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 kodos wrote:
Oh, I did no know that they released the mission cards and scenarios for free now, got a link because I cannot find them on WC?

Also were did they announce that faction rules will be free?

Mission cards - extra rules/optional. You've got 1 free generic mission in the core rules. Play that. Or you & opponent determine your own victory conditions.
Otherwise just rely on the opponent to have the cards if your too cheap to buy a deck yourself.

Faction rules - right now they're free.

Tittliewinks22 wrote:

 kodos wrote:

GW is the only miniature company with a business model build around selling a game
and if they sell a game, I demand that it is worth the money and not some expensive crap that needs to be replaced every 3 years because it is so bad that it is beyond fixing after that

If the game is not worth your money then don't spend the money. To some people there is value and they gladly spend the money on it. This isn't a problem for the whole customer base, just the people who complain that the game/models/rules/whatever are not enjoyable to them, but they still keep shelling out cash to buy up every latest release.

So I think this is a rather short sighted and sad statement, since I think largely GW is able to do this since the community that surrounds 40K and GW is so robust.

Often players maybe stuck in a community that only plays GW games, or even just 40K.
They can’t leave the game, if they want to stay with the hobby.
But even getting other games off the ground can be tougher, there is less support, less advertising online.
Even on YouTube finding painting for some games is hard on YouTube, guides or even just news and guides.

So in this environment players are stuck in the GW Hobby so to say, and they want to be able to have a say in the game they are playing.
Especially if GW is pulling what they enjoy out from under them.
If healthy competition could really thrive, I think it would be much more healthy and GW would need to make sure they at least support their design choices through.

It’s probably why GW puts so much into even there more niche small games now, as it is a way to keep players within a GW bubble.

Community rant about GW being so strong within the wider hobby. But I feel it’s an important thought to keep in mind for discussions like this.

Apple fox wrote:

Spoiler:

Tittliewinks22 wrote:

 kodos wrote:

GW is the only miniature company with a business model build around selling a game
and if they sell a game, I demand that it is worth the money and not some expensive crap that needs to be replaced every 3 years because it is so bad that it is beyond fixing after that

If the game is not worth your money then don't spend the money. To some people there is value and they gladly spend the money on it. This isn't a problem for the whole customer base, just the people who complain that the game/models/rules/whatever are not enjoyable to them, but they still keep shelling out cash to buy up every latest release.

So I think this is a rather short sighted and sad statement, since I think largely GW is able to do this since the community that surrounds 40K and GW is so robust.

Often players maybe stuck in a community that only plays GW games, or even just 40K.
They can’t leave the game, if they want to stay with the hobby.
But even getting other games off the ground can be tougher, there is less support, less advertising online.
Even on YouTube finding painting for some games is hard on YouTube, guides or even just news and guides.

So in this environment players are stuck in the GW Hobby so to say, and they want to be able to have a say in the game they are playing.
Especially if GW is pulling what they enjoy out from under them.
If healthy competition could really thrive, I think it would be much more healthy and GW would need to make sure they at least support their design choices through.

It’s probably why GW puts so much into even there more niche small games now, as it is a way to keep players within a GW bubble.

Community rant about GW being so strong within the wider hobby. But I feel it’s an important thought to keep in mind for discussions like this.

It is unfortunate that some people do not have communities/groups/clubs that are willing to branch out of the GW ecosystem. Traveling to a GT or whatever the major series is in your region is not the same as someone who is unable to find a local club that is willing to try new things. I have zero sympathy for people who complain non-stop about the things they dislike about GW game, and turn around and dump tons of money on them to travel and play in tournaments... It's no secret that GW is in the business of making money, and their objective with all decisions regarding game balance/rules changes is to facilitate increasing revenue. So the only way to get through to them is to vote with your wallet if you are disheartened... it worked in 6th/7th.

Apple fox wrote:

Tittliewinks22 wrote:

 kodos wrote:

GW is the only miniature company with a business model build around selling a game
and if they sell a game, I demand that it is worth the money and not some expensive crap that needs to be replaced every 3 years because it is so bad that it is beyond fixing after that

If the game is not worth your money then don't spend the money. To some people there is value and they gladly spend the money on it. This isn't a problem for the whole customer base, just the people who complain that the game/models/rules/whatever are not enjoyable to them, but they still keep shelling out cash to buy up every latest release.

