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pm713 wrote:
There's a difference between being a big part and being a needed part. It's perfectly possible to play 40k and never paint. The rules shouldn't penalise you for not painting and house rules shouldn't be needed to play a decently structured game.

I'm curious, if I demanded people bring written copies of their personal lore for their army to play the game and gave them 10% less points if they didn't do so how many people who are saying that the paint rule is fine would be cool with that?

I think the models can only fight if within 1/2" of 1/2" change in 9th is a bad change. I'll still play with it, but if it really angered me, I could always refuse to play with anyone who doesn't agree to play my version of the game, where models can still fight within 1" of 1".

GW just declared that having a basically painted army is necessary to get full VPs in matched play. How you react to that is up to you, just like how you react to any other rule change is up to you.

You're more than welcome to argue it's a bad rule - I agree, though not for the reason you do - just like I can argue the 1/2" of 1/2" is a bad rule. But it's fundamentally no different than any other rule change.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

I'm doing 6 day work weeks with errands being done on the last day. I haven't gotten a game in since the year started basically with all the Corona crap.

So you're on the internet complaining about a game you don't actually have time to even play? Seems like a good way of spending your precious spare time.

pm713 wrote:

 Grimtuff wrote:
ITT- people accusing HBMC of being a powergamer. HBMC as a powergamer... I've never heard something so absurd. He's like the anti powergamer.

Now, my gut feeling was I liked this rule, as it keeps out certain riff raff but after seeing the certain sociopath it has some Dakkanauts walking down it probably should be left by the wayside.

For full disclosure, I disagree with what some terrible Aussie powergamer ITT is saying ref painting, however he is 100% correct about the bloody objective of the game, which is to win. The point is to have fun and some people seem to be confusing the two. The game is quite literally a competition with victory conditions, how secondary or tertiary those are to the rest of the experience is down to the individual player.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

Also some of us work many hours even with lockdown, thanks.

Yet I still found time to paint my minis. What's your excuse?

Having better things to do with your free time? Some people don't like painting and why spend time doing something unpleasant when you could do something fun instead?

Also this. I like putting the miniatures together. However painting sucks. Ever spent DAYS painting thousands of points of stuff only to lose it in a fire? I'm commissioning my current project for painting, plus it'll actually look pleasant.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Nazrak wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

I'm doing 6 day work weeks with errands being done on the last day. I haven't gotten a game in since the year started basically with all the Corona crap.

So you're on the internet complaining about a game you don't actually have time to even play? Seems like a good way of spending your precious spare time.

Healthcare sucks so the least I can do is hope GW will create a decent game, but apparently they can't do that.

Some rules are just made to watch the world burn. Thank you GW, add just a bit more fuel to the dung fire that is 2020.

The Irony of including a rule for gate keeping while so recently saying how Warhammer is for everybody isn't lost on me though. Guess its for everyone who is rich and loves to paint eh ? Maybe a company name change to PaintsWorkshop.

That's a bit of an odd hot-take. Painting is by far the cheapest part of the hobby. The paint to paint a whole army to the battle ready standard will cost you less than the cost of almost any kit GW sells these days.

 Grimtuff wrote:
Oh boo, painting is unpleasant now is it?

Sorry, but you're in the wrong hobby. That is all.

I don't enjoy painting. I do enjoy playing.

Go on-tell me why I'm wrong.

 Sgt_Smudge wrote:

H.B.M.C. wrote:Well, you are the one who said "fun vectors", so this can remain entirely in your domain as far as I'm concerned.

Fun vectors makes more sense than claiming to know what a complete stranger is thinking.

Seabass wrote:
Of course, everyone plays to win.

I dunno. I was just told that people don't.

And they don't. Disagree with you both on that - not everyone plays to win.

I guess neither of them has played a demo game or a game with young kids. I have even played with my spouse who had absolutely no interest in winning.

He's having a good time re-framing the argument or being pedantic. That's his MO. He defaults to that state when ever he's losing ground.

In the N&R thread he argued that he doesn't even play competitively in order to "win" another debate. But somehow a none competitive person is finding this to be a massive issue lol. He even admitted his first and only tournament was in 7th despite posting on here since 2005. Oh, and that the event had one single guy with a painted army in an otherwise see of grey plastic, but apparently feth that guy for his effort.

