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I'm looking at getting into 40K and trying to figure out what I need to buy. The general rules seem to be available for free, but those don't cover a lot of army-building stuff or points. Codex and supplements seem to be more or less required. Is chapter approved required? Between the codex, supplement and chapter approved that's $120 before I buy a single model which is more of an upfront cost than I really like. Are any of those things optional? Maybe using battlescribe to get the points values and skipping Chapter approved.

I'd skip Chapter Approved books altogether. They change so often that they're not worth the paper they're printed on, and are just good money after bad.

What are you looking to start with? Are you getting a single army, or two so that you can start with a friend, or are you splitting a starter box?

If you can use battlescribe, then it does save you a lot of money that is for sure. As for how optional the things are, they really aren't. CA has errata and points changes, which as soon as they come out become the legal set of rules and you can't really use the old one.

I am looking at getting a single army (for now at least). I have done some research and the faction that appealed to me most in terms of lore and appearance was the Raven Guard faction of Space Marine.

Karol wrote:
If you can use battlescribe, then it does save you a lot of money that is for sure. As for how optional the things are, they really aren't. CA has errata and points changes, which as soon as they come out become the legal set of rules and you can't really use the old one.

That depends on the group. If you're playing with friends you can skip CA and just stick with the main rule book and codex if you all agree to it. If you're playing with strangers you might need it but if you're only using points changes Battlescribe will have you covered.

Dancingjoker wrote:
I am looking at getting a single army (for now at least). I have done some research and the faction that appealed to me most in terms of lore and appearance was the Raven Guard faction of Space Marine.

Just get the codex and the free rules, you don't need anything else to start.

You don't need points to play, start with PL and use the open war style of play.

You should be getting the supplement too at a certain point, but I would advise against that. The raven guard book has some years already, and before you get an army, build it, paint it and get enough games to start using some advanced rules, chances are that a new supplement will have been published already.

So in short, just get the codex and start building something and get some games. This can already take a lot of time. When you are ready to step up your game, check for the most current CA and supplement.

Dancingjoker wrote:
I'm looking at getting into 40K and trying to figure out what I need to buy. The general rules seem to be available for free, but those don't cover a lot of army-building stuff or points. Codex and supplements seem to be more or less required. Is chapter approved required? Between the codex, supplement and chapter approved that's $120 before I buy a single model which is more of an upfront cost than I really like. Are any of those things optional? Maybe using battlescribe to get the points values and skipping Chapter approved.

ok first of all what army are you looking into? that could help guide things.

beyond that I agree, just get the codex and the core rulebook. the supplement is a nice to havee but is something you can pick up later, Marines work without a supplement. (although blood angels, dark angels, space wolves and death watch DO lose a lot by not having it)

I suggest to start with a Start Collecting! Vanguard Space Marines box if you can still find one online or in your local store. Really great value and the Phobos units inside are fitting for sneaky RG.

Apart from that, I would say look at the different Combat Patrol boxes available for Space Marines and buy the one where the models are the most appealing for you. They are ~500p out of the box and don't really have any duds inside.

Wrote you a PM as well.

I would get ca over rulebook. Points, better scenarios, core rules. Only if you know you will be playing crusade would i bother with more expensive bigger heavier rulebook

tneva82 wrote:
I would get ca over rulebook. Points, better scenarios, core rules. Only if you know you will be playing crusade would i bother with more expensive bigger heavier rulebook

true I suppose that raises the "what do you want to play?" question.

Yeah, it's basically buy the basic rulebook for crusade rules OR buy chapter approved 2021 for matched play.

A new player really doesn't need both.

Dancingjoker wrote:
I'm looking at getting into 40K and trying to figure out what I need to buy. The general rules seem to be available for free, but those don't cover a lot of army-building stuff or points. Codex and supplements seem to be more or less required. Is chapter approved required? Between the codex, supplement and chapter approved that's $120 before I buy a single model which is more of an upfront cost than I really like. Are any of those things optional? Maybe using battlescribe to get the points values and skipping Chapter approved.

You don't need the chapter approved, but do bear in mind you will need to buy the rulebook, codex etc. again in 2-3 years when the new edition inevitably drops.

That's why cheaper CA is doubly good over rulebook. Unless you play crusade you don't need rulebook when CA provides same in better format and better scenarios to boot. Rulebook scenarios and secondaries suck.