So I think this is a rather short sighted and sad statement, since I think largely GW is able to do this since the community that surrounds 40K and GW is so robust.

Often players maybe stuck in a community that only plays GW games, or even just 40K.
They can’t leave the game, if they want to stay with the hobby.
But even getting other games off the ground can be tougher, there is less support, less advertising online.
Even on YouTube finding painting for some games is hard on YouTube, guides or even just news and guides.

So in this environment players are stuck in the GW Hobby so to say, and they want to be able to have a say in the game they are playing.
Especially if GW is pulling what they enjoy out from under them.
If healthy competition could really thrive, I think it would be much more healthy and GW would need to make sure they at least support their design choices through.

It’s probably why GW puts so much into even there more niche small games now, as it is a way to keep players within a GW bubble.

Community rant about GW being so strong within the wider hobby. But I feel it’s an important thought to keep in mind for discussions like this.

I just don't know anyone playing that game who paid for the rules since 7th edition
and they would stop playing it the moment they cannot pirate the rules any more

the game is not worth the money for a lot of people, but they play it because it is the game played and not because it is so good, they have fun or they like the 3 year cycle
also there are those making money as a 3rd party of the community and try to shut down any negativity or moving the goalpost if they cannot counter critic

like the game is free, yet it is not, so be happy with the 1 mission you get for free for the next 3 years

Tittliewinks22 wrote:

 kodos wrote:

GW is the only miniature company with a business model build around selling a game
and if they sell a game, I demand that it is worth the money and not some expensive crap that needs to be replaced every 3 years because it is so bad that it is beyond fixing after that

If the game is not worth your money then don't spend the money. To some people there is value and they gladly spend the money on it. This isn't a problem for the whole customer base, just the people who complain that the game/models/rules/whatever are not enjoyable to them, but they still keep shelling out cash to buy up every latest release.

so we are not allowed to demand better rules as long as someone will happily pay for what is offered
got it, just be a corporate shill and everything is fine

ccs wrote:

 kodos wrote:
Oh, I did no know that they released the mission cards and scenarios for free now, got a link because I cannot find them on WC?

Also were did they announce that faction rules will be free?

Mission cards - extra rules/optional. You've got 1 free generic mission in the core rules. Play that. Or you & opponent determine your own victory conditions.
Otherwise just rely on the opponent to have the cards if your too cheap to buy a deck yourself.

Faction rules - right now they're free.

so the rules are not free, and the amount of free rules will be reduced over time and we should be happy with what we get instead of demanding a better product for our money

 kodos wrote:

Tittliewinks22 wrote:

 kodos wrote:

GW is the only miniature company with a business model build around selling a game
and if they sell a game, I demand that it is worth the money and not some expensive crap that needs to be replaced every 3 years because it is so bad that it is beyond fixing after that

If the game is not worth your money then don't spend the money. To some people there is value and they gladly spend the money on it. This isn't a problem for the whole customer base, just the people who complain that the game/models/rules/whatever are not enjoyable to them, but they still keep shelling out cash to buy up every latest release.

so we are not allowed to demand better rules as long as someone will happily pay for what is offered
got it, just be a corporate shill and everything is fine

It's literally the opposite of a corporate shill to boycott or not buy product in order to enact change. They won't listen to complainers if their pockets keep getting stuffed...........

And to be sure, I do practice what I preach. I completely sold out of another game system because I disliked the direction the company was taking it. Throughout 8th and 9th I was not really interested in the 40k ruleset so I spent $0 on 40k product. 10th I've spent just a little because I like some of the changes. Once the codex's drop I'll determine if that arms race is worth my pursuit.

Apple fox wrote:

Tittliewinks22 wrote:

 kodos wrote:

GW is the only miniature company with a business model build around selling a game
and if they sell a game, I demand that it is worth the money and not some expensive crap that needs to be replaced every 3 years because it is so bad that it is beyond fixing after that

If the game is not worth your money then don't spend the money. To some people there is value and they gladly spend the money on it. This isn't a problem for the whole customer base, just the people who complain that the game/models/rules/whatever are not enjoyable to them, but they still keep shelling out cash to buy up every latest release.