He still hasn't honestly answered my question from the N&R thread. Why should another player win a game based on purchasing power? There is no way to claim there isn't an advantage to winning 40k when you have a bigger hobby budget. That has nothing to do with whos the better player but factors into who wins way more then this.

Whats hilarious to me is how many WAAC players are being unmasked by that little bonus they are tossing to the guys that paint their stuff. You don't even need to paint well mind you. You can spray a base coat from a rattle can on your army while its on the sprue, dip wash it with min wax in a tray and spray texture paint (yes this is sold in cans too) onto the bases before assembly. It would dry before you finished reading the rules and you would have the BRS lol. Literally no need for a brush. It also goes for slow or detail painters, it's the base initial set up you can paint them up from.

Why should a player that hates painting be punished? Counter question, why should the guy who painted his army be punished by having to play with an opponent that didn't paint their army?

GW sells models that require building and painting prior to playing. It's only been their business model for 3 decades. This rule doesn't even stop them from playing lol. It just wreaks of bratty entitlement. You still can play and win, your just at a minor disadvantage because you failed to meet the basic expectations from the social contract.

It's also not gate keeping, no more then playing an overpriced boutique luxury game itself is lol. I have played more new gamers with painted armies over the years then the old grogs. they show up and apologize if a model isn't finished, only to play one of those types that never paints their stuff and have this puzzled disheartened look. After a while they start to stop painting or worse yet stop playing at the shop.

yukishiro1 wrote:
That's a bit of an odd hot-take. Painting is by far the cheapest part of the hobby. The paint to paint a whole army to the battle ready standard will cost you less than the cost of almost any kit GW sells these days.

The rich part is based on the model cost, the love to paint part is its own thing. Either way if you really want to paint well that does actually take a good deal of cash, proper set ups, brushes, paints, replacement when they dry out or go bad which happens more than would be ideal. The residuals of the hobby aspect aren't cheap and are outright overly expensive if you get the tools through GW. Have you looked up the price for clippers lately ? Ouch and that is just clippers.

Edit: The point of the hot take is, I've rarely seen such a hamfisted rule to try and force painting in. It would be less divisive if they just made it illegal to play with unpainted models. Making it just fine, you're just at a handicap is a real sad way to say " You can keep playing, but F you. " It doesn't feel honest, and how violent the reaction is and will probably only grow from it is a sign it sucks big time.

At a time we should be coming together, many of us can't and haven't played a game for awhile, but really want to. We get rules like this that are just going to drive people away further, cause arguments, debates derision. Something we didn't need help to do as I'm sure we'll find other rules we think suck big time from this edition aside from this. Including it in such a wishy washy way does nothing good for the game and I can already hear the games of " Cool I won ! ".." No you didn't, you had a squad un painted, I really won because of the extra 10 points ! ". People, especially kids or waac adults will cudgel anyone with this.

I support using it but only in so far as to highlight it sucks. I have un painted stuff I can take, and I have full painted forces. All a rule like this does is promise I'll field unpainted stuff more just to spite it. As has been said, victory is in the mind. If I won by gameplay and lose to paint, the other player can say he won, I'll say I won, in reality we both won as we got to play at all. It does make it a point of contention and yet another thing that will need to be discussed for some ahead of time.

So lets see, what type of play ? Narrative ? Open play ? Matched ? If points values how much ? , ok easy so far., Competitive or casual ? How competitive or casual ? What counts as competitive or casual ? Terrain types of odd terrain pieces ? What does each count as ? Are we using the points for painted vs un painted ?

Am I missing any ?

 JNAProductions wrote:

 Grimtuff wrote:
Oh boo, painting is unpleasant now is it?

Sorry, but you're in the wrong hobby. That is all.

I don't enjoy painting. I do enjoy playing.

Go on-tell me why I'm wrong.

Oh oh, do me too while youre at it Grimtuff.

I enjoy painting, I enjoy playing.

Not all my models are painted because i want them painted to a certain level and i'm a slow painter.
I also happen to not want to burn myself out painting at mach speed at night instead of doing other things i enjoy (40k isnt at the center of my life).
I also want to test my models before playing them so i know how i should equip them/if theyre worth being put at the top of my painting queue.

Am i wrong?

 Crimson wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
You keep talking about tournaments. When will you understand that this isn't about tournaments???

And why do you care so much about who won or lost outside a tournament? If you throw a tantrum because in a casual game your grey horde lost to my painted army by five points due this rule, I will declare you the winner, ceremoniously hand you glorious and imaginary no-prize medal and make a mental note to not play with you again.

