently here) by making information easier to access and that if people couldn't learn to play it the way CB wanted you too with the lists you shouldn't play.

What the...?!?

I'm #TeamMonkeysloth on this one!

Where is my "Monkeysloth was right!" t-shirt!!!

Granted it was always during some dust up over whither or not N3 was too bloated and there are always people that want cards. I would suggest army just make it so each unit could have a card like printout with the skills (including modifiers) equipment and range bands. I like all in one refrences like cards but prefer the digital version that allows for CB to keep things up to date.

 Kanluwen wrote:

 LunarSol wrote:
The main issue is really just the compiled nature of what a unit profile is. You could do a card for every profile, but that would get rather unwieldy even before considering errata.

WarCry does it currently. It's entirely doable.

Warcry does it for one card per faction. The fighter cards have no words on them, so there’s only 1 needed regardless of language. It’s only the big overall faction card that is printed in multiple languages. In infinity you’d need at least one card per unit.

 Alpharius wrote:
That would be my guess as to why they won't *print* cards - but I do like the idea of being able to print our own, constantly up to date cards somehow, off of their excellent army builder!

This would totally work for me.

Having the rules partially on the table in the form of a card is very helpful to me, and being able to print them out of the army builder seems like a reasonable compromise.

Make the cards larger too, like what Malifaux did by going to a 'tarot' card size, 70mmx121mm. Should the cards be pretty, printer friendly or an option for both? I vote both.

 ImAGeek wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

 LunarSol wrote:
The main issue is really just the compiled nature of what a unit profile is. You could do a card for every profile, but that would get rather unwieldy even before considering errata.

WarCry does it currently. It's entirely doable.

Warcry does it for one card per faction. The fighter cards have no words on them, so there’s only 1 needed regardless of language. It’s only the big overall faction card that is printed in multiple languages. In infinity you’d need at least one card per unit.

I mean, if we're talking "per unit loadout", Warcry also only has like... 3? options per faction or so?

Probably the biggest innovation in warcry is the random card based terrain setup, deployment, and objective. Despite the simpler rules, you still get a varied game each time you play. All that on a smaller board that fits on non gaming tables, or allowed people to double up on a standard gaming table.

Infinity only had all that through a complicated and competitive focused secondary objective system. Players had to make multiple mission systems for casual play.

 Red Harvest wrote:
Make the cards larger too, like what Malifaux did by going to a 'tarot' card size, 70mmx121mm. Should the cards be pretty, printer friendly or an option for both? I vote both.

It's probably a case of designing multiple templates - full-colour/high-design "pretty", almost-wireframe-black-and-white "printer-friendly", large print, etc. Some people may not want to burn whole ink cartridges on the models they need for one game, some may only have access to a black & white laserjet, so you'd need to define the use cases and ensure a design for the ones you think will get the most use, as well as ones you'd need to be suitably accessible.

Do all of you not realize that you can already print army profiles, including weapon profiles, hacking programs,range bands, ammo types and more directly from the app? And you've been able to for years and years?

You all keep asking for cards, but all of this is already available. Is it just card shaped paper that you're so keen on? If so, why? having an easy to access and print sheets of paper with all your army info on it is surely better than having a bunch of cards that don't have enough space to display all the info, isn't it?

Do you all just not print your lists at all? Because it seems like you're very hungry for a solution to a problem that was solved years ago. It also mostly seems like you all want cards because other games you've played have them and you're stuck on the idea that thats how things are supposed to be.

I'm not saying theres anything wrong with wanting cards, or that cards aren't cool, or that any of you are stupid for wanting this solution. Please don't think that. But I'm puzzled by why you want cards at all, when it seems to me like all the things you want out of cards already exist by printing your lists in the army app.

You summed it up yourself - cards (IF the info could be summarized on them) would be more convenient and easier to use then...sheets of paper!

Yep. Even cards printed on sheets of paper!

I want everything for a unit in one place and not have to hop between multiple sheets. I don't want CB to waste money printing physical cards I want the option for army to allow me to do that without scissors and glue.

Well, nobody prints cards without scissors I’m aware of. Kind of scared to know what the glue is for.

I don't use scissors. But I have big boy skills, like being able to use a hobby knife and straight edge, so the angles are crisp and the lines are straight.

if your printer doesn't do double sided printing, and you are not going to sleeve the cards, or do not print front and back side by side and fold the paper, glue might be handy.

Jake, the cards would include summaries of the skills the units have. Currently this info is not available in the army builder printouts. Only the skill name is. Cards can be re-used. If you change your list you can simply 'rebuild your deck' rather than print-out a whole new list. It makes list experimentation a bit easier to do 'on the fly'. IME.

Printer friendly version: print card text only (B&W); Pretty version: print card text with background images. For the user it would be checking a box, which is something already done in the current army builder where you chose what to print with the unit profiles.

The glue is for adding range bands and equipment descriptions/skills to the unit. print, cut out, attach to the main stats.