So I think this is a rather short sighted and sad statement, since I think largely GW is able to do this since the community that surrounds 40K and GW is so robust.

Often players maybe stuck in a community that only plays GW games, or even just 40K.
They can’t leave the game, if they want to stay with the hobby.
But even getting other games off the ground can be tougher, there is less support, less advertising online.
Even on YouTube finding painting for some games is hard on YouTube, guides or even just news and guides.

So in this environment players are stuck in the GW Hobby so to say, and they want to be able to have a say in the game they are playing.
Especially if GW is pulling what they enjoy out from under them.
If healthy competition could really thrive, I think it would be much more healthy and GW would need to make sure they at least support their design choices through.

It’s probably why GW puts so much into even there more niche small games now, as it is a way to keep players within a GW bubble.

Community rant about GW being so strong within the wider hobby. But I feel it’s an important thought to keep in mind for discussions like this.

bs.
If you don't like a game - GW or otherwise - you are not forced to stick with it no matter what others are doing.
If you want to play something else? You need to invest the effort.
*That might be growing interest in a game yourself..
*Or you might need to go actively seeking the community who does play that game. Just because you don't see something being played at a shop DOESN'T mean it's not being played.

Apple fox wrote:
...
Especially if GW is pulling what they enjoy out from under them.
...

I want to call this specific line of thinking out. Nothing is being "taken away." Nothing prevents an individual from pursuing older editions of the game or previous iterations of Chapter Approved / Errata / FAQ except the individual themselves.

D&D is a great example. How many years do people prefer and play 3rd over 5th edition now???

This mindset of only grinding the latest's ruleset should be exclusive to Tournaments, and even then, what's to stop a TO from running a classic edition event?

Tittliewinks22 wrote:

Apple fox wrote:
...
Especially if GW is pulling what they enjoy out from under them.
...

I want to call this specific line of thinking out. Nothing is being "taken away." Nothing prevents an individual from pursuing older editions of the game or previous iterations of Chapter Approved / Errata / FAQ except the individual themselves.

D&D is a great example. How many years do people prefer and play 3rd over 5th edition now???

This mindset of only grinding the latest's ruleset should be exclusive to Tournaments, and even then, what's to stop a TO from running a classic edition event?

A common rule set to draw on, as well as being able to play anywhere and any event is a big thing.

RPGs are much more forgiving with a single GM making the rules choices, as well as deciding on a common rule set.

It also provides common ground for new players joining.

There is just a huge list of reasons for players to want the rule set as a base to be good, and we’ll designed by GW.

 kodos wrote:

Spoiler:

Apple fox wrote:

Tittliewinks22 wrote:

 kodos wrote:

GW is the only miniature company with a business model build around selling a game
and if they sell a game, I demand that it is worth the money and not some expensive crap that needs to be replaced every 3 years because it is so bad that it is beyond fixing after that

If the game is not worth your money then don't spend the money. To some people there is value and they gladly spend the money on it. This isn't a problem for the whole customer base, just the people who complain that the game/models/rules/whatever are not enjoyable to them, but they still keep shelling out cash to buy up every latest release.

So I think this is a rather short sighted and sad statement, since I think largely GW is able to do this since the community that surrounds 40K and GW is so robust.

Often players maybe stuck in a community that only plays GW games, or even just 40K.
They can’t leave the game, if they want to stay with the hobby.
But even getting other games off the ground can be tougher, there is less support, less advertising online.
Even on YouTube finding painting for some games is hard on YouTube, guides or even just news and guides.

So in this environment players are stuck in the GW Hobby so to say, and they want to be able to have a say in the game they are playing.
Especially if GW is pulling what they enjoy out from under them.
If healthy competition could really thrive, I think it would be much more healthy and GW would need to make sure they at least support their design choices through.

It’s probably why GW puts so much into even there more niche small games now, as it is a way to keep players within a GW bubble.

Community rant about GW being so strong within the wider hobby. But I feel it’s an important thought to keep in mind for discussions like this.