 JNAProductions wrote:

 Grimtuff wrote:
Oh boo, painting is unpleasant now is it?

Sorry, but you're in the wrong hobby. That is all.

I don't enjoy painting. I do enjoy playing.

Go on-tell me why I'm wrong.

It's not that you're wrong. It's just that GW evidently thinks painting is a fundamental part of the game, or, at least, important enough to penalize people for not doing it.

I think the new 1/2" of 1/2" for who can fight is a bad rule. That's just my opinion, like your opinion is that painting isn't fun. GW evidently disagrees with both of us. So we're left with three options:

1. Stop playing.

2. Play the game with our special version of the rules with anyone else who will accept that version.

3. Just play the game as written, whether we like it or not. In this case, that means either sucking it up and painting your models, or just sucking up the -10VP penalty.

Which of those three options you choose is totally up to you and there is no right answer.

 AngryAngel80 wrote:
Have you looked up the price for clippers lately ? Ouch and that is just clippers.

About $10 on Amazon for a quality set of side clippers that will last at least a decade of regular use. The trick to find good ones is to look in the electrician supplies section, not the hobbyist section.

 VladimirHerzog wrote:

 JNAProductions wrote:

 Grimtuff wrote:
Oh boo, painting is unpleasant now is it?

Sorry, but you're in the wrong hobby. That is all.

I don't enjoy painting. I do enjoy playing.

Go on-tell me why I'm wrong.

Oh oh, do me too while youre at it Grimtuff.

I enjoy painting, I enjoy playing.

Not all my models are painted because i want them painted to a certain level and i'm a slow painter.
I also happen to not want to burn myself out painting at mach speed at night instead of doing other things i enjoy (40k isnt at the center of my life).
I also want to test my models before playing them so i know how i should equip them/if theyre worth being put at the top of my painting queue.

Am i wrong?

You're not wrong, you're just out 10% of the possible points available if you and your opponent play by that rule.

 AngryAngel80 wrote:

yukishiro1 wrote:
That's a bit of an odd hot-take. Painting is by far the cheapest part of the hobby. The paint to paint a whole army to the battle ready standard will cost you less than the cost of almost any kit GW sells these days.

The rich part is based on the model cost, the love to paint part is its own thing. Either way if you really want to paint well that does actually take a good deal of cash, proper set ups, brushes, paints, replacement when they dry out or go bad which happens more than would be ideal. The residuals of the hobby aspect aren't cheap and are outright overly expensive if you get the tools through GW. Have you looked up the price for clippers lately ? Ouch and that is just clippers.

Yeah but GW isn't requiring you to paint well, just to paint to a very basic standard. A can of spray paint, two additional colors, a wash, a texture paint, and a $1 paintbrush will get you there. No need to use GW paints either. A can of spray paint is $5 off amazon, two vallejo paints, a texture paint, and two bottles of army painter wash (assuming you have a big army, if not, one is fine) is another $15. So that's about $25 to paint your army to the standard GW wants. I.e. cheaper than practically every kit GW sells these days.

I don't think anyone who can afford to buy the kits is going to find the cost of paint a serious limiting factor. Time? Sure, maybe. But cost? Not really.

Blind girl who played 3-5th, came back in 8th checking in here.
Hers pics of my army only the Sentry Pylon is recently done (my wife actually had to help me, as even this simple job became so frustratingly impossible I broke down in tears) the rest were done in 4th, when I had muuuuch better vision and motor skills.
(Posted links rather than pics to keep the thread from getting messed up)
https://imgur.com/a/HnXAJdm
https://imgur.com/a/KI8PXzz

I've been following 9th with high hopes.
The 1/2" stuff will probably cause me to lose more than I hope.
The paining requirements, well, if blank bases are fine, then I'm ok, but if I base them, I'll literally lose models, I lost a whole squad of warriors at a pick up game in a random store while I wasnt used to going to.

As a disabled Warhammer player, not just my vision, but a few other issues that impact my play as well, I'm frustrated by this rule.
I was really liking 9th, this makes me...not like it.
I was super psyched for Crusdae, after reading it, I was really excited as it's what I've always been wanting.....but then I saw this rule in there..

