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Breton wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Poor writing.

There's no reason to nest you Tyrannocyte inside a Tyrannocyte inside a Tyrannocyte.

It's just a silly unintended thing because they have (once again) failed to factor that into writing the rule.

[EDIT]: I checked. 8th had a specific note that a Tyrannocyte could not transport another Tyrannocyte. 9th and 10th do not have this note.

I'd say Jidmah was right, the RAW does prevent it - because if one Tyrannocyte is embarked it is not set up "high in the sky". The rule could/should have been clearer.

I was? I don't remember writing about it

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 JNAProductions wrote:
I won't-I think GW just forgot to make matryoshka Tyrranocytes impossible.

For, as I said, the third Codex in a row, IIRC.

We laugh, because it's easier than crying.

Remember, this is the management and coordination that we deal with. Management that can't make ruleswriters adhere to a design ethos for a full 3 year period or the far shorter 1-2 year codex release period. I.o.w. QA is once again... not existent, allready,

 Jidmah wrote:

Breton wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Poor writing.

There's no reason to nest you Tyrannocyte inside a Tyrannocyte inside a Tyrannocyte.

It's just a silly unintended thing because they have (once again) failed to factor that into writing the rule.

[EDIT]: I checked. 8th had a specific note that a Tyrannocyte could not transport another Tyrannocyte. 9th and 10th do not have this note.

I'd say Jidmah was right, the RAW does prevent it - because if one Tyrannocyte is embarked it is not set up "high in the sky". The rule could/should have been clearer.

I was? I don't remember writing about it

Oops, you're right, it was

 JNAProductions wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 Insectum7 wrote:
Are they?! Hahaha.

From the Index:

"This model has a transport capacity of... 1 Tyranids Monster model with a Wounds characteristic of 12 of less."

The Tyrannocyte has 10 wounds, and has the Monster keyword.

One could argue that its rule requiring it be set in reserves makes that impossible. One COULD argue that.

I won't-I think GW just forgot to make matryoshka Tyrranocytes impossible.

My bad.

Looks like the Tyranids have quite a variety of interesting units in their datacards, the Toxicrene looks a bit better than before as well and Old One Eye as a leader looks pretty good. I am looking forward to playing against them and I'm glad they are getting some updated models.

Personally, I'm disappointed that GW made it so that "Primaris" leaders can only lead "Primaris" units...

"Sorry Brother, I'm a Primaris Captain. I can't lead your Tactical Squad...for reasons."

 Lord Clinto wrote:
Personally, I'm disappointed that GW made it so that "Primaris" leaders can only lead "Primaris" units...

"Sorry Brother, I'm a Primaris Captain. I can't lead your Tactical Squad...for reasons."

It's Big Brain GW preventing potential broken interactions. I mean, could you imagine the unintended consequences of a Primaris Techmarine leading an Infernus Squad?

Also big brained of GW to fix the Vanguard unit entry to be less useful than the basic Assault Marine one.

"I'm sorry sir, but you cannot join our unit."
"Brother-Sergeant Hephastor! We have known each other for nearly 20 years. I remember when we first joined the Chapter, and had our grey armour painted glorious Ultramarine blue! You have risen to lead a squad of hardened veterans - true guardians of the Emperor's Galaxy - and I have risen to the rank of Company Captain. Surely you would not begrudge me to fight along side an old friend?
"I'm afraid not sir, I cannot allow it."
"Whatever for, Brother-Sergeant?"
"You... you don't have a Plasma Pistol sir. I'm sorry, but we Hellblasters are a unique breed. Sometimes our guns explode and kill us, so we come back to life briefly to fire our exploded guns before dying again, and the thought of having someone join us who doesn't have a Plasma Pistol just... it's just unconscionable, sir!"
"Uhh... go back a bit. Did you say come back to life?"
"Again, I apologise Brother-Captain, but we cannot speak until you have a Plasma Pistol. Which means you'll have to give up the shield and sword you've been using for years as well, because can only have a Power Fist if you have a Plasma Pistol."

This is a silly game.

