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Does anyone else feel a bit put off to using the Leviathan Dreadnought due to the fluff surrounding it? I think the model looks amazing and obviously it's quite powerful. Despite this I find that the idea of fielding one ridiculous since lore wise it essentially drives any pilot insane after some time and eventually kills them. 30k this works as the legions number in the tens of thousands and lives are more expendable. In 40k however a typical chapter is lucky to even have 1000 standard marines and by the fluff of this Dreadnought it will just kill the pilot eventually so obviously there wouldn't be any ancient members of the chapter inside it. Does that also include people like Carab Culn or are there exceptions?

All dreadnoughts run the risk of driving their occupant insane - it just happens quicker with Leviathans (and Redemptors). It doesn't always happen - Bjorn the Fell-Handed has kept it together, for example.

As long as they're combat effective they're useful - even if they're stuck re-fighting the same battle over-and-over again in their head.

beast_gts wrote:
All dreadnoughts run the risk of driving their occupant insane

Since when is this canon? First I've heard of it. I thought the insane sarcophagus thing was only a knight thing.

 Nerak wrote:

beast_gts wrote:
All dreadnoughts run the risk of driving their occupant insane

Since when is this canon? First I've heard of it. I thought the insane sarcophagus thing was only a knight thing.

This has always been true. It's why dreads are put to sleep in between use, to mitigate the effect over a longer period of time. But Leviathans (and Contemptors for Space Wolves) cause damage way faster.

Even in death, they serve.

Seems about par for the course on the chaos side. If you’re going to go crazy in a dreadnought you might as well go crazy in the feth-all sized one.

On the more practical side, leviathan’s are a great choice for younger battle brothers who get wounded beyond recovery. If a marine gets crippled during bullet catching duty in a devastator squad, you don’t really need his advice. Just put him in the leviathan and get some more fire power until you fry him like that piece of bread you left in the toaster too long.

beast_gts wrote:
All dreadnoughts run the risk of driving their occupant insane - it just happens quicker with Leviathans (and Redemptors).

Isn't the case in Redemptors that they burn out the occupant's brain, or something, rather than drive them insane?

As to the over the topness, heck no. That's what dreadnoughts are supposed to be in this crazy world: over the top walking heavy metal coffins bristling with weapons crewed by people too tough to die as they suffer endlessly in the cold dark embrace of their amniotic tanks while slowly falling into either insanity or the sweet release of death as their last organic parts cease functioning. More power naturally makes this faster, as is par for the course in the genre.

Anything resembling nice and utilitarian is completely missing the point.

 Dysartes wrote:

beast_gts wrote:
All dreadnoughts run the risk of driving their occupant insane - it just happens quicker with Leviathans (and Redemptors).

Isn't the case in Redemptors that they burn out the occupant's brain, or something, rather than drive them insane?

Codex Space Marines wrote:It is whispered that the advanced systems of the Redemptor are a curse as well as a blessing. The Martian tech-savants that first built these walking engines of destruction spared scant thought to the health of the incumbent, seeing him as little more than another part to be interred or replaced as necessary. Many Redemptors that have fought for a sustained period have already had their sarcophagi replaced, their original pilots burned out by the intensity of the machine’s destructive prowess.

 russthebus wrote:
Does anyone else feel a bit put off to using the Leviathan Dreadnought due to the fluff surrounding it? I think the model looks amazing and obviously it's quite powerful. Despite this I find that the idea of fielding one ridiculous since lore wise it essentially drives any pilot insane after some time and eventually kills them. 30k this works as the legions number in the tens of thousands and lives are more expendable. In 40k however a typical chapter is lucky to even have 1000 standard marines and by the fluff of this Dreadnought it will just kill the pilot eventually so obviously there wouldn't be any ancient members of the chapter inside it. Does that also include people like Carab Culn or are there exceptions?

Ehh, yeah imo that's a bit dumb.

I'm not really fond of them in the first place as they don't really travel very fast for rapid insertion. Standard Dreads at least get Podded in or can be carried via Storm Raven.

Cool model tho.