I just don't know anyone playing that game who paid for the rules since 7th edition
and they would stop playing it the moment they cannot pirate the rules any more

the game is not worth the money for a lot of people, but they play it because it is the game played and not because it is so good, they have fun or they like the 3 year cycle
also there are those making money as a 3rd party of the community and try to shut down any negativity or moving the goalpost if they cannot counter critic

like the game is free, yet it is not, so be happy with the 1 mission you get for free for the next 3 years

Tittliewinks22 wrote:

 kodos wrote:

GW is the only miniature company with a business model build around selling a game
and if they sell a game, I demand that it is worth the money and not some expensive crap that needs to be replaced every 3 years because it is so bad that it is beyond fixing after that

If the game is not worth your money then don't spend the money. To some people there is value and they gladly spend the money on it. This isn't a problem for the whole customer base, just the people who complain that the game/models/rules/whatever are not enjoyable to them, but they still keep shelling out cash to buy up every latest release.

so we are not allowed to demand better rules as long as someone will happily pay for what is offered
got it, just be a corporate shill and everything is fine

ccs wrote:

 kodos wrote:
Oh, I did no know that they released the mission cards and scenarios for free now, got a link because I cannot find them on WC?

Also were did they announce that faction rules will be free?

Mission cards - extra rules/optional. You've got 1 free generic mission in the core rules. Play that. Or you & opponent determine your own victory conditions.
Otherwise just rely on the opponent to have the cards if your too cheap to buy a deck yourself.

Faction rules - right now they're free.

so the rules are not free, and the amount of free rules will be reduced over time and we should be happy with what we get instead of demanding a better product for our money

(shrugs) You're simply wrong on this. Right now the rules, the faction rules, & all the various index cards are free. You can get them here: https://www.warhammer-community.com/warhammer-40000-downloads/
The only things you might want to spend $ on are the optional bits - the mission card pack & the main rulebook if you want Crusade info. Maybe the app as well if you think that's useful enough.

I'll bet the codexes wont be free, include extra rules and will be standard for competetive and most pick up game environments.

You can demand better rules, but my point is, don’t expect them. They haven’t done it yet, they don’t design the game to appeal people who wants super tight competitive rules. That’s not its purpose. You want that, play a different game, still play 40K but get your competitive wargaming fox with something that suits that and just have fun with 40K. (I’m not saying you have to do this, it’s just a suggestion that might lead to happier less frustrated hobby times)

End of the day 40K is the best wargame, for me, because I love the lore, I love the models and I have a huge history with it. I have narratives and characters that span all 10 editions and I go all the way back to my childhood with this game. A slightly ganky points system is a minor thing compared to all that and is something I can live with because overall I enjoy the game regardless.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also, right now I’m playing 40K with spending a penny on rules and do the same when I get to play a bit of AoS (very rare), but I have never bought a AoS rule book and haven’t pirated them either.

 Insectum7 wrote:
I'll bet the codexes wont be free, include extra rules and will be standard for competetive and most pick up game environments.

Ding ding ding.

Do people really believe this state of affaires will remain?
A company that has the gall to sell you on occasion two codices in a single edition?

ccs wrote:
(shrugs) You're simply wrong on this.

yeah, 40k is free to play as it always has been, you never needed to buy any rules at all because those rules have always been optional

Andykp wrote:

You can demand better rules, but my point is, don’t expect them. They haven’t done it yet, they don’t design the game to appeal people who wants super tight competitive rules. That’s not its purpose. You want that, play a different game, still play 40K but get your competitive wargaming fox with something that suits that and just have fun with 40K. (I’m not saying you have to do this, it’s just a suggestion that might lead to happier less frustrated hobby times)

End of the day 40K is the best wargame, for me, because I love the lore, I love the models and I have a huge history with it. I have narratives and characters that span all 10 editions and I go all the way back to my childhood with this game. A slightly ganky points system is a minor thing compared to all that and is something I can live with because overall I enjoy the game regardless.