There are lots of things about the game that make it hard for me, but I've always pushed through, found ways to manage, personal tricks that make it possible for me to play, but this feels like I'm just screwed. I know a few other disabled gamers. I'm the pest painter on the group, and for some, they physically can't do it, but have found ways to play regardless and enjoy the game. This is like a slap in the face.

"Get a friend to paint them"
Why would a put all that work on my friends? Most dont enjoy or care about 40k, it not a feasible thing.

"Pay to get them painted, you can afford to my models, so obviously you can get them painted"
HAHAHAHAHA No. you think I can afford models! If it wasn't for eBay and charity from other gamers, as well as my 20yr old self being more able bodied and able to work, which I can't any more, I wouldn't even have a enough for a 500pnt army. Disabled people generally can't afford the prices GW charges, the second hand market isn't much better at times. I've been saving for something new for my Necrons since I started playing in the summer of 2018, that money has been used for groceries and rent. At best I saved $26ish to get my Sentry Pylons. If I were commingninto the hobby now, as an adult, I couldn't afford it, even if I saved up.

"If it's this hard for you, just stop playing"
I've been told that my Dakka members in the past, with enough people supporting the person and this view that I did stop playing, as my local 40k community had the same attitude.

Blindmage, you or any person in a similar situation obviously has a very good reason for being exempted of this rule and if anyone argues otherwise, they're a dick.

That being said, your Necrons look fine to me so you'd be getting those ten points regardless.

 VladimirHerzog wrote:

 JNAProductions wrote:

 Grimtuff wrote:
Oh boo, painting is unpleasant now is it?

Sorry, but you're in the wrong hobby. That is all.

I don't enjoy painting. I do enjoy playing.

Go on-tell me why I'm wrong.

Oh oh, do me too while youre at it Grimtuff.

I enjoy painting, I enjoy playing.

Not all my models are painted because i want them painted to a certain level and i'm a slow painter.
I also happen to not want to burn myself out painting at mach speed at night instead of doing other things i enjoy (40k isnt at the center of my life).
I also want to test my models before playing them so i know how i should equip them/if theyre worth being put at the top of my painting queue.

Am i wrong?

Doesn't sound like you're the player chasing 10 VP at a tournament, either.

That's what this all comes down to, right? Who gets that 10 VP? And it isn't even arbitrary. I hate gluing models, I hate scraping mold lines, I hate basing... there's plenty of things I hate along the way in the process... but god do I love a fully painted model that has been given requisite love from start to finish. Well, if I want to earn that satisfaction, I guess I need to get over myself and do those few things I hate doing in order to get it.

You want to have +10 VP to improve your record at an event from 2-2 to 3-1? You want +40 VP total for tie breakers to go from 3rd place to 2nd place? If these are the things you chase... I would suggest you get the brushes out and do the parts of the hobby you hate, too. That's the price, right?

I mean, even looking at it negatively where "you're being penalized 10 VP for not bothering to paint" - there is a solution, right? Some primer, some contrast, and a few hours should take care of your problem. I'm also pretty sure someone above even gave you a non-GW brushless method of achieving this lofty standard for "battle ready" that GW is forcing upon you.

For the local clubs or garage games? Ignore it. No need to be a jerk to your friends... or be a jerk to them... coax and pressure them to get into that phase of the hobby. Ask them what is holding them back, and then help them overcome it. Socialize and be excellent to each other. You know, things good clubs do for each other. Organize paintings days, help your mate get his army painted up to battle ready so he stops losing games, have discord chat nights while you guys paint so you're not doing it alone.

... Or continue to be like: damn GW for punishing me for making the hobby a worse, less immersive, place because I hate X or Y.

You want the 10 VP? Sounds like you got a new motivation to get over your fear of fielding shoddy paint jobs (hell, I'd still consider myself bad at my best) or find that extra time. Amazing what a little push can do for you to find that motivation.

 Blndmage wrote:
Blind girl who played 3-5th, came back in 8th checking in here.
Hers pics of my army only the Sentry Pylon is recently done (my wife actually had to help me, as even this simple job became so frustratingly impossible I broke down in tears) the rest were done in 4th, when I had muuuuch better vision and motor skills.
(Posted links rather than pics to keep the thread from getting messed up)
https://imgur.com/a/HnXAJdm
https://imgur.com/a/KI8PXzz

I've been following 9th with high hopes.
The 1/2" stuff will probably cause me to lose more than I hope.
The paining requirements, well, if blank bases are fine, then I'm ok, but if I base them, I'll literally lose models, I lost a whole squad of warriors at a pick up game in a random store while I wasnt used to going to.