You don't understand, HBMC. There might be an unintended consequence for letting a Captain without a Plasma Pistol join Hellblasters.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
"I'm sorry sir, but you cannot join our unit."
"Brother-Sergeant Hephastor! We have known each other for nearly 20 years. I remember when we first joined the Chapter, and had our grey armour painted glorious Ultramarine blue! You have risen to lead a squad of hardened veterans - true guardians of the Emperor's Galaxy - and I have risen to the rank of Company Captain. Surely you would not begrudge me to fight along side an old friend?
"I'm afraid not sir, I cannot allow it."
"Whatever for, Brother-Sergeant?"
"You... you don't have a Plasma Pistol sir. I'm sorry, but we Hellblasters are a unique breed. Sometimes our guns explode and kill us, so we come back to life briefly to fire our exploded guns before dying again, and the thought of having someone join us who doesn't have a Plasma Pistol just... it's just unconscionable, sir!"
"Uhh... go back a bit. Did you come back to life?"
"Again, I apologise Brother-Captain, but we cannot speak until you have a Plasma Pistol. Which means you'll have to give up the shield and sword you've been using for years as well, because can only have a Power Fist if you have a Plasma Pistol."

That'll show him for taking the promotion from Lieutenant!

 The Red Hobbit wrote:
Looks like the Tyranids have quite a variety of interesting units in their datacards, the Toxicrene looks a bit better than before as well and Old One Eye as a leader looks pretty good. I am looking forward to playing against them and I'm glad they are getting some updated models.

What confuses me is why they've bothered calling out unit leaders for a few things- Neurogaunts, Zoanthropes, Warriors- if the leader doesn't get different stats, different wargear, or otherwise have any gameplay significance. It might as well just be another of the same trooper.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
"I'm sorry sir, but you cannot join our unit."
"Brother-Sergeant Hephastor! We have known each other for nearly 20 years. I remember when we first joined the Chapter, and had our grey armour painted glorious Ultramarine blue! You have risen to lead a squad of hardened veterans - true guardians of the Emperor's Galaxy - and I have risen to the rank of Company Captain. Surely you would not begrudge me to fight along side an old friend?
"I'm afraid not sir, I cannot allow it."
"Whatever for, Brother-Sergeant?"
"You... you don't have a Plasma Pistol sir. I'm sorry, but we Hellblasters are a unique breed. Sometimes our guns explode and kill us, so we come back to life briefly to fire our exploded guns before dying again, and the thought of having someone join us who doesn't have a Plasma Pistol just... it's just unconscionable, sir!"
"Uhh... go back a bit. Did you say come back to life?"
"Again, I apologise Brother-Captain, but we cannot speak until you have a Plasma Pistol. Which means you'll have to give up the shield and sword you've been using for years as well, because can only have a Power Fist if you have a Plasma Pistol."

This is a silly game.

Yup, fething weird beyond a doubt given the Lieutenant escapes the same fate.

 Matt.Kingsley wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
"I'm sorry sir, but you cannot join our unit."
"Brother-Sergeant Hephastor! We have known each other for nearly 20 years. I remember when we first joined the Chapter, and had our grey armour painted glorious Ultramarine blue! You have risen to lead a squad of hardened veterans - true guardians of the Emperor's Galaxy - and I have risen to the rank of Company Captain. Surely you would not begrudge me to fight along side an old friend?
"I'm afraid not sir, I cannot allow it."
"Whatever for, Brother-Sergeant?"
"You... you don't have a Plasma Pistol sir. I'm sorry, but we Hellblasters are a unique breed. Sometimes our guns explode and kill us, so we come back to life briefly to fire our exploded guns before dying again, and the thought of having someone join us who doesn't have a Plasma Pistol just... it's just unconscionable, sir!"
"Uhh... go back a bit. Did you come back to life?"
"Again, I apologise Brother-Captain, but we cannot speak until you have a Plasma Pistol. Which means you'll have to give up the shield and sword you've been using for years as well, because can only have a Power Fist if you have a Plasma Pistol."

That'll show him for taking the promotion from Lieutenant!

Just don't tell GW because they'll make sure to correct the PDF so that only Lts with a Plasma Pistol can join Hellblasters.

 Lord Clinto wrote:
Personally, I'm disappointed that GW made it so that "Primaris" leaders can only lead "Primaris" units...

