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chaos0xomega wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:
I think GW wanted Warcry to be its own thing but players didn't let it, we wanted full compatibility with AoS, both directions, and we tore a nice enough game down to just another line of mediocre bundle deals.

This.

It was originally marketed and announced as being focused on chaos factions fighting it out in the eight points, and there were comments made stating that it was distinct from AoS and not to expect the factions from AoS to show up.

What did the community do? They went, "But what about *insert x faction here*? The game seems cool but I'll wait until you release my faction before I play it." And it was all downhill from there.

We coulda had basically reverse Mordheim type experience out of it exploring a focused segment of the setting in a very distinct way with some really wild stuff. Instead the community ruined it abd made it a generic and somewhat pointless sublime that's been used as an excuse to deliver DLC content cut from the battletomes. great job guys.

Same as the reaction to Legions Imperialis anf Horus Heresy basically, except thevspecialist studio actually has a spine. "Waaaahhhhh I wanna play with orks and Eldar because my personality is intrinsically tied to a fictional race of aliens that only exists in a single IP but I need to try to parallel and shoehorn them into every other IP because I have no imagination and am too psychologically fragile to let myself experience new things."

I do think it's a shame that Warcry wound up going whole hog on ditching the original premise* (though that's as much GW corporate or design being greedy or spineless as its on players) but it's very strange to complain that people aren't playing Warcry, LI, or HH if the game isn't offering them something they want. You can like any of them all you want (and I quite like the initial concept of Warcry) but I don't owe GW purchases any more than they owe me creating stuff I want; if they line up then great.

*The original premise was cool, but IMHO GW really dropped the ball in two ways - one, having basically no army construction rules beyond "have a leader and at least have three models" so in when the first game launched there was a lot of waffle about which factions worked best with how many boxes because you might want more of this or that model. Of course sales wants you to sell as much as possible, and design either thought people would self regulate or didn't have the time or inclination to put in some kind of balancing, and then the continued insistence at the time that every little thing MUST be defined for AoS helped matters in no ways.

The other thing, and to my mind rather more fatal to the possibility of it developing into anything like Mordheim, is the general lack (and I still think it remains) of any kind of fixed context for AoS lore. I read the Warcry novels and short stories (and the Underworlds ones) and they didn't lead to anything like a Mordheim-esque feeling despite it INITIALLY seeming like we might actually have Carngrad feel like a place with narrative resonance. We're in a time where it seems quite clear that players of various games want to smash stuff together and let their own ideas run wild (and that's fine) but that suits something like M:tG or D&D way more than it did WHFB, and I think suits AoS more as well. We don't necessarily know exactly how many kilometres it is as the crow flies from Altdorf to Nuln, but we know how those two sit in relation to each other on a map, and we know the year in which the capital moved to Altdorf from Nuln and when and so on and and so forth. What do know about the Phoenicium and the Living City? That they were founded an unspecified span of time ago, and are an unspecified distance from each other, and they presumably had some mortals in them eventually.

That doesn't make AoS bad but I do think it explains why Carngrad was never going to be of interest to players, and why they wanted to bring other models in. I think for those of us who care about imagining the worlds our painted toys live in, that thinking about how our Tilean (using Empire rules, of course) general feels about the party of Piggalo ruling Tobaro once, or how Ponsard Trudot's winery is doing in Jordan Sorcery's Marienburg Project - is different in some way to thinking about our AoS models since the context in which they exist doesn't have much definition.

I think we can argue back and forth on if the changes to Warcry to include other factions was a good or bad move - in the end a LOT of factions have not had a warband; most are still Chaos and it was set in a Chaos Realm (well the one they have held onto at the Eightpoints).

The issue with the lore I feel is adjacent to it, but is an issue with ALL AoS lore. It's not just the geography is mindbogglingly huge; but also that early AoS didn't even have maps; didn't really want to have any structure to it and is so wildly fantasy that we actaully need a lot of books AND artwork to depict things like farms, cities, settlements, shipping and more. A LOT of Old World works because its basically faux fantasy medieval based off LotR. We don't need much meat on the factions because we can work most of it out. We can work out farming, trading, transport, travel and so forth.

For AoS ALL of that is a messy thing. Even something so simple as trade is complicated when there are whole realms of metals; foods and more. Basically how do you conduct trade when there are very few limited resources and the only one is Realmstone that's REALLY not something your average person would trade in at all.
Then you've the wildlife; the creatures; the farming. I enjoyed reading the Monster story about the new halfbreed monster Soulblight (names escape me right now); but it was based around a City that stood on huge stilts in a realm where you could have a field one day and a mountain range the next. It never really covered just how you could FARM or live in such an environment. Like how do you build any kind of static or even mobile settlement when everything can suddenly change in moments.

