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Hi!

I'm wondering how inorexable advance works together with disembarked units, which are flagged as "count as moved".
That's why a character might not summon a demon to the table after disembarking - because he counts as moved.

The new inorexable advance of the Death Guard tells them, the infantry counts as having remained stationary as long as it didnt fall back or
advanced in movement phase.
I conclude: as long as the vehicle didn't advance or falls back (which will be inherited), the crew counts as remained stationary even if they disembark and
the character can summon a demon right after leaving the vehicle.

Am i right with that?

Another question with even more impact:
If the vehicle has inorexable advance and counts as "remained stationary" - Can the crew disembark right after a normal move of the transporter?

If you could link the article so we can see the exact wording of the new rule, we'd be more able to help you.

As for the disembarking, I am fairly certain the answer is no. The rules for disembark don't care if the transport counts as "Remain Stationary", you can disembark "so long as the model itself has not yet made a Normal Move, an Advance or has Fallen Back that phase." Just because it counts as Remain Stationary, it doesn't mean the transport hasn't made a Normal Move etc.

On the first question, it would probably be best to see what the actual text for Inexorable Advance is in the supplement to make sure it hasn't changed from previous wording.

On the second question with even more impact. Unless the vehicle has a special rule that allows it, disembarking has then no. The unit has to disembark before the transport makes a move, that is unaffected by Inexorable Advance but is a mainstay of the transport rules.

BCB - the article today about 7 things for Death Guard talked about Inexorable Advance but did not actually quote the rule itself in the article.

Erturian wrote:

The new inorexable advance of the Death Guard tells them, the infantry counts as having remained stationary as long as it didnt fall back or
advanced in movement phase.

I conclude: as long as the vehicle didn't advance or falls back (which will be inherited), the crew counts as remained stationary even if they disembark and
the character can summon a demon right after leaving the vehicle.

Am i right with that?

Yes.

Erturian wrote:

Another question with even more impact:
If the vehicle has inorexable advance and counts as "remained stationary" - Can the crew disembark right after a normal move of the transporter?

If the VEHICLE has IA, then yes.

WHC previewed the new IA rule on dec 7th.

You still can't disembark after the vehicle has moved, even if it has IA. Read the rules for disembarking.

 BaconCatBug wrote:
You still can't disembark after the vehicle has moved, even if it has IA. Read the rules for disembarking.

If the vehicle doesn't advance or fall back, it would count as remaining stationary. I suspect they weren't necessarily thinking of it overriding the rules for disembarking, but it would count as remaining stationary for purposes of disembarking. If they didn't mean for it to apply then we'll probably see it FAQ'd quickly, but they might have wanted it in there to encourage people buying Death Guard and transports.

Disembarking doesn't say you can only get out of a stationary vehicle it says you can get out before a vehicle moves. I think BCB's interpretation is correct on that element.

It does remain possible GW wants it to work the other way but we can't know that until they weigh in.

Page 363 – Rare Rules
Add the following:
Transports and Rules that Count as Remaining Stationary
Some rules allow a model to count as having Remained Stationary, even if that model has moved during its Movement phase. Even if a Transport model is subject to such a rule, embarked models still cannot disembark from that Transport model during the Movement phase if that Transport model has already moved, unless that Transport model (or the models embarked within it) have a rule that explicitly allows them to disembark after the Transport model has moved.

From the new Errata for Warhammer 40,000 Core Book.

Thanks! That's enlightening!

But the disembarked unit might still summon and shoot heavy weapons without penalties, i assume.

Summoning says instead of moving so I would think no for the same reason as disembarking.

It's not that you are stationary but rather you forego moving to then summon at the end of the phase. (Assuming DG summoning is worded the same as CSM)

Erturian wrote:
Thanks! That's enlightening!

But the disembarked unit might still summon and shoot heavy weapons without penalties, i assume.

It can't summon, because it can't have moved.

Again, counting as X doesn't mean it actually is X. Even if you count as Remain Stationary, if you moved you still moved, and thus can't summon. Disembarking precludes you from summoning.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Pjats wrote:

Page 363 – Rare Rules
Add the following:
Transports and Rules that Count as Remaining Stationary
Some rules allow a model to count as having Remained Stationary, even if that model has moved during its Movement phase. Even if a Transport model is subject to such a rule, embarked models still cannot disembark from that Transport model during the Movement phase if that Transport model has already moved, unless that Transport model (or the models embarked within it) have a rule that explicitly allows them to disembark after the Transport model has moved.

From the new Errata for Warhammer 40,000 Core Book.

Good catch, my guess would be this is a pre-emptive errata in preparation for this exact scenario. One such transport with such an explicit rule would be the Impulsor.

Again, counting as X doesn't mean it actually is X. Even if you count as Remain Stationary, if you moved you still moved, and thus can't summon. Disembarking precludes you from summoning.

It can't be as easy like that, because the -1 shooting penalty for heavy weapons don't apply either. And there it is also called "if the unit has moved".

But the "at the end of the movement phase instead of moving" in the summoning rule get's me - it is an either move OR summon. You need to chose.

...on a second thought: the disembarking doesn't stop the unit from moving. If i can chose to move normal - why can't i chose to summon a demon instead?
I can activate the unit after disembarking as normal. The only difference is the contradictory flagging as "moved" (from disembarking) and "counts as stationary" (from IA)

Oh, and here is the missing Link (Sorry): https://www.warhammer-community.com/2020/12/07/death-guard-rules-preview-part-1-inexorable-advance/

I agree. Counting as remain stationary means exactly that. The unit can summon after disembarking, they can shoot heavy weapons without -1 to hit, etc.
But they can't disembark after the transport has moved, as the FAQ says. I was wrong.

Partially answering as the question regarding the transport seems to have been decided.

I'd be more inclined towards the 'can summon after moving if it has IA' camp.

The rules for 'Remain Stationary' states that no model in that unit can move this turn. If units were not selected to move, then it is assumed it has chosen to 'Remain Stationary'. Units that 'Remain[ed] Stationary' does not suffer from associated penalties from making a Normal Move, Advance or Fall Back. Note that as per the rules for movement phase, a unit can never have "not moved" because if a unit has not been moved, then it is considered to have 'remained stationary'. Thus, RAW, 'Remain Stationary' is effectively the catch-all binary opposite of 'active' movement types (Normal Move, Advance, Fall Back).

When rules for summoning is invoked, you have to check whether or not the unit has moved (i.e. made Normal Move, Advance, or Fall Back) - again, note that you can never have "not moved" because if a unit has not been moved, then it is considered to have 'remained stationary'. In other words, when checking whether a unit can summon or not, you are not actually checking to see if a unit has 'not moved' or not, but rather you are checking whether or not a unit has 'Remained Stationary'.

Oddities aside, if IA grants 'as if Remained Stationary' status, then the unit can summon.

But this is only true if the rules for Daemonic Ritual had read "if this unit did not move".

AFAIK, Daemonic Ritual is an ACTION performed during the movement phase, in lieu of moving. So RAW, a unit that performed Daemonic Ritual has neither Normally Moved, Advanced, Fell Back, nor Remained Stationary for all rules purposes. In other words, Daemonic Ritual is essentially 5th "movement option" during the movement phase. But because it has not Normally Moved, Advanced, or Fell Back, it is considered to be 'remaining stationary' (as per rules, units that were "not selected to move in the 'Move Unit' step of the Movement phase are assumed to have Remained Stationary that phase" Core Rules, p 10).

So no, the unit cannot summon after moving, even if it 'remained stationary', because 'remaining stationary' isn't the status being checked. Daemonic Ritual simply needs to be declared in lieu of following the movement phase as normal.