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The value just isn't there for me, though I still am loving the game right now. I'll probably pick up all the lances at retail, but do the $80 pledge if it at least has some stretch goal value.

I could see this campaign going over 4 million, but I have seen this story before with CMON, people pledge a lot on day one thinking the add-ons are coming, and when they don't, and rent comes due, the total starts going backwards. Kickstarter is still not a store, people are expecting a way better value than retail. So not a snowball's chance in Hell that it makes it to Frosthaven levels.

One thing to consider is that just because they've got more funding doesn't mean they can just add things. Many a KS has burned itself because they funded TOO WELL and added loads of things which causes delays and the more customers you have the more costs go along with that and the more production pressure etc.....

Heck Kingdom Death is a fine if not posterchild example for this - though they've managed to survive, some burn themselves out entirely.


So I'd not 100% expect loads of extra freebies; hope for more but be glad for what you've got.

 Overread wrote:
One thing to consider is that just because they've got more funding doesn't mean they can just add things. Many a KS has burned itself because they funded TOO WELL and added loads of things which causes delays and the more customers you have the more costs go along with that and the more production pressure etc.....

Sounds a bit like the Clan Invasion Kickstarter...

I thought this was interesting in the comments in response to "will there be bonus lance packs/minis added like the Clan Invastion"

They answered this question during the Twitch stream: Nope, nothing extra. They are doing this to not undercut the brick and mortar stores selling the product. So by design, it is not any cheaper to get the KS, the swag is the bonus.

If they wanted to help out B&M, then they shouldn't have ran a KS.

That line almost seals the "no double Force Packs" comment they made.

It will bite them in the ass in the end.

Generally speaking, the problem with stretch goals is that if its not already in the production pipeline when the KS begins, it can't be added in a way that doesn't jeopardize the original fulfillment schedule. The lead time on these things is just too long for stretch goals to actually be able to offer "new" stuff that is at all meaningful.

Did they say anything at launch about stretch goals past $2m, or was that the top end of them?

Yeah, but for this one its not really about new things, its about matching the value of the previous campaign with additional stuff that already exists. They will be able to trace their profit margin on each pledge, and work out how much more they can sub in before it hits them hard.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Dysartes wrote:
Did they say anything at launch about stretch goals past $2m, or was that the top end of them?

I just got a message from them through Kickstarter that says more goals will turn up soon.

I was looking forward to this to try get back into BT as its been hard to find the starter box and other packs, but adding VAT and shipping the value is just not there.

 TalonZahn wrote:
If they wanted to help out B&M, then they shouldn't have ran a KS.

That line almost seals the "no double Force Packs" comment they made.

It will bite them in the ass in the end.

Why? they've just made $2million in sales through KS in a few hours. People are already super hyped to buy the stuff right now, they don't need to sweeten the deal any more.


As for not running the KS to help stores, that's a tricky thing. I think pricing so that they aren't steeply undercutting is good and sensible, but running the KS itself provides a MASSIVE amount of hype and marketing that sales through regular stores won't generate. Like it or not the last KS and this one have pushed BTech from a super tiny niche game that hung on for years; hard into a mainstream game once more. It gets a LOT more attention, hype, marketing and chatter and so long as it goes well it means that whilst stores might see a dip, they should see a rise in demand after.

The real damage is done when its a one-and-done game such as boxed board games; or where they steeply undercut the prices or even go wholesale prices in the KS so that the stores can't compete at all on the prices and customers come pre-loaded expecting much lower prices and balking/pulling back when the store is "charging way more"

The real damage is done when they don't up the ante and people realize it will be cheaper to wait it out.

Sure they get some hype, but when people start putting together spreadsheets to show value breakdowns, and they will, pledges will go backwards.

There's already comments doing cost breakdowns and it's currently MORE expensive to pledge than buy at retail, and the "swag" is a weak gimme.


[Edit] Just go look at the comments section. It's already becoming a shitstorm of "not enough value" comments. People are already saying they are pulling back their pledges to lower levels because you can't get the Vehicle Packs and have to pick Force Packs. Those same packs can be had for $16-$22 all over the place. Again, making the KS more expensive than just sitting out and waiting for retail.

 Ghaz wrote:
I've heard that the conventional wisdom is that a KS will do 33% of its funding in the first 48 hours, 33% in the final 48 hours, and the final 33% in the intervening period. If this is true we could be looking at a $6 to $7 million Kickstarter

I think it is more 50/10/40.

 TalonZahn wrote:
The real damage is done when they don't up the ante and people realize it will be cheaper to wait it out.

Impatience is a thing. The Company Store backers won't get their pledges until after regular backers and then will have a 30-day guaranteed window before a regular hobby trade release.

 TalonZahn wrote:

Just go look at the comments section. It's already becoming a shitstorm of "not enough value" comments. People are already saying they are pulling back their pledges to lower levels because you can't get the Vehicle Packs and have to pick Force Packs. Those same packs can be had for $16-$22 all over the place. Again, making the KS more expensive than just sitting out and waiting for retail.