"Sorry Brother, I'm a Primaris Captain. I can't lead your Tactical Squad...for reasons."

There's still some transport nonsense, too.
Its mostly gone from the big tanks and drop pods, but rhinos, razorbacks and impulsors still have an 'armor check'

So do you think tournaments will ban Space Marines now? If we just ban all factions, the game will be balanced.

 Trickstick wrote:
So do you think tournaments will ban Space Marines now? If we just ban all factions, the game will be balanced.

Ban everything but the sassy nurgling.

 Trickstick wrote:
So do you think tournaments will ban Space Marines now? If we just ban all factions, the game will be balanced.

If it gets GW to fix the options, absolutely. We need to consumers, not consoomers. We need to tell GW every PDF with the same quality as Marines and Tyranids will not be played.

EviscerationPlague wrote:

 Trickstick wrote:
So do you think tournaments will ban Space Marines now? If we just ban all factions, the game will be balanced.

If it gets GW to fix the options, absolutely. We need to consumers, not consoomers. We need to tell GW every PDF with the same quality as Marines and Tyranids will not be played.

It's impossible until we get points though, because I can reply to almost every argument you make with "wait for points" and be correct. Not that I am saying the points are going to make things perfect, just that a proper analysis can hardly be made without them.

EviscerationPlague wrote:

 Trickstick wrote:
So do you think tournaments will ban Space Marines now? If we just ban all factions, the game will be balanced.

If it gets GW to fix the options, absolutely. We need to consumers, not consoomers. We need to tell GW every PDF with the same quality as Marines and Tyranids will not be played.

I suspect they'll all be like this.

 Trickstick wrote:

EviscerationPlague wrote:

 Trickstick wrote:
So do you think tournaments will ban Space Marines now? If we just ban all factions, the game will be balanced.

If it gets GW to fix the options, absolutely. We need to consumers, not consoomers. We need to tell GW every PDF with the same quality as Marines and Tyranids will not be played.

It's impossible until we get points though, because I can reply to almost every argument you make with "wait for points" and be correct. Not that I am saying the points are going to make things perfect, just that a proper analysis can hardly be made without them.

A list of points isn't going to fix the Tyranid Warrior or Vanguard Vet situation.

Overall very pleased with Marine reveals. My Scout force of Crimson Fists are very happy.

EviscerationPlague wrote:

 Trickstick wrote:

EviscerationPlague wrote:

 Trickstick wrote:
So do you think tournaments will ban Space Marines now? If we just ban all factions, the game will be balanced.

If it gets GW to fix the options, absolutely. We need to consumers, not consoomers. We need to tell GW every PDF with the same quality as Marines and Tyranids will not be played.

It's impossible until we get points though, because I can reply to almost every argument you make with "wait for points" and be correct. Not that I am saying the points are going to make things perfect, just that a proper analysis can hardly be made without them.

A list of points isn't going to fix the Tyranid Warrior or Vanguard Vet situation.

They're not broken, you just don't like them. Unlike the warriors though, vanguard vets are able to have an illegal loadout atm which maybe needs an errata in the event either player has 0 imagination. Given there isn't a picture of a vanguard vet on the card they're also either going to get legends or primaris'd like the sternguard in a couple of months likely.

Dudeface wrote:

EviscerationPlague wrote:

 Trickstick wrote:
So do you think tournaments will ban Space Marines now? If we just ban all factions, the game will be balanced.

If it gets GW to fix the options, absolutely. We need to consumers, not consoomers. We need to tell GW every PDF with the same quality as Marines and Tyranids will not be played.

I suspect they'll all be like this.

And we should NOT accept it.

 Trickstick wrote:
So do you think tournaments will ban Space Marines now? If we just ban all factions, the game will be balanced.

Death Guard tournament only. Everything else too broken.

Hammer of Wrath on Assault Marines needs to be clearer, it's easy to interpret it as "roll for each model in the enemy unit".

Imagine a 5 man Assault Squad hitting a 20 strong unit of Termagants and rolling 20 dice, each killing a Gant on a 4+ with Mortal Wounds, before they even swing attacks.

Even otherwise, it seems like a crazy good power.

