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Starting with real world stuff would give us something to key to.

Once we start considering Imperial Logistics, there’ll be a lot of speculation.

For example, even the largest mega-cargo ships in the real world are teensy tiny compared to Imperial Mass Conveyors. Add in Las weapon Power Packs/Cells are rechargeable, and from a wide range of sources. We know it can be done in a fire, but at the cost of its usable lifespan. But what a “properly and perfectly” maintained lifespan might be, and just how damaging “or just bung it in a fire” is to that base lifespan? Largely speculation. But it’s all going to factor in.

For instance? Let’s say that in as standard a battlefield condition as you might expect in 40K, each Power Pack can be recharged 10 times with no loss of performance. And each Guardsman (these are just sample numbers for demonstration) is issued with 4. One loaded, three reloads. And, going on the Dice Tin here

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/267014445325?chn=ps&_ul=GB&_trkparms=ispr%3D1&amdata=enc%3A1gELYLMGGQfuhg0XdEk48oA49&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=710-134428-41853-0&mkcid=2&mkscid=101&itemid=267014445325&targetid=2425733423477&device=c&mktype=pla&googleloc=9045109&poi=&campaignid=21697391927&mkgroupid=162558106770&rlsatarget=pla-2425733423477&abcId=10027104&merchantid=508460628&gad_source=1&gbraid=0AAAAAD_Lr1epMSZAhCa30G1w9MfLMAdv3&gclid=Cj0KCQjwgrO4BhC2ARIsAKQ7zUkdcaGuNb3o54Qg5BpK2ZVDpQ1VmP7WeXqfcyB9_RBHhV9zdfP64NYaAueLEALw_wcB

Each pack has 135 shots.

On their person, each Guardsman has the direct equivalent of 540 shots ready to go, and a maximum of 5,400 shots before they need to be resupplied.

That’s already a significant space saving in terms of how much small arms ammunition you need to cart about.

I will directly rule out “ifs and buts”, such as the potential to just hook a las weapon up to the mains, particularly exotic or simple versions, and just look for standard.

I’d also prefer “primary” canon, over stuff like the RPGs, which weren’t necessarily written by GW, and have additional limitations of making a game fun at that scale, and not seeing Guard able to just wildly fire.

A lot of that is answered by the Imperial Munitorum manual:


Firstly, the Departmento Munitorum expects a Guardsmen to carry 6 powerpacks with enough charge for at least 2000 shots (which is ~333 per pack). They do note this does vary by lasgun power setting, so some weapons may deplete this quicker like the Lucius pattern lasgun used by the DKoK.

Secondly, they give some numbers for equipment usage rate. 400,000 laspacks were used "in the recent combat activity on Cadia". The regiment used as an example in the book is the 91st Cadian, raised specifically for the 13th Black Crusade. It had 5037 soldiers at raising (including support staff), of which ~3500 are combat soldiers in 10 infantry companies. Said "recent combat activity is fighting Abaddon in the Defence of Cadia, which lasted for less than a year. This edition of the Munitorum Field Manual makes no mention of the Fall of Cadia* so presumably that consumption data is not even the entire war.

Codex: Imperial Guard (5th edition) gives the date of the Battle of Tyrok Fields as 975999.M41. I can't find any dates for the Fall, but the war seems to have lasted a few months. If we take 3 months of combat, then the regiment used 133000 packs a month firing over 44 million lasbolts. Someone else can do the maths for the weight of 44 million rounds of 5.56 NATO or something

Note: when they say consumed, I assume that means depleted. Probably most of the laspacks were simply recharged rather than replaced. Recharging from standard power sources is the norm, and I'd expect any Guard fortification to feature charging points and generators.



*The meta reason being it was written about a decade before the Fall of Cadia lore was written).

Consumed is definitely the troublesome word there for the reason you mentioned.

Is that “it was at full power, now it’s drained”, or is it “it had a good innings but the internal gubbins have had it, and now it can’t be charged back up”

As for NATO 5.56? Apparently, cursory Google apparently, each round is 12g. So…watch me utterly fail at maths.

12g x 44,000,000 of them. To get kilos, I think I multiple 0.012 (1,000g = 1kg, so I express the gram weight as a fraction) 528,000kg

Changing that to the more common ton? The UK ton? 519.66 tons. In US Tonnes? That’s 582,000

Just for the rounds. Not including the magazine or clip or whatever it’s proper name is,

Now, a standard shipping container has a maximum load of 30 tonnes. I’m assuming that’s US Tonnes.