Does CA include the core rules? Surely the BRB is kind of important to play the game.
As for OP, if you're going for Raven Guard then you will need the Space Marine Codex but the Raven Guard supplement is optional, it will give you access to a special character and extra rules like Relics/Stratagems but you can play Raven Guard with just the Space Marine Codex. As for a starter army:
https://www.games-workshop.com/en-GB/Combat-Patrol-Space-Marines-2021
The Space Marine Combat Patrol is filled with Phobos Primaris that are designed to be sneaky and would work well with Raven Guard. The only weird thing is that it doesn't actually come with an HQ choice which is strange so you'll need to get a Phobos character separately.

Isn't that the phobos Lt in the front of the squad of 10 scout dudes?

Huh, so it is. Blends in too well

Personally, I think the BRB is important. It has terrain and detachment rules, which other rule sources do not.

It has step by step instructions for playing Open, Matched, and Crusade, plus missions at all four game sizes for all three ways to play. I really find it to be essential.

That plus a dex will get you moving.

honestly if you want to preview all the rules and books there are corners of the web one could acquire the data from all of said books, just make sure to use a VPN. as for buying books i would start with chapter approved and then download battlescribe to see weapons profile abilities etc. it will not have it all but enough to get a feel for armies. once you narrow it down to a few armies i would swatch battle reports of said armies to see which one appeals to you most.

If there is a local facebook or other flg group i would also ask in there if somebody minded running you through a trial game, i have almost all the armies and will happily run starter games to let another person try an army before buying into it.

PenitentJake wrote:
Personally, I think the BRB is important. It has terrain and detachment rules, which other rule sources do not.

It has step by step instructions for playing Open, Matched, and Crusade, plus missions at all four game sizes for all three ways to play. I really find it to be essential.

That plus a dex will get you moving.

CA has the terrain rules as well, detachments are part of battlescribe and open play really doesn't need a book at all.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Gert wrote:
Does CA include the core rules? Surely the BRB is kind of important to play the game.

Yes, I think the only important thing missing is detachments. Outside of that, everything you need to play is in the CA booklet.

If you can't find the main rulebook cheap (which you should be able to), I'd advise the Chaper Approved and Space Marine Codex. Chapter Approved has the missions that you will play, plus the rules. In the short term I'd also consider getting GWs app as all of the Supplements from 8th edition (so not Blood Angels, Deathwatch, Space Wolves or Dark Angels) are available in that app. You could then experiment with ravenguard, or any of the other marine supplements.

As for models, many stores still have the Start Collecting Vanguard and I would recommend it for Ravenguard. It will start you with a Lt, 2 small Infiltrator squads, a suppressor squad and an eliminator squad.

PenitentJake wrote:
Personally, I think the BRB is important. It has terrain and detachment rules, which other rule sources do not.

It has step by step instructions for playing Open, Matched, and Crusade, plus missions at all four game sizes for all three ways to play. I really find it to be essential.

That plus a dex will get you moving.

Terrain false. Det's are easy to sort out. If you don't play crusade brick will just sit on shelf.

Brick, ca and codex too much. Brick is only one you can skip. Nobody plays open aka bring whatever you wish. Crusade is only good part of brick. Matched play scenarios　in brick sucks. They were lousy compared to ca20 and those are worse than ca21

Yeah, I've never used Battlescribe- didn't know it had detachments. Also didn't know CA had terrain rules.

CA + Dex is definitely the way to go for a matched player.

tneva82 wrote:

PenitentJake wrote:
Personally, I think the BRB is important. It has terrain and detachment rules, which other rule sources do not.

It has step by step instructions for playing Open, Matched, and Crusade, plus missions at all four game sizes for all three ways to play. I really find it to be essential.

That plus a dex will get you moving.

Terrain false. Det's are easy to sort out. If you don't play crusade brick will just sit on shelf.

Brick, ca and codex too much. Brick is only one you can skip. Nobody plays open aka bring whatever you wish. Crusade is only good part of brick. Matched play scenarios　in brick sucks. They were lousy compared to ca20 and those are worse than ca21

I think that open stopped being "Bring whatever you wish" around 8th edition. It is now a a quite decent way to play the game. PL based with a mostly kill point mission.

Does anyone play that way though? I don't feel that anyone needs rules to just line up stuff with a simple scenario.

I would go for the Chapter Approved/Grand Tournament 2021 rules pack over the BRB it has all of the rules except crusade play and the detachments.

You might want to remove that link and send it via PM.