I don't demand a competitive game, I demand a working and balanced casual game so I can enjoy the lore (and don't need to be careful that my fluffly lore-heavy list is not a crushing WAAC list) without planned obsolescence
for competitive gaming 40k works very well anyway, because the one thing that is needed are players, everything else does not matter, neither balance nor how bad the rules are written because those things will be handled by the TO and the players
Eldar are too strong and everyone who wants to win an event plays Eldar, who cares, this does not matter at all for competitive players, this is just a problem for casual and pick up games, not for tournaments
halve the units in a Codex are not worth taking, just a problem for the fluff and casual gamers, competitive players don't care and use the the half

40k fails at the one thing were it is said to be best, and people are defending that as if GW paid good money for it rather than demanding GW to do better

and when you say 40k is the best "wargame" because of all the good things that are not related to the game at all is a strange way to put it
the same way you would say Star Wars are the best "movies" because you like the extended universe books

what you are talking about is that 40k is the best IP/Setting for you, nothing you like has to do anything with the wargame

Andykp wrote:
[spoiler]
You can demand better rules, but my point is, don’t expect them. They haven’t done it yet . . .

Sure they have, in prior editions like 4th.

Andykp wrote:

End of the day 40K is the best wargame, for me, because I love the lore, I love the models and I have a huge history with it.

I can say the exact same thing, but still want it to be better.

Not Online!!! wrote:

 Insectum7 wrote:
I'll bet the codexes wont be free, include extra rules and will be standard for competetive and most pick up game environments.

Ding ding ding.

Do people really believe this state of affaires will remain?
A company that has the gall to sell you on occasion two codices in a single edition?

I thought everyone knew this was going to be the case? DId anyone honestly think otherwise? They just announced that the army builder is getting locked away behind WH+, anyone who though GW wouldn't find a way to try to make you pay to play is a fool.

 Sim-Life wrote:
I thought everyone knew this was going to be the case? DId anyone honestly think otherwise? They just announced that the army builder is getting locked away behind WH+, anyone who though GW wouldn't find a way to try to make you pay to play is a fool.

I got dogpiled for having the temerity to suggest that the datasheets wouldn't be free forever in a thread discussing that very topic. Some people get very angry when you point it out.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 Sim-Life wrote:
I thought everyone knew this was going to be the case? DId anyone honestly think otherwise? They just announced that the army builder is getting locked away behind WH+, anyone who though GW wouldn't find a way to try to make you pay to play is a fool.

I got dogpiled for having the temerity to suggest that the datasheets wouldn't be free forever in a thread discussing that very topic. Some people get very angry when you point it out.

nah, you got dogpiled because you were pointing it out when it wasn't relevant. People were saying indexes were free and that was a nice touch by GW and you came in there "BUT CODEXES WONT BE!!!11!".

 VladimirHerzog wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 Sim-Life wrote:
I thought everyone knew this was going to be the case? DId anyone honestly think otherwise? They just announced that the army builder is getting locked away behind WH+, anyone who though GW wouldn't find a way to try to make you pay to play is a fool.

I got dogpiled for having the temerity to suggest that the datasheets wouldn't be free forever in a thread discussing that very topic. Some people get very angry when you point it out.

nah, you got dogpiled because you were pointing it out when it wasn't relevant. People were saying indexes were free and that was a nice touch by GW and you came in there "BUT CODEXES WONT BE!!!11!".

And people were only saying the indexes were free in order to try and deflect from the rules being bad with the argument that they are free so quality doesn't matter.

 A Town Called Malus wrote:

 VladimirHerzog wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 Sim-Life wrote:
I thought everyone knew this was going to be the case? DId anyone honestly think otherwise? They just announced that the army builder is getting locked away behind WH+, anyone who though GW wouldn't find a way to try to make you pay to play is a fool.

I got dogpiled for having the temerity to suggest that the datasheets wouldn't be free forever in a thread discussing that very topic. Some people get very angry when you point it out.

nah, you got dogpiled because you were pointing it out when it wasn't relevant. People were saying indexes were free and that was a nice touch by GW and you came in there "BUT CODEXES WONT BE!!!11!".

And people were only saying the indexes were free in order to try and deflect from the rules being bad with the argument that they are free so quality doesn't matter.

And people only say the rules are bad if they don't like them, but somehow think they speak with authority even when some people like certain aspects or design decisions of the rules.

Everyone throw stones!

 VladimirHerzog wrote:
nah, you got dogpiled because you were pointing it out when it wasn't relevant. People were saying indexes were free and that was a nice touch by GW and you came in there "BUT CODEXES WONT BE!!!11!".

That's not what I said at all. I said that they'd stop being free as soon as the Codices arrived.