 Insectum7 wrote:
Hammer of Wrath on Assault Marines needs to be clearer, it's easy to interpret it as "roll for each model in the enemy unit".

Imagine a 5 man Assault Squad hitting a 20 strong unit of Termagants and rolling 20 dice, each killing a Gant on a 4+.

This=own, that=enemy. For once gw been consistent on terms for long long time.

EviscerationPlague wrote:

Dudeface wrote:

EviscerationPlague wrote:

 Trickstick wrote:
So do you think tournaments will ban Space Marines now? If we just ban all factions, the game will be balanced.

If it gets GW to fix the options, absolutely. We need to consumers, not consoomers. We need to tell GW every PDF with the same quality as Marines and Tyranids will not be played.

I suspect they'll all be like this.

And we should NOT accept it.

Maybe you should not be telling people whether they are allowed to think reduced options is acceptable?

Dudeface wrote:

EviscerationPlague wrote:

 Trickstick wrote:

EviscerationPlague wrote:

 Trickstick wrote:
So do you think tournaments will ban Space Marines now? If we just ban all factions, the game will be balanced.

If it gets GW to fix the options, absolutely. We need to consumers, not consoomers. We need to tell GW every PDF with the same quality as Marines and Tyranids will not be played.

It's impossible until we get points though, because I can reply to almost every argument you make with "wait for points" and be correct. Not that I am saying the points are going to make things perfect, just that a proper analysis can hardly be made without them.

A list of points isn't going to fix the Tyranid Warrior or Vanguard Vet situation.

They're not broken, you just don't like them. Unlike the warriors though, vanguard vets are able to have an illegal loadout atm which maybe needs an errata in the event either player has 0 imagination. Given there isn't a picture of a vanguard vet on the card they're also either going to get legends or primaris'd like the sternguard in a couple of months likely.

I'm sure you would've used the same post to defend what happened to Chosen as well.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Dudeface wrote:

EviscerationPlague wrote:

Dudeface wrote:

EviscerationPlague wrote:

 Trickstick wrote:
So do you think tournaments will ban Space Marines now? If we just ban all factions, the game will be balanced.

If it gets GW to fix the options, absolutely. We need to consumers, not consoomers. We need to tell GW every PDF with the same quality as Marines and Tyranids will not be played.

I suspect they'll all be like this.

And we should NOT accept it.

Maybe you should not be telling people whether they are allowed to think reduced options is acceptable?

Bruh, Vanguard literally lost any heavy power weapon and dual pistol options. They got Chosenfied

tneva82 wrote:

 Insectum7 wrote:
Hammer of Wrath on Assault Marines needs to be clearer, it's easy to interpret it as "roll for each model in the enemy unit".

Imagine a 5 man Assault Squad hitting a 20 strong unit of Termagants and rolling 20 dice, each killing a Gant on a 4+.

This=own, that=enemy. For once gw been consistent on terms for long long time.

That's fair, but it still looks to be easily misinterpretable.

 catbarf wrote:

 The Red Hobbit wrote:
Looks like the Tyranids have quite a variety of interesting units in their datacards, the Toxicrene looks a bit better than before as well and Old One Eye as a leader looks pretty good. I am looking forward to playing against them and I'm glad they are getting some updated models.

What confuses me is why they've bothered calling out unit leaders for a few things- Neurogaunts, Zoanthropes, Warriors- if the leader doesn't get different stats, different wargear, or otherwise have any gameplay significance. It might as well just be another of the same trooper.

I thought that was pretty odd as well, my thought is that may be future proofing. Those units may get distinguished with an ability in the codex or perhaps a White Dwarf. Could also be that the unit card will remain plain but certain detachments will boost leaders with certain keywords.

 Insectum7 wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

 Insectum7 wrote:
Hammer of Wrath on Assault Marines needs to be clearer, it's easy to interpret it as "roll for each model in the enemy unit".

Imagine a 5 man Assault Squad hitting a 20 strong unit of Termagants and rolling 20 dice, each killing a Gant on a 4+.

This=own, that=enemy. For once gw been consistent on terms for long long time.

That's fair, but it still looks to be easily misinterpretable.

Eh.
'When this unit charges, roll dice for each model in this unit' seems hard to misinterpret.