 Insectum7 wrote:

 russthebus wrote:
Does anyone else feel a bit put off to using the Leviathan Dreadnought due to the fluff surrounding it? I think the model looks amazing and obviously it's quite powerful. Despite this I find that the idea of fielding one ridiculous since lore wise it essentially drives any pilot insane after some time and eventually kills them. 30k this works as the legions number in the tens of thousands and lives are more expendable. In 40k however a typical chapter is lucky to even have 1000 standard marines and by the fluff of this Dreadnought it will just kill the pilot eventually so obviously there wouldn't be any ancient members of the chapter inside it. Does that also include people like Carab Culn or are there exceptions?

Ehh, yeah imo that's a bit dumb.

I'm not really fond of them in the first place as they don't really travel very fast for rapid insertion. Standard Dreads at least get Podded in or can be carried via Storm Raven.

Cool model tho.

Loyalists can deploy leviathans via the Lucius pattern dreadnought drop pod. Heretics should be able to do the same with the Karybdis, but apparently those have shrunk since the hh, because "reasons".

 Nerak wrote:

beast_gts wrote:
All dreadnoughts run the risk of driving their occupant insane

Since when is this canon? First I've heard of it. I thought the insane sarcophagus thing was only a knight thing.

You live in a tiny dark box unable to properly feel with nobody to talk with for years jumping from decade to decade. It's what psychologists call "a real bad time".

Mind you insanity takes many forms. Some dread pilots are just losing their grip on reality, seeing current day comrades as those who lived and died hundreds of years ago. It could all come down to the varying practices for the chapters, techworlds etc etc. Like, those Redemptors seem like they would break all current day WHS standards. "Ah yes, this forklift snaps the driver in half every 50 uses. Perfect design!"

Gadzilla666 wrote:

 Insectum7 wrote:

 russthebus wrote:
Does anyone else feel a bit put off to using the Leviathan Dreadnought due to the fluff surrounding it? I think the model looks amazing and obviously it's quite powerful. Despite this I find that the idea of fielding one ridiculous since lore wise it essentially drives any pilot insane after some time and eventually kills them. 30k this works as the legions number in the tens of thousands and lives are more expendable. In 40k however a typical chapter is lucky to even have 1000 standard marines and by the fluff of this Dreadnought it will just kill the pilot eventually so obviously there wouldn't be any ancient members of the chapter inside it. Does that also include people like Carab Culn or are there exceptions?

Ehh, yeah imo that's a bit dumb.

I'm not really fond of them in the first place as they don't really travel very fast for rapid insertion. Standard Dreads at least get Podded in or can be carried via Storm Raven.

Cool model tho.

Loyalists can deploy leviathans via the Lucius pattern dreadnought drop pod. Heretics should be able to do the same with the Karybdis, but apparently those have shrunk since the hh, because "reasons".

Ahh, I thought the Lucius only carried up to Contemptor size. Fair enough.

Leviathans still bug me for loyalists. It's a bit like giving Space Marines a Knight. I'd consider getting one or two for my Chaos Marines though.

 evil_kiwi_60 wrote:
Seems about par for the course on the chaos side. If you’re going to go crazy in a dreadnought you might as well go crazy in the feth-all sized one.

On the more practical side, leviathan’s are a great choice for younger battle brothers who get wounded beyond recovery. If a marine gets crippled during bullet catching duty in a devastator squad, you don’t really need his advice. Just put him in the leviathan and get some more fire power until you fry him like that piece of bread you left in the toaster too long.

feth you ! Because TOOAAASST !!!!

 russthebus wrote:
Does that also include people like Carab Culn or are there exceptions?

Carab Culln is just an all round badass with one of the coolest named rules in the game: ”Proud to live, proud to die, hard to kill” so he gets a pass

 russthebus wrote:
Does anyone else feel a bit put off to using the Leviathan Dreadnought due to the fluff surrounding it? I think the model looks amazing and obviously it's quite powerful. Despite this I find that the idea of fielding one ridiculous since lore wise it essentially drives any pilot insane after some time and eventually kills them. 30k this works as the legions number in the tens of thousands and lives are more expendable. In 40k however a typical chapter is lucky to even have 1000 standard marines and by the fluff of this Dreadnought it will just kill the pilot eventually so obviously there wouldn't be any ancient members of the chapter inside it. Does that also include people like Carab Culn or are there exceptions?

I figure since the occupant was going to die anyway due to being mortally wounded, however much longer after that he stays alive is just gravy. For the chapter of course, not for the battle-brother.