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 ingtaer wrote:

 Sim-Life wrote:
I'm surprised GW hasn't shut this down already? FFG have started doing it so its probably only matter of time.

Where did you hear that FFG have shut this down? None of the three games I play have been on either TTS or Vassal.

People on my board game Facebook group were talking about it I think. I don't use TTS so I didn't really pay attention.

Edit: found the facebook post and the BGG thread it linked to
https://boardgamegeek.com/thread/2415261/asmodee-ffg-seem-be-taking-down-all-ffg-games-tts

I expect this could actually be good for their business, people get the chance to try new units or even factions and then decide they want to use them on the tabletop afterwards. Not that big business always look at things rationally but that's another matter!

I also don't think that's its actually taking money out of their pockets.
I doubt people are buying less models because they are playing on TTS or would buy more if it didn't exist.

Theres also the issue of being forced to defend your IP - as far as I have understood this framework software+fan-made game data somehow dodges this issue. Similar mechanisms have been used by vassall, magic workstation, battlescribe and more.

 Jidmah wrote:
I also don't think that's its actually taking money out of their pockets.
I doubt people are buying less models because they are playing on TTS or would buy more if it didn't exist.

Theres also the issue of being forced to defend your IP - as far as I have understood this framework software+fan-made game data somehow dodges this issue. Similar mechanisms have been used by vassall, magic workstation, battlescribe and more.

The modular approach pretty much completely insulates the creator of the service from any liability. However, the individual modules could be targeted for takedown if they include any copyrighted or trademarked material. Most mods I've seen for board games and wargames use loads of copyrighted art assets and often trademarked imagery and components too. If your mod uses official dice, markers or tokens from the real-world game it'll be in violation of trademark or copyright law. So TTS is unlikely to be hit directly but the mods that actually let it simulate what you want could be removed.

 Jidmah wrote:
Theres also the issue of being forced to defend your IP

This is mostly a myth. The only IP that needs to be defended is trademarks, like 'Warhammer'. If other companies were selling products under a 'Warhammer' brand and GW did nothing about it, they could eventually lose the ability to defend their trademark in court.

Copyright does not need to be actively defended, so GW is under no obligation to quash 3D renders or game asset extractions of their IP- they just choose to, for whatever reason. I don't get it, because I have a hard time believing that it detracts from their miniature sales (anecdotally: on the contrary, there are certain armies that I would never have purchased if I hadn't been able to use TTS to see how they play), and stuff like ripped Dawn of War files aren't going to be used to 3D print an army.

Why was the fan-made Star Trek movie (almost) squashed then?

I'm fairly sure that unless you challenge people using your IP, you basically give everyone else a free pass to do it as well.
I'm also fairly sure that modeling follows other rules, as it's quite difficult to prove that a model is violating your IP unless it's an exact copy.

 Jidmah wrote:
Why was the fan-made Star Trek movie (almost) squashed then?

Why wasn't Astartes?

To answer your question: Because that's how Viacom rolls. They aggressively protect their copyright to maintain exclusive curation over the Star Trek brand, not out of any legal obligation.

 Jidmah wrote:
I'm fairly sure that unless you challenge people using your IP, you basically give everyone else a free pass to do it as well.
I'm also fairly sure that modeling follows other rules, as it's quite difficult to prove that a model is violating your IP unless it's an exact copy.

'IP' is not a singular thing. IP is copyright, trademarks, and patents and they all follow different laws.

You have no obligation to discover and issue a C&D to anyone who violates your copyright or patents, and you don't lose your copyright or patent by failing to do so. Trademarks are the only form of IP that needs to be aggressively protected, since the legal justification for a trademark is that it uniquely identifies a brand. If another company is able to establish a market presence using a trademarked term, then it becomes by definition a generic and therefore non-trademarkable term.

GW sued the writer of a children's book called 'Spots The Space Marine', because they have a trademark on 'space marine' and wish to maintain exclusive rights to the term 'space marine' in a science fiction context. If the term 'space marine' were to become widely used in wargaming, GW would no longer be able to claim trademark on it. (The fact that they were ever given a trademark to 'space marine' to begin with is nonsense, but neither here nor there)

GW hasn't C&Ded Astartes because their copyright remains intact regardless of how others use their property. They would be well within their legal rights to sue the creator of Astartes for copyright infringement, but not only would they have to demonstrate damages (unlikely) to receive any kind of positive judgment, it would generate a lot of ill-will to no gain.