Woah, woah, we can't pick the vehicles packs?

Or is that people wanting JUST vehicles and nothing else?

 Ghaz wrote:

 TalonZahn wrote:
The real damage is done when they don't up the ante and people realize it will be cheaper to wait it out.

Impatience is a thing. The Company Store backers won't get their pledges until after regular backers and then will have a 30-day guaranteed window before a regular hobby trade release.

I don't disagree, but that's going to be a small amount of people that would rather pay $30 for a pack at Day X than $22 at Day Y.

Again, the comments section is strongly going the way of people lowering pledges as they see the value just isn't there like last time.

Right now, Veteran ($80) or Company ($150) pledges are about the only place there's actual value.

Last time around the $275 pledge was the sweet spot.


[Edit] No, you get to pick FORCE packs, NOT Battlefield Support Packs. I'm trying to find where the difference was said by CGL.

[Edit 2] I asked, and replies have been exactly what I stated, but not from an official CGL person yet, but they also mentioned the same post I'm looking for.

On the Kickstarter page at least the battlefield support packs are pictured in the box labelled forcepacks.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Force packs are AUD$50 in Oz, hard to find in bulk, and you never know when something will be out or be in stock.

12 of them would be AUD$600 before you add the Merc Boxed Set.

Seems like a good deal to me...

Seems like it is a good deal for your specific situation, and I'm glad that it is. I think for me is less of a good deal, as distribution here is good and I have a local store that's carrying a lot of Btech (wargenwargames.com).

 Flinty wrote:
On the Kickstarter page at least the battlefield support packs are pictured in the box labelled forcepacks.

Yet, they are NOT Force Packs and multiple people are waiting for an official answer since we can't find the original answer that they are NOT Forcepacks.

Which, is odd since they are the main reason most people are in this KS to begin with, lol

Also on the stretch goal listings they are specifically named as forcepacks.

Yeah, the 'ForcePacks/not ForcePacks' is something Catalyst is going to need to clarify.

Oh yeah, the latest campaign update does state that. How weird!

One of the "Collaborators" replied that they are NOT Forcepacks, so wouldn't be selectable.

Still searching.

Ray just said on stream that 'all of the vehicle packs can absolutely be chosen as pledge packs'.

They need to update the latest update the that states

“Note: The Battlefield Support packs are not available to choose as part of your pledge, only as an add-on.“



I’m sure it’ll get smoother out shortly.

 Prometheum5 wrote:
Ray just said on stream that 'all of the vehicle packs can absolutely be chosen as pledge packs'.

Nvm, found him


[Edit] Ok, that "note" has been removed, so now the vehicle packs ARE able to be picked....

Yes, latest word on KS is: Please note: The Battlefield Support Packs ARE available as selections for your pledge. The information we had was incorrect and it is being corrected.

As a US backer, this currently feels like a pretty bad deal. Outside of say neoprene maps, the contents of their KS'ers have generally been available at retail for quite a cheap price, and fairly consistently.

I personally can barely tell the difference between many chassis of mech, and own mountains of them from the last KS. What I, and many others want are just numbers of vehicles/support stuff, and without a more value rich way to get them in bulk, I feel like I need to skip this one, despite really wanting to back it.

No double-packs makes this one a rough proposition.

 petrov27 wrote:
I thought this was interesting in the comments in response to "will there be bonus lance packs/minis added like the Clan Invastion"

They answered this question during the Twitch stream: Nope, nothing extra. They are doing this to not undercut the brick and mortar stores selling the product. So by design, it is not any cheaper to get the KS, the swag is the bonus.

Interesting to know this. I wont go above Battalion then. I was hoping to upgrade in the pledge manager.

The one thing this campaign gives us is a universal price for force packs in the pledge levels. I will use my six packs with Battalion to fill up on vehicles, then buy my new lances on top post pledge. Vehicle packs are billed at $40, Clan at $30 and IS mechs at $25, with no Salvage box equalisers.
Also with no double Force Packs there is no incentive to pledge any more right now, instead I can drip feed money into the pledge manager in the next few months. I have an idea of what I want to buy long set up from the pre campaign info drops. So six boxes of vehicles seems right to me.

Upon reflecting on the fact that all the "swag" from the previous kickstarter has sat unused up in my attic compared to the actual miniatures, I've decided to cancel my pledge and just wait for retail.

I also get to sit on my moral high horse for supporting a brick-and-mortar store, too.

 infinite_array wrote:
Upon reflecting on the fact that all the "swag" from the previous kickstarter has sat unused up in my attic compared to the actual miniatures, I've decided to cancel my pledge and just wait for retail.

I also get to sit on my moral high horse for supporting a brick-and-mortar store, too.

The T shirts were reasonable, and I will admit the faction pins were high quality. I was impressed with the ones I got.
I bought lots of faction dice and they were very poor.

I am dumping zero cash on swag.