So for us to cart that much ammo, you’d need 19,4000 standard, 20’ shipping containers. And our largest Container Shippers (which are mind bogglingly vast) can carry a maximum of 12,000.

Lasguns. They just make sense! Because even if we likely considerably overestimate the weight of a Lasgun Power Pack at a nice, round 1kg? That’s 133,000kg for the same amount of shots. And far, far fewer if Depleted means “can no longer be recharged”, as an unknown number of equivalent shots would be effectively recycled, further reducing the shipping strain.

At least, according to the figures I’ve just worked out. I’ll now sit back and await someone with a greater more recent ability in maths to prove me wrong and make me look stupid(er than normal)


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But remember, my figures are just for the bullets. Not the magazines, not ammo hoppers and other storage solutions. Just the bullets themselves.

A typical lasgun weighs 2.3kg (Imperial Infantryman's Uplifting Primer). It isn't clear whether that is the loaded or unloaded weight, but probably loaded. So a power pack is probably a substantial portion of that but I'd be surprised if it was over half. 1kg is maybe the upper limit (modern batteries are heavy but who knows how much batteries weight in 40000 years?)

Dunno, the barrels have the lens array, and are said to be metal. Even if the body is relatively free of worky bits, given Bayonets are standard issue, you’d need the body to have significant heft to it, if for no other reason than balancing it for ranged and bayonet usage.

Sure the power pack would be part of that equation (because even if it’s depleted, it likely doesn’t change weight, so should be factored in as a fixed weight factor) but I can’t see it being terribly heavy in itself, when compared to the rest of the weapon?

Considering what they fight against and the volumes of shots "consumed" could well mean anything from

"It's no longer recharging to optimal capacity" through to "a chaos sorcerer turned half the squad into an amalgamated horror along with their weapons and we took it out with a baneblade shot to the face - loss of all equipment."

Plus theft, loss on the battlefield and so forth. Even though its FAR more efficient than bolter rounds, they'll still take huge losses of lasgun ammopacks.

One thing that makes the stats always big is that the Imperial Guard deals in big numbers in battle

Oh I don’t think anyone could argue with a straight face that being deployed with your six packs means every survivor comes back with six packs - or that there’s any particular expectation of that.

But, post battle? I wouldn’t put it past the Imperium to have Sevitors or standard Plebs scour the field for dropped power packs, whether expended or not, for reuse.

 Overread wrote:
Considering what they fight against and the volumes of shots "consumed" could well mean anything from

"It's no longer recharging to optimal capacity" through to "a chaos sorcerer turned half the squad into an amalgamated horror along with their weapons and we took it out with a baneblade shot to the face - loss of all equipment."

Plus theft, loss on the battlefield and so forth. Even though its FAR more efficient than bolter rounds, they'll still take huge losses of lasgun ammopacks.

One thing that makes the stats always big is that the Imperial Guard deals in big numbers in battle

This is assuming that "consumed" means a pack is lost when it could just mean a pack is depleted and needed recharging. From the perspective of a Guardsman, if they deplete 5 packs and give them back to the quartermaster, they've consumed 5 packs. If they then get the same 5 packs back fully charged, they probably don't know or care that they are the same or not.

I highly doubt that 3500 troopers required 120000 packs as replacements for completely unusable/lost packs in a few months of war when the packs are rechargeable. That would suggest a very high usage of packs when factoring in recharging. As it is, 44 million shots equates to ~140 shots per day per Guardsman over a 3 month period (assuming no heavy and special weapons, which isn't the case). That doesn't sound like that much but if a green regiment was engaged against the Black Crusade every day it wouldn't last for 3 months IMO, and it will still be suffering casualties that means the consumption distribution is not even over those months. But the manual suggests the 91st Cadian are still a combat-effective unit at time of writing.