"Once the Codex comes out the datacards will vanish (one by one - not all at once)."

Learn to read.

 A Town Called Malus wrote:


And people were only saying the indexes were free in order to try and deflect from the rules being bad with the argument that they are free so quality doesn't matter.

My personal discourse was :

"Although the rules aren't perfect, them being free is a good step from GW, hopefully they stick to it for the whole edition but i fully expect codexes to be paid. Most likely the army builder will stay free like the AoS one"

i was wrong on the app but the rest of my claim still holds, even if GW dissapointed me


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 VladimirHerzog wrote:
nah, you got dogpiled because you were pointing it out when it wasn't relevant. People were saying indexes were free and that was a nice touch by GW and you came in there "BUT CODEXES WONT BE!!!11!".

That's not what I said at all. I said that they'd stop being free as soon as the Codices arrived.

"Once the Codex comes out the datacards will vanish (one by one - not all at once)."

Learn to read.

ok, was that confirmed anywhere? (legitimately asking)

 VladimirHerzog wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 VladimirHerzog wrote:
nah, you got dogpiled because you were pointing it out when it wasn't relevant. People were saying indexes were free and that was a nice touch by GW and you came in there "BUT CODEXES WONT BE!!!11!".

That's not what I said at all. I said that they'd stop being free as soon as the Codices arrived.

"Once the Codex comes out the datacards will vanish (one by one - not all at once)."

Learn to read.

ok, was that confirmed anywhere? (legitimately asking)

No. The opposite has been mentioned by Stu Black in various interviews prior to the release of 10th. In reality, nobody really knows and we'll have to wait for the first Codices to be released before we find out for sure.

 kodos wrote:

ccs wrote:
(shrugs) You're simply wrong on this.

yeah, 40k is free to play as it always has been, you never needed to buy any rules at all because those rules have always been optional

Andykp wrote:

You can demand better rules, but my point is, don’t expect them. They haven’t done it yet, they don’t design the game to appeal people who wants super tight competitive rules. That’s not its purpose. You want that, play a different game, still play 40K but get your competitive wargaming fox with something that suits that and just have fun with 40K. (I’m not saying you have to do this, it’s just a suggestion that might lead to happier less frustrated hobby times)

End of the day 40K is the best wargame, for me, because I love the lore, I love the models and I have a huge history with it. I have narratives and characters that span all 10 editions and I go all the way back to my childhood with this game. A slightly ganky points system is a minor thing compared to all that and is something I can live with because overall I enjoy the game regardless.

I don't demand a competitive game, I demand a working and balanced casual game so I can enjoy the lore (and don't need to be careful that my fluffly lore-heavy list is not a crushing WAAC list) without planned obsolescence
for competitive gaming 40k works very well anyway, because the one thing that is needed are players, everything else does not matter, neither balance nor how bad the rules are written because those things will be handled by the TO and the players
Eldar are too strong and everyone who wants to win an event plays Eldar, who cares, this does not matter at all for competitive players, this is just a problem for casual and pick up games, not for tournaments
halve the units in a Codex are not worth taking, just a problem for the fluff and casual gamers, competitive players don't care and use the the half

40k fails at the one thing were it is said to be best, and people are defending that as if GW paid good money for it rather than demanding GW to do better

and when you say 40k is the best "wargame" because of all the good things that are not related to the game at all is a strange way to put it
the same way you would say Star Wars are the best "movies" because you like the extended universe books

what you are talking about is that 40k is the best IP/Setting for you, nothing you like has to do anything with the wargame

That was kind of my point, it’s the best not because of the game but because of everything else. The reason I play is because all of that, I have tried other games, ones that people claim are “objectively” better than 40K and not enjoyed them at all, because I don’t have that history with them or that live of the fluff and models. A game is a sum of your experiences with it not just your time at the table. Changing points and doing with with power level as some here want so I have to use an army design system set up for competitive play would not improve my experience at all and probably lessen it.

I have said all along and will do it again, I think there should be a granular points system to help out people playing pick up games and competitive play, ALONGSIDE a PL style system for those that don’t care about that. That would solve all your issues. But so many in favour of points seem to think you have to remove power level so for some reason?

