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I do think you are right on the One or the Other point, regarding Auspice and Transhuman, I would very much like to experience more wins with my Custodes before the end of 9th. Unfortunately, I have a local meta that is mostly Tau and DE, and the SM players basically don't come to the store anymore. I have basically 4 wins in this edition, all were cheese lists of all shields, back before our codex. Now I've created an all Bike list, but I'm honestly afraid to play it for fear of being That Guy (tm).

We are gonna take some lumps. GW doesn't like one faction getting above 50%. But I don't think we'll get nerfed in the way normal nerfs happen.

10th is basically almost here, with the remaining codex's already announced or soon to be revealed. Nids are here, Guard have been announced(?) and the last in the pipe are Chaos and Knights. I don't see how they keep anything the same, when Knights come out. They either have to Break the game to let knights win, or they have to completely go ham in power creep, where every knight has a Gatling Volcano Cannon and 16x Cogni-Heavy Stubbers with 28"Assault 6 S5 shooting. Then we will have our nerfs.; We'll be relagated to the dust bin in the wake of 9th edition Super Walker battles.

Tiberias wrote:

I really don't understand why people get so hang up on that strat. We had it in 8th and turning off rerolls wasn't breaking anything back then. It's also one unit, people act like it's a rule that affects our whole army....bait the strat out and then blast something else. Threat saturation is really not that difficult in 9th with all that hyper deadly shooting.

Completely agree. With the amount of highly lethal shooting in 9th it's easy to get around it, as soon as your Custodes opponent plays it then focus fire on a different unit. If you have no other units available to target then that's a positioning problem that needs to be corrected.

You don't think the fact that AGA and EA both cost 2CP in 8th is why people weren't moaning about it?

Thankflly it looks like Trajann's got some vital paperwork to fill out on Terra, so no need to cost him appropriately at 220 points anymore.

Well, now that we're limited to two units of bikes, I feel more justified in those Dreads I got. LOL... oh GW... hamfisted "fixes".

I just finished painting Trajaan last night...

NewTruthNeomaxim wrote:
Well, now that we're limited to two units of bikes, I feel more justified in those Dreads I got. LOL... oh GW... hamfisted "fixes".

I just finished painting Trajaan last night...

I'd say it is fake! GW has never banned a unit for balance reasons in 8th or 9th not even the infamous broviathen which had a 82% win rate and was literly unbeatable for most lists.

Where did you hear about Trajann going up, or being limited to 2 units of bikes? Nothing on WarCom suggests such a thing has happened yet.

 ZergSmasher wrote:
Where did you hear about Trajann going up, or being limited to 2 units of bikes? Nothing on WarCom suggests such a thing has happened yet.

Someone made a fake article and leaked it.
Those tidbits were in there.

So you might also notice the person who made it misspelled two major words.

Thank God that was fake. It sounded sooooo much like something GW would actually attempt. The writing was a particularly good fake.

I'm happy to embrace sensible nerfs though.

I actually think something like this, Not this drastic, has merit. I know Ro3 is just a suggestion, but this is simply an expansion of that. We already have it. Can you take more than 1 of any type of Shield Captain currently, ala 3 Bike Captains? No. This is the same thing.

My bet, this was partially real, but the leaker got stupid. I can see GW limiting most factions in this way. Ala, you should only be able to take a single Autarch of each type, or Farseer, etc. Same with Company Commanders, or SM Captains. It would be silly to have Sicarius, Calgar, and Bobby all commanding the same 5 squads of Intercessors and whatnot.

There should absolutely be a chain of command restriction. Are we really thinking Gaz would allow another 2 Warbosses in his Wahh party?

I guess one idea is that a single detachment can have only 1 single Named Character HQ model? I can see GW doing that.

Free daggers for Sagg, now officially confirmed:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/03/l7HMwjs20r7R53Gx.pdf

We are gonna need it vs clowns and eldar and probably Nids

 nordsturmking wrote:
Free daggers for Sagg, now officially confirmed:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/03/l7HMwjs20r7R53Gx.pdf

We are gonna need it vs clowns and eldar and probably Nids

That's neat. Thanks for sharing.

On another note: anyone seen the leaked Nids codex? Bugs got some cool new things to play with, they seem pretty strong. How do you think that matchup is going to be like?

Was there a debate on daggers? I guess I've just been house ruling it these last few weeks.