For some WWII US numbers (note this is for heavy fighting):

It is clear that troops understood the unit of fire to be roughly the amount of ammunition consumed in a day of heavy combat. Eugene Sledge, a Marine mortar crewman in the Pacific, certainly understood it in this sense (Sledge 1981):

Determined from experience, a unit of fire was the amount of ammunition that would last, on average, for one day of heavy fighting. A unit of fire for the M1 rifle was 100 rounds; for the carbine, 45 rounds; for the .45 caliber pistol, 14 rounds; for the light machine gun, 1,500 rounds; and for the 60mm mortar, 100 rounds

They later list the M1 carbine as 60 rounds per day, M1 Garand as 150 per day, and the BAR as 750 per day. Now I suspect the numbers are higher for modern assault rifles and higher still for lasguns, but 140 rounds per day total sounds reasonable if you expect that days of heavy fighting will be higher whereas days of lighter engagement will be lower.

If the consumption means packs lost, suddenly that number jumps up hugely because laspacks are highly rechargeable unless abused, meaning that those losses are probably all to damage or being left in the field. Bear in mind the regiment probably only had ~25000-30000 packs in combat loads to start with, so they would have lost 4 times their starting complement without the regiment being destroyed as a fighting force.


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 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Oh I don’t think anyone could argue with a straight face that being deployed with your six packs means every survivor comes back with six packs - or that there’s any particular expectation of that.

But, post battle? I wouldn’t put it past the Imperium to have Sevitors or standard Plebs scour the field for dropped power packs, whether expended or not, for reuse.

DKoK definitely do this, there was a nice FW model of a quartermaster with servitors collecting material for reassignment.


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 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Dunno, the barrels have the lens array, and are said to be metal. Even if the body is relatively free of worky bits, given Bayonets are standard issue, you’d need the body to have significant heft to it, if for no other reason than balancing it for ranged and bayonet usage.

Sure the power pack would be part of that equation (because even if it’s depleted, it likely doesn’t change weight, so should be factored in as a fixed weight factor) but I can’t see it being terribly heavy in itself, when compared to the rest of the weapon?

Aside from needing to be robust, I don't think extra weight will be added to aid its use with the bayonet. 2.3kg is already somewhat heavy for such a short spear, adding extra weight just makes it a worse spear (spears are very light and quick). The killing is done by the point and blade, weight isn't particularly helpful as it slows the weapon down.

However I think it is fair to say the packs probably are not that heavy. The fact a trooper carries 6 suggests they have a similar weight to modern magazines IMO.

Procedure there may also vary depending on deployment.

If like Cain’s regiments you’ve a mere stopover on your way to a larger engagement? I can see a more lax reclamation discipline.

But, if You’re It until reinforcements arrive (perhaps a Garrison force, or forward expeditionary force, scouts, rangers etc) then I can see reclamation being very much the order of the day.

I mean, consider daft stuff like Catachan Jungle Fighters and other Super Duper Scout forces of note. Those guys and gals can likely live off the land with reasonable success. So reclaiming and recharging power packs would allow such a force, competent and experienced in bushcraft, to operate for far longer than if they needed to re supply ammo packs.


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On modern mag weight? Anyone got reliable numbers for modern, military standard issue?

Well, losing your powerpack is officially a flogging offence. The Imperium doesn't really do lax

Whether that is actually enforced is a different question and probably more up to the regimental culture than anything.

It’s gonna annoy me that I don’t think we have a reliable, primary canon source for how many recharges can be expected from a Mint Power Pack.

Spesh as going back to Confrontation, the same power packs used in Pistols and Rifles could be batteried to power a Lascannon, and I’d need to double check, presumably other, larger Las Weapons. Again not necessarily as standard practice (Confrontation being the precursor to Necromunda) but in extremis, being able to pool power packs for even a single sneaky, cheeky “you didn’t expect that Lascannon shot or Multi-Laser burst would surely appeal, and potentially turn a battle.


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OK doke. Firearms thread suggests a fairly standard, NATO 5.56 mag weighs a bit over a pound. So in the region of 453g.

Now, we’re still in “for argument’s sake” territory here 40K wise, as we don’t have a form number.

But, my rationale is a Lasgun Power Pack is, presumably, just a very advanced, very efficient battery. Which means it still contains metals and acids, circuit boards and that. And, even if the Worky Bits are fairly light? Giving it some deliberate heft (for instance, a lead base) would help with speedy reloading, and noticing if something is missing from your webbing. And it would help protect the internal Worky Bits from shock, wet etc if you give it some form of insulation/padding.

So. That’s based on a magazine holding 30 rounds. Which means, to get comparable shots using the figures listed earlier?