Can we not do this yet again in this thread?

That would be great.

Stealth update in faction packs

https://www.warhammer-community.com/warhammer-age-of-sigmar-downloads/

Why no change log? The Lumineth one is over a MB bigger but I have no idea what actually changed!

I am hopeful the changelog will be posted along with an article sometime today.

I found Hexwraiths going from Control 2 to 1 and some nerfs to manifestation summon ranges.

Maggotkin got a well deserved nerf ("clarification") that they can't infect enemy manifestations.

And since half of this is AoS-related...

Nice looking marshal. I'll get him third party like the others.

Those are all very cool. Warhammer+ models?

Aye. Here's a close up

Kind of wish the helmet option was more ornate.

A Steelhelm or Fusilier unit champ has a more decorative helmet. The same is also true of the Marshal on horseback though, with his barebones helmet, so I guess its a deliberate design decision.

 nels1031 wrote:
Kind of wish the helmet option was more ornate.

A Steelhelm or Fusilier unit champ has a more decorative helmet. The same is also true of the Marshal on horseback though, with his barebones helmet, so I guess its a deliberate design decision.

Need to avoid standing out too much so no plucky sharpshooter on top of an ogre's pole shoots you!

Regarding the updates: the app has a cool feature now where FAQs and errata changelog are put in the relevant faction areas.

So without having to dig through PDFs or warscrolls, I can at a glance see that Kharadron Overlords got nerfed (albeit in the sense of making a potential feelsbad moment not happen any more). Can't drag units out of combat with boats any more.

Squire model is my favourite. He could also be useful outside of AoS.

Yeah that Squire has Vampire Hunter lackey written all over him. Getting David Wenhams character from Van Helsin vibes.

 Snrub wrote:
Yeah that Squire has Vampire Hunter lackey written all over him. Getting David Wenhams character from Van Helsin vibes.

He would be great parried with some witch hunter, like one from Underworlds etc.

 Snrub wrote:
Yeah that Squire has Vampire Hunter lackey written all over him. Getting David Wenhams character from Van Helsin vibes.

I literally only read the first sentence and I instantly went to google to respond with a photo of Carl. But then I saw you had already made the connection first lol

I now like that model much more

Kind of cheeky, them not telling what changed in all those documents that were updated yesterday. I looked at the points one and nothing appeared different in my armies (Kruleboyz and Stormcast).

 ZergSmasher wrote:
Kind of cheeky, them not telling what changed in all those documents that were updated yesterday. I looked at the points one and nothing appeared different in my armies (Kruleboyz and Stormcast).

Points changes are marked with a big bold asterisk, there's about a dozen and most of them in Nurgle

The big thing is they put the faction pack changelog at the end of the points pdf

 lord_blackfang wrote:

 ZergSmasher wrote:
Kind of cheeky, them not telling what changed in all those documents that were updated yesterday. I looked at the points one and nothing appeared different in my armies (Kruleboyz and Stormcast).

Points changes are marked with a big bold asterisk, there's about a dozen and most of them in Nurgle

The big thing is they put the faction pack changelog at the end of the points pdf

Ah ok, my bad, guess I should look at the whole thing next time huh?

Hm, so only the Stormcast are actually getting revealed and then a map:

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2024/08/26/are-you-ready-for-the-warhammer-preview-show-nova-open-2024/

gonna be busy during the show this time, so i'm glad i won't be missing much

 Inquisitor Gideon wrote:
Hm, so only the Stormcast are actually getting revealed and then a map:

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2024/08/26/are-you-ready-for-the-warhammer-preview-show-nova-open-2024/

I thought that was the plan, regarding just SCE being in this preview?

Certainly would've been nice to see some more stuff for sure, but my impression was that it would be the "second half" of the preview which previously featured the Skaven, just spaced out so that the loser of the event had a different show.

I think most thought that everything on the list was getting a preview. Not that i especially care as the SCE are what i've been waiting for.

Stormcast article and roadmap:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2024/08/29/nova-open-preview-new-stormcast-eternals-arrive-in-a-flash-of-thunder/

So those rumours were all true. Stunning.

Wow some impressive miniatures coming here

That big griffon piece is very nice not sure what it's called but reminds me of a hippogriff or something similar.

The skeleton guy with standard, the alternate skull head with robe reminds me of Skeletor!

Some more bits of info from the article:

The Slaves to Darkness will also get a new Spearhead box featuring the Darkoath Tribes – and this will be joined in 2025 by a Spearhead for the Orruk Warclans, and an army box and individual releases for the Gloomspite Gitz

army box should mean more than just a foot hero for GSG