As a disabled Warhammer player, not just my vision, but a few other issues that impact my play as well, I'm frustrated by this rule.
I was really liking 9th, this makes me...not like it.
I was super psyched for Crusdae, after reading it, I was really excited as it's what I've always been wanting.....but then I saw this rule in there..

There are lots of things about the game that make it hard for me, but I've always pushed through, found ways to manage, personal tricks that make it possible for me to play, but this feels like I'm just screwed. I know a few other disabled gamers. I'm the pest painter on the group, and for some, they physically can't do it, but have found ways to play regardless and enjoy the game. This is like a slap in the face.

"Get a friend to paint them" Why would a put all that work on my friends, most dont enjoy or care about 40k, it not a feasible thing.

"Pay to get them painted, you can afford to my models, so obviously you can get them painted" HAHAHAHAHA No. you think I can afford models! If it wasn't for eBay and charity from other gamers, as well as my 20yr old self being more able bodied and able to work, which I can't any more, I wouldn't even have a enough for a 500pnt army. Disabled people generally can't afford the prices GW charges, the second hand market isn't much better at times.

"If it's this hard for you, just stop playing" I've been told that my Dakka members in the past, with enough people supporting the person and this view that I did stop playing, as my local 40k community had the same attitude.

I don't think anybody will have a problem not honoring the rule in your case, or in a lot of cases (like new players). I honestly think this is a problem solved by not playing against ***holes.

WYSIWYG was, iirc an official rule in the past, and lots of people still proxied, etc, and the world didn't fall into chaos.

I don't want poorly painted models. I'm ok with my own bad painting but saying "rattle can, wash and dry brush" means that model is now painted in a way that isn't congruent with the rest of my models.

How's this an incentive again?

 AngryAngel80 wrote:
Some rules are just made to watch the world burn. Thank you GW, add just a bit more fuel to the dung fire that is 2020.

The Irony of including a rule for gate keeping while so recently saying how Warhammer is for everybody isn't lost on me though. Guess its for everyone who is rich and loves to paint eh ? Maybe a company name change to PaintsWorkshop.

The gate keeping argument is hilarious. The rule literally doesn't prevent anyone from playing or partaking. Thats hardly gatekeeping. No more then rules that encourage min maxing or taking the latest and greatest despite the expense.

 AngryAngel80 wrote:
Some rules are just made to watch the world burn. Thank you GW, add just a bit more fuel to the dung fire that is 2020.

The Irony of including a rule for gate keeping while so recently saying how Warhammer is for everybody isn't lost on me though. Guess its for everyone who is rich and loves to paint eh ? Maybe a company name change to PaintsWorkshop.

Dramatic much?

Kayback wrote:
I don't want poorly painted models. I'm ok with my own bad painting but saying "rattle can, wash and dry brush" means that model is now painted in a way that isn't congruent with the rest of my models.

How's this an incentive again?

Yeah, this is definitely the worst part of the rule, in that it encourages you to paint badly just to satisfy the rule, rather than taking your time to paint your entire army well, even if it means playing with a few unpainted models in the meantime.




Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Crimson wrote:
Blindmage, you or any person in a similar situation obviously has a very good reason for being exempted of this rule and if anyone argues otherwise, they're a dick.

That being said, your Necrons look fine to me so you'd be getting those ten points regardless.

Just want to second this. I can't imagine anyone would be such a jerk that they would try to use this rule against someone with a disability that made it difficult for them to comply, and anyone who did would not be worth playing with.

To the folks who think I could be given a pass due to my disability.

In garagehammer groups, you'd be right.

At FLGS's? Literally had my vision used against me on a number of occasions, and when I called it out at the store? A slap on the wrist, and zero consequences. The digital local groups froze me out or told me to "play better".

The local community is competitive and tournament focused.

I've tried to find folks who I could play not at stores with, but I've become a Pariah now.

Being a disabled gamer isn't easy of as fun as you'd imagine.
Most gamers are...at least not consciously ablist, but it's a huuuge issue.
That's not even touching on the misogyny that's almost a core tennentnof many gaming circles.
Literally had folks cancel/ghost games and big organized things after I changed my avatar in our local groups to a pic of me.

I'm really sorry to hear that. It hasn't been my experience, and it makes me grateful that people around here are not like that.