44,000,000 divided by 30 gets us the Magazine Count (I’m assuming they’re issued ready to go, as it’s the least bulky option for shipping) gives us 1,466,667 (rounding up) Magazines for equivalent shots.

Now, we multiply 0.453 by 1,466,667 (453g per mag) gives us 664,400 Kilograms (slightly rounded down due .151).

Which gives us 732.2 US Tonnes.

As covered earlier, a standard 20’ Shipping Container has a max weight load of 30 Tonnes. So we’d be needing a whole lot fewer containers which means either here or above my maths has exploded in my face.

Hmm.


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Pretty sure it’s my first calculation was off.

I did the grams to kilo as 0.012, when it should’ve been 0.0012? As it’s 1,000g to 1kg, and 0.012 is 120g, not 12g.

Can you tell I don’t use maths terribly often?


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So, anyways.

732.2 US Tonnes, divided by 30 (max tonnage of Shipping Container) of course gives us 24.4 such containers. Which probably leaves the remaining few tonnes to stick some Servitors in for good luck and offloading.

Ahem. Anyways.

Using Haighus’ numbers from the Uplifting Primer, and the fairly informed assumption of near enough identical weight?

133,000 power packs, at 453g a pop is 60,249 kilos, or 66 US Tonnes. A smidge over 2 standard, 20’s shipping containers.

Which means if you’re to ship equivalent weight? You’ve 22 Shipping Containers, or around 1,320 tonnes of other guff you could select.

Lasguns. Gotta love ‘em!

Lasgun power pack capacity varies depending on the lasgun type.

According to the FFG books, most of the basic lasguns have 60 rounds as their standard magazine size. Laspistols are typically 30. Then there were the more specialized lasguns which had different capacities. Overcharging lasguns usually consumed extra "ammo" to produce the more powerful shots on lasguns where that was an option.

When I was DM'ing I ruled that pretty much all lasgun power packs were interchangeable unless it was something weird or special like a Hotshot lasgun(which does explicitly have special Hotshot packs which can also be used in normal lasguns). The listed magazine size for a particular weapon was for the power pack that typically came with that weapon, but you could stick that power pack in other lasgun weapons. IE: You could put a laspistol pack in a lasgun and vice verse, it just has half the ammo.

I also said you could cludge together normal power packs to power a lascannon or something, but it would basically be 1 shot per pack and require some skill checks and risk the tech priest's wroth.

So even if a lasgun power pack is heavier than a normal magazine, having twice the ammo would make up for it easily. You can then either give a soldier the same weight of power packs as magazines, leading to more ammo total, or carry fewer power packs but the same amount of ammo and save total weight.

Given that power packs are easily recharged in the field, I could see soldiers being given as few as 3. Maybe less if they are seen as extra expendable.

I tend not to favour the RPG stats, as they have an in-game pressure that “pure” background sources don’t.

333 or so shots per pack would change how a character approaches combat in an RPG, whereas 60 is the right mix of “wow, that’s a good bit more than real world rough equivalence”, and still being limited enough to make you consider your shots.

But, all is canon in 40K, so just my preference.

I've found some other sources for laspacks.

So, to start with, the Munitorum Field Manual and Imperial Infantryman's Uplifting Primer are referring to M-G short pattern lasguns operating in the 19 megathule range, whatever a "thule" is. They state a laspack lasts for "many shots" and the manual states at least 2000 from a standard 6 pack load. The primer gives a standard load as 4 spare packs and presumably one in the lasgun for 5 packs.

Codex: Imperial Guard (3rd edition, 2nd codex) gives very similar information for the Kantrael short pattern lasgun used by Cadian Shocktroops- 19mt, laspacks last for "many" shots.

Imperial Armour Volume 5 gives the Lucius pattern lasgun as noticeably more powerful, operating in the 21mt range, but using standard power packs. They are good for 25 shots at this power level. A typical Korpsman has 4 spare packs + lasgun by standard, and are typically issued more for assaults.

Imperial Armour Volume 4 gives the Accatran pattern lasgun as using standard powerpacks lasting for 50 shots. It notes the weapons are semi-automatic only so may also be more powerful than a typical short pattern lasgun, but Imperial Armour Volume 3 notes they still operate in the 19mt range.

I haven't found any other "authorative" sources (i.e. outside of BL novels) yet.