Not to rain on the parade, but the parade is now hordes of 9 (Supposedly) flying troops with S5 guns. Oh, and obsec. I really don't want to have to roll defensive rolls against 40+ shots of Fleshborers against my 3 Guardians. Here, just have the point, this is too boring.

Tiberias wrote:

 nordsturmking wrote:
Free daggers for Sagg, now officially confirmed:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/03/l7HMwjs20r7R53Gx.pdf

We are gonna need it vs clowns and eldar and probably Nids

That's neat. Thanks for sharing.

On another note: anyone seen the leaked Nids codex? Bugs got some cool new things to play with, they seem pretty strong. How do you think that matchup is going to be like?

Yes i have the codex, looks really strong. Screamer killer has 10A -3AP 3D hits on 3+

Tiberias wrote:

 nordsturmking wrote:
Free daggers for Sagg, now officially confirmed:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/03/l7HMwjs20r7R53Gx.pdf

We are gonna need it vs clowns and eldar and probably Nids

That's neat. Thanks for sharing.

On another note: anyone seen the leaked Nids codex? Bugs got some cool new things to play with, they seem pretty strong. How do you think that matchup is going to be like?

I think it's going to push us more towards Hurricane Bolters on bikes to clear out the bug swarms (unless you build around Dachatarai and have good timing). This will weaken us to the big monsters who still have -1 damage so I'm expecting Caladii to make a bit of a return with the high damage gun. This also helps in Custodes mirror matchups since you can put more shooting pressure on your opponent from farther away.

Depending the number of T6-7 critters I'd expect mixed Shield and Spears again if you were running basic Custodes as troops.

EviscerationPlague wrote:
Depending the number of T6-7 critters I'd expect mixed Shield and Spears again if you were running basic Custodes as troops.

That's a tough one. If you're running troop heavy I definitely see it. If you're still leaning on bikes (S7, +1 to wound on the charge), spamming the comparatively cheap Allarus (S8 for axes) or taking Achillus/Galatus, you probably want to stick with shields. The point of the troops there is to be durable, not deadly. Definitely troop heavy build wants some spears though (and in that case I'd say just put one shield in each squad, two spears and pair them with Sag squads).

So with a good amount of time with the new book/missions, what is everyone's personal pool of secondaries you consider viable?

I've been running an Inquisitor for Psychic Interrogation recently, but want my points back, leaving me struggling to pick a third, generally comfy secondary outside To the Last, and Stranglehold

NewTruthNeomaxim wrote:
So with a good amount of time with the new book/missions, what is everyone's personal pool of secondaries you consider viable?

I've been running an Inquisitor for Psychic Interrogation recently, but want my points back, leaving me struggling to pick a third, generally comfy secondary outside To the Last, and Stranglehold

In my view, To The Last is very situational. I generally do:

Behind Enemy Lines (spend the 120 points for 2 1-man Allarus units, your Bikes can be back there T3 if the Allarus take casualties)
RND (Retrieve Nachmund Data) / Raise the Banners (if it's a 6 objective map)
No Prisoners / Assassinate / Abhor the Witch (whichever one scores the highest based on the situation as long as at least one of them can score 9 points)

Audustum wrote:

EviscerationPlague wrote:
Depending the number of T6-7 critters I'd expect mixed Shield and Spears again if you were running basic Custodes as troops.

That's a tough one. If you're running troop heavy I definitely see it. If you're still leaning on bikes (S7, +1 to wound on the charge), spamming the comparatively cheap Allarus (S8 for axes) or taking Achillus/Galatus, you probably want to stick with shields. The point of the troops there is to be durable, not deadly. Definitely troop heavy build wants some spears though (and in that case I'd say just put one shield in each squad, two spears and pair them with Sag squads).

The problem with Shields is that the plethora of AP-3 isn't wasted

EviscerationPlague wrote:

Audustum wrote:

EviscerationPlague wrote:
Depending the number of T6-7 critters I'd expect mixed Shield and Spears again if you were running basic Custodes as troops.

That's a tough one. If you're running troop heavy I definitely see it. If you're still leaning on bikes (S7, +1 to wound on the charge), spamming the comparatively cheap Allarus (S8 for axes) or taking Achillus/Galatus, you probably want to stick with shields. The point of the troops there is to be durable, not deadly. Definitely troop heavy build wants some spears though (and in that case I'd say just put one shield in each squad, two spears and pair them with Sag squads).