Another solution again would be if people playing pick up games and the like accepted a more narrative approach, moved away from match play being the standard. Relaxed a little. That is something I have no influence over or experience of but it sounds pretty grim out there, all the talk of legends not being aloud and optimising lists and all this. The fact that peoples first thoughts about not paying for upgrades is about how they can gain an advantage from this.

And eldar apparently being too strong is not about the points system. Using points to fix it is a bad idea. If a factions rules aren’t working as intended fix the rules don’t just charge more points for them to compensate.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Slipspace wrote:

 VladimirHerzog wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 VladimirHerzog wrote:
nah, you got dogpiled because you were pointing it out when it wasn't relevant. People were saying indexes were free and that was a nice touch by GW and you came in there "BUT CODEXES WONT BE!!!11!".

That's not what I said at all. I said that they'd stop being free as soon as the Codices arrived.

"Once the Codex comes out the datacards will vanish (one by one - not all at once)."

Learn to read.

ok, was that confirmed anywhere? (legitimately asking)

No. The opposite has been mentioned by Stu Black in various interviews prior to the release of 10th. In reality, nobody really knows and we'll have to wait for the first Codices to be released before we find out for sure.

The 40 k app is identical in design to the AoS one, the datasheets in that are free still so why would 40K be any different?

Andykp wrote:


The 40 k app is identical in design to the AoS one, the datasheets in that are free still so why would 40K be any different?

because there is one big difference between the two : the 40k listbuilding will not be free, so them using thesame model for both has gone out the window sadly

ccs 810334 11574206 wrote:(shrugs) You're simply wrong on this. Right now the rules, the faction rules, & all the various index cards are free. You can get them here: https://www.warhammer-community.com/warhammer-40000-downloads/
The only things you might want to spend $ on are the optional bits - the mission card pack & the main rulebook if you want Crusade info. Maybe the app as well if you think that's useful enough.

How do you draw missions from a deck, if you don't have a deck? And this is not some sort of attack question, but a "how to" question. Do people use some sort of dice roll system to randomize the results and how do they avoid getting the same missions for two people. Like maybe first person roll and the other rolls +1/-1 depending on something or re-rolls same missions? Is that how it is done?

Karol wrote:

ccs 810334 11574206 wrote:(shrugs) You're simply wrong on this. Right now the rules, the faction rules, & all the various index cards are free. You can get them here: https://www.warhammer-community.com/warhammer-40000-downloads/
The only things you might want to spend $ on are the optional bits - the mission card pack & the main rulebook if you want Crusade info. Maybe the app as well if you think that's useful enough.

How do you draw missions from a deck, if you don't have a deck? And this is not some sort of attack question, but a "how to" question. Do people use some sort of dice roll system to randomize the results and how do they avoid getting the same missions for two people. Like maybe first person roll and the other rolls +1/-1 depending on something or re-rolls same missions? Is that how it is done?

Goonhammer's Tabletop Battles App can simulate the card draws, as well and being a super useful tool for tracking the battle in general.

One day I will stop buying supplements and paying rent, and buy myself a smart phone. It is good to know there is something that works well. Although it is kind of a ironic that a bit like with Battlescribe, it is done by a non GW entity.
Very nice that parts of the community stepped in to resolve a problem, the community didn't create.

Karol wrote:
One day I will stop buying supplements and paying rent, and buy myself a smart phone. It is good to know there is something that works well. Although it is kind of a ironic that a bit like with Battlescribe, it is done by a non GW entity.
Very nice that parts of the community stepped in to resolve a problem, the community didn't create.

I believe CCS was implying that the mission cards are not a required item to play the game since the core rules have a free mission available to play. The cards are an extra bit to play that variant.

Tittliewinks22 wrote:

Karol wrote:
One day I will stop buying supplements and paying rent, and buy myself a smart phone. It is good to know there is something that works well. Although it is kind of a ironic that a bit like with Battlescribe, it is done by a non GW entity.
Very nice that parts of the community stepped in to resolve a problem, the community didn't create.

I believe CCS was implying that the mission cards are not a required item to play the game since the core rules have a free mission available to play. The cards are an extra bit to play that variant.

Correct.

The Stand-Alone Crusade book has quite a few missions in it, as well as core rules. I think it might be somewhat cheaper than the BRB, but not sure.