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For a bit of extra spice, the Lucius pattern hellgun fires in the 28mt range and the backpack power unit is good for 200 shots.

The Ryza pattern hotshot lasgun fires in the 60mt range (!) at maximum capacity, no indication of the ammo capacity is given.

I wonder what's the regular range of a Ryza Hotshot, that'd be nice information to have to figure out just how much you can crank up some Guns.

 Bobthehero wrote:
I wonder what's the regular range of a Ryza Hotshot, that'd be nice information to have to figure out just how much you can crank up some Guns.

I'm not aware of any sources with that information, but I'd guess at closer to the Lucius weapons as that would avoid draining the power pack too quickly.

Unfortunate, but you're probably right, too, you put it on 28mt (or equivalent for the Ryza) to handle your common cultist and get to crank the charge depending on what you're fighting.

I’m now wondering where the Worky Bits actually sit in a Lasgun.

I mean, it’s all fine and well saying “this model has adjustable shot power”. But, how would that work if your power pack is a single output?

Sure you could use a resistor (look, I’ll apologise now, not an electrician, sorry if I’m using the wrong terms) to reduce the input. But to increase it? I’m thinking that Worky Bit is in the power pack. As in, it comes preset to a certain output. But installed in the right model of Lasgun, and you can dial that up and down. And if you don’t have the output widget? You just fire the same every shot.

Unless…..for ramping it up? Your Lasgun has a capacitator, drawing off and storing charge from the power pack, loosing the bolt when the capacitator is at max? If you’re just talking a 50% increase in output, that’s not going to be a long charge, but will mean an overall slower rate of fire?

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
I’m now wondering where the Worky Bits actually sit in a Lasgun.

I mean, it’s all fine and well saying “this model has adjustable shot power”. But, how would that work if your power pack is a single output?

Sure you could use a resistor (look, I’ll apologise now, not an electrician, sorry if I’m using the wrong terms) to reduce the input. But to increase it? I’m thinking that Worky Bit is in the power pack. As in, it comes preset to a certain output. But installed in the right model of Lasgun, and you can dial that up and down. And if you don’t have the output widget? You just fire the same every shot.

Unless…..for ramping it up? Your Lasgun has a capacitator, drawing off and storing charge from the power pack, loosing the bolt when the capacitator is at max? If you’re just talking a 50% increase in output, that’s not going to be a long charge, but will mean an overall slower rate of fire?

Increase the pulse repetition rate of the laser. More pulses means more energy in a given amount of time.

Same input power to the laser from the charge pack, but you pulse the laser faster which results in more power of the laser compared to a laser with a lower pulse repetition rate. This would drain the power pack faster as each pulse is draining it by the same amount.

Trouble there is Lasguns may not be lasers as we understand them.

Sources are frustrating here, as some describe a coherent beam, other blasts, others still bolts.

And I swear I read somewhere they are in fact a form of particle weapon, with the beam being used to carry the particle. But until I can find a give a proper citation, let’s chalk that up to me misremembering or simply imagining it.

Found one. Ropey source as it’s Reddit, claiming to quote a WD I don’t have (WD 482)

LAS WEAPONS
Imperial 'las' weapons are not true laser weapons, but rather sophisticated particle-beam weapons that emit a coherent 'packet' of energy that can melt through armour and sear flesh on impact. The category of weapon encapsulates perhaps the most disparate selection of weapons in the galaxy, ranging from crystalline cell-powered pistols to the prodigiously large primary armaments of void-ships. Within this broad bandwidth lie lasguns and lascannon, frequently relied upon by numerous forces thanks to their rechargeable power packs or inbuilt generator systems that lessen the burden on an army's logistical train.

Particle weapons would still function the same way. No single particle can carry enough energy to do what lasguns do (and trying to do that would utterly fail in any non-vacuum as other particles are very good at stopping particles), so they would still need to be a pulsed emission system to get a high number of particles (which are sent in a beam of particles) hitting the target in a short amount of time. Increase the pulse repetition rate to get more particles sent per unit time means more energy per second delivered to the target and energy per unit time is power.

Oh cool.

Well, I mean I’m taking you at your word on this, I know a good deal about 40K background, real science not so much.

Well, predicting how a fictional weapon using tech from 39000 years in the future is pure guessing, but capacitors is how I imagined it.