The problem with Shields is that the plethora of AP-3 isn't wasted

AP-3 doesn't cut it. Shield +1 adds on to Light Cover (either natural or banner). Gives you a 1D6+2 succeeding on a 2+. AP-3 applies a negative 3 modifier so you're rolling 1D6-1 and succeeding on a 2+. I.e. you get a 3+ save against AP-3. I'll take that over trying 4++'s on spears when the unit's goal is to be durable.

What I love is they set a new precedent! There is a weapon that even Morty can't save against. It's a crappy relic sword, but still. Any wounds this thing does CANNOT be saved, it's a new "ultra Mortal Wound". Great. So we have this now.

NewTruthNeomaxim wrote:
So with a good amount of time with the new book/missions, what is everyone's personal pool of secondaries you consider viable?

I've been running an Inquisitor for Psychic Interrogation recently, but want my points back, leaving me struggling to pick a third, generally comfy secondary outside To the Last, and Stranglehold

I usually do Attrition, Raise Banners and Auric Mortalis. Behind enemy lines would be a good one if you're running a decent amount of deep strikers.

 nordsturmking wrote:
Free daggers for Sagg, now officially confirmed:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/03/l7HMwjs20r7R53Gx.pdf

We are gonna need it vs clowns and eldar and probably Nids

It's looking more and more like Sags are going to be my go-to troops unit.

At this point, I don't see how they aren't #1 Troop slot.

I already run three squads of Saggitarm, and now I almost want to try more.

Played a game last night vs death guard.

I went infantry spam heavy shooting msu to make the most of emperors chosen and play the objective game.
Me:
Trajan
Bike cap
Celexus assassin
2 x units of sags
1 x unit sword n board
Vexilla
3 x units of venatari (2 pistol 1 lance)

Him:
Plague caster
Tallyman
Plague spewer dude
2 close combat marine units
2 rhinos
Terminator blob
2 fleshmower drones

Custodes scored big early with aggressive movements. Flying obsec (venatari) allowed me to hold 2 and hold more immediately, sealing the game by t3.
Army wide -1 damage is really problematic, especially with the drones that are surprisingly good counters to our t5 2+/4++.
Bike captain failed a six inch charge, even with the reroll, but survived the counter charge from the terminators thanks to EA for shadowkeepers and AGA.
Venatari swept up marines and rhinos pretty effectively, but even with rendax struggled to put damage on the bloat drones. I can definitely see why people bring missile bikes instead. If I get some more I might try a list that plays both.
That said, venatari are super versatile and playing nine isn't a huge points investment (by custodian standards).

I'd be interested to try a list that plays an outrider detachment of bike cap 2 bike squads, 3 venatari and a vexilla to minimize first turn losses.

Yeah army wide -1 DMG is one of the easiest counters to our armies. Rendax is a good kata but there's definitely some luck involved, it does work pretty well with hurricane bolter bikes.

So anyone got any good anti-Harlequin tips? I'm facing off against a Halequin troop this weekend, and I'm just playing my Biker List. What really worries me is their new Sniper unit, I don't know if he's gonna be using 1-3, but I know he's bringing at least 1. I'm guessing with the Relic gun and the Warlord trait that gives him exploding 6s, and MW on 6s. With the Weaver of Fate thing he can auto-turn one of his misses into a 6. How do we counter snipers as Custodes? They bypass Look out sir, so Wardens are out. They have character targeting, I guess I'm just gonna park my captain behind a LOS terrain but within 6" of my shooters, and hope?

FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
So anyone got any good anti-Harlequin tips? I'm facing off against a Halequin troop this weekend, and I'm just playing my Biker List. What really worries me is their new Sniper unit, I don't know if he's gonna be using 1-3, but I know he's bringing at least 1. I'm guessing with the Relic gun and the Warlord trait that gives him exploding 6s, and MW on 6s. With the Weaver of Fate thing he can auto-turn one of his misses into a 6. How do we counter snipers as Custodes? They bypass Look out sir, so Wardens are out. They have character targeting, I guess I'm just gonna park my captain behind a LOS terrain but within 6" of my shooters, and hope?

Snipers do not bypass the Warden bodyguard rule.