 VladimirHerzog wrote:

 JNAProductions wrote:

 Grimtuff wrote:
Oh boo, painting is unpleasant now is it?

Sorry, but you're in the wrong hobby. That is all.

I don't enjoy painting. I do enjoy playing.

Go on-tell me why I'm wrong.

Oh oh, do me too while youre at it Grimtuff.

I enjoy painting, I enjoy playing.

Not all my models are painted because i want them painted to a certain level and i'm a slow painter.
I also happen to not want to burn myself out painting at mach speed at night instead of doing other things i enjoy (40k isnt at the center of my life).
I also want to test my models before playing them so i know how i should equip them/if theyre worth being put at the top of my painting queue.

Am i wrong?

Yes. I also paint to an extremely high standard. The BRS is literally a base you can start at to get there.

Some honest advice. Spray the models while they are still on the sprue, dip wash them optionally (not required), then clean and assemble them onto the bases. Do the basing prior to assembly. Drybrush them or zenithal form an can or airbrush. From there they are BRS and you can take all the sweet time you want upping the standard.

 Asmodai wrote:

 AngryAngel80 wrote:
Have you looked up the price for clippers lately ? Ouch and that is just clippers.

About $10 on Amazon for a quality set of side clippers that will last at least a decade of regular use. The trick to find good ones is to look in the electrician supplies section, not the hobbyist section.

I did say buying them direct from GW, I promise you they aren't just 10$ lol

 Blndmage wrote:
To the folks who think I could be given a pass due to my disability.

In garagehammer groups, you'd be right.

At FLGS's? Literally had my vision used against me on a number of occasions, and when I called it out at the store? A slap on the wrist, and zero consequences. The digital local groups froze me out or told me to "play better".

The local community is competitive and tournament focused.

I've tried to find folks who I could play not at stores with, but I've become a Pariah now.

Being a disabled gamer isn't easy of as fun as you'd imagine.
Most gamers are...at least not consciously ablist, but it's a huuuge issue.

I believe they would fall strongly into the "jerk" category then. That sucks and I feel for you. I'd give you a game any day (and waive the painting points )

Unfortunately I'm not getting any games at all, CV-19 and all.

 Blndmage wrote:
To the folks who think I could be given a pass due to my disability.

In garagehammer groups, you'd be right.

At FLGS's? Literally had my vision used against me on a number of occasions, and when I called it out at the store? A slap on the wrist, and zero consequences. The digital local groups froze me out or told me to "play better".

The local community is competitive and tournament focused.

I've tried to find folks who I could play not at stores with, but I've become a Pariah now.

Being a disabled gamer isn't easy of as fun as you'd imagine.
Most gamers are...at least not consciously ablist, but it's a huuuge issue.

I'm really sorry to hear this. These people are dicks.

yukishiro1 wrote:

 AngryAngel80 wrote:

yukishiro1 wrote:
That's a bit of an odd hot-take. Painting is by far the cheapest part of the hobby. The paint to paint a whole army to the battle ready standard will cost you less than the cost of almost any kit GW sells these days.

The rich part is based on the model cost, the love to paint part is its own thing. Either way if you really want to paint well that does actually take a good deal of cash, proper set ups, brushes, paints, replacement when they dry out or go bad which happens more than would be ideal. The residuals of the hobby aspect aren't cheap and are outright overly expensive if you get the tools through GW. Have you looked up the price for clippers lately ? Ouch and that is just clippers.

Yeah but GW isn't requiring you to paint well, just to paint to a very basic standard. A can of spray paint, two additional colors, a wash, a texture paint, and a $1 paintbrush will get you there. No need to use GW paints either. A can of spray paint is $5 off amazon, two vallejo paints, a texture paint, and two bottles of army painter wash (assuming you have a big army, if not, one is fine) is another $15. So that's about $25 to paint your army to the standard GW wants. I.e. cheaper than practically every kit GW sells these days.

I don't think anyone who can afford to buy the kits is going to find the cost of paint a serious limiting factor. Time? Sure, maybe. But cost? Not really.

You can do it without an actual paintbrush actually. Spray them on the spru prior to assembly. Zenithal after assembly. Spray the bases with texture paint, glue on bases. Dip wash in minwax if you wanted. It would take longer to assemble them then to actually paint anything to that standard. That standard also doesn't prevent folks from painting the models further to higher standards.

Red Corsair, you say we're wrong without saying why.