I suspect the maximum power is determined by the power pack though. A standard lasgun can use hot shot packs, it just burns the weapon out really quickly. The lasrifled used by the Solar Auxilia could use a special blast pack to get a really powerful volley off, but at the cost of destroying the pack.


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 A Town Called Malus wrote:
Particle weapons would still function the same way. No single particle can carry enough energy to do what lasguns do (and trying to do that would utterly fail in any non-vacuum as other particles are very good at stopping particles), so they would still need to be a pulsed emission system to get a high number of particles (which are sent in a beam of particles) hitting the target in a short amount of time. Increase the pulse repetition rate to get more particles sent per unit time means more energy per second delivered to the target and energy per unit time is power.

Plus photons can behave as particles (wave-particle duality).

However I have never seen anything to suggest las weapons are not light emitters.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
I’m now wondering where the Worky Bits actually sit in a Lasgun.

I mean, it’s all fine and well saying “this model has adjustable shot power”. But, how would that work if your power pack is a single output?

Sure you could use a resistor (look, I’ll apologise now, not an electrician, sorry if I’m using the wrong terms) to reduce the input. But to increase it? I’m thinking that Worky Bit is in the power pack. As in, it comes preset to a certain output. But installed in the right model of Lasgun, and you can dial that up and down. And if you don’t have the output widget? You just fire the same every shot.

Unless…..for ramping it up? Your Lasgun has a capacitator, drawing off and storing charge from the power pack, loosing the bolt when the capacitator is at max? If you’re just talking a 50% increase in output, that’s not going to be a long charge, but will mean an overall slower rate of fire?

Both methods seem to exist in the fluff.

You can have "Hotshot" power packs which can turn a normal lasgun's shots into much more powerful ones, or you can have a specially made "Hotshot" lasgun which does the same either using Hotshot packs or normal ones. It is stated that using a Hotshot powerpack in a normal lasgun does damage it, so its probably basically a battery that is forcing more of its energy into the system. And this can force a normal lasgun to perform better, at the cost of damaging it. While a Hotshot lasgun is basically just a lasgun made to withstand this extra energy load.

Kinda like how a power surge will make lightbulbs burn way way brighter than normal, then they'll burn out if it gets to be too much.

I'm not aware of any source suggesting a hot shot lasgun will still fire overcharged shots with a standard power pack. I'd expect it to simply be a very overbuilt lasgun firing at a standard power setting.

If I’m right in thinking, originally the Hotshot was the power pack? Either made for higher yield, or a standard one tampered with. And it was that higher than rated discharge which knackered the Lasgun’s components?

Since then we’ve had Hellguns and formal Hotshot Lasguns introduced, which are designed with the higher tolerance required. They still require greater and more regular maintenance, but with that as a given, they’re less likely to fail you in the heat of battle?

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
If I’m right in thinking, originally the Hotshot was the power pack? Either made for higher yield, or a standard one tampered with. And it was that higher than rated discharge which knackered the Lasgun’s components?

Since then we’ve had Hellguns and formal Hotshot Lasguns introduced, which are designed with the higher tolerance required. They still require greater and more regular maintenance, but with that as a given, they’re less likely to fail you in the heat of battle?

Exactly, the hot shot lasgun is overbuilt to tolerate hot shot power loads (either from cable feeds or hot shot laspacks). Long-las are the same, they also use hot shot laspacks.

You can see this on most of the models, they have a much more substantial barrel shroud or thicker barrel which probably helps with cooling or something.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
If I’m right in thinking, originally the Hotshot was the power pack? Either made for higher yield, or a standard one tampered with. And it was that higher than rated discharge which knackered the Lasgun’s components?

Since then we’ve had Hellguns and formal Hotshot Lasguns introduced, which are designed with the higher tolerance required. They still require greater and more regular maintenance, but with that as a given, they’re less likely to fail you in the heat of battle?

I'd have to check the 2nd Ed Guard Codex, but Stormtroopers had Hotshot Lasguns in that one if memory serves, not Lasguns with Hotshot packs as part of their wargear. Regardless, it made them hit at Str 4 no AP, for reference, they were also cabled rifles.

Hot Shot Lasguns and all Lasguns had AP -1 in 2nd. Hotshot Lasguns in 2nd basically were Boltguns.

IIRC in later editions they were Str3 but also AP3